FW Amm TrbFixF

FAQs on Freshwater Aquariums & Ammonia:
Troubleshooting/Fixing

READ! Know what your situation is, what the source/s of ammonia are... and your options for their control/elimination.

When/where in doubt: Water Changes! But... not too much or too many... as changing water quality can/will forestall the establishment of nitrification, aka Nitrogen cycling.

Ammonia in tap water all of a sudden! 9/25/12
Hi there! I've read many of your posts and wanted to consult with you over posting in other forums because you seem most knowledgeable. I'm really at a loss here, having only kept fish since December of last year. Several issues have cropped up on me and I cannot find answers to my specific questions on any forums. So, thank you in advance!
Here's my two set ups:
5 gallon
Small Wonder sponge filter, cycled since February. I did a fishless cycle.
Heated @ 76 degrees (not adjustable)
1 female Betta (1")
Feeding: 3 Omega 1 Betta pellets & frozen bloodworms as a treat. (I used to give her dried, soaked daphnia and bloodworms, but she would float at the surface a bit and struggle to swim downward.)
20 gallon long
Aqueon quiet flow 10 with extra filter media & a Small Wonder sponge filter
(This tank has been cycled since January, but housed goldfish and was changed over to current setup in July. The goldfish are in a pond, btw.)
Heated to 78 degrees
Aquarium sand & soft gravel substrate
Driftwood that releases tannins
10 types of plants, some floating
1 make plakat Betta (2")
8 yellow phantom tetra
1 peppered Cory
1 panda Cory
1 false julii Cory
3 albino cories
Just added:
1 emerald catfish
1 false blochii
Food:
M, W, F: 1/2 of a Top Fin Algae Thin (40% crude protein) for the cories.
Tu, Th: Soaked Tetra tropical fish flakes, poured into water column for all fish
Sa: day off
Su: peas (all of them eat the peas a bit, what is left is removed)
Sunday eve: thawed bloodworms (I use a turkey baster to get some of them directly to the bottom.)
The Betta gets 6 Omega 1 pellets a day except Saturday and Sunday.
Does this sound like a good feeding schedule?
<Yes>
Water parameters (both tanks):
PH 7.8 (I use test strips)
0 ammonia (until recent discovery of .5 ppm in my tap water)
0 nitrites
Consistently very low nitrates
Water changes are performed bi-weekly, due to low nitrates. 20% in the five gallon and 20% in the twenty gallon.
I hope that is enough details. So now for the issues!
Starting with the five gallon tank, my poor little Betta now has horrible fin rot from the sudden appearance of ammonia in the tap water. This happened some time in the last few weeks and it measures .5 ppm. I don't check ammonia weekly because both of my tanks are cycled, so it could have been there for 3 weeks now.
On Sunday I did a 20% water change and added Prime to remove the ammonia.
It lasted 24 hours, but this was not long enough to allow the bio filter to process that much more ammonia. It is used to one 1" fish! Now the ammonia level is back to .5 ppm.
Yesterday I also added Kanaplex to cure the fin rot. This isn't going to work it I can't get the ammonia out of my water...
<Correct>
Or will it? The dosage is 3x, adding it every other day. Tomorrow I will just add another dose I suppose...
How do I get the ammonia out?
<Best to treat the water, and/or store it ahead of use for several days, a week>
Could I set up another filter with zeolite in it in a bucket of water and the use prime when I'm about to add the water to the tank?
<Yes.>
I have a Cascade 300 (I think) which is rated for up to 10 gallons and has a compartment for zeolite and carbon. How long would it take to reduce the ammonia?
<A day or so>
Is there a long term solution if my tap water will be like this from now on? (I do plan on calling the water company to find out.)
<Mmm, yes; as stated: treatment w/ an ammonia remover, and/or storage of new water ahead of use>
Now for the issues with my 20 gallon:
1. I am wondering if you recommend a different filter. Mine is a basic hob that uses carbon filter cartridges. I don't change the cartridge because I think I am allowing it to be a bio filter. Am I correct?
<Yes>
I added a bio sponge before the cartridge. When I did my last water change, it looked less dirty on the extra sponge and water seemed to be avoiding both sponges and going right over the side compartment and back out into the tank. I fixed it, but I'm not even sure how it happened. I wish I had a picture, but the idea is that it's not the greatest filter. What do you recommend?
<Perhaps an additional hang on filter (what I would do)... using the present and the new... Or adding a canister, or an internal power filter>
Also, I'm using the bio sponge filter on the other side of the tank, as it's a long and the filter goes on the far left, so I added the bubbly sponge filter on the far right for adding water circulation and gas exchange, as well as bio filtration. Is this a good idea?
<It is indeed>
The increase in ammonia seems to be stabilizing in the 20 gallon, as it measured about .1 or .2 ppm today after adding Prime on Sunday. Today is Monday, but 24 hours have passed since I added Prime.
2. My plants are mostly doing very well, but sadly, the easiest ones are kind of rotting! The rhizome of the Anubias plants (4 of them) is rotting where it had been cut. I have them gently rubber banded to wood or rocks.
Is this normal?
<Mmm, normal? This is a very tough genus of plants... Not normal for them to rot; given decent water quality, a source of nutrients and light... they should grow. I would NOT rubber band them... just plant in the substrate or pots>
One just melted to my touch, but the rest is ok. It just seems like the rhizome is slowly rotting away. Does this indicate that bad bacteria is in the water or something else?
<A lack of something essential... phosphate, iron... see WWM re plant health>
I am using a florescent light that is for plants called Tropic Sun, I think. The tank is shallow, but has black water and the floating plants block some light. This shouldn't be a problem for Anubias though, right?
The leaves are beautiful, btw, and all of my plants have new growth.
<See WWM re this genus (note that I've corrected the spelling); this amount and quality of light should be fine>
I understand that I have low amounts of dissolved co2 and o2 with such a high PH, but should plants thrive as long as there is good water circulation, surface agitation and food from fish waste?
<Usually, yes>
3. I have a quick question about tetra schooling. It's normal for tetras to not school in a small tank, right?
<Yes>
I am guessing they would only school if they felt threatened.
<Mmm; no... mostly when they are "happy">
It looks like they huddle together at night, but they seem at ease during the day, chasing, swimming and hiding in plants intermittently.
4. And here's where I just did something all newbie's at least think of doing... Impulsively, I went and got the emerald catfish, now 1.25" and the false blochii Cory, now 1.5". 4 of the other cories are only 1" currently, and the other 2 are 1.25", so they are all small now.
<Mmm, okay... but you and they would be better off w/ more of just one species of Corydoras or Brochis here>
Backtracking, I ended up with the panda, peppered and julii as my first fish, why, because "the guy at the lfs told me it would be ok." This probably sounds like "my dog ate my homework," but really he just threw them in a bag before I could decide which ones to get. Well those three seem to be very happy with each other, but what do I know? They hang out all the time... swimming, sleeping together.
<You could likely trade them in...>
Then I added one albino Cory, thinking he could just join in. Well no. They were racist and nipped his fins and made him stay in the corner. So I got his two friends from the store and ever since the group of six has gotten along fabulously. They all swim and rest together, or sometimes break into pairs or threes, or go off on their own. It all seems normal.
<Ok>
The two new fish seemed to be fitting in well the first two days. (That was when I discovered the ammonia in the tap water.) They were very social with the other fish. Then they both became very shy and wouldn't come out of the plants after day two, which seems like the reverse of what should happen.
Neither of them would eat and it has been almost a week now that they have not ate. I am sure they are getting some flakes and bloodworms though...
But they won't come out to eat the sinking pellets. (Are they even the right kind?)
<Do try the Spectrum brand... a fave... for palatability and being completely nutritious>
Is this because the other group is dominant? The ammonia? Is the Betta possibly harassing them when I'm not looking?
<Most likely the ammonia>
As for the Betta, when I am looking he usually swims around at the top and comes to the glass to beg for food. Lately he is swimming back and forth along the glass with the cories and today I even caught him resting with them on the gravel! I tried to take a picture of this, but he moved.
He only flared at the tetras the very first day he was introduced, which they needed to learn not to nip him. He has been in there for a month and he seems relaxed and never flares at anyone, not even his reflection anymore, which he spent the first week or so doing. His short fins enable him to get around and swim normally.
So back to the new cories, I am wondering if I should just take them back.
<Yes; I would>
They will get too big for the tank and clearly they are not thrilled to be here. I saw the two of them hiding together, and the emerald has been coming out to be with the other fish a bit. But they must both be stressed.
This could cause problems... Am i over stocked?
<Not really, no>
Are these two ever going to acclimate, or is it a really bad sign? The emerald looks way better than he did at the store. All of the emeralds had chewed up dorsal fins. His is nearly healed. When I was buying the Prime, I peaked at the other emeralds in the store, and they were all hovering vertically at the top with badly chewed dorsal fins and 20 Serpae tetras all facing them... I hate to take him back to that!
<Tell the manager... he should move one or the other elsewhere>
I don't want to take the fish back, but if the voice of reason says I should, then I will!
Thank you for your time and knowledge!
Lori
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>
Willing to edit my last email 9/25/12
Hi,
<Lori>
I just read further down the page about your requirements. I will edit my last email if the need be. I am on my cell phone, so it didn't come out as well as if I were on a pc.
Actually, I'd like to re-do it! I appreciate proper grammar and wisdom!
<Mmm, not necessary. Your writing is/was clear, understandable>
The list format for the tank specs is O.K. though, right?
I will resend it tomorrow.
Cheers,
Lori
<And you, BobF>
Ammonia in tap water all of a sudden! /Neale 9/25/12
Hi there! I've read many of your posts and wanted to consult with you over posting in other forums because you seem most knowledgeable. I'm really at a loss here, having only kept fish since December of last year. Several issues have cropped up on me and I cannot find answers to my specific questions on any forums. So, thank you in advance!
Here's my two set ups:
5 gallon
Small Wonder sponge filter, cycled since February. I did a fishless cycle.
Heated @ 76 degrees (not adjustable)
1 female Betta (1")
Feeding: 3 Omega 1 Betta pellets & frozen bloodworms as a treat. (I used to give her dried, soaked daphnia and bloodworms, but she would float at the surface a bit and struggle to swim downward.)
<All sounds okay.>
20 gallon long
Aqueon quiet flow 10 with extra filter media & a Small Wonder sponge filter
(This tank has been cycled since January, but housed goldfish and was changed over to current setup in July. The goldfish are in a pond, btw.)
Heated to 78 degrees
Aquarium sand & soft gravel substrate
Driftwood that releases tannins
10 types of plants, some floating
1 make plakat Betta (2")
8 yellow phantom tetra
1 peppered Cory
1 panda Cory
1 false julii Cory
3 albino cories
Just added:
1 emerald catfish
1 false blochi
<No obvious problems here either, though as a rule, it's nicest to keep Corydoras species in groups of at least 5 specimens per species.>
Food:
M, W, F: 1/2 of a Top Fin Algae Thin (40% crude protein) for the cories.
Tu, Th: Soaked Tetra tropical fish flakes, poured into water column for all fish
Sa: day off
Su: peas (all of them eat the peas a bit, what is left is removed)
Sunday eve: thawed bloodworms (I use a turkey baster to get some of them directly to the bottom.)
The Betta gets 6 Omega 1 pellets a day except Saturday and Sunday.
Does this sound like a good feeding schedule?
<Yes.>
Water parameters (both tanks):
PH 7.8 (I use test strips)
0 ammonia (until recent discovery of .5 ppm in my tap water)
0 nitrites
Consistently very low nitrates
<Also good.>
Water changes are performed bi-weekly, due to low nitrates. 20% in the five gallon and 20% in the twenty gallon. I hope that is enough details. So now for the issues! Starting with the five gallon tank, my poor little Betta now has horrible fin rot from the sudden appearance of ammonia in the tap water. This happened some time in the last few weeks and it measures .5 ppm. I don't check ammonia weekly because both of my tanks are cycled, so it could have been there for 3 weeks now. On Sunday I did a 20% water change and added Prime to remove the ammonia. It lasted 24 hours, but this was not long enough to allow the bio filter to process that much more ammonia. It is used to one 1" fish! Now the ammonia level is back to .5 ppm.
<Odd.>
Yesterday I also added Kanaplex to cure the fin rot. This isn't going to work it I can't get the ammonia out of my water... Or will it?
<Medications can, do affect biological filtration. A good approach here would be to stop feeding, finish the meds, and then over the next few days see if things settle down and ammonia and nitrite just drop to zero. If they do, then any oddness might be simply down to use of medications. You'd imagine fish meds wouldn't do this, but they do.>
The dosage is 3x, adding it every other day. Tomorrow I will just add another dose I suppose...
How do I get the ammonia out?
<Ammonia in tap water is best removed using water conditioner that removes ammonia -- many do, but if yours doesn't, you can buy products like Ammo Lock that do the trick. If you have ammonia in the aquarium -- but NOT in the tap water before added to the aquarium -- then the ammonia is coming from the fish. In that case, the thing to do is review stocking, filtration and feeding.>
Could I set up another filter with zeolite in it in a bucket of water and the use prime when I'm about to add the water to the tank? I have a Cascade 300 (I think) which is rated for up to 10 gallons and has a compartment for zeolite and carbon. How long would it take to reduce the ammonia?
<Zeolite is fairly limited in use here. While it can remove ammonia, and may work well in certain situations, but long term it isn't really a fix (zeolite is best used in tanks where biological filtration isn't an option at all, e.g., hospital tanks). You may want to use zeolite for a couple weeks, but really, you do want to pin down what the problem is with your existing biological filtration.>
Is there a long term solution if my tap water will be like this from now on? (I do plan on calling the water company to find out.)
<May be. But do also remember that you can get "false positives" if your water supplier uses chloramine and your water conditioner doesn't remove chloramine. To be honest, I tend to do two things here: [1] use a water conditioner that removes ammonia and chloramine; and [2] use a NITRITE test kit to measure problems with water quality, since nitrite reflects poor water quality quite well, but the risk of false positives is much lower.>
Now for the issues with my 20 gallon:
1. I am wondering if you recommend a different filter. Mine is a basic hob that uses carbon filter cartridges.
<Not a big fan of carbon.>
I don't change the cartridge because I think I am allowing it to be a bio filter. Am I correct?
<Yes. Once carbon is saturated (i.e., after a couple weeks of use) it becomes a fairly good biological media that houses lots of bacteria.>
I added a bio sponge before the cartridge. When I did my last water change, it looked less dirty on the extra sponge and water seemed to be avoiding both sponges and going right over the side compartment and back out into the tank. I fixed it, but I'm not even sure how it happened. I wish I had a picture, but the idea is that it's not the greatest filter. What do you recommend?
<Likely the best thing would be simply to add a second filter. An air-powered sponge filter is a great add-on: easy to maintain, cheap, and hosts lots of bacteria.>
Also, I'm using the bio sponge filter on the other side of the tank, as it's a long and the filter goes on the far left, so I added the bubbly sponge filter on the far right for adding water circulation and gas exchange, as well as bio filtration. Is this a good idea?
<For sure.>
The increase in ammonia seems to be stabilizing in the 20 gallon, as it measured about .1 or .2 ppm today after adding Prime on Sunday. Today is Monday, but 24 hours have passed since I added Prime.
2. My plants are mostly doing very well, but sadly, the easiest ones are kind of rotting! The rhizome of the Anubias plants (4 of them) is rotting where it had been cut. I have them gently rubber banded to wood or rocks.
Is this normal?
<Not uncommon, but usually because the rhizome was put under the gravel.
Rubber bands can work, but they're not the best way to hold them on. Try black cotton instead. Anyway, the very best thing to do with Anubias is buy one ALREADY attached to bogwood or rock. Bit more expensive, but very reliable. Oh, and do also make sure it's one of the easy Anubias species, like Anubias barteri.>
One just melted to my touch, but the rest is ok. It just seems like the rhizome is slowly rotting away. Does this indicate that bad bacteria is in the water or something else? I am using a florescent light that is for plants called Tropic Sun, I think. The tank is shallow, but has black water and the floating plants block some light. This shouldn't be a problem for Anubias though, right? The leaves are beautiful, btw, and all of my plants have new growth.
<Anubias doesn't mind shady conditions.>
I understand that I have low amounts of dissolved co2 and o2 with such a high PH, but should plants thrive as long as there is good water circulation, surface agitation and food from fish waste?
<Not quite. Fish waste provides some nutrients, particularly nitrate and phosphate, but not iron and magnesium. So you do need to add plant fertiliser.>
3. I have a quick question about tetra schooling. It's normal for tetras to not school in a small tank, right? I am guessing they would only school if they felt threatened. It looks like they huddle together at night, but they seem at ease during the day, chasing, swimming and hiding in plants intermittently.
<Quite normal.>
4. And here's where I just did something all newbie's at least think of doing... Impulsively, I went and got the emerald catfish, now 1.25" and the false blochi Cory, now 1.5". 4 of the other cories are only 1" currently, and the other 2 are 1.25", so they are all small now. Backtracking, I ended up with the panda, peppered and julii as my first fish, why, because "the guy at the lfs told me it would be ok." This probably sounds like "my dog ate my homework," but really he just threw them in a bag before I could decide which ones to get. Well those three seem to be very happy with each other, but what do I know? They hang out all the time... swimming, sleeping together. Then I added one albino Cory, thinking he could just join in.
Well no. They were racist and nipped his fins and made him stay in the corner.
<Very unusual for Corydoras.>
So I got his two friends from the store and ever since the group of six has gotten along fabulously. They all swim and rest together, or sometimes break into pairs or threes, or go off on their own. It all seems normal.
<Good.>
The two new fish seemed to be fitting in well the first two days. (That was when I discovered the ammonia in the tap water.) They were very social with the other fish. Then they both became very shy and wouldn't come out of the plants after day two, which seems like the reverse of what should happen.
Neither of them would eat and it has been almost a week now that they have not ate. I am sure they are getting some flakes and bloodworms though...
But they won't come out to eat the sinking pellets. (Are they even the right kind?) Is this because the other group is dominant? The ammonia? Is the Betta possibly harassing them when I'm not looking?
<Hard to say, but Corydoras generally don't cause major social problems.
Letting them sort their pecking order out will help, and adding one or two more of any species with fewer than 3 specimens can be very useful.>
As for the Betta, when I am looking he usually swims around at the top and comes to the glass to beg for food. Lately he is swimming back and forth along the glass with the cories and today I even caught him resting with them on the gravel! I tried to take a picture of this, but he moved. He only flared at the tetras the very first day he was introduced, which they needed to learn not to nip him. He has been in there for a month and he seems relaxed and never flares at anyone, not even his reflection anymore, which he spent the first week or so doing. His short fins enable him to get around and swim normally.
<So long as he's feeding normally, I wouldn't worry overmuch.>
So back to the new cories, I am wondering if I should just take them back.
They will get too big for the tank and clearly they are not thrilled to be here. I saw the two of them hiding together, and the emerald has been coming out to be with the other fish a bit.
<Emerald Corydoras aren't actually Corydoras at all, but a Brochis species, Brochis splendens. They're nice fish, but that bit bigger and more robust than typical Corydoras.>
But they must both be stressed. This could cause problems... Am i over stocked?
<Not obviously, but if water quality doesn't stabilise, then yes, this could be a factor. On the other hand, if you have extra space and could swap out to a 25 or 30 gallon tank, then this would be a great excuse to upgrade.>
Are these two ever going to acclimate, or is it a really bad sign? The emerald looks way better than he did at the store. All of the emeralds had chewed up dorsal fins. His is nearly healed. When I was buying the Prime, I peaked at the other emeralds in the store, and they were all hovering vertically at the top with badly chewed dorsal fins and 20 Serpae tetras all facing them... I hate to take him back to that!
<Serpae Tetras are notorious fin-biters!>
I don't want to take the fish back, but if the voice of reason says I should, then I will!
Thank you for your time and knowledge!
Lori
<Hope this helps, Neale.>

Congo tetras with Finrot 2/17/12
Dear WWM crew,
<Helen>
Firstly, thanks in advance for your advice! I don't normally need to read the wwm pages about medications and diseases, but sadly today I find myself doing so :(

I have just received a batch of 10 Congo tetras in the post (lacking a car it's usually easier for me to order fish online than to drag myself, toddler and baby to an aquarium shop). They look ok, not that I'm expert in the species.
While they are not coloured up yet, I can see hints of the shiny reflective colouring that I'm hoping to have resplendent in the future. But some of them (maybe all of them?) have what looks to me like Finrot.
<Phenacogrammus do ship rough... often appearing like you describe on arrival. Given suitable circumstances, feeding, they rapidly "bounce back" into good shape>
I have very little experience at treating aquarium diseases. Usually I manage to keep sick fish out of my systems in the first place. But I suspect that these guys need treating. Several of them have a white line at the edge of their tail or fin that I think is the Finrot in action, some of the fins look eaten away and on one of the tails I can clearly see that the web is eaten away leaving just the rays.

They have been in the post for two days coming to me
<Quite a long time... about the limit for most aquatic livestock>
and when they arrived the ammonia level in the bags was off the scale (at least 8ppm on my API drop test, if one can rely on any accuracy at that level). The pH was only 6 (or maybe lower - again that's at the edge of the test and I wouldn't trust it to be accurate, though I assume the PH was definitely low. I don't know whether that level of ammonia would have been harming them or not, given the low pH.
<Not as much, thank goodness... Had the pH been high, they'd all be dead>
I have slowly acclimatised them to a quarantine tank with pH 6.8, ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 0, temperature 25.5 degrees. There's no nitrate because I have just set it up, but I've put mature filter media from my main tank into the filter, so hopefully there will be no trace ammonia or nitrite showing up.
If there is, I'll use Seachem Prime to reduce the impact and add more filter media or zeolite or similar to help.
<Good>
I'm planning to feed these guys a mixture of baby brine shrimp and flake and small sinking pellets. I'm planning to keep them in quarantine for at least two weeks or until they seem well.
<Also>
So my questions are:
1. Would you treat the Finrot or let it alone and see what good water conditions and good food can do? My inclination is to think it needs treating, but I'm not sure.

2. If you suggest treating the Finrot, what medication would you suggest that I can get hold of here in Australia, where medication options are fairly limited?
I can get tetracycline, Myxazin, triple sulfur,
<This... the Triple Sulfa, if anything. 250 mg.s per ten gallons, water change every three days for three treatments>
promethaysul, Methylene blue, and that's about it for things that claim to treat something like Finrot.
Would any of those be likely to help? Or might they just harm the already stressed fish further?
Do you have any other suggestions for me?
<To enjoy your new charges>
Thanks again,
Helen
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>
Re: Congo tetras with Finrot, ammonia burn f' as well – 12/17/12
Dear Bob and Crew,
<Helen>
Thanks very much for your advice.
<Welcome>
This morning when checking the fish I notice that several of them have blackish marks on their tails or fins. I didn't notice that yesterday afternoon but the light was different so maybe it was there and not so obvious as now.
However, I am inclined to guess that these are the marks of now-healing ammonia burns (something I've not seen before but have read about).
<You are correct>
I've attached a photo, not a great one but the best I could manage. You can see the black marking on the fish's tail. Do you agree this is likely to be ammonia burn?
<Yes>
If so, would you recommend any treatment other than good water, good food, and time?
<Not really, no>
How long would you expect the fish to take to heal?
<A week or two>
I certainly wouldn't want to put them into my main tank when they are still injured.
Thanks again,
Helen
<Certainly welcome. BobF>

Ammonia levels and Molly trouble. 12/30/10
Hello,
<Hello,>
I've got a couple of questions regarding a new tank.
<Okay. Start here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/fwset-up.htm
>
I bought a 10 gallon (48 litre) tank two and a half weeks ago. I bought it from one of a chain of large pet stores (my first mistake)
<A bit unfair. Large chains can be just fine, but as with *any* purchase you'll do best if you do your research independently. By all means take advantage of low prices and wide ranges of stock, but *know* what you're buying.>
and thought that asking them a million questions would be better research than reading (my second mistake.)
<Indeed. Do buy at least one aquarium book. Many good titles can be obtained used from Amazon.com and similar, not to mention your public library.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/bookswwmsugg.htm
>
On their advice, I set the tank up with heater (24 degrees C), filter, gravel and decorations, and had it running for three days.
I went back to the store to buy my first fish. I asked for lots of advice and came away with a Corydora catfish,
<Singular of Corydoras is Corydoras. It's a scientific name, Corydoras, e.g., Corydoras paleatus, rather than a plural.>
a black Molly, a silver Molly, and two Dalmatian Mollies.
<These Mollies need at least 20 gallons, and I'd strongly recommend 30+ gallons.>
The Cory died within an hour and was replaced after having my water tested.
The water was apparently perfect, but they said to change my temperature to match theirs (26 degrees C.) I changed it by one degree so I didn't shock them, but three Mollies died overnight leaving the black Molly (female).
The temperature in my tank is now 26 degrees.
I went back to the shop in tears, and was told that my water was too acidic.
<Indeed. Mollies require hard, basic water. This has nothing really to do with pH, though the pH should be around 7.5 to 8.5. What makes or breaks your Mollies is the hardness. Mollies either need water that has been strongly hardened using a Rift Valley salt mix at 50-100% the recommended dose, or else slightly brackish water, with 5-10 grammes of marine aquarium salt mix per litre. For beginners, adding 5 grammes of marine aquarium salt mix per litre is BY FAR the easiest way to keep Mollies. Do read:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/mollies.htm
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/fwh2oquality.htm
Needless to say, Mollies aren't good companions for fish from acidic water conditions like Corydoras. Instead, keep them on their own, or mix with salt-tolerant species or brackish water species, such as Knight Gobies and Brown Hoplo Catfish.>
Through several water changes I got the ph to 7.6 and the pet shop said I could put more fish in. I got another Cory and another black Mollie as I'd learnt that they are shoaling fish.
<Mollies aren't schooling fish. Males are very aggressive. Keep at least two females per male.>
Cory's one and two are both fine, but Molly 2 was very weak and I'll looking when introduced to the tank and Molly 1 wouldn't leave her alone, and she too died overnight.
<Indeed.>
After all this, we finally found a family run local pet shop and bought two blue tetras. They took a few days to settle in, and we've had no problems with them (except for them eating whole catfish pellets!)
<You need more than two Blue Tetras (Boehlkea fredcochui) for them to live for long. They're schooling fish, so keep at least six. They're also very nippy, and will damage slow-moving fish such as Mollies. All this is clearly stated in aquarium books.>
On Christmas day, my Molly gave birth to two babies. These are now five days old and are doing well in a nursery tank floating in the main tank.
<Well, some good news there, at least.>
The adult Mollie is now being extremely aggressive, to the Cory's in particular, and especially when there is food around. The Molly seems to be very hungry all the time, but I've been told not to feed her more than normal. This is my first problem. I need to know why she is being so aggressive, and if it's temporary or not.
<Mollies aren't "nice" fish. They aren't easy to keep and they tend to throw their weight around. Mollies are beautiful, yes, but they aren't fish for beginners. Any good aquarium book should state this.>
My second problem is with the chemicals in my tank. The levels of ammonia and nitrite were low, but nitrate was high, so we bought some plants to help. Since then, my nitrate has dropped to 5ppm, but the ammonia has shot up to 1ppm, and the nitrite to 0.5ppm.
<The rise in ammonia and nitrite imply poor filtration, overfeeding, overstocking, or some combination of the three. Do read:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/fwestcycling.htm
Do further understand that biological filtration is what you need, not carbon or Zeolite.>
I am changing the water every day, 25 or 50% on alternate days, but this isn't helping! I've used Filter Start since we've had fish to boost the bacteria levels and my tank is spotlessly clean, so I can't figure out where I'm going wrong, or what to do to fix this. Please help!
<Buy, borrow a good aquarium book, curl up with it in the next day or two, and read about keeping fish. It's not hard, but the mistakes you're making are easy ones to fall into without forethought.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_5/volume_5_3/stocking.htm
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwlivestk.htm
>
Sorry the email is so long, I've had so many different things go wrong and really need to get it fixed!
<Do please read where directed.>
Thank you!
Sasha
<Hope this helps. Cheers, Neale.>

Question on Low pH and High Ammonia 7/4/10
Hi,
<Hi! Melinda here.>
I've searched the WetWebMedia FAQs for a solution to my problem, but I can't seem to find an exact match yet. I wonder if you could help me.
<Sure!>
I transferred a 5ï¿½ Oscar from a 10 gal tank to a 29 gal tank a little more than 2 weeks ago. The Oscar had developed a case of ï¿½hole-in-headï¿½ disease and I was looking to improve the water quality, change to a higher quality food (New Life Spectrum), add some vitamins (Boyd's Vita-Chem) and a little more varied diet (an occasional mealworm, cricket or krill). The little guy seems to have responded very well ï¿½ he is more active and his appetite is ï¿½voraciousï¿½ and insatiable. I think that the hole-in-head is healing since the whitish areas in his head are much darker now (like the rest of his coloration). I can't thank you enough for your very informative FAQs on
HLLE.
<This move is a good, good thing for him. Keep in mind that you'll eventually need about a 55 gallon to keep this guy at his full, mature size (around 12 to 14 inches), and a 75 is even better. Please do review filtration along the way and ensure it's turning the tank's volume over eight to ten times per hour. Big, beefy canister filters are really great when it comes to these lovable, messy fish!>
My problem now is that my 29 gal tank pH has dropped to 6 (or below, since my test kit only goes down to 6) and the ammonia is staying at 4 to 5 ppm.
Nitrite and nitrate are 0 ppm.
<Reading ahead, it sounds as if you've done what you could to cycle this aquarium, but since you're still having problems, I'd first start by doing huge, frequent water changes to dilute Ammonia.>
The water quality test results kind of
hovered at pH ï¿½ 7.2 to 7.3, ammonia 0.25 to 0.4 ppm, nitrite ï¿½ 0 ppm and nitrate ï¿½ 0 to 2 ppm for a little over a week after I moved the Oscar to the bigger tank. I also put some of the old gravel into the new 29 gal aquarium
and stuck the 10 gal AquaClear ï¿½BioMaxï¿½ biological media into the 29 gal tank power filter (AquaClear 50) to help along the establishment of the biological filtration system. Soon after this I transferred the AquaClear 20
power filter over from the 10 gal to the 29 gal tank to help out the AquaClear 50.
<I do like these AC filters; they're a great compromise between the media choices offered by canister filters and the ease of a hang-on-back filter. However, do ensure that your tank's turnover is somewhere around what I mention above.>
The 29 gal tank remained slightly cloudy for a little over a week in spite of all my efforts - 25% water changes and gravel filtration every other day, the two AquaClear power filters and limited feeding.
<He represents a very large bioload for an uncycled system. I'd stop feeding, for now. He can go a while until things clear up -- it's really harmful to him to continue feeding until the tank is under control, because the more you feed, the more waste he produces, and more toxic Ammonia levels become.>
Then, yesterday the water turned VERY cloudy, almost opaque, overnight. Now I am really worried and I think that I need to do something real soon to correct the pH and clear up the water ï¿½ something is really wrong in that aquarium, but I can't figure it out.
<It does sound as if this system is very out of balance, but I think this may be a fairly easy fix.>
I am thinking that;
1. My tap water may be too ï¿½softï¿½ and have very little buffering ability. I am thinking of adding either baking soda (sodium bicarbonate), Seachem Neutral Regulator (pH 7) or Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Proper P.H 7.0. Is the low pH in the 29 gal killing off the bacterial in my power filter and in my gravel? What do you recommend?
<Yes, I have had this problem myself. I tried everything (Really... everything!) to reduce Ammonia levels to zero in a newly-established pond with a good-sized bioload. Nothing would work, and my pH and KH were at rock-bottom. I employed the rift valley salt mix as detailed here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/fwh2oquality.htm. I experienced Ammonia levels in my pond for many weeks until employing this salt mix; within four or five days, Ammonia was at zero, and pH went from 6 (or below) to 7.2, KH from 0 to 4. It's an amazing mix. Often pH cures in a bottle cause rapid fluctuations in pH and lend very little stability. This mix provides for elevated, steady pH and KH levels, and for folks in our situation, gives the biological filtration a "leg up," so to speak, and makes it easier for the bacteria to do their job. My tapwater comes out with a pH of 6 or below, so I actually treat every tank/pond I've got with this mix. It's easy to use and very cheap to make.>
2. If you think that I need to adjust my pH back to 6.5 ï¿½ 7.0 should I then add some API ï¿½Stress Zymeï¿½ or other similar product to inoculate my filters again with live bacteria?
<I would be extremely careful when choosing this beneficial-bacteria-in-a-bottle. Frankly, a lot of them aren't any good. One I have experienced good results with is Dr. Tim's One-And-Only. Another thing you could do, if you have any fishkeeping buddies, is borrow some cycled media and place it into your filter. I'd avoid adding products which claim to "improve stress coat," as these products often irritate fish more than anything, and your fish is no doubt irritated enough right now. Water changes are really the best medicine right now -- large, and frequent ones would be best.>
Here is some more data on my setup that may be helpful ï¿½ about Â½ inch of gravel, temp. - 80 degrees and a 5500 K fluorescent tube. Food was changed from an old bottle of Omega One Cichlid (floating) pellets, that was never
refrigerated, to New Life Spectrum (sinking) pellets to improve nutrition.
That food was making a real mess in the tank so I changed to Hikari Cichlid Gold (floating) pellets.
<A lot of my fish, Cichlid or no, really enjoy this food. However, in order to avoid issues with digestion and bloat, it's good to feed wet-frozen foods or fresh foods (such as fish filet, like Tilapia, peas, or earthworms) from time to time. The crickets and mealworms you're feeding as treats don't count, since they have such dry, tough body parts, and as a matter of fact, in my experience (er... rather, my fish's!), mealworms are pretty much non-digestible altogether. If you check out his poop after he eats them, you'll likely see big fragments, or even possibly whole mealworms, in it. In addition, krill isn't really as good a treat as the options I list above, due to the presence of thiaminase in this food. Please do read here about the negative effects of thiaminase: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_6/volume_6_1/thiaminase.htm.
As far as your temperature, I'd decrease this to 78. Since fish are cold-blooded, keeping them very warm leads to increased metabolism, which is going to lead to him processing food more quickly, and producing waste more quickly, as well as being hungry more quickly. 78 will be just fine for him, and will help him "weather" these hard times a little easier.>
I have also used several different products to deactivate the chlorine/chloramines in my tapwater (Stress Coat, etc.).
<There's no need to use more than one if it removes both chlorine and chloramine. Just use it at the manufacturers' recommended dose every water change, and you'll be fine.>
Recently, in a panic, I have been using Ammo Lock to try to de-toxify the ammonia.
<I would, instead, go ahead and start doing big, big water changes to dilute the amount of Ammonia in the water. I'd begin with the salt mix, and either attempt to get a hold of some cycled media to "boost" the biological cycle, or get a well-recommended beneficial bacteria. Since, at this point, you really do need some Ammonia present (even though it's not ideal AT ALL, and you should keep it as low as possible) in order to feed that biological bacteria, I wouldn't use the Ammo-Lock. If ammonia is no longer available (has been "locked," so to speak) then that bacteria isn't going to grow to meet the needs of the system.>
I would appreciate any suggestions that you might have. Sorry for the long, rambling message.
<No problem. I hope this helps some, and please do write back if you have any questions after reading.>
-Greg
<--Melinda>

Detectable ammonia in an established tank 6/21/10
Hi Crew,
<Daniel,>
I have an issue with ammonia / test kits / pH that I'd like to run past you. I have a 65G planted tank that I use to grow out angels. I hadn't actually tested the water in some time as it has been running for 4 years and keeps growing out big, healthy fish. I do monitor pH though because I keep the pH below 7 and I soften the water a little with peat. It has been stable at 6.4 which is a little lower than I'd like it but I've never had a crash.
<Indeed. I'm not a big fan of low pH systems except for very specific applications. For general community tank work, pH 7 is adequate, even for the majority of South American tetras. Hardness is rather more critical than pH.>
When I ran out of reagent I treated myself to an API Master Test Kit just out of curiosity. Nitrate and Nitrite were both 0ppm but I had a moment of panic when ammonia read at 0.25ppm. I assumed that with a pH of 6.4 almost
all of that was ammonium but I was still worried. Some frantic Googling explained that salicylate test kits give false positive readings for ammonia in the presence of Seachem's Prime (which I use). I calmed down but decided to purchase Seachem's MultiTest Ammonia which is supposed to give a true reading in the presence of Prime.
<Supposedly so.>
The free ammonia reading was 0ppm but the total ammonia reading was 0.04ppm. This doesn't seem to be a critical issue for the tank but I don't understand why I have any detectable ammonia.
<Oh, could be any number of reasons. At that very low level, margin of error is going to be a factor. Remember, scientific-grade colorimetry kits that are truly accurate down to hundredths of a part per million will costs hundreds of dollars. Anything sold to hobbyists will be a much more rough and ready alternative. It's the same problem with things like pH meters and marine aquarium refractometers. In any case, there will always be tiny amounts of ammonia/ammonium present in aquarium water. Provided nitrite was zero as well, and as you say free ammonia is zero, I wouldn't worry unduly.>
My tap water has chloramines but I obtained that reading 72 hours after the last 10% water change. Is it possible that the low pH is limiting the effectiveness of my filter (Fluval 305)?
<To a degree, yes, is possible; filter bacteria are "happiest" between pH 7.5 and 8, depending on the bacteria concerned.>
I understand that biological filters don't really work below a pH of 6
<Apparently the case, or at least, the filter bacteria we normally culture in biological filters aren't multiplying rapidly at such low pH levels. Below 6, they all but stop.>
and (I have read) Nitrosomonas and Nitrobacter prefer a pH above 7.
<Certainly true.>
I also wondered if I could need more filtration but at the same time my
nitrite reading has remained at 0ppm. I assumed that if there was a problem with the filter I would see a nitrite spike.
<Indeed, though the ammonia bacteria and the nitrite bacteria have slightly different optimal pH levels, so may respond differently.>
I add and remove fish on a monthly basis on average but the bioload stays approximately the same. I haven't changed my maintenance or feeding routines. My plan at the moment is to continue monitoring closely and begin
to slowly raise the pH.
<Well worth doing, with the focus placed on hardness rather than pH.>
I'd be really grateful to hear any thoughts or recommendations.
<No simple answer here, but I suspect nothing to worry about.>
Thank you,
<You're welcome.>
Dan
<Cheers, Neale.>

Wits end with Ammonia, FW 4/28/10
Neale,
<Greg,>
I can't seem to completely extinguish ammonia after several months.
<Then there's one of two things happening. You may have false positives, as happens when chloramine and tap water ammonia is neutralised (under some situations, anyway). Alternatively, the filter isn't adequate for the job
at hand, perhaps because you're too aggressively cleaning the biological media, or overfeeding the fish, or overstocking the tank.>
Since I have had positive tests for nitrite and nitrate AND an algae bloom this is quite depressing. I can only come to the conclusion that I am overstocked. I have cut their feeding in half (once per day for about 1 minute).
<Cutting down food will help, but if the filter is overwhelmed, this reduces rather than eliminates the problem.>
Recap:
Trichogaster leeri: 1 large male (apx 4"), 2 small females (apx 2.5")
Six Corydoras all adults.
Four Red Wag Platy (adult males)
Six small Harlequin Rasbora
Tank: 36 USG bowfront 30"L x 15"W x 21"H
<This shouldn't be overstocking a 36 US gallon tank at all.>
Filter:
Aqueon Aquarium Power Filter For 30-45 gallon Aquariums - 200 GPH - Model CA30
<I think this is the problem. These hang-on-the-back filters just aren't terribly good, and there's much wasted space inside them that makes them difficult to predict in terms of performance. Perhaps I'm just a biased European, but hang-on-the-back filters are very rarely seen here. Give me a decent external canister any day of the week!>
Now, there's a chance that this is due to a clogged filter after the fish devouring some floating plants I added. They pretty much stripped it overnight. I don't know how normal it is to see a spike in ammonia when changing filters. Before the change both ammonia was around 1.0 and nitrites were also present. After the change of filter and a water change ammonia and nitrite were 0 for 24 hours and now ammonia is 1 and nitrite is 0.
<Right.>
I am not working presently so money is tight. Not a good time to start a new hobby or maintain one but watching the tank has helped me cope with down times so I'm not about to junk it.
<Understood.>
I am also planning on being out of town for a week next month. My plan if everything stays the same for the moment will be to do a couple of partial water changes before my departure and not leave any food for the 4 or 5
days I'll be gone.
<Do the water change the morning before you go, so there's at least a full afternoon to watch the tank settles down. There's nothing worse than doing the water change and filter clean on the evening before you go, and then on the following morning you see problems but don't have time to fix them!>
I also wonder if adding more filtration would buy me some time.
<Likely so.>
I have an AquaClear that is on standby that everyone but me seems to love.
It isn't self-priming and can be a pain to get restarted even after a water change. I'm not keen to trust it while I'm absent and it rattles the cover quite a bit.
<I'd stick it on the tank anyway, and see what happens. If you ammonia and nitrite levels drop to zero -- once the media matures, which should take a couple of weeks -- then that's your problem: inadequate filtration. You can
always upgrade/replace one or both of these filters with something else as/when the funds are in.>
I'm also intrigued by the new (?) Eheim Aquaball with filtration
(http://www.eheim.com/base/eheim/inhalte/indexc127.html?key=liniendetail_27481_ehen) . Well I guess not new but I hadn't seen it advertised until recently.
<An excellent filter. I have the Eheim Aquaball 60, a fine filter for the ~10 gallon tanks I use it on. The only downside is that the blue sponge filter at the top clogs pretty quickly in my tanks, but then I do tend to have rather densely planted, cruddy tanks with sand and silt! For your tank, the Eheim Aquaball 180 should be about right, all by itself.>
I had planned on looking at a canister system in addition to the power filter perhaps the Ecco Comfort. That seems like a lot for a beginner but it might be something I can transport to a new tank sooner than later.
<All the Eheim external canisters are excellent. The "Classic" range for example has been in production for at least 20 years, and there's a reason for that: they're about as good as a filter gets. The Ecco ones are easier to use, but you do a pay a premium for that. So do balance what you'd pay for an Ecco against the turnover rate and filter capacity of an Eheim Classic of similar price. For your tank, the Eheim Classic 2215 would be an outstanding filter by itself, or you could use the 2213 with the existing hang-on-the-back. The downsides? The Classic filters are fiddly to open and service, though not difficult, you just need to be careful you close the taps before you unplug the hoses. They aren't self priming either, but frankly, I've never found self priming filters prime themselves reliably
anyway, so this isn't something I care about. All Eheim filters seem rather expensive in the US, but given they operate for 10+ years, they're good value.>
So before going any further let me know what you think of adding filtration before changing tanks. This would be to tide me over.
<Do review undergravel filtration. Set up properly, this is the cheapest way to get excellent water quality. It isn't compatible with plants though, so you'd have to put plants either in their own pots (typically filled with rock wool) or else you'd choose epiphytes like Java fern and Anubias that don't care.>
Now for your opinions on tanks. I have a stand that is compatible with a 46 gallon bow front that would cost me $200. That would take the height to 24" though and I've seen your cautions about the catfish at that depth.
<Correct. Corydoras comes from shallow water habitats, and can get stressed, even drown, in deep water. Does vary from species to species though, bigger catfish being less fussy.>
They do seem fine with 21" and are pretty calm about getting up there since the evil tetras left. I guess they've been in there since November now.
<OK.>
The choice I wish I had made looking back would be a nice 60 gallon combo with stand for $350. This is only about 20" tall. I think the catfish will be OK with a few more inches than what's in there now at 24" but I cringe
at only gaining 10 gallons by paying $200 when for $350 I get a new stand and 24 gallons.
<Understandable. An extra 10 gallons for $200 isn't worth it. Save your pennies.>
I guess if adding filtration such as the Aquaball which looks easy, or bite the bullet with the canister system and all those parts to fit together,
<Internal canisters like the Aquaball are easier to maintain than external canisters. That's their key advantage. Compared to internal canisters, external canisters like the Ecco and Eheim Classics are better value in terms of turnover and media capacity, and can go for longer without servicing since they take longer to clog up and have much stronger pumps.
External canisters are also easier to hide, since they don't go inside the aquarium. Either type of filter can be a good choice, but generally internal canisters are suited to small/medium tanks with small fish and minimal silt, whereas external canisters are better choices for medium/large tanks with lots of fish or bigger fish, and where there's more
stuff like silt and dead leaves. Internal canisters typically need to be cleaned every week or two, while external canisters can go months without cleaning -- six months isn't uncommon!>
it may be cheaper way to hold tight.

This is discouraging after all this time and I'll double-check everything over the next couple of days. I think they'd be OK with my plans for a few days in May since they wouldn't be fed, but I'd rather have a stopgap in. I can afford (gulp) either extra filtration or the 46 gallon tank before then. I'm not sure I can swing $350 for a new combo but perhaps if that's the best.
<Indeed.>
Another choice may be to get a cheap 20 gallon tank and relocate the Harleys and the platys there for a bit. Let me know what you think of that option too.

I don't have a QT so that isn't a bad thing to pick up I suppose. If I go to 60 gallons the 36 gallon bowfront would make a hella hospital tank.
<Hopefully not needed.>
Please write your answer on a 100 pound note and forward to an address to be provided :)
<We do have a tip jar on the front page of WWM, so feel free to buy us a beer or two, should you feel motivated.>
PS: I think what you call "tinned" is what we yanks simply call "canned".
<Yep. Indeed, we often call them canned peas here. But we call the containers "tins" even though they aren't made from tin.>
I spent at least 30 minutes trying to figure out what cooking method "tinned" was regarding peas even though Google was desperately trying to convince me there wasn't such a thing (as far as a cooking method). I was really determined to find out how to tin my own peas!
<Yikes!>
Your humble apprentice,
GregInCharlotte
<Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Wits end with Ammonia 4/29/10
Thanks for the quick reply as usual. One thing I left out. I'd rather clean up detritus than scrape algae. It looks like you are not a fan of Octos though that is what is pushed here.
<Do you mean Otocinclus? As opposed to some eight-legged mollusc? Right, now, my issues with Otocinclus are that they're not particularly hardy and they really only graze green algae. They are ideal for tanks without major
algae problems, like nicely maintained planted tanks. That's why you see them pushed for use in 'Amano' tanks, with some justification. But for the standard community tank they have little to no impact on algae, and after a
few months will probably end up starved to death anyway.>
I am reducing light but I don't expect that to solve all of the bloom.
<If anything, it'll make it worse. Do understand that dealing with algae means providing the right amount of light for whatever fast-growing plants you're using. If you aren't using fast-growing plants, algae will grow even under fairly poor lighting, so you may as well get used to the fact you'll be using a scraper or sponge every couple of weeks.>
If I were to go the snail route, how many would be good for a 36 gallon tank?

I'll also test the treated tap water to see what water values I get. It's always tested 0 for chlorine and ammonia without treatment. I didn't think to test it after treatment.
<Oh.>
I like the idea of the canister if I don't have to fiddle with it very much.

Plus, for the photography I want to do, it won't be so ugly though my mom (me mum) wants a full length DVD with the waterfall sound of the hang on filter.
<Each to their own, I guess...>
I don't think that would sell so well (I can hear you saying "indeed" from here :)
<Indeed. Cheers, Neale.>

Ammonia problems in pond, trop. 9/22/09
Hello Crew--
My husband and I are having some problems with ammonia in our pond, and we don't know why. I really hope that you can help, because it's so frustrating to have built this indoor pond for these fish, only to have them be subjected to ammonia! That really wasn't the point! This is in our 1,000 gallon pond with the two Pacu and one Red-Tailed Catfish. About a month ago, I noticed a slight ammonia spike (.5, at the most).
<Yikes!>
I immediately assumed that it was time to increase water flow through our filter, as we were only running about 4,000 gallons per hour, and I know that 10x is recommended. So, we ordered three new pumps, and they're 5,000 gallons per hour each, so, after the plumbing (elbows and such) we should be getting around 12,000 gallons per hour. The filter is approximately a 7 ft by 1.5 ft by 3 ft area, and it is
filled with Matala filter media pads, just stacked one on top of the other. Tucked onto the very top of the pads is a layer of filter floss. We're still experiencing ammonia problems.
<Unusual... By what measure?>
The only chemicals used in the pond are Prime, and now, Organica Pond Clarifier, because it absorbs ammonia. However, we were not using this product prior to the ammonia presence, and I have never heard anything about Prime causing a false positive on ammonia tests, so I think we have ruled out a false positive, especially considering we use Prime in all of our tanks. Our ammonia tests come in at zero when I test the other tanks, so I know it's not a bad test. We have no nitrite, which is strange, because there's always a little ammonia, except in the couple of days after we add the Organica. It's like the cycle is "stuck." Though I didn't like it, at first, I did not add Organica. I didn't want to arrest the cycle, so I waited. Ammonia climbed to 1 over a week and a half, and I started doing water changes and adding the Organica. However, I would think that within this time, we would have seen nitrite. Nitrate is between 10 and 20. We do 30% water changes (just changing water) once per month, and also rent a pond vacuum and vacuum the gravel

once per month, which removes roughly the same amount of water. Prior to the initial ammonia spike, we didn't do any of the things that usually kill off beneficial bacteria -- no non-treated tap water was used to clean anything, no over-cleaning, and no medications have ever been used in the pond.
The only thing I can think of that's left is pH, which is 6.0. Could this be crippling the biological filter?
<Yes... it could>
I have read in various replies on the site that bacteria don't function as well at this low level, but since we have a 180, 125, and 75 gallon tank with no problems, I'm not sure this is the cause. What do you think?
Should I work on raising the hardness? Our water comes out of the tap at 6.6.

We are in the process of setting up a 50 gallon stock tank with water lettuce and a fluorescent fixture with grow lights to slowly pump water out of the pond, through the stock tank, and pour back into the pond. We're hoping this will help (it should be up and running tonight). The water lettuce has about twelve to fourteen inches of roots on it, so we have our fingers crossed that we'll see some sort of change.
<Might well help>
I'm sorry for the novel, but I wanted to give you as much information as possible. I appreciate any help that you can give me, because I'm stumped, and the situation is frustrating! Thanks again for all you do.
--Melinda
<Thank you for writing so completely... I would do what you have planned and look into bolstering both the pH and alkaline reserve. Please read here re: http://wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwph,alk.htm
and the linked files above. Bob Fenner>

Re: Ammonia problems in pond -- 9/22/09
Hello Bob--
Thank you for your reply. We will stop gravel vac'ing the pond for a couple of months, and will begin to add Neale's Rift Valley Salt Mix at the dosing he suggests for community aquariums. We'll probably do this very slowly, monitoring hardness and pH constantly, and only add enough to get to a pH of 7. Hopefully, we'll see some improvement. Again, thanks.
--Melinda
<Thank you Melinda. Please do report back with your findings, results. Bob Fenner>

Re Ammonia Problems in Pond... Resolved! 10/4/09
Hi Bob--
I'm writing back to update you on an earlier e-mail, in which I explained that ammonia levels were present in our pond. We began to add Neale's salt mix slowly. In order to avoid doing 250 gallon water changes over and over, we mixed up a batch which would "treat" 500 gallons in a 55 gallon barrel.
<Good>
Then, we added half of the barrel every few days, testing each time. We have now treated 75% of the water at Neale's community fish suggestion.
Our pH is up to 7.2, and KH is at 3. Best of all, ammonia has been 0 for six days! Our nitrates are up, so we'll do a large water change tomorrow, and, obviously, replace what we take out, but this worked so fast, and it was so easy, and so cheap.
<Ah yes... like moi>
I really appreciate your help in this -- it would have taken me a lot longer to come to the conclusion that you suggested. We're going to begin using this mix in our other freshwater aquariums, as well. I have one more question -- do you suggest we go ahead and add the rest of our solution in the barrel to the pond, thereby treating 100% of the volume?

Or, should we add the rest, and raise KH levels higher? Will this raise pH more (we are a little above what you suggested to me in your e-mails)?
Thank you again!
--Melinda
<Should raise pH only slightly. BobF, who will share with Neale>

Thanks for your help with the indoor pond! 10/4/09
Hi again Bob--
We'll definitely add the rest of our solution of the salt mix to the pond. Thanks for your speedy reply, and please pass along thanks to Neale for coming up with the mixture!
<Will do so>
I just wanted to provide a photo of the fish that WWM has helped so much.
And, no, your eyes are not playing tricks on you... there are 3 Pacu now.
The last, and final, Pacu was 20 inches long, and living in a 55 gallon tank before he came to us.
<Imagine its relief! To go from a world 13 inches wide to your home>
I have promised myself, the fish, and my husband that no more fish will be added! Thanks again for all of your help throughout this process.
--Melinda
<Thank you for sharing. BobF>

Re: Ammonia Problems in Pond... Resolved! 10/5/09
<Should raise pH only slightly. BobF, who will share with Neale>
<<Thanks for the update. Yes, Bob is correct, raising the KH generally doesn't raise the pH wildly. the minerals responsible are buffers, steadying the pH in both directions. For pond fish, something around pH 7.5 is ideal. The pH will go up and down through the daytime cycle, depending on photosynthesis, even as high as pH 9, but this doesn't seem to cause pond fish problems. But a pH drop, much below 7.0, is much less tolerable, especially for carps (e.g., Goldfish) which don't like soft/acid water.
Cheers, Neale.>

re: Thanks for your help with the indoor pond! 10/5/09
Hi again Bob--
We'll definitely add the rest of our solution of the salt mix to the pond. Thanks for your speedy reply, and please pass along thanks to Neale for coming up with the mixture!
<<Glad to have helped. The mixture certainly *isn't* mine. I'm trying to think where I got it from. If I recall, from the excellent The Krib site?
That sticks in my mind for some reason. Anyway, credit where credit's due.
Enjoy your fish! Cheers, Neale.>>

Fishless cycling, Freshwater 7/8/09
Hi crew, the following is an Email I attempted to send Chris Cow Ph D.
author of http://www.tropicalfishcentre.co.uk/Fishlesscycle.htm .
Apparently his email is not working.
<Unfortunate.>
Does anyone at WWM have experience with fishless cycling?
<Yes, it quite popular with the crew.>
Greetings , I read with great interest the Fishless Cycling article and wanted to share my diary with you and possibly get some feedback. My wife is the fish person while my involvement is setup and cycling.
I have a broad mechanical/fabrication background and am enjoying learning about aquarium plumbing and function.
<Good>
We already have a 10 gallon setup that we will use as a hospital tank that currently contains 2 Cichlids.
<Ok>
It turns out our well water is a natural for them ( Non chlorinated, high hardness/high pH).
<Ok>
We recently acquired a 2' x 2' x 8' 200+ gallon aquarium free (should have been my first clue) from our neighbor.
<Wow, nice.>
It was up and running until I moved it to our home on 6/1. After 2 weeks of work refinishing the base, building a new canopy, beefing up foundation, polishing scratches in acrylic tank, re plumbing pump and filters and overhauling the under gravel filter it was time to fill and cycle.
<Lots of work.>
Added 2 1/2" fine gravel over filter(filter covers the entire bottom with 3 evenly spaced 3/4"suctions in bottom of tank).
<While under-gravel filters work just fine they are sort of out of favor currently, they do have some pitfalls to be aware of. See here http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwfiltration.htm and here
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwfiltrmedart.htm for details.>
Added 15- 6" x 8" x 4" rocks along with 2 dozen fake plants and a 48" air wand.
<The rocks may cause filtration issues with the UGF as detailed in the above articles.>
Twin cartridge filters (plumbed in Parallel) with a tested pass thru rate in excess of 600 GPH
<Ok>
This aquarium will be an all Cichlid No live plant setup.
<Can't offer much on the Cichlids as I have never kept them, but we have many dedicated cichlid keepers on the crew.>
Lighting is 3- 24" Dual compact fluorescent (3- 10,000K 65 Watt white and 3-Actinic Blue 65 watt for a total of 390 watts)
<Overkill here if you do not plan on keeping plants, but should work fine,
although it might encourage algae growth.>
All test kits are by API and ammonia is 10%. Tank temp set AT 80 degrees.
Due to time constraints all tests performed once daily at 7 AM
<Ok>
Tap water : 0 Amm(ammonia) , 0 Ni(nitrite) , 0 Na(nitrate) , 200 ppm KH(carbonate hardness) , 200 ppm GH(general Hardness) , pH 8.2
<Ok>
KH , GH , pH did not vary from beginning to end so I have omitted them from the daily readings.
<Ok>
6/12 filled tank added 4 tsp(Teaspoons) Amm to achieve 5 ppm
6/13 Amm 4.0 , Ni 0 , Na 0 , added 4 tsp Amm
6/14 Amm 5.0 , Ni 0 , Na 0 , added 4 tsp Amm
6/15 Amm 5.0 , Ni 0 , Na 0 , added 4 tsp Amm
6/16 Amm 10+ , Ni .25 , Na 8 , added 4 tsp Amm
6/17 Amm 10 , Ni 1 , Na 10 , added 4 tsp Amm
6/18 Amm 8 , Ni 5 , Na 10 , added 4 tsp Amm
6/19 Amm 2 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 4 tsp Amm
6/20 Amm 0 , Ni 5 , Na 7 , added 4 tsp Amm
6/21 Amm 0 , Ni 5 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm
6/22 Amm 0 , Ni 5 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm
6/23 Amm 0 , Ni 5 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm
6/24 Amm 0 , Ni 5 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm
6/25 Amm 0 , Ni 2 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm
6/26 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm
6/27 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 7 , added 2 tsp Amm Cartridges changed
6/28 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm
6/29 Amm 0 , Ni .5 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm
6/30 Amm 0 , Ni .5 , Na 8 , 50 % water change & added 2 tsp Amm
(thought we were done, my mistake) Green algae and brown algae (Diatoms ?)appear
<Common in new tanks, water changes to keep it in check.>
7/1 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm
7/2 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm
7/3 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm
7/4 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 20 , added 2 tsp Amm
7/5 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 10 , added 2 tsp Amm
7/6 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 15 , added 2 tsp Amm
7/7 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 10 , added 2 tsp Amm
Green algae and brown algae(?) multiplying to cover all large rocks.
<More water changes will help, 10-15% weekly ideally in my opinion, biweekly at least.>
Sooo I'm a little confused.
Hardness and pH haven't changed, Ammonia has crashed, Nitrite seems to beholding at 1 ppm, and Nitrate seems to be wallowing around 10 to 20 ppm.
<Nitrates are the end product, and need to be removed by water changes, more filter material may be necessary to get the nitrite down to 0.>
Am I missing something or is this on track and just not done cycling ?
<Is not done, although hopefully will be soon, usually takes less than a month but with this sized tank and it may take a little longer.>
Will the brown algae(Diatom?)die off or do I need to take action?
<Nutrient control should keep it in check, pretty hard to eliminate completely especially without live plants to compete for resources.>
Still having fun just want to make sure I'm not spinning my wheels.
<You seem to be on track here. Enjoy, you have a nice start here and a tank that gives you lots of options.>
Thanks, Chris
<Welcome>
<Chris> <<Stop pouring in the ammonia. You're forestalling establishment of nitrification... RMF>>

Re: Fishless cycling 7/9/09
Hi Chris
<Hello>
Thanks for the input. Your site and forum are far and away the best resource on the web.
<Thanks>
It has been in the back of my mind for a while that the amount of Ammonia I add every day could be overwhelming the biological filer, so unless you have reason to object, I think it is time to shift gears. The article says to do a 80% water change before adding fish so I'm thinking I could do this and at the same time reduce the ammonia added daily to 1 tsp.
<Ok>
I will continue to test daily and also take your recommendation of 15% water changes weekly.
If the Nitrite drops to Zero that should support the idea that the biological filter is either to small or not completely developed ( I lean toward the latter).
<Agreed>
My wife ordered (on hold) 60 juvenile - 1" Mbuna Cichlid : 12 Demasoni, 12 Electric Yellow, 12 Red faced Mac, 12 Rusty and 12 Obliquidens Zebra's from www.livefishdirect.com. According to the article the amount of ammonia we have been adding is well in excess of what a fully stocked tank will produce.
<Probably, but I would still not try to introduce all these fish at once, small groups least to most aggressive.>
If this is true 60 juveniles should be a small percentage of what the biological filter will eventually need to support.
<Most likely.>
Assuming I do all the above how long should I wait to stock the tank ?
<Once nitrite hits 0 and stays there you should be ok.>
I knew when I built the canopy that the lighting was overkill but I didn't want to build it twice and I wanted to allow for future possibilities.
<Good idea.>
I will continue to research the under-gravel filter (thanks for the links).
Assuming that the UGF stays what would your recommendations be for possible live plants to combat the Diatoms/Nitrate ?
<Live plants are often problematic with UGF, could try some floating plants, or set up a sump/refugium to grow plants in.>
We have a standing order on hold for
<Stock slowly, patience is key here.>
<Chris>

Re: Fishless cycling 7/12/09
Hi Chris Saw my previous post(with your inputs) on WWM website.
At the end of the post "RMF" added a comment to the effect that I should stop adding ammonia altogether.
<Yes... adding ammonia at this juncture is very likely poisoning your beneficial microbes>
If I interpreted this correctly then I either have to add fish immediately or the biological filter will die for lack of ammonia/waste.(?)
<Neither my friend. I would simply add a "pinch" of some dried food at this point... the protein therein is sufficient to supply nitrifying microbes>
A brief update : After an 80% water change and reducing daily added ammonia to 1/2 Tsp ammonia,
Tests on 7/10 thru 7/12 show 0 ppm Nitrite and 5 ppm Nitrate. If this continues it is my intention to stock the tank on 7/17.
My question for you or any crew member with Cichlid experience is about the manner in which I stock.
My wife and I have researched this extensively and the consensus seems to be that if we are going to have an all Cichlid tank, then the proper method is to Purchase "All juveniles" of varieties known to
coexist successfully and to introduce them all at once.
<This is the best approach>
From what we read this leads to less aggression and attrition. What are we missing in this equation?
<Perhaps to start with all individuals of about the same size>
Once again I thank you for your patience and help.
Chris
<Welcome. Bob Fenner/RMF>

Re: Fishless cycling 7/13/09
Thanks so much! Will go with adding flakes starting tomorrow. And yes, the plan is to stock all 1"/1.5" juvenile fish.
Once again, we think that you have one of the greatest sites around for information.
We spent many hours reading WWM prior to doing anything to setup this tank and I am certain that the information we have gleaned will keep us out of trouble.
Thank you again and have a great day!
Regards,
Dawn & Chris
<Thank you D & C. BobF>

Ammonia Issue 05/23/09
High Ammonia Issues In Goldfish Tank
Hello, A month ago I upgraded from a 10gal to a 40gal tank. I've had the 40gal tank set up for a few weeks now and I have 2 lionheads, 2 calico Ryukins, 1 black moor, and 1 common goldfish in there. For a while the ammonia in the water was ok, until I checked it again a week ago and the ammonia spiked to 8.0ppm!! I put in ammo lock, and I've done several water changes but I am unable to get the ammonia down at all. There are signs of nitrites and nitrates.
The API liquid tests read
Ammonia: 8.0ppm
Nitrate: 5.0ppm
Nitrite: 0.25ppm
I do not know why for the past week there was the ammonia spike, and why I am unsuccessful in getting the ammonia lowered. It's stressing me out, and I'm sure it's stressing my goldfish out! I'm assuming the tank is cycling but again the ammonia is extremely high. I have yet to lose a fish but I'm worried that soon I will if I can't figure this out. I've tested the tap water for ammonia and it tested 0 ppm. I do treat the water with AquaSafe and make sure it is at room temperature before I put it back in, I've siphoned the rocks to clear the debris. During the day the fish are swimming and active, however during the evening they seem to hangout at the top of the tank. Again I've used ammo lock to neutralize the ammonia in the tank. Perhaps get an air stone to help put more oxygen in the tank? I don't know what else I can do to alleviate this ammonia problem. Any help would be great. I'm running out of ideas, and I am bound and determined to not lose any fish. Thank you, Annie
< You should have transferred the gravel and the original filter media with the additional nitrifying bacteria to the new tank to help it get cycled. You are starting from scratch so you are experiencing new tank symptoms. Add Dr. Tim's One and Only as per the recommendations on the bottle. In a couple of days the ammonia and nitrite levels should come down to normal levels. Then you can start to do water changes to keep the nitrates under
20 ppm.-Chuck>

Re: Ammonia Issue 05/23/09
High Ammonia Problems When Upgrading Tank
I did transfer the old gravel over, and I did transfer the old filter media and we did add cycle. I don't know if cycle works but I did make sure those steps were followed. I will use Dr. Tim's and follow the directions! Thank you for the advice, it's been the most resourceful information on this problem. Thank you, Annie
<I have found that Dr. Tim's products to be very effective in getting tanks started again. Many tank maintenance pro's use it when setting up new tanks. The filter media and gravel may not have been enough for the bigger tank or something may have happened to these materials during the upgrade to slow down their progress.-Chuck>

The tank won't cycle! Never ending ammonia. 8/1/08 Hello, <Hello,> I have a frustrating problem that I brought upon myself. I went a little crazy when cleaning an established 15 gal. freshwater quarantine tank. At the time, it was hosting seven young fancy platys. They had been there just over a week. When I did the regularly scheduled water change (I change 20% every other week in all my aquariums), I noticed there was quite a bit of Pleco dirt on the bottom left over from a previously quarantined fish a month before. You guessed it. I over-vacuumed the gravel which siphoned off two-thirds of the aquarium water and, like a fool, I had changed the filter pad that week too. A couple days later I had three dead fish, tested the water and found the ammonia spiked at 2.0 <Removing water has ZERO impact on how well a biological filter operates. There are virtually no bacteria in the water. If you want to change 100% of the water, then go ahead. Just did this myself yesterday with my 180-litre system because I emptied it to redecorate. All I did was make sure the temperature and water chemistry weren't too different from the water I'd taken out. Likewise rinsing or vacuuming filter media (including gravel) does no harm provided the media doesn't dry out and isn't exposed to water with much different temperature or water chemistry.> Still kicking myself, I pulled the surviving fish and stuck them in temporary hospital tanks and waited for the 15 gal to start cycling and balancing out. That was five weeks ago. The ammonia is still at .5 and nitrite and nitrate are still not showing up at all. What's going on? Should I be doing something besides waiting? Where's that nitrite? <To be honest, I suspect the tank is under-filtered, overstocked, and/or overfed. Platies are too big for a 15 gallon tank once they're mature, and while you might have been fine when they were younger, as they grow they will of course put more strain of the filter. Undergravel filters can work very well, but their capacity depends on how deep the gravel is, how fast the water is moving, and how small the gravel particles are. In any event, if you are finding your ammonia isn't going down, then one of these issues is to blame: review the filtration, stocking, and feeding.> I thought about trying bio-Spira but I did not have any luck with it when I bought it once before. Any advice is appreciated. I really miss having that big quarantine tank always standing ready. I'm almost considering tearing the whole thing down and trying to start the cycle up again. The java moss and crypts are growing beautifully, BTW. ~Mars <Hope this helps, Neale.>

Re: The tank won't cycle! Never ending ammonia. 8/2/08 Thanks, Neale. I doubt overstocking is an issue here. <The filter is inadequate/immature, or the tank is overfed. The ammonia comes from decaying organic matter, and that comes from fish and their food. There's really no argument over this linkage, so if you have ammonia in your aquarium that never goes away, then your problem is one of these issues. My gut feeling is under-filtration, or at least improper maintenance of the filter or perhaps bad choices re: media. Review these topics, and address any problems.> The seven platys were quite small and, as it is a quarantine tank, only destined to stay in the tank for 2-3 weeks. The Pleco that resided there the month before had been long removed to his new home. There were no other fish in the tank. However, judging from the amount of debris, it's clear I hadn't vacuumed properly after the Pleco was moved. <OK.> The filter isn't an undergravel but a Penguin Bio-Wheel 100 which is supposed to filter up to 20 g. <Not a fan of going by the recommended capacity of a filter. I much prefer the turnover rating.> I was looking at it yesterday and wondering if this filter might be the cause. The tank is a 15 tall and the intake does not reach all the way to the bottom so there is likely a lack of circulation on the bottom. <Sounds a good analysis. I'm just not wild about these hang-on-the-back filters. I know they're popular in the US, but you hardly see them in the UK, and I don't miss them! If you're on a budget, then a properly set up Undergravel filter or a sponge filter will work much better, with less to go wrong and much easier maintenance. For breeding tanks, sponge filters are particularly good because the gentle water current helps the baby fish, and the baby fish love nibbling on the algae and micro-organisms that grow on the sponges. Bubble-up box filters can also be very good for the same reasons.> I mocked up an extension and will give it another week to see if that helps. It's odd as I have not had water quality issues with this tank before. It's been set up for a year and a half. <The filter may well be mature but just inadequate for some reason. Do consider that filter cartridges containing carbon are basically wasting space that could be used for biological filtration. When push comes to shove, biological filtration must always be the priority. Again, that's why I like sponge filters for small tanks.> ~Mars <Cheers, Neale.>

Water problems... ammonia, cycling, treating tap... -- 6/11/08 Hi! <Hello,> I bought a 20 gallon aquarium about a month ago. I put some fancy goldfish in it to try and help cycle it. <It's a lot easier (and nicer on the fish) to use a "fishless method". The best of these is merely to grab some filter media from one aquarium and stick in in the new aquarium's filter.> About 3 weeks into owning it I ran into an ammonia problem (obviously part of the cycling process I take it). I started frequent water changes (every day) because the ammonia level was in the stress-harmful zone (lost a fish). <Yes, ammonia is likely the problem here. There are commercial products that can jump-start the filter by adding live bacteria. The most popular seems to be Bio Spira, though I admit to never having used any of them. I prefer to "seed" filters using media from other tanks. 100% effective, zero cost!> My question is this ...my tap water even after conditioning it with dechlorinator is still in the safe range but not ideal. <Meaning what? It has ammonia? First thing -- there is no "safe" level of ammonia; it's like being pregnant, it's a binary state sort of thing. So, you either have zero ammonia in the water (which is good) or not zero ammonia (which is bad). Some water supplies do contain traces of ammonia, which can be fixed using products like Ammo Lock or even many dechlorinators. Secondly, do remember that if you use some (older formulation) dechlorinators on tap water that contains chloramine rather than chlorine, you actually *make* ammonia.> Obviously, when doing a partial water change the ammonia level goes up after a couple days because the tap water isn't ideal to begin with. <Hmm... the quantity of ammonia in new tap water should be zero or very low; if the ammonia concentration goes up or at least fails to go down, then the problem is more about lack of filtration, overfeeding, or both.> Any ideas of what to do to remedy this problem (without buying expensive bottled water)? <Tap water, particularly hard, alkaline tap water, is ideal for Goldfish. Use an ammonia-neutralizing conditioner on all new water, and that should take care of the small (typically less than 0.5 mg/l) ammonia in the tap water. Your job now becomes ensuring the filter system handles the ammonia produced by the fish.> I was thinking to try a double dose of the dechlorinator? Currently I am using "AquaSafe" (1 teaspoon to every ten gallons) <Not familiar with the brand. In any case, use the dose as indicated on the package. If it says it neutralises ammonia, then fine. If not, you'll need to switch to (or supplement with) another conditioner that neutralises the ammonia in tap water. Understand this: no "ammonia removing" conditioner will do ANYTHING about the ammonia produced by your fish. As far as you're concerned, these are utterly different issues.> Any advice you could give me will be greatly appreciated as I would like to get away from changing water every other day <I understand. First, make sure you're treating new water correctly to remove tap water ammonia. Secondly, review filtration/feeding to see if the ammonia produced by the fish is excessive. Do have a read of the 'setting up' articles we've got here at WWM, perhaps starting with these: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwset-up.htm http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwfiltration.htm Cheers, Neale.> Re: Water problems 6/13/08 Thanks for the informative advice! <You're welcome.> I went today and bought a larger filter instead of the 10-20 I bought a 20-40 Ammonia levels dropped almost immediately after I put on new filter and changed water. <Very good.> One fish has ammonia scars on his little tail (not bad I've seen way worse) He keeps flashing around tank. Anything I can give him that will ease him? <Treat for Finrot. He'll recover. Provided the damage is superficial and limited to the fin membrane rather than the body, fish tend to recover quite well.> Thanks Oh, also the tank I have I bought at a garage sale for a buck and it seems to be a homemade one as it is much taller than wide (not like in stores). The tube from filter doesn't really go down to the middle of the tank. Any Ideas on how to extend it? <What sort of filter is this? One of those hang-on-the-back ones? Not sure they can be adjusted as you suggest. This does cause a problem that the bottom layer of water could be relatively stagnant. Adding an airstone would help, or even another little submersible electric filter or air-powered sponge filter placed closer to the bottom of the tank.> I checked with PetCo and they sell nothing. I was thinking maybe a piece of plastic tubing from Menards to attach? Could that have been one of the problems? (The tube goes down around a foot and a half) about 3-4 inches from middle of tank) <Well, it could help. But the pump mechanism might not work so well if the inlet is located that much further away from the impeller. I'm not an engineer though so can't comment with any authority here! Cheers, Neale.>

Chronic Ammonia? 5/10/08 Hey y'all, Love the site, it has helped me more times than I can count. This is my first time writing in as I cannot find the answer anywhere else. I have had my fresh water aquarium up and running now for about three months. At this time It contains a silver Arowana- 8in, a clown knife- 8in, a jewel cichlid- 3in, a common Pleco- 4in, and two crayfish. My dilemma is that the ammonia has registered around 4 ppm for about a month now. I figured the test may have gotten old so I replaced it with a new one and the readings are still around 4ppm. Now for the puzzling part: My Nitrites have consistently been at zero since the cycle finished, my Nitrates are around 10ppm consistently, I do bi-monthly water changes of 25%, I do not overfeed my fish, my aquarium is bare bottom, and no one in the tank exhibits labored breathing, scratching, or any other stressful behavior. As I monitored the cycle the ammonia spiked (as it should), and never dropped below 1 ppm. Then I noticed in the months that followed the ammonia would not drop. Now it has apparently skyrocketed to 4 ppm just in the last month as I said. Could there be an inhibitor for the ammonia eating bacteria, or could there be something in my aquarium giving me false positives? I would have to assume that if my ammonia was really this high for any length of time my fish would at the very least be acting funny, and my crayfish would definitely be dead. Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated. Regards James <Hi James. As you seem to understand anyway, ammonia comes primarily from the fish, either as an excretory product or else because of the decay of uneaten food. So you could review your filtration and consider whether an upgrade (or perhaps a service) is in order. For fish of the type you're keeping, I'd be recommending turnover rates of 8-10 times the volume of the tank. Things like carbon are (in my opinion) a waste of filtration space, so removing carbon the make space for more biological media may be in order. Water changes of 50% weekly would also be recommended for this type of system, but that's not really relevant to this particular problem. More important might be the size of the tank: unless the tank is fundamentally big enough (in terms of volume) to dilute the ammonia the fish produce, the combination of a too-small tank with too-weak filtration system can result in persistent levels of ammonia. Or put more simply, the filter never gets enough time to remove the ammonia in the system, and the tank isn't big enough to dilute what remains. For these types of fish, the aquarium will need to be 750 l/200 gal in size once the fish are adult, though juveniles might get away with a somewhat smaller system. Now, the other issue is servicing the filter. Filters need a certain amount of care, in particular cleaning. Removing the filter media for a rinse is fine, but some folks overdo this and end up killing the filter bacteria. Conversely, if the filter gets clogged, the lack of oxygen lets the bacteria die as well. One last consideration is your water. Some water supplies come with a certain amount of ammonia; others are treated with chloramine, and this can split into chlorine and ammonia when treated with traditional dechlorinator. So test your tap water. Cheers, Neale.>

Problems with ammonia, Goldfish in too small a world, reading 4/28/08 I have two fancy goldfish who are currently living in a 10 gallon aquarium. <Stop! This is the real problem... Need more room than this...> I am now aware that ten gallons is not sufficient and I am looking into upgrading to 30 gallons, hopefully in the near future. In the meantime, I am trying to cycle my tank <!? Fish should not be present during> and I am very concerned about the ammonia levels. Unfortunately, I did not know about cycling ahead of time. <Take the fish back> The pet store did a quick water test of my two day old aquarium water and said I was "good to go." I knew that a biological filter would have to develop, but I thought it was OK to do that with the fish in there. <No> I didn't know how hard it would be on them and that I would have such trouble addressing the issues with ammonia. Regardless, I now have two adorable fish looking to me to provide a safe environment for them. I added the two small goldfish (one Oranda, one Ryukin) 17 days ago and I have been trying to keep the ammonia levels down by doing daily partial water changes of 25 to 40%. <Mmm... the changing of water will forestall the establishment of cycling> This does not seem to be providing adequate relief from the ammonia, however, and the tank does not seem to be cycling yet (Nitrates and Nitrites are both at zero and the ammonia does not decrease significantly). I am extremely concerned for my fish. I just can't get the ammonia down to an acceptable level. Today, I placed them temporarily in a fishbowl with water that is similar to what they have in the tank (regarding temperature, pH, etc.) just to give them some relief from the ammonia while the aquarium cycles. <Won't work either> I plan to change the water daily (at least partially) and closely monitor ammonia. At least I can change the water in the fish bowl and let their aquarium cycle without them. I just could never get the ammonia down to zero in the aquarium. Is this OK? How long can they stay in the fish bowl? I just want them to be somewhere safe while their home undergoes all the ammonia and Nitrite, etc. spikes. I want them to go back in as soon as the aquarium water is safe for them. Please help. I love these little guys <Then return them temporarily... use a real cycling product or other means... see below> and I know a fish bowl is not where they should be but I don't know what else to do. Thank you so much. Sincerely, Laurie <Read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm and the linked files above. Bob Fenner>

How to clear 0.5 Ammonia Level? -- 03/07/08 Hello, My 20cm Flowerhorn who is in a 55-gallon tank has stopped eating and changed swimming behaviour for a week. The pet store tested the water, everything is OK except ammonia level (0.5) and I was recommended to clean and use Ammo Chips for the filter . I did as recommended but today when the pet store tested again. the ammonia level is the same without improvement. I usually change water every day, about 1 gallon every 1 or 2 days to remove fish feces. I don't know how the tank got that ammonia level. Please show me how to remove the ammonia or any solutions to use for ammonia removal. Thank you. Sophie <Greetings. Ammonia-removing chemicals won't work in a situation like this. Ammonia-removers are designed either to remove ammonia from tap water or from small, lightly stocked aquaria where biological filtration can't work. In your case, the problems are one or more of these: overstocking, under-filtration, or overfeeding. Pick and choose. I'd recommend a program of major water changes per week, at least 50%. The filter needs to be providing at least 6 times the volume of the aquarium in turnover per hour (i.e., the filter used in your tank needs a turnover of not less than 6 x 55 = 330 gallons per hour). Reduce the amount of food you are providing; fish need no more than they can eat in a couple of minutes. Big fish only a need a single meal per day, and skipping a meal once a week will do no harm at all. Lean towards green rather than meaty foods to provide energy with less protein, as this will also help. If you fail to manage the aquarium as I've described, this fish will soon be dead: cichlids have very little tolerance for ammonia. Cheers, Neale.>

Guppies... hlth., use, dis-use of ammonia removing tap/source water treatment products 02/29/2008 I'm sorry for being a nuisance but I wonder if you could give me a bit of advice, I purchased 2 male guppies and 2 female guppies yesterday to go with the other guppies in my tank but two of the males have since died, I checked the water and found that the PH, Nitrate and Nitrite were smack on the correct level, but the ammonia gave a reading of 8.0. <Means one of two things. Firstly, the filter could be completely immature (i.e., the fish produce ammonia, but not ammonia gets converted to nitrite, let alone nitrate, so you detect zero nitrite and whatever nitrate level you have in your tap water. Alternatively, you have a source of ammonia above and beyond what the filter can cope with, e.g., ammonia in the tap water, or a lot of decaying organic material. Either way, extremely bad news.> I added some "Ammo Lock" to the water but when I checked it this morning it was still high so I changed a third of the water and added some "Tap Safe" I have just checked the water again and whereas all the other readings are correct, the ammonia is still between 4.0 and 8.0 so I added some "Interpet Ammonia Remover" <OK, you're misunderstanding what these Ammo Lock-type products do. They do not remove ammonia produced by the fish or from decay. All they do is neutralise small (typically less than 0.5 mg/l) amounts of ammonia that sometimes are found in tap water. If your tap water has ammonia, then obviously adding it to an aquarium would be bad, so these product render than ammonia harmless. What they CANNOT do is remove masses of ammonia constantly being produced by livestock or decay in the aquarium. If it was that easy we wouldn't bother with filters! So put them away; they are as much help here as a bottle of mineral water would be for putting out a forest fire. You need to establish why your aquarium is generating ammonia (because it is). Review: stocking, feeding, filtration. Do also check you are using the correct dechlorinator: if your local water supplier uses chloramine, but you use a dechlorinator that doesn't treat chloramine, you end up with a measure of ammonia in each bucket of treated water. Stop feeding the fish, for a start. Check the filter is running and mature. Do 50% water changes DAILY until things get down to normal. Ammonia is incredibly toxic to fish, and anything above zero will kill them quickly.> Do you have any suggestions on why all the readings are fine apart from the ammonia. <Outlined above.> The other thing which puzzles me is that although the guppies have died, all the other fish are thriving, including two very small molly fry which are between a third and half the size of my neon tetras. Many thanks for your help. <Hmm... fish that have been in deteriorating conditions will adapt (to a point) whereas new stuff added from a clean tank to a dirty tank will just keel over and die. But the short answer is if you have ammonia in the water, then chances are all the fish will die.> Regards, Gaynor <Hope this helps, Neale.>

Ammonia, FW, reading 2/22/08 I have read the q&a section of your site <Have read your msg. here... the Q and A is not where you need to peruse...> and could not find what I was looking for. I have a 55 gal. aquarium with about 1-2ins of gravel. An AquaClear Power Filter with Chemical, Mechanical and Biological Filtration. Artificial Plantings and Decos. bought at PetSmart. Set-up tank 12/31/07 without fish. Readings: Amon.-O 1/5/08---Amon - 0.5 PH - 6.5 PH - 7 No2 & No3 - O No2 & No3 - O On 1/9/08 I added 6 Danios for cycling - Amon. Levels stayed at 0.5, <... this is toxic... There should be no fishes present> PH stayed at 7, No2 & No3 stayed at O until 2/12/08. Was in constant contact with a knowledge salesperson at PetSmart (I thought) due to the Ammonia level not going above 0.5 and any rise in the No2 % No3. He told me not to worry about it and the fact that my tank is 55gal., it will take longer to start cycling. <This is so> On 1/24/08 he told me it was ok to add more fish. <Was there still measurable ammonia present? Still toxic> He suggested 3 swordtails & 1 male gold/honey Gourami. (Total now 10) On 2/4/08 noted 1 Danio missing and never found to this day-searched everywhere including gravel. Salesperson told me that it was probably a weak one, died and was eaten. Still telling me the Amon. level was ok even though I kept telling him of my concern. No2 & No3 still at O. <... trouble> On 2/10/08 he told me the cycle must be complete and that I could add more fish. He suggested 6 Australian Rainbows. 3 female & 3 males (Total now 15) On 2/17/08 Amon level- 1, PH-7.2, No2 & No3 - O <...> Had been doing 15% - 25% water changes every week, rinsed foam (2/10/08), replaced carbon (2/13/08) and then replaced foam (2/20/08) Last water change was 2/17/08 (25%) Still no change in Amon, Ph, No2 % No3. Am really concerned and don't want to lose any fish but thinking it may be too late. <Have you read on WWM re FW cycling?> On 2/21/08 noted tiny bit of tail fin on a Danio missing. It is eating fine and swimming fine. Also noted that the Gourami stays pretty much by itself now. It's not eating that well and its' movements are strange. At times when it's swimming forward it looks like it is hopping forward instead of a smooth forward motion. As you can tell, I am new to this hobby and want to have a healthy tank. <You should have read, been reading... not listening to a lone "sales clerk"> What is happening? I am thinking that the tank didn't cycle when I was told it did and may be cycling now with all of these fish in there. What can I do? Is there any hope for my fish? Should I stop feeding and changing water? Please Help asap Thank you for any info. you can give me <... Read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm and the linked files above, particularly Ammonia... I would be very careful re feeding anything much here, and immediately seek out and use BioSpira (A Marineland product) to establish cycling here. No more fish for now... Bob Fenner>

New Tank Problems Debating the Next Step... FW... mis-mix, new tank, ammonia... 9/9/07 Hello. I've done quite a bit of research in these last two weeks and have found your site to be the most informative and hopefully helpful. Our situation is probably not an uncommon one, but knowing that doesn't make it any less stressful. Two weeks ago my husband decided to invest major money in a 20 gallon aquarium. Of course since he had kept a few goldfish alive in a small tank years ago, he thought he knew what he was doing. I tried to research, but he didn't give me any time. He bought the tank and set it up on a Saturday night. He wanted to get fish 24 hours later and I tried to convince him to wait but the most he would wait was 48 hours. <Mmmm, hmm> During that time I researched the fish he wanted to get and found out that they were cichlids who would need a larger tank or to be an only child virtually. This did not jive with his idea of a tank full of pretty fish so without consulting me he decided to change to buying what he thought would be smaller more peaceful fish, and he bought 9! Mistake number one over stocked tank. Mistake number two, too many fish introduced at once. Mistake number 3 fish that didn't necessarily go together, <Yikes!> 2 Kissing Gouramis, 2 Tiger Barbs (which I discovered need to be in a larger group to get along well and not stress out each other or others) 2 Silver Dollars, 1 Bala Shark, 1 Albino Rainbow Shark and 1 Silver Tip catfish. <Some mix now! The last fish isn't even freshwater...> We then proceeded to Mistake number 4 overfeeding, he fed them everyday and probably more than he should have. Mistake number 5 was probably the wrong testing kit. Although he wouldn't listen to me and anything I found out on the web, he completely believed the LFS people. They sold him a little testing strip kit, <Notoriously inaccurate, imprecise> and although we read about the nitrogen cycle in the tank info, and knew we had to test for ammonia, since ammonia wasn't listed on the test strip we assumed that the PH and ammonia must be the same thing. Not once did the LFS people mention ammonia or testing for it. <Dismal> For several days the fish seemed okay, and according to the little strip nitrate and nitrite were okay and PH was 6.5. We did do a small water change and added the conditioner again on day 4 and all was fine. Then we began to notice the one Tiger Barb constantly bullying the other to the point of him hiding and shaking. The gouramis also seemed occasionally stressed by this fast aggressive little guy. Finally we started seeing little white spots on the gouramis and dollars and the more aggressive barb started floating funny so we removed him for a day or so and treated him with Melafix, <...> which perked him right up. I researched the spots and discovered it was ICH so we bought copper safe <!> and dosed the tank once but had to remove the filter so that the medication would absorb. During the removal of filter for the first time it ripped. Have you noticed I've stopped counting mistakes at this point. <Yes... and I must commend you... for being so level-headed and such a good recounting> The white spots did seem to fall off the fish but in my reading I knew that we needed to continue to treat the new water we added for up to a month and to raise the temp to 82 to shorten the cycle of the ICH and catch it at it's most vulnerable. Since we were treating the ICH and Mr. Barb seemed better we added him back to tank. The next day though (this is by now day 8) we noticed the water started getting murky. <Cycling...> We weren't sure if it was the treatment we added or no filter to keep things moving or the natural cycling process. We then noticed the fish sitting on the bottom from time to time not moving much. However the apparently ineffectual little strips we had from the pet store kept telling us that the nitrate and nitrite were zero and the PH was in normal 6.5 range. We did a small water change and decided to not add any more CopperSafe just in case that was the problem. <Has to be tested for (copper) to prevent poisoning from overexposure> We also added the filter back but had to replace the pad that had ripped (Mistake Number ???) because there went any good ammonia eating bacteria we might have accumulated. At this point my husband actually started asking me to see if I could find out what was wrong. <Yay!> Apparently research could have a use after all. The fish were starting to gasp, alternating between laying on the bottom and hovering under the surface. With some more research I found from some helpful people that the ammonia was probably our biggest problem. ICH could be worried about later but the ammonia would kill our fish quick. This person finally informed us that the PH and ammonia are NOT the same thing and we needed a separate kit, all of $5.00. We bought this kit the evening of day 11 and found our ammonia was halfway up the chart on 1 By this time our fish were really gasping, even our catfish and Bala were swimming funny when they had seemed the least affected. On this site I found a recommendation to do a huge water change so my husband did that and also siphoned some of the gravel as he had just bought a siphon for the first time as well. That's when he could really see the amount of waste and food that was contributing to our ammonia. He also added AmmoLock to the water as well as the conditioner this time. The fish perked up a little, but within a few hours were listless again. However it was late at night and I was gone out of the house, so he didn't do another check like I would have suggested. When I got home at midnight I thought I would ask him about it in the morning and he would tell me he had done another check, and then I would have him do another water change. However, when I woke up he had gone to play golf. I also discovered one of the fish was missing, which, when he returned from golf he told me was due to a power outage we had in the middle of the night. He thinks the albino made his way near the filter when it was turned off and somehow got out of the top because he was on the floor this morning. With him gone and no information I did a test myself and found ammonia still at .50, and the fish were gasping, so I did a 30 percent change adding the conditioner and AmmoLock. Two hours later they weren't looking any better. Ammonia still said .50 so I attempted a 50 percent change. Then he came home. I told him that I had done a 50 percent change but he thought I meant that morning, so about 2 hours later, while I was gone, he did a 50 percent change. I think all of this change and the ammonia finally drove the fish over the edge, because within 2 hours of this last change, the 2 dollars, the Bala, the catfish, and one Barb all lost the fight. The 2 gouramis and remaining barb didn't look so well either so he removed them for awhile and decided to do another big water r change, still with the AmmoLock and conditioner, and clean the gravel really well. He then waited and checked the ammonia and it was down to .25. I did finally buy a separate nitrite kit so will test that too instead of believing the zero the little strip test tells me. So now for the questions............. Do we put the 2 gouramis and one barb back (even though they are iffy)? <Mmm, can... I would... along with a fresh pack of a product called BioSpira...> Do we try to continue to cycle with this tank as is if even one fish makes it and then let it go for a good solid 6 weeks before we even think about adding another fish as we should have done originally? <Likely a good routine> If all fish die do we put a new fish in immediately to keep the tank cycling or do we not subject any fish to this crazy toxic tank and clean it our and start fresh? <Perhaps the latter would/will be best for peace of mind> Thank you for reading this novel. This aquarium was not my choice, and if it had been or if I had been able to have any input, I would have thoroughly prepared ahead of time and hopefully sidestepped most of these mistakes. But either way, I can't stand to see a living creature suffering and I really don't want to waste such a huge investment financially and emotionally. Any help is greatly appreciated. Rea <Your husband... and the aquatic livestock in both your care is indeed fortunate to have someone as yourself... Intelligent, curious and caring... to look out for their welfare. Unfortunately by the time you discovered the ammonia issue (to be expected) in this small, crowded, ich-infested, mis-stocked mess... doing water changes to dilute the metabolite also forestalled/forestalls the establishment of cycling... Do please keep reading, culturing that husband... and put together a more sustainable mix going forward. Bob Fenner>

Ammonia levels 9/6/07 Hi guys/girls, <I'm a guy,> I wrote about 3wks ago...thanks for your advice! So when I previously wrote, my ph had crashed and I found my water cloudy white and foamy. Got the ph problem solved. Now I can't seem to get the ammonia levels down, ever since I wrote last. It's very high, been using Ammo lock, but can't get it down. <Ammo Lock doesn't make ammonia go away. All it does is remove ammonia from water *out of the tap* that contains small amounts. To manage ammonia in the aquarium, where it is constantly being produced by the fish and other animals, you need a biological filter OR a chemical filter (Zeolite).> I've had the tank around 6-7 weeks. It's just a small 6gal and I have just two tiny fish; an Endler's and Otocinclus; perhaps the tank's still not fully cycled. <Indeed not.> Just strange since there's only two of them in there. <Not really all that strange.> I was doing 20% water changes every 2-3 days. Since the ammonia's high, I suppose I should do a change every day? I've also been vacuuming the substrate 1x/wk. <Largely redundant. But if it makes you feel better, sure.> Question about my substrate, I have sand, maybe coral sand (around 2 1/2 inches deep.) Don't ask me why I have sand. <Nothing wrong with sand. I use it myself. But there's a big difference between silica sand and coral sand. Silica (or silver) sand is chemically inert. Coral sand is calcareous and raises the pH and hardness. While your Endler's guppy won't care either way, your Otocinclus will, being a native of quite soft/acid water conditions.> Bought it on suggestion of LFS, wasn't aware of what substrate to buy :( From what I read, seems that gravel is a better bet for freshwater? If yes, why so? <Not better/worse -- difference. On the plus side, silica sand at least doesn't affect the water chemistry, fish like digging into it, and plants root readily in it and seem to like growing in it, possibly because of the dysaerobic conditions that develop a few cm below the surface. On the downside, big fish make a mess swishing it into the filter, and organic material can decay anaerobically under deep beds of sand, releasing toxic gases. Never seen this myself, but on paper at least, its possible if you don't take precautions. Gravel has some pluses and minuses itself. The good: it is cheap and only big fish can move it around. The bad: its boring and burrowing fish hate it, to the point where they can damage themselves trying to dig into it. Plants aren't wild about it either, unless it's backed up with something more nutritious, like laterite. Now, coral sand is whole different kettle of fish. Coral sand is used exclusively in freshwater tanks where plants *aren't* grown but hard water/brackish water fish *are* being kept. It's the standard substrate for Malawi and Tanganyika cichlid aquaria for example. Standard tropical fish (tetras, gouramis, etc) don't like it though, because it raises the pH and hardness.> I also feel like I'm not getting enough of the waste sucked up when I vacuum, and perhaps that's leading to the high ammonia levels? <No, not much stuff gets into the substrate, and even if it did, it would make a difference. The ammonia is related to how much protein (in food) you put in the tank. Where that protein decays in the gravel or the filter or a fish makes no odds. Nitrogen is nitrogen is nitrogen.> Would you suggest switching to regular gravel? <If you have coral sand, yes; if inert silica sand or similar, not unless you want to.> If not needed, I'd rather not. The Oto seems to get stressed very easy, so I'd rather not take him out of the tank if possible. <He's a schooling fish, and is nervous because he's frightened. Within the next month (which should be long enough for your filter to finish maturing) buy 2 more Otocinclus!> Any advice is very appreciated...thanks!!! Vanessa <Hope this helps, Neale>

Re: Ammonia levels 9/6/07 Got your reply Neale, thanks so much. What I meant about the Ammo lock is, I'm using it in conjunction with water changes, but yes definitely it won't remove the ammonia. Will do another change today. <Good.> More questions about my sand. I'll have to find out from LFS what kind of sand it is exactly, before I decide if I should switch. I read on your site the following about sand: "My suggestion for fine sands is to use an inch or less (aesthetic and prevents nutrient accumulation, but supports less life) or a minimum of 3-4" (some risk of nutrient accumulation, but supports more life that better processes these nutrients, also better denitrification). In either case, I would avoid any stirring or major disturbance of fine grained substrates. Such action can cause major disturbances in water quality." So, when I read that, I assumed my vacuuming and stirring was causing the ammonia spikes from waste; changing water quality. <Possibly, but it's important to realise the ammonia comes from the protein you put in the tank. At the end of the day, whether the aquarium is completely empty or filled with plants, fish, sand, and corals is neither here nor there. 10 grammes of protein will make the same amount of ammonia, regardless. It might take longer for the protein to decay into ammonia in an "empty" tank than a busy one where it's metabolised by the animals, but the amount of ammonia produced will be the same.> And about the following, did you mean it would 'not' make a difference? Just confused. <Yes.> Lastly, you mentioned 'organic material can decay releasing toxic gases. Never seen this myself, but on paper at least, its possible if you don't take precautions.' Being the sand is 2 1/2", perhaps I should make it around an inch instead, to prevent more accumulation? Sorry for being naive about this. As for precautions, was thinking of getting some waste reducer; not sure if this is suffice. <I'm assuming you're reading the above from sometime on marine tanks, since denitrification isn't a big deal in freshwater aquaria. Anyway, in a freshwater tank there are three ways to keep sand "safe". Firstly, you use burrowing fish, like loaches, Corydoras, earth eating cichlids. These dig through the sand and remove bits of food and also turn the sand over, keeping it aerated. The second thing you can do is install lots of plants. Plant roots transport oxygen into the sand, and in doing so, prevent anaerobic decay. If you've ever looked at the mud at the bottom of a pond, it's quite gooey and black because of the lack of oxygen. This anoxic state makes the mineral ions more available to the plants. To live there, the plant roots carry oxygen down with them, sort of like a breathing tube. Some of this oxygen escapes, and aerates the mud. We can use this in fish tanks. Finally, you can add Malayan Livebearing snails. These fantastic little creatures burrow through the substrate, eating up every scrap of decaying material, and also aerate the sand, like earthworms on land. I *always* use these snails in my tanks. They're totally harmless to plants.> Thanks again for all your help. Your website's great!! Vanessa <Hope this helps, Neale>

Ammonia problems! Five gallon, goldfish... -- 08/31/07 Hi! <<Hi, Danielle. (My daughter's name by the way.) Tom here.>> First off, I want to say that this is a great site! <<Thanks, Danielle. Glad you like it!>> We bought a 5 gallon mini bow tank back in May from the LFS. Picked up 2 gold fish and a little frog. <<Danielle, I can't begin to tell you how much too small a five-gallon tank is for ANY Goldfish. 25-30 gallons is more appropriate for the fancy varieties and figure 50+ gallons for Commons, Comets, and Shubunkins. (Now, after you've caught your breath, picked yourself up off the floor and stopped disparaging the parents of the individual that allowed you to buy Goldfish for a five-gallon container, we can get to the details.)>> Everyone was great for about a week and then the fish started dying. <<Not unexpected though I'm sorry to hear this.>> Took a water sample to the LFS and they said to do a 50% water change, that the ammonia was high (2.5), but the nitrates and nitrites were 0. <<Not that your fish stood a chance, Danielle, but a 95%-100% change would have been my recommendation'¦daily. The tank hadn't 'cycled'.>> Bought my own test kit and kept an eye on all readings. <<Excellent.>> After 4 more fish died, I realized that my LFS was missing something so I did some research and learned all about cycling a tank. <<Something the folks at the LFS apparently had never heard about?>> Wish I would've known about that first! <<Indeed.>> Anyway, went to a Petco and they gave me some gravel from an established tank. I placed it evenly throughout the bottom of my tank and let it stay there for about 2 months. <<A good move. Not optimal but still good thinking on your part.>> Reading on 8/10 showed nitrite 2.0, nitrate 10., ammonia 1.0 and ph 6. I assumed my tank was cycled. <<Nope.>> We took our sons to a county fair and they won 2 goldfish. One is small about one inch and the other is about <<?>> inches. Well, I placed them in the (I thought) cycled tank. The next day I tested the water and now the readings are nitrite 0, nitrate 5., ammonia 2.0 and the ph is 7.5! <<They won't make it, Danielle. Even trace amounts, say 0.25 ppm of ammonia, is deadly. You can't possibly keep Goldfish alive in a five-gallon tank. They produce too much ammonia/waste for a five-gallon tank to sustain.>> I did a 50% water change. I'm guessing that I put in too much for the tank and that it wasn't fully cycled. <<Correct on both counts.>> How can I not lose these fish? <<Realistically? You can't keep from losing them. (Don't get me wrong. We've worked folks through worse but, the bottom line is that they had far bigger tanks.) A five-gallon tank has virtually no stability. Conditions can 'go south' in a few hours with a tank this small. That said, and given the fact that you've written to us (which indicates to me that you care), no more fish until we work out what you need to keep your pets healthy and thriving. Okay?>> Would doing 50% water changes daily be okay? <<I don't like coming off like a horse's patootie, Danielle, but you'd need to do 100% changes perhaps three times a day to stand a chance. Beside their waste products, Goldfish (like other fish) excrete ammonia from their systems through their gills -- very specialized gill filaments called lamellae. Without proper cycling for beneficial bacterial growth, room for dispersion/dilution and adequate filtration, your Goldfish might as well be living (?) in a septic tank -- with about the same chance for survival.>> Yesterday was the last time that I fed them. I read that I should wait a couple of days. Is this okay? <<Less feeding is better given the situation, Danielle. Not 'the' solution but a good idea nevertheless.>> Any help you can give me would be greatly appreciated! <<Inclined to take a shot at it, Danielle? Get a large Tupperware-style storage bin, or something similar, and fill it with dechlorinated, i.e. conditioned, water. Move the fish to it. They'll be better off than they are now and you won't have quite as many headaches. :) Purchase an aquarium of about 30-gallons, or larger, and start the cycling process. (I'll tell you of another 'trick' in a moment.) Goldfish won't need a heater but they will need lots of filtration. Double or triple the size of the filter that the manufacturer claims it will serve. Goldfish need 7-12 water exchanges per hour. GPH is what you want to look at, not tank size. So, for a 30-gallon tank, figure on a filter that handles, minimally, 230 gph. (There's about a 10%-15% loss from the manufacturer's claims.) Decorate the tank as you'd like but use a dark (black?) substrate. (There's a reason for this.) Once the tank is up and running, the 'trick' I suggested is BIO-Spira from Marineland. It's somewhat pricey but you can -- in fact, must -- add the fish to the tank within hours to preserve the live bacteria the product contains. (Should be added to the filter chamber versus the tank.) A long-winded description that I'll be happy to go over with you in shorter 'bursts', Danielle, but that's what you need to do. (Save the five-gallon tank for a Betta. Wonderful size but he'll need a heater (Hydor 'Theo' -- 25 watts) and a sponge filter (quite inexpensive).)>> Thanks, Danielle <<'Information overload'-time, Danielle. I realize this, which is why I'd like you to write back with specific questions you might have, if any. A lot to digest, certainly, but Goldfish can live for 20 years, or more, in the right environment. Best regards. Tom>>

Re: ammonia problems! (follow-up) 9/1/07 Hi Tom, <<Hi, Danielle!>> Thanks for the fast reply! Maybe having your daughter's name got me faster service, lol! <<It didn't hurt! :) >> It would be nice if the LFS gave accurate info. <<In a 'touch' of fairness, Danielle, solving problems with fish/aquariums isn't the main thrust of their jobs. They're there to move merchandise, period. A shame, really.>> After I wrote to you, I did some more reading on the site and started doing 95% water changes. I have done 2 so far in the past 4 hours. Ammonia went down to .25 but from what you've told me, I'll be doing this everyday for the rest of the goldfishes' lives! Not fair to them and too much work for me! <<Good to hear about the decreased ammonia levels, Danielle. As you now know, even .25 ppm can be/is deadly but it's a far cry from 2.0! Good job and I certainly do agree that both you and your Goldfish will need relief from the water changes. A larger, cycled aquarium will do just that.>> I actually went out and bought a 92 quart plastic tub the day the kids won them to get them home from the fair (was 3 hours from our house, didn't want them to not make the ride home). Is it okay if I keep them in there for a day or two until I can get to the store to get all my supplies? <<Absolutely! Nearly tripling the size of the container they're in now will help a lot. You don't want to get lax about their care, obviously, but you'll certainly be giving yourself and your pets a 'leg up' on the situation.>> Again, thank you so much! Danielle <<You're most welcome. If you have any more issues/questions prior to making any substantial purchases, please get back to me/us. Hopefully, I've given you -- along with the information you've found here at WWM -- plenty to make an informed decision on how to go about this. No need for 'guesswork'. The better informed you are, the less chance that someone will pass off 'bum' information on you once you're in the store. Lastly (?), if you're in doubt about ANYTHING, don't make the move! From here on in, informed choices/decisions are going to be the key to success in our hobby. My best to you and your family'¦and fish! Tom>>

Ammonia in uncycled FW tank, needs to read -- 07/18/07 Hi, I think your FAQ's site is great. <Me, too.> However, I am a new fish tank owner. The tank is 29 gallons and I am looking to stock with fresh water tropical fish. The instructions that came with the tank said to add fish the first week of set up then a 1/3 the second and 1/3 the third week. So I did. Now I am down to 2 Dalmatian mollies. The ammonia levels are off the chart and the national pet store told me to use chemicals. They don't work to bring the ammonia down even a little. What do I do? I don't want the last two fish to die as well even though they have survived these conditions for 2 weeks now? Please help, the store keeps giving me bad advice. <Do large partial water changes (up to 90% if the ammonia is high) daily to dilute the ammonia. Watch out for nitrites to appear and act accordingly. Add some old filter material or refrigerated live bacteria like BioSpira to your filter. Search WWM for cycling a tank, nitrogen cycle (e.g. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm) and mollies (e.g. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/mollies.htm) and their needs. Don't add any more fishes until you tank is cycled. Cheers, Marco.>

Urgent Ammonia, FW 7/11/07 Hi, great web site and you have helped me successfully in the past, so firstly thanks. <<Thanks and, let's see if we can do it again! (Tom here, by the way.)>> I am at a loss and need your help urgently again. <<Been there myself once or twice.>> My 50 gallon tank finished cycling last week the levels were 0 ammonia, 0 Nitrite, 40 Nitrates and I had finally got pH down to 7.0. <<Nitrates, as you're no doubt aware, are far too high but all else looks good.>> I have a community freshwater set-up with live plants. <<Okay.>> I have 8 Platies all pairs, 19 Rasboras (mixed), 2 CAE, 1 male and 1 female (Golden), and 4 young angel fish (sex unknown). I also have 5 baby Platies in a segregation tank within my community tank. <<The CAE's are going to become problematic as they mature, particularly where the Angels are concerned. They lose their taste for algae and develop a taste for the slime coating/flesh of other tank mates, especially slower moving, tall-bodied species like your Angelfish. Not your immediate issue, I understand, but it definitely will become one if you keep these animals. They can/will kill tank mates. Just a head's up.>> I had lime scale build up in my filters pipes so I expelled it into the tank, I have done this before with no toxic fall out. <<Not where I would have 'expelled' it but shouldn't be a problem.>> Soon after cycling the filter failed and all the hard work seemed undone. <<Not what you want to have happen, that's for sure.>> Ammonia levels spiked off my testing chart so I did filter maintenance and cleared the gravel of as much waste as possible, reduced feeding, started treating water with ammo lock and aquarium salt. <<The salt wasn't going to be overly beneficial in this case but water changes on a massive scale would be.>> Did 15% water change, left 2 days retested, still high did 25% water change, left another 2 days, still high did a 50% water change retreating water as before as necessary. Still off the chart I tested my tap water which was negative for ammonia so that's not the problem. <<When I suggest a massive change, this is on the order of 90%+ and possibly more than once per day. 'Detectable' levels of ammonia are lethal and your levels are, by your own admission, off the chart. No time for partial measures. Fish are highly stressed but none have died yet! Levels won't drop. I don't know what else to do. Should I empty tank completely starting from scratch? I can't find the cause of the ammonia spikes. <<The ammonia isn't 'spiking' in the normal sense of the word. It simply isn't going away because you haven't attacked the problem vigorously enough. You can't just let the tank sit after a big change. You need to re-test within hours. If ammonia's detectable at that point, change the water again, BIG TIME, until levels are undetectable. Hardcore as this sounds, you won't have a fish left otherwise.>> I have recently had the introduction of snails in my tank ( not by choice ) currently only 3 as far as I can tell, can they be polluting the water? <<You've got, as of your writing, 30+ fish in a 50-gallon tank. The snails are contributing virtually nothing compared to your other livestock. Now, I confess some confusion about your filter here. Did it temporarily quit pumping? Did it die completely? Was a new filter purchased or is the old one up and running again? What I'm getting at is that your beneficial bacteria shouldn't have taken such a hit that your ammonia levels went ballistic if the filter media was preserved in either the old filter or after being transferred to a new filter. You could possibly have spiked a bit but not on the order that your sharing with us now. I'm surmising that a new filter was purchased and the old one tossed out, i.e. you started re-cycling from square one. The only thing that makes sense to me.>> HELPPPPPPPP!!!!!!! <<Regardless of what transpired filter-wise, you absolutely MUST stay on top of the water changes'¦fanatically! If you can, find a local LFS that carries BIO-Spira from Marineland. Addition of this product will all but instantly cycle your tank and, hopefully, save what you can of your pets. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you. Best of luck. Tom>> Re: Urgent Ammonia, FW 7/12/07 Thanks for your fast response. <<Happy to do so, Victor. (I'll enclose my "quotes" for readability.)>> 'Nitrates, as you're no doubt aware, are far too high but all else looks good.' Yes, nitrates should have been 20 or below. <<On the money.>> 'The CAE's are going to become problematic as they mature, particularly where the Angels are concerned.' The CAE'S are a female and male pair who have grown to 4-5 inches since the onset of my tank and have no problems with my other fish including the angels. They are already over a year old and still not a problem; maybe I got lucky as I have read all the bad press but never experienced it to date yet. <<Please do keep an eye on them, though.>> 'The salt wasn't going to be overly beneficial in this case but water changes on a massive scale would be.' I heard it aids breathing and stops pathogens that can attack when fish are stressed! <<Easy, Victor. Your first point is correct but to a limited degree. Same with your second point. I probably would have tried just about anything, myself, under the same circumstances but I don't want to give the rest of our readers the idea that salt is some type of 'silver bullet' given the situation you were/are faced with. No criticism here whatsoever and I apologize if it was construed as such.>> 'The ammonia isn't 'spiking' in the normal sense of the word. It simply isn't going away because you haven't attacked the problem vigorously enough.' Last water change was 75% this morning and I manually removed all snails I could see. <<More on a par with what I'd like to see you going after. Good job! Now, increase it to 90%+.>> 'You've got, as of your writing, 30+ fish in a 50-gallon tank. The snails are contributing virtually nothing compared to your other livestock.' Yes, but the angels are young/small and I intend to rehome one/two of them as they get bigger. Rasboras don't take much mid-tank space and Platies don't grow too big (although I will be rehoming at least two - four soon as a neighbour is getting a tank and will probably take the baby Platies as well) with the CAE'S taking the bottom of the tank between themselves. <<Not an issue of stocking, per se, Victor. It's the collective contribution of ammonia to your system that I was referring to. Each and every one of your fish is adding ammonia regularly. Some fish will rid their systems of ammonia through 'waste' while others actually expel ammonia from their systems via specialized cells in their gills. Regardless of the means, your system's getting inundated by sheer numbers alone.>> 'I confess some confusion about your filter here.' The filter seemed to stop pumping so I assumed it got blocked maybe from the lime scale discharging, so I did normal filter maintenance as in any trouble shooting guide and it began working AGAIN, however this did involve losing some of the beneficial bacteria medium in there!!!! <<Glad to hear that you saved the expense of a new filter but you lost more than 'some' of the bacteria. Sounds like you lost almost all of your bio-colonies. Quick point here. If you rinsed your media in tap water, don't. Always rinse in used tank water to protect the colonies. Losses will be minimal.>> 'If you can, find a local LFS that carries BIO-Spira from Marineland.' Thanks, will do ASAP. Since last water change ammonia has dropped to between 6.0 - 8.0 !!!!! <<Then, do another water change and another and another.>> But, at least it's coming down. What do I do next? ARRRRRRRRRRG. <<'Broken record' time but stay the course with massive water changes. In a brutal nutshell, if you sucked your tank dry and left your fish flopping in the substrate, they wouldn't be in any worse danger than they are now. It's that plain and simple.>> I can't believe at those levels my fish are still alive! <<Nor can I, frankly.>> I have not lost any fish nor do I intend to. Seeing my fish gasping at the top and losing their appetites is not a good sign though. Is a 95% water change my next step? <<Absolutely! Test your water afterward and, if you get a reading of ammonia, do another 95% change.>> I was reluctant to do a major change from get-go because I did not want to raise my pH levels again as I researched that makes ammonia worse. <<Good for you for researching! (To clarify for everyone reading this, 'ammonia' exists in two forms that we hobbyists are concerned with. Ammonia (NH3) and ammonium (NH4). At lower pH levels, ammonia takes the form of NH4 (ammonium), which is less toxic to fish. As pH rises, it converts to NH3 (ammonia), which is lethal to fish.) Your concerns are understandable, Victor, but we're already up to our 'behinds' in alligators, if you see what I mean, and a big one has us in his teeth!>> No fish are showing external signs of ammonia poisoning yet. Let's hope with your advice we can nip this in the bud before I do!!!!! <<If the fish are gasping at the surface and losing their appetites, they're showing signs. No time for 'half measures'.>> Thanks in advance Victor <<You're welcome and I want to hear back from you, Victor. Tom>> Re: Urgent Ammonia, FW 7/12/07 <<Hello, Victor.>> Wow , what a roller coaster ride! <> I did a 90% water change before waiting for your reply & tested the water after, the results were 4.0 at last. <<Funny hobby, ain't it? We're pleased with this, in its specific context, and yet folks are panicky (rightly so) if their water tests at 0.25 ppm ammonia.>> Fish did not seem happy though so I watched for a while , was not impressed so another change (90%). However, both these times I dispensed with the ammo lock, water conditioner, aquarium salt and another test revealed 2.0 we are on our way :). <<Here I would not dispense with the water conditioner, Vic. You mentioned that your tap water tests 0 for ammonia but any chlorine must be dealt with. Best to add the conditioner. It won't hurt and will undoubtedly help.>> Will leave till morning & continue your aggressive water changes till near to normal and then treat as would with usual water conditioners. <<In something of an ironic twist, you will reach a point where 'some' ammonia, over a very short term, will be of some assistance in getting the bio-colonies re-established. We can't starve them completely or they won't populate the tank/filter media adequately to reach a state of equilibrium with the bio-load. The bacteria will, ultimately, take care of any trace ammonia.>> Fingers crossed no dead fish and after I get the BIO-Spira from Marineland, a cycled tank at last & yes, I will keep you posted with pictures if you like :). <> Many thanks & hope I did not sound too defensive in my last post. All your advice is taken with appreciation. <<Understood and taken as such, Vic. Thank you. Keep up the good work!>> Vic/ <<Tom>>

Re: URGENT AMMONIA- Update! 7/13/07 Hi Tom, <<Hello, Vic. How goes it?>> Just got your last reply :) <<Good.>> Been doing water changes 80-90% every four hours and on my last change I re-added the water conditioners and ammo lock as the reading was holding steady at 1.0 for ammonia. <<We're seeing daylight, Vic!>> The reason I excluded the conditioner before was because I was changing the water so often it seemed pointless putting it in at that point. <<Understood but the conditioner eliminates chlorine almost instantly. Stick with it.>> Oh, just in case you missed it ammonia reads 1.0 & holding (yippee!!) <<No, Vic, I didn't miss it and, I'm happy for you!>> Should I continue water changes and, if so, at what level now? <<Back off to 50%, Vic. Let's let Nature kick in here a bit. The beneficial colonies need to feed in order to populate the tank. Keep the tests up, though. You'll be 'flying blind' without them.>> I have also purchased some live bacterial matter from my local centre and am adding that straight into the filter. <<Excellent. Every little bit'¦>> So far things seem to be on the mend. Anything else you think I should consider at this point? <<Yes. Here is the spot where you should consider going back to the use of aquarium salt. Go easily with this and don't consider it long-term maintenance. Just until we get you back to 0 ppm Ammonia. Aeration is also going to be very important. Your fish and the beneficial bacteria both need this.>> I will keep you posted & am very grateful for all your assistance ... <<That's what we're here for, Vic. You're doing the 'hard part'! I'm just supplying info. :) >> Thanks Victor <<My best to you and, keep me posted. Tom>>

Re: URGENT - Ammonia, the follow up, I am still worried :( 7/13/07 Hi, Tom or whom ever responds from the WWM Crew :) <<It's me, Vic.>> I have been relentlessly changing my water to the point where my water conditions are this: Ammonia 1.0 Nitrites 0 Nitrates 20 PH 7.8 I'm using 1 teaspoon of Aquarium Salt per 10 Gallons of water. <<Okay.>> Water conditioner every change as instructed and same with ammo lock. <<Also good.>> The problem is my fish seem to struggle after about an hour after each water change, (75%) at the moment, even though my ammonia seems to have stabalised at 1.0 for the moment. <<Still too high, Vic. We need to get this down even further.>> Are my fish showing signs of permanent gill damage, or am I missing something? <<You're not missing anything. I told you that time would tell. Apparently, it's beginning to tell'¦>> I have read research and they do not show the normal external signs of ammonia poisoning, red gills, etc.... <<What happens is that the gill tissues swell which inhibits the oxygen uptake and also inhibits the expulsion of ammonia from the fish's system. It may not exhibit itself in 'textbook' fashion, though.>> They appear to be OK otherwise!!!!! No fish loss, to date, despite all my problems. <<Glad to hear this, Vic. Have you increased the aeration of the tank? Even dropping the water level to let the filter outflow disturb the surface water will help. Airstones/air wands are another source.>> I am getting very demotivated and depressed. <<Take a breath. You've gotten 'slammed' and everyone here knows it. Focus on one thing. Whether all of your fish make it, or none make it, you'll have done your best. You can't do more than that. We don't have all of the answers. (A lot of them, perhaps, but not all.) You and I knew we were in for a fight from the get-go. You got my 'best' and you gave it yours. Don't quit or get discouraged. 'Ain't over 'til the fat lady sings.'>> Even my water heater failed and now I'm keeping hood down, lights on all night and am going to rush out in the morning for a new heater. Don't know how much more bad luck my fish can take. <<They're resilient, Vic. Can't say that you haven't had a hard way to go, however. Jeez! Stay with the water changes and, if you can find it, AmQuel from Kordon's to 'lock' up some of the remaining Ammonia.>> Victor... <<Don't give up, Vic. Tom>>

Re: URGENT! Ammonia - Tom, good news :) 7/17/07 Hi Tom, <<Hello, Vic.>> I thought I would let you know how I am getting on. <<I'm glad you did.>> Firstly, I am currently doing water changes at 35% twice daily and my water conditions are: Ammonia 0.50 <<Would love to see this at 0, obviously, but a far cry from 8.0! :) >> Nitrites 0 Nitrates 20 pH 7.4 <<Anything above 7.0 is going to keep the NH3 up and NH4 down, unfortunately.>> Secondly, (a) I have planted the tank more heavily. <<Very good.>> (b) I am no longer using Ammo Lock as I have researched that it slows down cycling by killing off some of the Beneficial Bacteria in the filter. Although, rest assured I am continuing to use Water Conditioner every water change. <<Also, very good.>> Also, I discovered my water filter was losing pressure, even though it was only 4 months old and, I believe this was the cause of my problem from the start! <<Could be, Vic. You brought this up at the very beginning.>> So after days of trouble shooting I took the motor back to my LFS and had it replaced. Before going to replace the motor I put all my original filter cages, which housed any "beneficial bacterial matter" into warmed and aired aquarium water. <<Sounds like you're after my job, Vic. Well done!>> The filter was running again with the new motor installed within half an hour. <<Excellent.>> I am now very optimistic and the oldest of my Platy fry has now been released into general population and is doing well. <<Just what I like to hear!>> Still no fish loss to date, so fingers crossed and touch wood I will find any long term damage to my fish will be minimal. <<My fingers are crossed with you, my friend, and, if all of your fish make it (good Lord willin'), you will have re-defined 'good luck'!>> Once again thanks for all your time and support, I will keep you updated once things are looking 100%. <<I'll look forward to hearing from you, Vic'¦with that 100% report!>> Victor <<Best. Tom>>

Re: Urgent - Ammonia. Tom; the conclusion! (Amended) 7/28/07 Hi to all the WWM Crew and Tom, <<Well, Happy Friday, Vic!>> I promised to keep you posted as to how I got on with my 50 Gallon Freshwater Set Up... so here I am with the final update. <<Let's see what you've got for us.>> Firstly, my water conditions are: Ammonia 0 <<Very good!>> Nitrites 0 <<Also, very good!>> Nitrates 10 <<For the third time, very good!>> PH 7.4 I gave back to my LFS, 2 Pearl Scale Angels (to avoid overcrowding, now that my tank's planted more heavily) only to find, as luck has it, I was left with a pair of Veil Tail Angels who have since bred!!!! <<Now what were we saying about overcrowding, Vic? :) >> Also my 6 Platy Fry are all doing well. The first of which to go into my main community tank I have called Tom :) <> Most importantly I have lost no fish to date :) <<That's great, Vic! I do believe in Guardian Angels for fish, I do believe in Guardian Angels for fish'¦ :) >> So as a great BIG thank you for all your help and time over the last few weeks. As promised I am attaching a photo of my Freshwater Set Up, which you can feel free to post if you like. <<We will, indeed. (Very nice job, by the way.)>> Keep up all the good work as many marine hobbyists would be lost without your site. <<Very kind of you to say so, Vic. Rest assured that we'll continue to give it our best.>> Best wishes for the future. <<And mine/ours to you, my friend.>> <<Tom>>

New water Caused Fish Loss 4/16/07 I have a 55 gallon freshwater tank. For the past few weeks, after I feed the fish, the excess food that was not sucked up by the 100 gallon filter I have on there, fell to the bottom and started to collect around the decorations in the tank. I did what I could to remove 90% of it, but it sticks to everything in a glob. My water tested fine for ammonia, nitrites, nitrates and the pH hovers at right around 6-7. Yesterday, I was topping off the tank the way I always do and the tap water had no odor, but within 30 minutes of adding it to the tank (I only added 1 gallon and it was treated with tap water treatment) all of my fish went to the top of the tank and were gasping. Within an hour, I had lost all 20 of my fish, including 2 Cory catfish and one lace cat. The rest were for my kids and were fancy fish, and mostly tetras of various kinds. My 2 snails made it! Within that first 30 minutes and all day yesterday, the tank was emitting a VERY STRONG Sulphur smell? I tested the water after all the fish died and the only thing that was elevated was the nitrates? I have Nitrazorb in the tank at all times and have never (in 5 years) had a total loss. What would be causing the Sulphur smell and how do I fix it. I have since moved my snails to my cichlid tank and they are doing fine. I topped of the cichlid tank with the same 1 gallon of water and have had no issues at all? Any ideas? I'm planning on draining all the water tomorrow and rinsing the rocks, etc...Basically starting from scratch on that tank to avoid a total loss again. The kids were devastated. Any help you can suggest would be greatly appreciated. At a loss!? Shay Einhaus < OK, Stick with me here. I think I can explain what is going on here. It may be a little confusing but I think I know what happened. Excess food that is not removed from the tank is broken down into ammonia. This is deadly to fish. In an acidic pH like the one you described, there is no ammonia. The ammonia is bound up with an extra hydrogen molecule to form ammonium. This is less toxic and loved by plants. When you topped off your tank the water was probably alkaline and shifted the pH from an acidic to basic environment. All that ammonium iron then reverted to ammonia and you had an ammonia spike that started to "burn" the fishes gills. This caused all your fish to rush to the surface, since they had less active gill tissue the were starving for air. This didn't happen in the cichlid tank because it is already at a high pH so all the waste is an ammonia and the new water didn't change the pH. I would make the following recommendations. Only feed your fish enough food so that all of it is gone in 2 minutes once a day. Remove any uneaten food. Food going into the filter does not count as gone. It is out of site but not out of the system and is still affecting your fish. Get rid of the Nitrazorb. This effects the biological filtration. When the resin has expired and can no longer absorbed any additional nitrogenous wastes , it will cause the toxins to rapidly accumulate for no apparent reason. Ammonia, nitrite and nitrate are all part of a normal aquarium system. I would recommend that you use Bio-Spira from Marineland to add the additionally bacteria needed to properly breakdown the wastes in your aquarium. Check the water you are adding with the water that is already in your aquarium or at least remove some of the old water to reduce the waste before adding any new water.-Chuck>

Fishless Cycle Mistake 2/12/07 Good Day, <And to you> I'll make this short and sweet. I was attempting to fishless cycle my 29 gallon tank which contains Ecco-Complete Cichlid Sand for substrate and an Eheim 2215 filter. I purchased "clear ammonia" from Shaw's and added 8ml to my tank; <Yikes... this is a BUNCH... too much ammonia presence actually kills all life... including nitrifying bacteria... I imagine (though barely) that too many pizzas would kill even me!> however, I neglected to give the ammonia the "shake test" before I added it to my tank. (I know, big mistake) Of course I shook the bottle and it foamed indicating that the ammonia contains surfactants, and now I don't know what to do. Please help? <Oh!...> The tank is empty besides the 40 lbs of Ecco-Complete Cichlid Sand.. and of course 29 gallons of water. I have carbon in the filter that is only a week old. Could that help take care of the surfactants? <Mmm, yes> I realize that I may have to empty my tank and rinse everything, which, of course is very frustrating. If this is what you recommend, Is there a way that I can keep some of my bacteria alive through out the process. Many thanks! Dan

Re: Fishless Cycle Mistake 2/13/07 Good Morning: <Daniel> I just wanted to clarify a point with regards to my fishless cycle question. Yes, 8ml is a lot of ammonia; however, I did some research on the ammonia that I used and found that it only contains 2% ammonia. 8ml of this product brought my ammonia to 3ppm, 2ppm shy of the recommended 5ppm. I ended up draining the tank and cleaning everything with water that I treated with prime in an attempt to save as much bacteria as I could. I went out and bought a product called "Austin's Clear Ammonia", and after checking with the manufacturer to make sure the product is pure I'm starting the entire process again. <Better by far to "start" with an organic source of ammonia (protein)... food... that will provide a steady supply...> With the help of a nasty filter cartridge from a locally owned trusted LFS <Ah, good> I'm hoping to put some fish in it soon. Thank you so much for your help! Your site is simply awesome! <Thank you for this follow-up, clarification. Bob Fenner>

Fish Concern During Cycling 9/12/06 Hello Crew, I have made the ignorant mistake that other beginners have made. I did not let the aquarium do its cycle before introducing fish. I have 10 fish and 3 mystery snails in my 28gal bowfront tank. I have read the fish will start to die near the end of the 'Cycle'. It has been about a week and no fish have died yet and ammonia levels are about 1.5mg/l. My question is, as the ammonia increases throughout the cycle should I remove the fish from the tank and place them in smaller containers of freshwater until the chemical levels are normal. I have performed 2 - 25% water changes and added the product "ACE" (ammonia chlorine eliminator). Thanks for your time < Add Bio-Spira by Marineland. Tank will be cycled within a day. Or keep fish in tank and continue to dilute ammonia with water changes.-Chuck>

Tank Cycling - 25/8/06 Hi there! I need your astute advice on this. <'astute' is my middle name... (ahem.. yeah, right...)> I had an aquarium go "bad" with, I guess, ammonia and nitrates, etc. <You need to be testing for these with test kits. Beats guessing.> Several fish died before I removed them and the survivors went on living in a noncontaminated aquarium. <It's not a matter of an aquarium being 'contaminated' or not... it's all to do with the ability of the biological filter to be able to respond to the fish load and convert their wastes fast enough. Indeed, if the filter in he new tank is not used to such a heavy fish load, you'll soon be facing the same issues there.> I then tried EVERYTHING to bring the ammonia, nitrates, etc. down, but I'm having a helluva time! I've vacuumed at least three times and withdrawn much of the old water and replaced it. I've put in practically a whole bottle of Novaqua in but the bad stuff doesn't seem to subside. <How are you measuring this? What 'bad stuff'? I wouldn't dump a whole bottle of anything in...> Why does it seem so difficult to do this? Is there something I'm missing? <If I were you, I would research "cycling" (the process of establishing a biological filter) - on WWM and on many pages on the net. If you are in the US and can purchase the "bio-Spira" product locally, it may be your best chance not to kill more fish at this stage.> I want to get the fish back in there ASAP, but it just doesn't seem to be responding! <More reading! Thanks for writing in, hope you get the tank under control. Best regards, John> Thanks, Leslie

My nitrates aren't rising, FW cycling, ammonia 7/3/06 Hello there, <G'morning Sara> I've been cycling my tank for seven weeks but I think I'm doing something wrong. In all this time, my nitrites and nitrates never rose above zero, and test results have been consistently around 79 deg/8.0pH/1.0AM/ 0 NO2and3/300 KH&GH. My Ammonia level rose to 2.0 in the past couple of days <Oh... the nitrites, nitrates are coming> so now am wondering if it's a good idea to change the water to bring it back down and risk losing the good bacteria that's built up. I'm really trying to be patient but I really want to add more fish. <... there should not be any fish present currently> I'm new to the hobby so I'm also trying to do things the "right way." Any help you can provide would be much appreciated. Here's the background... Week One: Setup 20g freshwater tank with bio-wheel filtration for 50g, gravel, sandstone rock, heater, plastic plants, and decor and let it run for a week to ensure that things were working properly. During this time test results hovered around 82-77deg/ 8.2pH/0.5-0.25 AM/ 0 NO2/3. I also tested my tap water and got inconsistent results, one day 7.6pH and other days 8.8pH. <... too much vacillation here. Something is awry chemically or your test kit is bunk> I add AmQuel plus to the water in the bucket and stabilize the temp before adding to the tank. I tried to lower the pH by taking out the sandstone rock (no change) and changing 10% of the water which brought about a slight change but pH is consistently around 8.0, so I'm not going to fight it. <Good> Week Two: Added two fancy guppies (Tequila Sunrise) to start the cycling process. <Not necessary. See WWM re> They seemed a bit timid and kept swimming to the top to get air, though not in a desperate way and not really gasping. Nevertheless I added an air stone, so between and it and the bio-wheel, the fish did much better with the increased aeration, meaning they hardly swam up to the surface to get air. I fed them sparingly once a day. Test results were 75-77deg/ 8.0pH/0.5AM/ 0 NO2and3/300 KH&GH consistently. Week Three: I added three more Tequila Sunrise guppies to help speed up the process ... I know not much patience shown here but I figured 5 inches of fish for 20g should be OK. Thankfully the addition really seemed to help as all five males enjoyed each other's company and seemed to happily play in the moving water and find spots to sleep in. Two of the new fish showed some frenetic activity by swimming up and down the sides of the tank and I did notice a red dot on the tail of one of the original guppies so I thought, uh-oh, ammonia poisoning! <Likely so> I changed 20% of the water and monitored several times a day. Test results were consistently 77-79deg/ 8.0pH/0.5AM/ 0 NO2and3/300 KH&GH. I added a small piece of driftwood to lower the pH and hardness, and while the fish like the wood, no real change seen. The fish seemed very active so I turned off the heater but still temp stays between 77-80 which is a little warmer then the temp in my house. Tank is not near a window or a drafty area but I took out the heater anyway. Week Seven: I feed the fish twice a day, trying not to overfeed (but sometimes I do). Water clarity is pretty good, and it never got too cloudy with the five fish. There was a week where a lot of dust seemed to be floating in the water so I rinsed out the filter (a mistake right?) to see if that would remove the dust and it helped a little. Maybe the dust was actually little bubbles from all the aeration? <Actually just high concentrations of microbes free in the water> As for the tank temp, my air conditioner stopped working so my home got pretty hot which brought the tank water to 82 deg one day. Other than the one day heat wave, testing during these weeks produced consistent results of 77-79 deg/8.0pH/1.0AM/ 0 NO2and3/300 KH&GH. And despite my newbie efforts, the fish seem to be doing well - no frenetic activity, no gasping for air, no signs of aggression or illness (red dot previously spotted now gone), enjoying the small feedings, and continue exploring the tank. Yesterday my ammonia level rose to 2.0 and after I topped off the tank (5%) the ammonia level still remained at 2.0. Maybe I'm overfeeding? I want to keep the good bacteria but should I do a water change to bring it down? Also, why aren't my nitrites/nitrates changing? Seven weeks should be long enough right? <Mmm, not with your changing things... adding the driftwood, trying to modify pH...> What kind of fish do I want to add you ask? Well I started off wanting a community tank of colorful fish but given temp, pH, and water hardness, it seems that my tank is more suited to African Cichlids but since I have guppies that isn't going to work. So now I figure I'll just have an all male guppy tank. 3 different colorful varieties or a total of 15. <Should make for a nice display> I did get some Bio-Spira but I haven't used it to give this traditional method of patience and starter fish a chance to work. It seems that whatever I'm doing isn't working. Please help! Thanks in advance!! <Please read: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm and the linked files above, especially http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwammfaqs.htm Patience my friend. Bob Fenner>

Ammonia level in Molly Tank 3/24/06 Hello <Hello, Pam. Tom here.> Back in October I bought Mollies (turned out to be 2 females and 4 males) to go in my 65 gallon tank. <Okay. Would like to see the ratio reversed but,...> Didn't know they gave live birth. SURPRISE! The black female started having babies about a month after this. Found the info on your sight about saving the fry. <Good> Have been VERY successful with this. We now have about 40 mollies. <You have, indeed, been very successful!> Santa brought both my sons 10 gal. tanks for Christmas. We placed 3 of the adult males in one tank and the 1 adult male with 3 of the fry that were large enough in the other. <You don't say when but, I'm guessing too soon> We have had continued ammonia problems with the two 10 gal. tanks. We lost the 3 in the one tank and have had a constant battle with the other. <Pam, I'm not "guessing" any longer. The fish were added too soon> I have done partial water changes <Good>, treatment with AmQuel <Not good and, I'll explain why. Products such as Amquel convert ammonia (NH3) to ammonium (NH4). (Bear with me. You, honestly, won't need a degree in chemistry, I promise!) Ammonia is extremely toxic to fish - literally burns the gill membranes. Ammonium doesn't. However, the beneficial bacteria that your aquarium needs to "cycle" don't feed on ammonium, they feed on ammonia. The upshot? Amquel, et. al., starves your tank of exactly what it needs to properly cycle and establish the bio-colonies that make the tank healthy. An oxymoron-type situation? To be sure! To get a leg up, so to speak, look into Bio-Spira (Marineland). Expensive but, the product contains "living" bacteria that greatly speeds up the cycling process. (Don't waste your money on other products that make a similar claim. Bio-Spira must be refrigerated. Off-the-shelf products don't contain what you need. Period.) In the meantime, keep up with regular water changes. Best maintenance you can do> and even tried breaking them down completely, doing a new set up (rocks, plants, added underground filter <Please, rethink a UGF. In fact, throw it out. Will likely lead to problems as bad as what you have now> etc.) and refilling from the large tank which has perfect ammonia levels. <Water alone won't do it. Will help but bacteria dwell on the "solids", i.e. filter media, substrate> Within hours the ammonia level is right back up. <Yep> My pet store said the only thing I had to really watch was the ammonia level and told me I didn't need to check anything else. Based on what I read on your sight, this doesn't sound right. <Advise them to us. There's much to know that they aren't sharing with their customers> Any suggestions on how to remedy the ammonia issue? What else should I be testing for? <Nitrites (as important as ammonia), Nitrates, pH, to name a few. Aquarium Pharmaceuticals has an excellent Master Test Kit for freshwater aquaria. Nice starter kit> Thanks PH <Feedback is always welcome, Pam. Hope I've helped. Tom>

Ammonia...still need help after reading FAQs... 2/17/06 Okay, I've read the FAQs, cycle stuff, etc. and there are some things that I saw that may explain some of this, but I'm still worried. It's a little long, but here goes: I have a 5 gallon Aqua Tech aquarium with a built in top filter w/ BioWheel. I put my female Betta into the tank after conditioning the water with a normal water conditioner. A couple days later (not knowing anything about the nitrogen cycle, bioloads, etc.), I added 3 cardinal tetras, 3 Rummynose tetras, and three assorted Corydoras. Obviously, this is too many fish, <Yup.> especially at one time, but I didn't know that at the time. So, two days later, one cardinal died, and the next day, the other two died as well. I went to get my water tested at the aquarium store, and they said my ammonia was sky high and gave me some AmGuard. <Don't use this stuff. It will starve cycle bacteria, they don't eat Ammonium. It will "reset" your cycle.> I used this for a couple days, but with no change in ammonia (It was at 4-5ppm), I took all of the fish except for the Betta out over a couple of days and put them in my friend's established tank. Now, it's a week and a half later and my ammonia is still around 4 ppm. I've done 2 partial water changes, and the ammonia goes down, but is back up the next day. I added some live Cabomba plants because I heard live plants can help with ammonia. I've used Stress-Zyme, <Useless, doesn't even contain the kind of bacteria in a bio-filter.> which I'm pretty sure is live bacteria like Bio Spira, <Possibly OK. At least contains the right kind of bacteria. I wouldn't bet on it working, though.> although I have no idea if it's a good product or not. I've also used some water conditioners that said that they get rid of ammonia (which actually just changes it from the toxic, free ammonia into ammonium, right?) with the water changes, but from what I'm reading now, that could kill the Stress-Zyme bacteria if it was alive in the first place? I did a 1/3 water change yesterday, and the ammonia went down to around 2, but it's back up to three today. I'm trying to feed as little as possible (every other day, 3 or 4 little bloodworm pieces or 4 pellets, and she eats them all). <You can feed her much less. That is still more than I feed my Bettas normally. Try 2-3 pellets every 3rd day.> Through this whole thing, Lois (the Betta) has seemed fine and happy, swimming all around. The only weird thing she does is wedge herself in b/w the flat thermometer suction cupped to the aquarium wall and shimmy down it (hoping it's not b/c of ammonia burning her...but could be, I guess...). My uneducated guesses are 1)the ammonia's not that high because my fish would be dead and it's a false positive from the AmGuard awhile back <Your ammonia is definitely high. It will shoot up fast in 5 gallons.> and the conditioners that get rid of ammonia and chloramine 2) it is that high but not free ammonia so my fish is still okay 3) maybe my plants are dying and making it worse? <Do your plants look like they're dying?> 4) fish care just isn't for me. <You're doing fine. Most people never learn what a cycle is and scratch their head when their fish die.> What do you think? Why isn't my biological filter working? What do I need to do to get the cycle going? Should I do water changes to dilute the ammonia or try leaving it alone? I really like Lois and I'd like to put more than one fish in my aquarium someday... <Maybe, after you are all cycled, a small group of Corydoras, but nothing else. Certainly not the Tetras you had before.> thank you so much for your help... Levels: Ammonia - 3ppm Nitrite - negligible (maybe a teeny bit) Nitrate - assuming it's 0 KH - 3 GH - 2 (pretty soft water) pH - 7.0 <I am looking into your future, and I see... water changes! Daily, twice daily if you have to. Keep Ammonia/Nitrite below 1.0 PPM. Try to avoid changing more than 30% at a time, although that isn't always possible while you're cycling. It takes 30-40 days to establish a cycle, be patient. If your friend can spare one, a sponge from their filter will help you cycle your tank faster. Just put it in your filter box or affix it to your filter intake, it can take weeks off the process. Jason N.>

Cycling, Ammonia - 09/11/2005 I set up a 55 gallon fresh water aquarium about 2 Â½ weeks ago (I used Stress Coat to condition). After the set-up and before adding starter fish I gave a sample of the water to a local pet store. <You'll probably want to invest in your own test kits at some point.> I was told the ammonia was sky high (like 8.0 - 9.0) other then this I was told everything else was normal (PH was a little high but not significantly). That day I purchased Ammo-lock <Not wise to use this during cycling.> a full test kit, <Ahh, good.> 9 Rasbora heteromorpha, <ACK! Shame on your fish store.... These ammonia levels are deadly high. Please do NOT add any more fish at this point....> and TLC for Freshwater Aquariums (100% live bacteria). I put half the dose of ammo lock in the tank and then tested it and Ammonia was 0. <This unfortunately may have delayed your cycle.... In the future don't add stuff to remove stuff; instead, do water changes to dilute toxins.> I also tested the tap water and it was also 0. I added the TLC per instructions and of course the fish. After a week I added perfect PH 7.0 <Mm, you probably don't need to use pH augmenting chemicals, unless your pH is really, really off what you want. It is FAR better to have a constant, stable pH than a "perfect" (but fluctuating) pH.> and the second does of TLC. Now 1 more week later and the Ammonia levels have increased around 1.0, <Dangerous.... Please do water changes to get/keep this at zero.> PH is around 7.0, Buffering is about 180, Hardness less then 120 Nitrite 0, Nitrate maybe slightly above 0. The tank is very clear and the fish seem happy. The filter is getting clogged though (I didn't want to change it so I lowered the water flow because water was flowing over the intake tube) <You can rinse the filter in a dish of water from your tank.> Is this normal? Shouldn't I be seeing Nitrites first? <The Ammo-Lock probably "threw off" your cycle some. You may see ammonia rise further, again, and then nitrite, and finally higher nitrate. Please be doing water changes through this to keep ammonia and nitrite as close to zero as possible, or you risk harming/killing the Rasboras.> When can I add a few more fish (I would like to put some Angel Fish in there). <Not until you've held your ammonia and nitrite confidently at zero for a week or so. Be VERY sparing in how many fish you add at a time, so your nitrifying bacteria can catch up. Feel free to browse through our water quality information (in set-up of our Freshwater Subweb): http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwsetupindex.htm . Wishing you well, -Sabrina> Cycling, Ammonia, and Thanks - II - 09/12/2005 Thank you so much Sabrina, you confirmed my suspicions and you have definitely aided in my understanding on what to do in this case. I will take all your advice. <I'm very glad I was able to help you out!> Oh and I actually think that sample I gave to the pet store was a bad sample or something as I can't seem to find the source of that much ammonia -as the water I added did not contain it, and I don't think the dose (spelled correctly this time) I added could have neutralized that much pH (unless the buffer was really low or something). <Mm, I don't think the buffering capacity will affect how well or quickly Ammo-Lock will augment ammonia readings. Perhaps the store's test reagents are old/expired.> Anyhow thanks very much again (you really know your stuff when it comes to cycling) <.... originally gained from experiences such as your own. I really love this vast information exchange system known as the World Wide Web.> I will start the water changes today after I retest the water. <Sounds great. Wishing you well, -Sabrina>

Cycling, Ammonia, and Thanks - III - 09/13/2005 Sorry, I hate to bother you once again, but I think my situation has worsened. Oh and sorry about that bit about Ph, I wrote that with a huge lack of sleep and I still can't figure out what I was thinking. <No worries. I think I've forgotten what sleep is, most times....> Anyway after the ammonia levels tested the same I did the partial water change (about 20%), and retested directly after and then about 3 hours later, and found the ammonia may have gotten higher not lower. <Yikes!> This influenced me to retest the tap, and now I find .25 in the tap water. <Very, very disturbing - and perhaps unsafe for human consumption.... You might consider contacting your local water district and health departments.> I'm thinking the levels in the tap may not be constant and me even be higher as the 15-20 gallons surfaced from the tap. Shall I just leave the tank be until the cycling process improves? <I fear your only option for using tapwater here is to go ahead and use an ammonia-neutralizing product such as AmQuel+.... I normally discourage using these, especially during a cycle, but you might have no other choice. The BEST option would be to use reverse osmosis filtered water.> I have noticed a thicker "slime coat" in the tank. When I moved the heater slightly it actually came off in large chunks. <Bacteria or algae buildup.... to be expected in new tanks. Remove if/as possible, otherwise don't worry. It should pass in time.> The water still looks crystal clear and fish show no signs of stress. <Good indeed.> Oh and I rinsed the filter with the tank water (It was really bad) so I dumped the remaining water, should I have put that water back in the tank? <Nope, you did right.> A special thanks yet again... I'm sure your work has saved hundreds of aquatic beings, and just as many people from walking away from this hobby.

New Tank With Bad Advice 12/10/05 Hello Everybody, What a great site, I have seen that you have given advice over time on ammonia and cycling and stuff, I seem to have a big problem! I'm almost at the stage of emptying the tank and starting from scratch. This is how the story goes. In August My husband and I bought a 55 gallon tank, a whisper filter and a bubbler, we filled it with water and left it for a couple of weeks. We then bought 2 Dwarf Gouramis, 1 Sucker and 2 Angels. The next week we bought another couple of community fish (can't remember what now). The Angels died and a Gourami, so we replaced them, then they died along with some other stuff. We got to having about 10 smallish fish when we bought 3 Balloon Mollies and nothing was dying. One of the Mollies decided to have babies, it was really exciting! The staff at PetSmart suggested a live plant for the fry to hide in, so we got one. That is where the problems started. The fry lasted for about 3 days - the Gourami ate them all, one by one and the water went cloudy - milky white. We removed the plant as soon as all the fry were eaten. We have followed the advice from PetSmart from the start, now we need some proper advice. The ammonia went off the chart when the water went cloudy, that was nearly 3 months ago now. We started trying to solve the problem by doing a water change every couple of days for a week, we then tried ammonia removing stones in the filter, we have removed half the water and replaced it with new, we have made complete pests of ourselves at PetSmart! Their last piece of advice was to add Prime to the water, we were told everything would be fine in a couple of weeks. We added Prime and prayed we would be able to start restocking the tank in a couple of weeks - that was three weeks ago. I took a water test to the store 2 weeks ago and the ammonia was off the chart again - we only had one Gourami left, everything else had popped their clogs (can't say I blame them). The people in PetSmart said we wouldn't get a true ammonia reading as we had used Prime and we could restock in a week or so. Yesterday we bought 2 Tiger Oscars and a Albino Oscar (I want to get a bigger tank next year). The Albino has already joined fish heaven. I have tested the water today and the readings are as follows: Nitrate (no+3) = 0 Nitrate (no-2) = 0 Hardness = 150 - 300 Alkalinity = 120 - 180 pH = 7.8 Ammonia = 7.3 On seeing the Ammonia levels, I panicked and added another dose of Prime, I don't want to murder the other two Oscars and am at a loss of what to do - any advice will be a help. Many thanks Loraine < Do a 50% water change, treat the new water with Amquel+. Vacuum the gravel and clean the filter. Add Bio-Spira from Marineland. Feed only once each day and only enough food so that all of it is gone after two minutes. After that, siphon out all the uneaten food. Do a 25% water change every week. Vacuum the gravel once every two weeks. On the weeks you do not vacuum the gravel you can clean the filter. Keep checking the WWM website for adding new fish after your tank settles down.-Chuck>

High Ammonia Level Hello, Your web portal is really a great source of information for beginners. Thanks a lot. I have high ammonia level in my new tank (between 3 to 4 ppm). It has been almost 23 days I set up an aquarium. I have total of 8 fish that as follows: Four Black skirt tetras; Four Mickey mouse platy. I added four fish initially and added four more after fifteen days. My water test readings are as follows: Tank Specs: 20 gallon with whisper filtration system. Water Temp: 82 F Ammonia: between 3 to 6 ppm Nitrate: 20 ppm Nitrite: between 0 to 0.5 ppm Hardness: 150 ppm Alkalinity: 40 ppm pH: 7.0 My two Platies just died today and the level of ammonia higher. I always did 20% partial water change every three days since last so days. I have also added a product called CYCLE for additional bacteria to minimize cycle length for a new tank. I also have three live and two artificial plants. I turn light on from 9:00 PM to 9:00 AM. I always added water conditioner to remove chlorine and chloramines from tap water as per instructions of AquaSafe produce manual. I do not want to see any more fish dying because of higher level of ammonia. Could you please guide me what should I do to get over this problem. Thanks, Min <Yep, Water changes. Lots of them. 50% per day until that ammonia is at a trace. Make sure you are not cleaning the bio media in your filter. After 23 days ammonia should be at zero. Something has interfered with the establishment of your beneficial bacteria. Read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm Don>

Ammonia Spike 2ppm I'll try and make this as brief as possible, as this is a long story. While on vacation, my heater malfunctioned (up to 99 degrees from what she told me) <Wowzah!> and I lost a lot of fish. I had a lady taking care of them and feeding them out of pre-measured cups which I'd prepared in advance. <Good technique> When I got home I tested the water (ammonia 0, nitrIte 0, ph 6.8, nitrates 10) I vacuumed the tank and searched for dead fish, and changed out 25 gallons of water, <Out of how many total gallons?> and had an ammonia spike of 1 PPM. I do this volume of water change weekly and always have. I raise Angels and the Angels are used to this, as I do daily 50% water changes in fry tanks. <Another good technique... unless folks are set-up to do drip replacement/changes continuously... even better> I kept assuming the spike was from dead fish, but later After cleaning a couple of filter boxes in preparation for Bio Spira, I tested our tap water, and discovered our tap water is testing at 1 PPM. <... possibly dangerous... for human consumption...> I have been using Bio Spira to set up new tanks, so I ordered some for this tank to get it back to normal. In preparation for the Bio Spira, I cleaned the filter boxes and rinsed the filter media, vacuumed really well, did a huge water change, then added the Bio Spira. I thought it would be a good time to clean the box filters as my sump had been running for 7 months and it was filter overkill. The Bio Spira didn't work. My ammonia went up to 2, then 4 ppm after cleaning the filters.. <Yeeikes... hopefully at a moderate to low pH> I used AmGuard daily for another week to protect the fish, then discovered it would kill the Bio Spira if it had any good bacteria in it at all. So I ordered more Bio Spira, changed 25 gallons with our tap water, then later that day changed 40 gallons using bottled water, in an effort to remove as much of the ammonia locking product as possible, thinking it is what kept the Bio Spira from working. I got the Ammonia down to 2 ppm , and added the Bio Spira. I also removed the box filers and floated their bio wheels in the sump. <Good> I had faith that the BioSpira could easily handle 2 ppm overnight, compared to 4 ppm, but 2 days later it was back up to 4 ppm. The ph had crashed to 6.0 , I'm assuming from the bottled water, <Maybe> and I left it low, so the ammonia wouldn't be as harmful to the fish. Last Saturday I took every plant and bog wood out and searched all through the gravel for any dead fish again, and I took the sump filter apart looking for dead fish. I found none. Put the tank back together without changing any water of vacuuming, as I didn't want to remove any more bacteria. But still no change in Ammonia. It has been 14 days with this Ammonia spike, , my nitrItes are 0, Ammonia 2ppms, ph 6.0, nitrates 5 ppm. Shouldn't there be a nitrIte spike by now?? <Mmm, not necessarily... with the water and filter media changes, cleaning... nitrification could be fore/stalled...> What can I do?? I know I removed a lot of Bio by cleaning, then later removing the filter boxes. and my Bio Spira was ineffective at replacing it, but why am I not getting Nitrites, <The chemical changes, addition of ammonia locking material...> and why is the Ammonia staying at 2 ppm. This is a 72 gallon tank with a sump trickle filter that has been in place since October of 2004. It was started by combining the gravel, plants and decor from mature tanks so it really never did have to cycle. I was running 2 Emperor 250's also, from the other tanks, but removed them when I added the Bio Spira, but am floating their mature bio wheels in the sump, plus I added 3 other mature bio wheels from other tanks. I started a bubble wall to help also. My fish don't act stressed and I haven't lost one fish since I came home. I'm stumped. I have 2 adult Angels, 1 juvenile Angel, 2 Plecostomus, (one around 5 inches, the other around 3 inches), 8 clown loaches and 6 Cory cats. I lost 6 turquoise rainbows, 4 Cory cats, 2 Farlowella cats due to the heater malfunction, so the bio load should have been even easier for this tank to handle. Any ideas?? <My first suggestion is to "check the checker"... that is, to use another known-accurate ammonia test kit here... Next, to start using the water from other sources you have that have fish/es in them... and of course, in the meanwhile to be extremely careful re feeding. Bob Fenner>

Re: Ammonia spike 2ppm Thanks for the advise. I bought a new test kit about 5 days ago and get the same results. I try not to feed an more than I have to, but I noticed the Corys eating the combs on the Angel's Veiltails so I had to step up the pellets for them. We are just praying that the bio will start to multiply ASAP. <Me too> I'm running 36" of bubble wall and the PH is 6.0, and that is about all I can do for right now. I forgot to mention, I tried Fritz Turbo Start 700 on the 14th of May and it didn't work, then I ordered from Bernie <?> and got the first batch of Bio Spira and added it on the 17th. Then again on the 19th. I had read somewhere on your site that they may have bad reactions to each other, and I wondered if that could be a problem? <Yes, could be. Bob Fenner>

Re: ammonia spike 2ppm This is truly a miracle. This morning the ammonia was at .25 ppm It's my guess that it's taken from the 14th of May until the 28th for the Bio Spira to catch up with the 2 ppm Ammonia spike . I thought yesterday that it looked like it was between 2 and 1 1/2 ppm, but I thought I may be wishful thinking. I believe we are on the mend. Thanks for letting me vent and for your help. I hope this helps someone else sometime to be patient with Bio Spira in these severe cases. Just keep your pH low, run a bubble wall, and don't use Ammo Lock or Am Guard with Bio Spira. I'm so fortunate not to have lost my best male Angels!! <Excelsior! Bob Fenner>

Cycled tank suddenly has ammonia Hi. I have a 5 gallon heated tank with sponge filter for my Betta fish, Flash. The tank has been cycled for over about two months. There is nothing else in the tank, just the Betta. Today I checked the water and ammonia was at 1.0, nitrites at .25, and nitrates at 15. Why would there be ammonia and nitrites if the nitrates haven't been knocked out? <Mmmm, there just are not the conditions to promote, sustain "biological filtration"... please read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm> I did a water change. Actually those were the readings after the water change. Could the sponge filter need to be cleaned? <Oh! Didn't understand you had this... likely not advisable to clean this... perhaps just time going by will bring on a completed cycle... do read the above citation> How often should I do that and how? There has been a bit of algae growing too. Could that be a factor? <Likely not> If I change too much water, won't I get rid of too many nitrates? <Possible, but not likely... I would keep doing the water changes to keep ammonia, nitrite under 1.0 ppm, the nitrates under 20 ppm. Bob Fenner>

Ammonia Levels I'm now in a vicious cycle of ammonia 4ppm --> water exchange --> Ammonia 4 ppm ---> water exchange + AmmoLock ---> Ammonia level 4ppm. I am adding bacterial solutions such as Stability and StressZyme but I am starting to read that these aren't really helpful because they are the WRONG bacteria. I'm beginning to wonder if the water exchanges on a frequent basis do as much harm (by removing any established bacteria) as good (by temporarily lowering the ammonia level). Does anyone have any suggestions? David <Try Bio Spira. It's the only product that contains the living bacteria needed to cycle. Also, test your treated tap for ammonia. If your tap is low (a trace to .25) but the tank is staying at 4.0 then you have something organic decaying in the tank. Old food and waste in the gravel, a piece of old driftwood, dead fish or plant. Something is creating a lot of ammonia. Feed very lightly while cycling. Once every other or third day will do for a few weeks. And doing water changes will slow, but not stop, the cycling of your tank. This is why it's much better to do a fishless cycle. No choice though when you use fish to get things established. Please continue with the water changes. 50% a day, or even twice a day, is not too much. Don>

Ammonia in Fry Tank I have found your website to be very helpful. First I want to say that I am a proud owner of two mollies one a balloon black (female) and the other a orange (male). Two days ago I discovered 17 fry. I was so thrilled! I need help in deciding what to do. So far the adults have left the fry alone. No problems there. I have a 2.5 gallon tank and know that that is not enough room for all of them. I am wondering if I should take the adults out (to another 2.5 tank) and leave the fry to grow a bit bigger in the existing tank. I would like to possibly keep two at the most but want them to get bigger so I can determine the sex. I have spoken to the LFS and they will take a the rest from me. My levels are at ph. 7.8 nitrite .25 nitrate 5.0 and ammonia is at 4.0. temp is 78/80. I am a determined new aquarist. What is the safest thing to do in my situation? Thanks in advance. Vanessa I. Tucker <Water changes, and lots of them. 4.0 ammonia is deadly! And .25 nitrite is .25 too high and it's about to go higher. Check the pH of your tap water. If they are within 2 or 3 tenths then match temp, dechlorinate and change 50% right now. Wait a few hours and do it again. Then daily until ammonia and nitrite are at zero. Your problem is a lack of bio filtration, something that takes time to get established. Do move the adults out. The ammonia is from fish waste. The less fish, the less ammonia will be added to the tank. Read here on establishing FW bio filtration. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm I hate to tell you to limit feeding the fry, food is very important to growing fish. But the more you feed the more waste will be produced. Just feed them twice a day and only enough that it's all eaten within a minute or two. Once the ammonia comes down you can up this to three or four small feedings a day. When you do the water changes use a gravel vac to get any uneaten food and old waste out of the system. You are going to have to continue with almost daily water changes for a month to six weeks. It will take about that long to get cycled. That link contains the most important information a new aquarist needs to have in order to keep their fish alive. And congrats on the births. 17 is a lot for a Molly. BTW they are not as bad as guppies and swordtails when it come to taking their young. As long as they do not get too hungry they generally leave them alone. But since you need to limit feeding, move the adults out. Don>

Ammonia Ugh. I know you have heard this a thousand times before. <1001> I have a 29 gallon tank with two goldfish. I cannot keep the ammonia levels down. I decided to test the water out of my tap just out of curiosity. Ammonia levels measure .50 right out of the tap!. I tried using Amquel Plus before putting the water in the tank. Tested the ammonia level 15 minutes after adding the Amquel + and it measures 0ppm. Put it in the tank after a .25 water change and ammonia level measures .50. Well not bad, at least better than 1.0. So, this morning I measured it and it is back up to 1.0. I don't know what I am doing wrong? The tank has not cycled yet... <You answered your own question.> ...it has been 2 weeks. <Not long enough, 21 to 28 days usually.> I have a 330 filter on the tank, a bubble curtain, a very thin layer of rocks. I know I am probably the culprit because I have been changing the water so much because the fear of the ammonia hurting the fish! (I have been changing 20% a day!). Any suggestions? I have laid off on feeding, which I do one pellet a fish one time a day. <Yes, let the tank finish cycling. James (Salty Dog)>

Nitrite and Ammonia still high after 5 weeks I have a 10 gal freshwater tank set up five weeks ago. Nitrite levels are still .5 and ammonia .25. I do 10 to 20% water change every 4 to 5 days by vacuuming the gravel trying to get those levels to 0. <I would not change the water... unless the ammonia or nitrite approach 1.0 ppm... and feed VERY sparingly in the meanwhile... the water changes are forestalling the establishment of biological filtration...> Nothing seems to help. The water I'm putting in is reverse osmosis water and shows 0 nitrite and ammonia. <Umm, you'd be better off with at least some mineral content (i.e. non-R.O. water) being mixed in here... try taking out a few gallons (w/o gravel vacuuming) and adding some tap water...> My tank currently has only 1 Serpae tetra as all the others have died of ich. I am still treating the tank with CopperSafe until 30 days are up (1 more week). I don't understand why I can't get those levels down. Thanks, Tina <Mmm, Tina, someone/s have not been making known to you more of a/the "full picture"... that is, what you need to know. The Copper is also killing off the beneficial bacteria you need to convert ammonia and nitrite to less noxious products... There are a few things I would do at this point. First and foremost is for you to READ, understand what biological filtration establishment and ich actually are: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm and http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwich.htm and the Related materials, linked, in blue, above... I would raise your water temperature to the mid 80's F (this will kill the ich, save your Serpae... and speed up establishment of biological filtration). STOP using the Copper product, all such "medications"... You will soon understand enough of the underlying factual material to be aquarium-confident, proceeding beyond these present troubles. Bob Fenner>

Re: Nitrite and Ammonia still high after 5 weeks Thank you so much for your prompt response. I have read the links you gave me which leads me to more questions. Even though I did a ton of research before I started this tank (which incidentally was a Christmas present for my 8 year old daughter) I seem to have overdone a lot of things. <Yes> I did let the tank run for 4 days before I added any fish but then I added three cherry barbs right away. <There are ways... as you now know... to "break in" a new system... but this was too much too soon> They seemed really happy so after 4 more days I added 3 Serpae Tetras. That's where things started getting out of control. <Actually not where, or even when... think about this... all this life produces wastes, which poison themselves... and not enough biological filtration going...> I was having trouble stabilizing the water and kept doing water changes every 2 or 3 days. When the ammonia got high I added "Ammonia Clear" then the next day I would have a bacteria bloom and freak out that my water was cloudy so I would do more water changes. After three weeks the filter was really dirty so I changed the Whisper carbon filter but I did reuse the original framework that goes in the bio bag as they said it would have built up beneficial bacteria. <Yes, good> After all this one morning the male cherry barb looked like he had been sprinkled with salt after identifying this as ich I quickly ran to Petco where they advised me to put CopperSafe in the tank and it would fix everything. It didn't, the other fish rapidly showed signs of ich and they all died a slow agonizing death. It was horrible to watch. (some Christmas present) The only fish that was not affected was the largest Serpae who seems to be immune to ich. He never got a spot. Now that you have the background here are the questions. My husband thinks I should just dump this whole tank and start over since I've messed up so many things trying to give them tender loving care. What do you think? The tank has been running at 80 degrees of about 2 weeks. I will turn it up higher like you mentioned. Were you suggesting that I remove all the CopperSafe from the water? <It's gone... absorbed by material in the tank, fallen out of solution> Should I put the carbon filter back in? <Yes> To clarify my previous e-mail I have only put in about 5 gallons of RO water in the tank, the other five were treated tap water. <Oh, good> I have noticed that when I stir up the water in the tank when cleaning hundreds of pieces of what looks like mucus or skin start floating around the tank. Do you know what that would be. Is it from the fish that died, or ich, etc. <Don't know... could be scales, copper flecks...> Last of all I just want to mention that the Tetra looks great very brightly colored and healthy. When I feed him I only put in a few pieces at a time and quickly remove what he doesn't eat. Sorry this was so long but your my only reliable source of information. I can't trust the high school kids at Petco that never had a fish. Thanks, Tina <Take your time... wait a few weeks and see how the tank looks, feed sparingly till there are no nitrogenous waste anomalies... Bob Fenner>

Re: Nitrite and Ammonia still high after 5 weeks Thanks again Bob. I will put the carbon back in my filter and raise the temp. I will slow down on water changes. Is once a week still too much?<Not as long you don't touch the gravel. Syphoning the gravel will remove the bacteria that you are trying to produce.> Would you recommend that going forward I do not always vacuum the gravel with every water change?<NO, once a month should be sufficient.> Should I wait until the water is completely stabilized before adding another Serpae? <Yes, absolutely.> This one seems so lonely since all of his buddies died. I don't have an isolation tank since this is our first try at tropical fish so I'm nervous about when I do add another fish. According to one of those links you gave me it sounds like if the conditions are good in your tank there is less of a chance of a fish getting ich. Tina <Tina, let the tetra be in the tank for about 2 weeks after the tank has stabilized. This will remove the ich from the tank. Once the water quality is stable then you start your time for the 2 weeks. Then you add fish 2 or 3 at a time. I would suggest one addition of fish a week. This will give your biological filter time to recover from the addition of the new fish. good luck. MikeB>

Inexplicable (?) ammonia readings -12/14/07 Hi Crew, <Leah,> Let me apologize in advance for a lengthy question. I've received help from you before, and I am really hoping that you can help explain the current ammonia emergency I seem to be having in my tank. I've read several threads and FAQs, but nothing I see explains my extreme ammonia readings. I have 2 small honey Gourami and 3 small clown loaches in a 20g tank running a 20-40 Whisper HOB plus an under-the-gravel filter (and if the fish all pull through this they're going in a 55g in January). <Ah, am glad to see you plan on buying a bigger tank. Clown loaches are WAAAYYY too big for a 20 gallon tank. Adults are big fish, and even in a 55 gallon tank they're going to be pretty cramped.> The tank with Gourami only was running for over 6 months with no trouble before buying the loaches. I didn't qt the loaches and thus learned my lesson. They gave my tank ich. I treated with Rid-Ich+ for 10 days, which ended about a week ago. The treatments seems to have been effective (fingers crossed) but it also seems to have killed off my biological filter. <Used as directed, aquarium medications shouldn't harm the filter. The filter is filled with bacteria, whereas the Ick parasites are Protozoans. What kills the one is normally harmless to the other. So I'd be looking around for other factors.> I started getting ammonia readings around 1 or 2 on the last day of treatment. I did daily 50% water changes, but there was no measurable effect on the ammonia. After 2 or 3 days, I grew very worried--why wouldn't water changes result in an immediately lowered ammonia reading? <Depends on where the ammonia is coming from. Potentially you could have ammonia in the water supply. Infrequently, this happens, and when it does, water changes dump ammonia in the water. Another source is Chloramine, used to sterilise tap water. Dechlorinators not designed for Chloramine break it into Chlorine (which they neutralise) and Ammonia (which they do not). If you've switched brand on dechlorinator and you happen to have Chloramine in the tap water, you will suddenly have an ammonia crisis. Likewise, if your water supplier has suddenly started adding chloramine to your tap water but your favoured brand of dechlorinator doesn't treat it, then again, elevated levels of ammonia will appear in the water. Other sources of ammonia include overstocking, overfeeding, and under-filtration. Filters need to be maintained, and if they're excessively clogged up, their ammonia processing ability declines.> I bought a product called Ammo Lock and began using it. The daily ammonia readings grew even higher. <Ammo-Lock is essentially a one-shot tool for removing ammonia from tap water. It has no impact on constant ammonia production, e.g., by your livestock or from some dead animal decaying in the tank. It is almost never the solution to an ammonia problem.> Yesterday I spaced out several big water changes, resulting in changing at least 100% of the water over the course of the day, and the ammonia stayed squarely at 4. Finally in the evening I did one big 80% change, and the ammonia lowered to 1--but by the morning it was at 4 again. I did another 80% change, resulting in a reading of 1--and in six hours it was at 4 again. I did another 90% change, resulting in a reading of .25 to .5--and in five hours it was over 4 again. I am, to say the least, frustrated. These readings just don't seem possible. <I agree, this is odd and severe. The first thing is test the water. Test it straight from the tap, and then after dechlorination. If there's ammonia in the tap water, that's one problem identified. If the ammonia appears only after dechlorination, then the problem is chloramine plus the wrong type of dechlorinator. If both tests are negative, but there's ammonia in the aquarium, then the ammonia source is in the tank: the fish or decaying protein (which could be food or a dead animal). In either case, the solution is to remove that source, by [a] reducing the stocking density; [b] increasing the biological filtration; [c] removing any dead animals in the tank; or [d] feeding the fish less often.> I should add that I haven't fed the tank for 2 days. <Good.> My pH is 6.4 to 6.8, nitrites are 0, and nitrates around 10. Also, I have a 10g tank with 6 Rasboras in it, which is running a 10-20 Whisper HOB and a 70 Aquaclear HOB (the Aquaclear is running to seed it with bacteria for the 55g coming in January). Yesterday I took the unhealthy biological filter pad from the 20g Whisper and switched it with the healthy media filter from the 10g Whisper (they use the same size biological filter). No change in ammonia. This morning I removed the 70 filter, which has been running on the 10g tank for about 8 days, and put it on the 20g. So the 20g is running with one established bio filter pad and one partially established 70 filter. No improvement in ammonia. How is it possible that I do an 80% to 90% water change, and the ammonia spikes back up to 4 in a matter of hours? Where is it coming from? <Assuming not in the tap water as ammonia or chloramine, then one of these: too many fish, too much food, dead stuff decaying.> There's only 5 small fish who haven't eaten in 2 days. (And they seem perfectly fine--I can only assume this is the result of the Ammo Lock, which I have replaced with every water change in proportion to what I take out.) I wonder if either I am getting false positives (I'm using a salicylate test from API, the makers of Ammo Lock), <Possible. Take some water to the pet store and have them test for ammonia.> or maybe its a case of what I've read online about under-the-gravel filters that trap toxic waste and release it in the water. <Doesn't work that way. Undergravel filters don't magically produce ammonia. Ammonia comes from protein, and protein is either live animals (fish) or dead animals (fish food). Plants contain tiny amounts of protein so don't produce much ammonia even when dead and decaying. 'Toxic Waste' covers a range of chemicals. Undergravel filters are said to produce nitrate; assuming this happens, that nitrate is largely harmless and certainly doesn't magically become ammonia.> But I am good with vacuuming the gravel. I will be so grateful to hear your opinion on what I'm doing wrong and how I might fix this. Perhaps the worst part of this story is that on the 17th I leave town for over a month and a house-sitter will care for my tank. I so want these fish to make it until I get back and can set up their new 55g that I've already bought for them. Thanks in advance for your help.

Re: inexplicable (?) ammonia readings -12/14/07 One possible source might be this: I used to have lots of copepods or other tiny shrimpy things living in my gravel, but the Rid-Ich+ seems to have killed them (the bottle says it will kill invertebrates). I'm not seeing their bodies when I vacuum the gravel, but maybe there's a ton of them decaying beneath the under-gravel filter. Should I try to take it out and check? <Certainly sounds plausible. There's nothing wrong with taking apart an undergravel filter for a good clean. In fact, it should be done every year or so. Remove the gravel to a bucket and clean (in stages if need be) using aquarium water or lukewarm, dechlorinated tap water, just as if you were cleaning a filter sponge. With the gravel remove, clean the filter plate and siphon away any detritus. Because u/g filters need to be maintained in this way, they're somewhat out of fashion these days compared with easier to maintain canister and sponge filters. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: inexplicable (?) ammonia readings -12/14/07 Thanks for the response, Neale. I have indeed tested my tap water, but it contains no ammonia. My dechlorinator (Stress Coat) treats both chlorine and chloramine. Ammo Lock also treats both chlorine and chloramine, in addition to ammonia. <All sounds fine.> For this reason I've been using only Ammo Lock and no Stress Coat for the past few days. <I'm not a big fan of Stress Coat. It doesn't really do anything essential in the average aquarium.> I didn't want to use two dechlorinators at once, but maybe this is part of the problem? AL says it treats 7.0 ppm chlorine and 5.0 ppm chloramine; SC doesn't give numbers on the bottle. <Ammo Lock should work adequately well on its own; no need to supplement with Stress Coat.> Last night I tested some water from my 10g both with and without the addition of some AL, and it was 0 ammonia in both cases, so I think the test works and is not affected by the AL. Last night I also bought a small Zeolite cartridge for the under-gravel filter, and this morning was the first morning that the ammonia level stayed where it was when I went to bed last night (still close to 4). I assume this is because the Zeolite actually removes ammonia as opposed to binding it. <Zeolite binds with ammonia in a _reversible_ way up to its capacity, after which it does nothing. There's no need to use Zeolite in most aquaria, but in this instance it may be useful. To actually have any effect you need quite a lot of the stuff unless the tank is very lightly stocked. The small cartridges are largely a waste of money. Seriously, you need about a litre volume of the stuff (i.e., a 10 cm by 10 cm by 10 cm) for about 10-15 gallons of aquarium space. It is hugely inefficient compared with biological filtration, which is why it's only useful in exceptional situations, such as tanks with less than pH 6.> But I know this is only treating the symptom. I've removed rocks and plants to see if some animal or bug or something fell in the tank and died, but there's nothing in there. Just 5 hungry fish, and lots of java fern. Nothing has happened in that tank except for massive water changes. Considering all this, do you have any other ideas about the source of the ammonia? <Nope. There's really only two places ammonia comes from: organic sources, i.e., animals dead or alive, and inorganic sources, i.e., ammonia in the tap water.> Just because I'm feeling so desperate to get the fish out of this sick tank, I have considered the idea of setting up the 55g tank before I leave for vacation, and running it with all three of my HOB filters (10-20 Whisper, 20-40 Whisper, and 70 Aquaclear) plus the under-gravel plate. My thinking is that, if it works, it will not experience much of a cycle and will leave the house-sitter with a more stable system. But if it doesn't work, and if the 20's cycling problem is only imported into the 55, then the house-sitter would be left with a 55 tank experiencing ammonia spikes and thus she'd have to deal with way bigger water changes than she'd need to for the 20.... Any opinions on this? <You might ask a retailer if you can "holiday" your fish. Some will do this, either free of charge or for a small fee. Depends on your relationship with the retailer. Do also check all filters are working, and optimise for biological filtration. Remove junk like carbon, and I don't think Zeolite is going to really help here. If I was using Zeolite, I'd fill up a big box or canister filter with the stuff. You need A LOT to do a job. I'd also clean the tank from top to bottom, removing anything even remotely dead or decaying. And don't feed the fish!> Again, thanks so much. <Cheers, Neale.>

Re: inexplicable (?) ammonia readings 12/15/2007 Sorry to keep writing back with more questions. I think setting up the 55 might be a bad idea--I should wait until I get back and have time to monitor it. I'm in the middle of scooping out gravel in order to remove the under-gravel filter and clean it. Since I have two HOB filters running on this tank, would it be ok not to re-install the under-gravel? Would that significantly decrease my biological filtration? <Difficult to answer this question without knowing the size of the tank. It doesn't matter how an aquarium is filtered, provided the total filtration is at least 4x the volume of the tank in turnover per hour. So if the HOB filters cover that, you may not need the undergravel filter. But my instinct is to say NO, do not remove the undergravel filter. A clean u/g filter works very well, and in my experience at least as well as a couple of small, easily clogged HOB filters. If you have physically removed the ammonia source by cleaning the gravel, you should find the ammonia level drops to zero very quickly. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: inexplicable (?) ammonia readings 12/15/2007 I'll give it a try and clean the gravel filter today. Any opinion on setting up the 55? I would have only 3 days to monitor it before leaving on Monday.... <Tough call. Moving a mature filter to a new, bigger tank should cause no problems and in fact improve environmental conditions. The bacteria don't care where they are provided the water chemistry is the same. But if you'd prefer to take things slowly and check for leaks, water chemistry, etc., then leave the 55 gallon tank until you return. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: inexplicable (?) ammonia readings 12/16/07 Hi again (Neale?), I had hoped to write back with good news, but things don't seem to be improving in my 20g tank with the ammonia issues. I cleaned the gravel in old tank water, and replaced about 90% of the water. I then put everything back it--gravel, two rock decorations, and some java fern attached to rocks with twisty-ties. For about 5 or 6 hours the ammonia stayed at .25 and I was optimistic, but last night it started to slowly creep up and this morning its at 4 again. <Very strange. If this was me, I'd empty the tank 100%. No gravel, no rocks, no nothing. Fill with water. Install filters and heaters. Put in a couple hiding places for the fish, such as the Java ferns, though thoroughly clean these under a running tap to wash away any dirt. Return the fish. Switch off lights. Leave tank running 24 hours and see what happens. If the ammonia returns, then the source is almost certainly too many fish/not enough filtration. If the ammonia stays at zero, as it should, either seriously deep clean the gravel or else install brand new gravel. At this point, you need to eliminate possible sources of ammonia. Since dead animals in the gravel is one of the options, checking things this way would help.> I am consider 1) removing all the gravel and replacing it with new gravel; 2) setting up the new 55 tank today; or 3) moving all the fish (two honey Gourami and three small Clown loaches) to my 10g tank for the month I am away (it has 6 Rasboras in it). <I'd go with [1], though at least setting up the 55 gallon tank might have some mileage. Moving the fish to the 10 gallon could be sensible if the ammonia refuses to go down, but for anything more than a couple of weeks you don't really want to cram this many fish into such a small tank.> In any case I have only 2 and 1/2 days to monitor the situation before I leave. <Always the way! Things go wrong just before a vacation.> I really appreciate your help. (PS--I didn't get your email about the UGF until I had already put the gravel back in without the UGF, so that is not in the tank, but I could put it back in today since I'm removing the gravel again.) <For now, remove the UG filter as described above and see what happens. Assuming the tap water is ammonia-free, and the HOB filters are adequate to the task, then an "empty" aquarium with no gravel should be safe and ammonia-free, even if the fish aren't happy about the lack of decor. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: inexplicable (?) ammonia readings 12/16/07 Thanks again, Neale. I have removed all gravel and put back in the java fern. There is 100% new dechlorinated water in the tank. I'm going to let it sit for a few hours to acclimate to room temp, and then I'll put the fish back in. Instead of having them in a bucket, I put them in the 10g while I worked, and to be honest the clown loaches seem to like it in there. It's got a ton of java fern in it, and they're out swimming around in it, not hiding under a rock like they used to do in the 20g. So, I was wondering what you think about putting only the two Gourami in the 20g and leaving the clowns in the 10g for the 3 and 1/2 weeks I'll be away. I hate to move them again--it really wigs them out, whereas the Gourami will swim right into the net. <Hmm... depends on the size of the Clowns. I'd not like to see 3" Clown loaches in a 10 gallon tank for any length of time. While they might be fine, I'd prefer to see how the ammonia levels do in the big tank, and then act accordingly. If it's a toss-up between a healthy 10 gallon and an ammonia-laced 50 gallon tank, then keep 'em where they are. But if the big tank settles down, as I think it will, then moving the Clowns back to the 50 gallon tank will be the wiser choice. At the end of the day this will have to be your choice based on the happiness of the fish, their size, and the water quality in the big tank. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: inexplicable (?) ammonia readings 12/16/07 Cheers to you, too, Neale -- I do think I'll need a drink at the end of this day.... <Heh!> I've moved the Gourami back over to the 20g, and I'm going to wait and see what happens in 24 hours. (The tank with the ammonia issues is a 20g, not a 50, although I have a 55 sitting on my coffee table that I was planning on setting up after vacation.) This afternoon I'll get some fresh gravel from the pet store. The loaches are still in the 10g--I'll decide what to do about them tomorrow. I am leaning toward, as you suggest, putting them back in the 20g if the ammonia calms down. <I think that would be the ideal move, but if the ammonia is still above zero, then keeping them in the healthy 10 gallon tank would be the safe option. I've been in your situation, and had to keep overly-large fish in a small tank simply because it was the safest place for them. While your Loaches will be fine there for the short term, the problem for us here when recommending this sort of thing is some people will read this as saying "Clown Loaches can be kept in a 10 gallon tank". Which they can't, at least not for anything other than the short term.> I guess I have some lingering worries about there being bacteria issues. But then again I did switch filter media 2 days ago. In an attempt to manage the ammonia crisis, I took the bio filter pad from the 10g's filter and switched it with the pad on the 20g's filter. So now the 10g's filter is running with what I thought was the "bad" bio filter pad damaged by Rid-Ich+, and the 20g has a "good" bio pad from the stable 10g. But now I doubt that this was ever a bacteria problem, since switching the pads has had no effect on either tank, leading me to believe that both pads are equally stable. <Precisely so. Filter bacteria are basically quite tough and difficult to kill once established, and fish medications are almost all safe to use with biological filters.> And you advised me that Rid-Ich+ shouldn't wipe out my bacteria when used as directed. I think most clues point to the ammonia problem being attributable to an ammonia source and not a bacteria failure. <Does seem probable, but this is all speaking without experimentation. Removing the gravel and then seeing what happens should clear this up.> In any case, I'm not doing anything except water tests for the next 24 hours. I do apologize for all these emails and kind of abusing your patience and the very generous wetwebmedia.com services, but it's been really invaluable to have someone knowledgeable to correspond with throughout this whole situation. Thanks again! <Glad we could help, and I hope everything settles down. Enjoy the holidays! Neale.>

Re: inexplicable (?) ammonia readings 12/20/07 Well things settled down for about 30 hours, and then the ammonia began to rise to .25. <Very odd.> I am not sure whether this may reflect the loss of all the bacteria in the old gravel, and thus maybe it will settle down on its own, or if there is still yet another source of ammonia in the tank that I haven't identified (just java fern, rocks, and two cave decorations in there), <If the undergravel filter was the principle location of biological filtration, then cleaning/replacing the gravel would have the effect of allowing ammonia (and nitrite) to go up for a while. At least until the canister filters come up to maturity and compensate. As for sources of ammonia, the plants certainly won't be a factor. Plants remove ammonia directly as a source of nitrogen for protein synthesis. It is hard to imagine rocks or ornaments could produce ammonia, and certainly not if sold as "aquarium safe".> or if there is after all a bacteria problem (which seems unlikely since I'm running the filter pad from the established 10g on the 20g--albeit the 10g contains only 6 Rasboras, so maybe that pad didn't have a large enough colony to take over on the 20g.) <In this case, the mature filter media will quickly inoculate the clean media in the filter, so that the tank should fully "cycle" up to a full biological filtration capacity in a week or less.> Due to the time difference, if you get this email before I leave, it will likely be in the morning for me. <Well, I was away for a few days, so only now able to answer this question.> So, my question is, if the ammonia just won't get under control, and you had to get the fish out of the tank, would you 1) move them to the 10g or 2) set up the 55 running with all three filters I have? <I'd move everything to the big tank, attach the mature filter to it, and remove everything from the big tank that I wasn't 100% sure was safe. In other words, I'd happily leave it empty of gravel, with maybe just the heater, a flower pot for a hiding place, and a plant or two.> The 10-20 HOB has the "bad" bio media pad, the 20-40 HOB has the "good" bio media pad, and the new 70 HOB has only been running for about 10 days to get seeded with bacteria. The fish would be six small Rasboras, two 1 inch honey gouramis, and 3 clown loaches all under 2 inches each. <Do-able, but perhaps not ideal. Too much in the 10 gallon tank could cause its own problems.> Would you use the java fern from the 20g in either tank? Could the plants be part of the problem? <I can't see how, but to eliminate the possibility, I'd remove the plant to a glass jar filled with water and place it somewhere sunny. In other words, treat it like a pot plant. It'll be fine kept thus for a few weeks.> Thank you again, Leah. <Cheers, Neale.>

Re: inexplicable (?) ammonia readings 12/20/07 Hi again Neale. I wonder if it would make any difference in your assessment of the situation if I tell you that there is a discrepancy now between the API liquid test and the Mardel ammonia monitor that hangs in the tank. The monitor shows no ammonia, but it only measure free ammonia (I believe that's NH3 as opposed to NH4?). Now there's no Ammo Lock in the water, so if the ammonia is the non-toxic sort, then it's not because of any chemicals I added. The API test measures both NH3 and NH4, and it is the slightest bit green--it was almost hard to tell, so I tested the water from the 10g to compare them, and the 10g is definitely a lemon yellow while the 20g's water is slightly green-tinged, seeming to match the .25 color strip on the chart. Just thought I'd add that, because I only started using the API test during the current situation. Before I relied only on Mardel monitors, so the fish could have been in these same water conditions many times before but I wouldn't have known it because the Mardel monitor doesn't seem to reflect the change I'm currently experiencing. <Hello Leah. In-tank pH and ammonia monitors have a fixed lifespan after which point they stop being accurate. The Mardel one apparently needs to be replaced every 6 weeks. So I'd not place too much store on any values offered by that device if it is older than that. Personally, I find these devices a bit of a waste. Anyway, all ammonia is toxic. It doesn't matter if it is ammonium (the stuff produced by the fish, and the form of ammonia present in acidic tanks) or ammonia proper (which the fish waste turns into under alkaline/basic water conditions). While reading around your problem, I came across a very interesting article on ammonia-removing products and ammonia test kits, published by the manufacturers of an Ammo Lock-type product called AmQuel. http://www.novalek.com/kordon/articles/truth_about.html If your fish are otherwise happy and healthy, it might be that your test kit is either past its "best before" date or is reacting adversely to the Ammo Lock. High levels of ammonia (above 0.5 mg/l) tend to produce very obvious signs in fish: lethargy, poor colours, loss of appetite, outbreaks of whitespot and Finrot, and so on. If these are not present, I would be very keen to test out the test kits. I'd do a few big water changes that would flush out the Ammo Lock, and then I'd use a different (new) test kit to test for ammonia, perhaps asking the pet store to do it. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: inexplicable (?) ammonia readings 12/20/07 I'm really sorry for the constant updates, but as of 7 PM Hawaii time tomorrow I'll be bound for the mainland, and I can't really ask any questions after that--the fish are on their own. The ammonia is still creeping up--it's at .5. I am leaning toward setting up the 55 for several reasons: 1) all the fish in the 10g would be overcrowded, risking an ammonia situation in that tank that arises after I leave; 2) all the fish in the 55 would be under-stocked, and lots more water means more dilution of ammonia and a more forgiving system; and since the house sitter may only come by every other day, I feel like there's less chance in the 55 of a sudden spike that would kill the fish in that time; 3) my 10g filter is running what I thought was the "bad" filter pad damaged by Rid-Ich+, so I don't know if the 10g tank can handle an overload of fish, and although I don't fully trust any of my filters now, I feel like all three running on an 55 tank might have time to get themselves back in line before the ammonia level even becomes readable. I will have the house sitter test the water, and if things get bad I will give her instructions on how to set back up the 10g. My follow up question is what stuff should I bring over from the 20g: the gravel seems ok, its new; the plants I'm not sure about, maybe they're contributing to the problem?; the 70 Aquaclear HOB needs to go on the 55, it was running on the 10g for about 10 days before I moved it to the 20 to help out with the ammonia issue; and lastly the 20-40 Whisper HOB is running the "good" filter pad from the 10g, but I wonder of something in there is causing the ammonia. I checked it--its slimy, but not full of dead copepods or anything--but could anything else in there be dumping ammonia in the water? <I think your plan is basically sound. If it was me, I'd not risk having house-sitters doing water changes and so on. I'd simply empty the 55 g tank of everything but the bare essentials: a filter, a heater, a flower pot or two for hiding places, and maybe some plastic plants or something else inert and 100% safe. I'd leave the 10 gallon tank (with the Rasboras?) alone doing its thing. I'd then ensure the house-sitter gave very infrequent meals, perhaps once every 3-4 days. That would minimise the amount of waste in the system. I tend to NOT clean biological filters before going away on vacations unless they are obviously clogged and poorly performing. Best to leave the bacteria alone in my opinion. Cheers, Neale.>

Disregard previous emails: here's what happened Re: inexplicable (?) ammonia readings 12/20/07 Hey Neale. <Leah,> After fretting over this yesterday afternoon (sorry for the barrage of updates) I returned home to find the ammonia creeping still higher to .50. Having changed the gravel completely, I can only conclude that the problem is either 1) something inside my filter producing ammonia; <Seems improbable.> 2) something in the java fern or the stones they're tied to producing ammonia; <Again, improbable.> 3) something in the plastic rock decorations producing ammonia; <Very improbable, assuming aquarium-safe to begin with.> or 4) a lack of bacteria. <Often the case with immature tanks, but as I understand it, this isn't the case here.> Yet none of these seems plausible: 1) took my filter apart, nothing in there but some green slime which I thought was where some bacteria lived, but I cleaned out some of it from the intake tube; <Hmm... healthy filter sponges (or whatever) should have nothing more than brown detritus, basically decaying plant matter and fish faeces. The smell should be earthy but pleasant, like soil. Fungi and saprophytic bacteria look whitish, while blue-green algae is very obviously that colour and has quite a nasty musty smell. Anything that clogs up the sponges is bad, though the degree to which this matters depends on the quantity. As a rule, gently cleaning out sponges by squeezing them in buckets of aquarium water once every 1-2 months should do the trick nicely.> 2) the same java fern and stones, bought from a pet store for aquariums, were in my 10g causing no problems; 3) the plastic decorations are also made for aquariums; <Ditto.> and 4) the bio filter pads were switched, so it seems both pads work equally (I should add that these tanks have run with no measurable ammonia ever for 2 months [the 10g} and almost 4 months [20g]). <Sounds fine.> Yet, the "good" bio filter pad was indeed running in a 10g tank with only 6 Rasboras, so maybe it wasn't prepared for the Gourami and clown loaches. I figured that if this is the case, dumping all 5 fish in the 10g would be a bad idea and would cause an ammonia rise after a few days. <Broadly agree, but healthy biological filters adapt to increased loads remarkably quickly, certainly if only small numbers of extra fish are added at a time.> If none of my filters are 100%, but they're all at least partially seeded with bacteria, then the right thing to do seemed to be to set up the 55 with all 3 filters. And at least with that much water, an ammonia spike would come on slower--if they're all in the 10g it'd kill them pretty quickly--and maybe the bacteria will have a chance to catch up before the ammonia becomes measurable. <Agreed.> I am using the 20-40 filter from the 20g, but I haven't added the java fern yet on the chance that it's the problem--do you think it'd be safe to add it back? <Should be fine.> Should I clean that filter any more? <No; overdoing the cleaning will only stress the bacteria population.> I'll show my house sitter how to test the water and set the 10g back up, just in case things go wrong in the 55 (by the way, the fish love it in there). Is there anything else I can do in the 12 hours before I leave Hawaii to make sure this 55 is as stable as possible? <Have said what I'd do in the other messages leading up to this one. Sorry I'm behind schedule answering, but I've been away. Cheers and good luck, Neale.>

Re: disregard previous emails: here's what happened... FW cycling... 12/27/07 Dear Crew, <Leah,> I hope this email gets to Neale, because I finally have good news. I got your last emails a few days ago. Please don't apologize for being away and not answering earlier--I totally abused the "send" button the night before I left Hawaii as I quickly threw together a 55 gallon tank. But I've been on the mainland for 10 days now, and the tank has been pretty peaceful. I won't speculate on whether it is out of the woods yet, but I do think the fish are much safer in the 55 than in the 20, and I am tentatively optimistic that maybe they'll all be ok when I get back on the 13th. So thanks again for all your advice, and happy holidays! Best, Leah <Well this all sounds promising. All else being equal, a 55 gallon tank will take significantly longer (a factor of 2.75) to go "bad" than a 20 gallon tank. So simply trading up in this way reduces -- dramatically -- the potentiality for problems. Or at least will give you much more time to spot and remedy any problems as they develop. In the meantime, minimise feeding, do regular water changes, and hope for the best. Good luck, and happy holidays yourself! Neale.>

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