Easy Balance and cycling questions 10/16/12
Hi folks
<Gordon>
Right, I'll ask the quick one first. I recently bought a new 70 litre tank and it came with whatever Tetra's version of tap safe is, a small tub of food and some mystery product called "Easy Balance" that claims I only need to do water changes once every six months if I use it. It also seems to "stabilise pH and KH". Is this stuff snake-oil, consignable only to the bin or is it worth using it until the bottle is empty? I'm always hesitant to believe extraordinary claims and anything that mucks with my water chemistry makes me uneasy.
<Personally, I'd probably donate it to a local fish club for the next auction. Nothing can replace water changes in my opinion.>
I won't buy any more of it, anyway, since I'm not paying for something that elbow grease can accomplish just as easily, just curious.
<Set up another small tank and play with it if you are curious.>
The purpose of the tank was to set up the Betta Splendens "Sorority" scenario as per this thread (amongst others):
http://www.ultimatebettas.com/index.php?showtopic=12193 
I know it's a risk but I am keeping a really close eye on them and have backup nanos to use as hospital tanks or outright isolation tanks. So far, I've not seen any real open aggression, just a few nips, chases and a bit of flaring. No worse than Danios, so far. Fingers crossed! I've got some lovely specimens too, with some of them really similar in colouration to wild betas.
<Females can often live in a sorority tank. Depends on the individuals.>
Into this new tank went a mature bubbler filter and a new All Pond Solutions 600 litres per hour internal filter.  I rubbed the wetted media from the 600lph over mature filter media from my other tanks. The media from each mature filter was also rinsed in the new aquarium's water with the "pumps running". I want to go with the 600lph since the trick to this setup seems to be slight overstocking to disperse aggression. I thought over filtering might not be a bad plan in this situation!
<Just watch your water currents. Bettas are still water fish.>
I didn't expect the bubbler to keep up with 8 female betas in a 70 litre tank, but I didn't expect it too be too harsh on them either, especially with frequent partial water changes (plan was 10% per day, depending on analysis) and light feeding. Sort of an "assisted" fish in cycle. Well, it seems like the bubbler is keeping up after all, two weeks in and not a jot of ammonia in my daily tests. I'm now feeding normal amounts and doing my standard 20% weekly water change. The issue I have is that I'm not sure how long to leave the bubbler running in parallel with the new filter. Normally I'd set up a tank with a new filter, go fishless and be able to monitor the cycle but this isn't really an option here.
<I have a sponge filter going in all my tanks in tandem with HOB filters, unless I don't want currents, then it's only sponge filters.  I think you can just use common sense here. Just turn it off for a few days and leave it in the tank so you don't lose the bacteria. If trouble starts, turn it back on.>
Just as an aside, so far I really like these internal filters from All Pond Solutions for Betta setups. They come with an optional spray bar that you can adjust the angle of egress on. The spray bar really reduces the force of water and with the outlet holes angled toward the back of the tank it does so even further. I have another smaller one cycling in another tank to use with my male Betta. I can get rid of the ugly home-made baffle on the outside of his internal filter soon. Still, they are dirt cheap, so I'll be interested to see how much life I get out of them.
<Have not used them myself.>
Anyroad, thanks for any advice you can give, both on the new filter cycle issue, the Easy Balance and anything else you might spot that I've overlooked. Also, thanks again for all the help you've given me in the past.
<I think you are right on track.>
Cheers
<Rick>
Re: Easy Balance and cycling questions 10/16/12     10/18/12
Hi Rick
<Gord>
Thanks for your input. I always like an experiment, so I might just do that!
I'll stick the bubbler in it's final destination (a soon-to-be cherry shrimp nano) and once I'm sure the Bettas are fine then go ahead with that.
Thanks again, your advice and reassurance is very much appreciated.
<Let us know how it turns out.>
Cheers
Gord
<Rick>

Re: Floaty fish... est. bio-cycling FW 1/25/12
Ok I have been reading till my eyes hurt, still cant get exact answers and cannot navigate through the forum , never did this before but I did try, I have a question about using Dr. Tim's one and only for moving one of my goldfish about 7 inches 12 yrs old to a tank of his own,
<Best to move media et al. as well. Read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm
one to allow the others more room and he fights with them, I feel I should do this, I will move one of the BioWheels from old tank and add his new whisper 60 to new tank, also will take half the stones from old tank, now with this and adding one and only WILL I have any problems in old and new tank, as the old will still have fish in it with less stones and one less filter, each will have fresh water added
<Not likely>
Does Dr Tims one and only work, Does anyone know this for sure??
<I do; yes. I know Tim Hovanec personally.>>
How will I know it is working?? I have ordered 70 dollars worth of that , and have my new tank and filters ready to set up, JUST SO NERVOUS!! Please let me know if anyone thinks with my plan I will have any problems?? And if anyone knows for sure if dr Tims one and only really works?? Is it as good as the once available BioSpira
Thanks I am sorry to have to mail again but I cant read or find what I need anymore, MY EYES are burning!!
Cathy Hart
<BobF>
Re: Floaty fish... Dr. Tim/'s 1/26/12
wow you know dr Tim personally!!
<Yes; we were both life science majors at San Diego State University>
So one and only really works,
<... it does>
even if I didn't use old media will it work as well??
<No>
Will I have ammonia problems, What can you tell me about this one and only?? How does it work where others don't at all!!
<Please... learn to/use the search tool, indices on WWM. Your repeated questions re what is already archived there are tiring. B>
Re: Floaty fish
I do try, I am sorry for all the questions, thanks for the help
Re: Floaty fish 1/26/12
I do try to search, never can find what I am looking for, I just typed in the search, one and only nitrifying bacteria and got something like this
River type setup (Crayfish with Hillstream fish, snails) 10/26/10
then I typed in the search switching tanks, got the same thing
I will not bother, I will try this on my own, I hope I already have enough info from you so far to switch tanks safely for the fish (sorry for bold letters, don't know how that happened!)

Question about my new cycling Platy tank, FW, cycling products 12/29/10
Hello,
<Hi there>
I recently purchased a 14 gallon tank. I have 4 platies in the tank and as of tomorrow they will have been there for 3 weeks. Before I added any fish to the tank I added Nutrafin Cycle
<Mmm, have found this product to be... unreliable. Sometimes works, other times...>
and let the tank run for about 3 or 4 days. Prior to adding any fish the levels for ammonia, nitrites and
nitrates were 0 and the pH was about 7.6. The tap water is about 7.4 and the guy at the fish store told me that Platies like water with a little bit of salt in it so I added a little over 1 tablespoon of salt to the water,
thus raising the pH to 7.6.
<So... something other than table salt, NaCl>
The fish all seemed to adjust well. They spent the first day or two hiding in different corners of the tank. Because one spent a lot of time at the surface, I was concerned there wasn't proper aeration so I installed a power head to further oxygenate the tank. The fish all get along well, all 4 are males and occasionally they chase each other, but that is infrequent.
My concern is the ammonia level and whether the tank is cycling properly.
Starting about 3 days into having fish in the tank I noticed that the ammonia levels were rising (as I knew they would).
<... Not really. IF the "Cycle" worked... and this exposure is very hard on your fish>
I used a test kit on a daily basis. I did frequent water changes (perhaps 30% at a time) every day or every other day. If the water was unchanged for a day then the ammonia would easily rise to 1.0.
<Deadly toxic at high pHs>
I kept doing 30-40% water changes daily to try and bring the levels down to .25 or .5. When it seemed as though the ammonia was rising closer to 2.0, the guy at the fish store told me to buy Ammo Lock because it would detoxify the ammonia (converting it to ammonium),
<Only temporarily...>
which would be less stressful for the fish, but which would still provide the beneficial bacteria with the food they need for the colonies to grow.
I continued doing 1-2 water changes per day and added about 5mL of Ammo Lock to the tank for 3 days. The ammonia levels continued registering at about 1.0. For the first two weeks, the pH held steady around 7.4 or 7.6 and I still have 0 nitrites or nitrates.
<Uncycled>
But last night I noticed that the ammonia was about .5 and the pH seemed to have suddenly decreased to 6.
<Yikes!>
The fish were acting normal, but I immediately did a 30% water change. The pH rose to about 6.4. This morning I tested the water again and the pH was back down to 6. I did another water change this afternoon bringing the pH up to about 6.4-6.6. The temperature has been holding steady at 80 degrees.
<Really too high for Platies>
I am concerned that the ammonia levels are still high after 3 weeks and that the pH seems to be suddenly erratic. The guy at the fish store told me NOT to add any salt to the tank at this point so I have not been able to increase the pH of the tank other than through water changes, which I'm doing at least once a day, sometimes twice.
<Do take care to not elevate pH in the presence of ammonia, nitrite. The two together make the water very toxic>
I feel as though I shouldn't be doing this many water changes, but I am concerned about leaving the fish
in water at such a low pH and with the ammonia levels as they are.
What should I do to help the tank cycle properly and to keep the fish healthy?
<... read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm
and the linked files above>
Is the fact that I still have zero nitrites after 3 weeks a sign that the tank is not cycling properly?
<No... these events may not be related>
Am I doing the right thing by doing so many water changes?
<Not really... Let us cut to the proverbial chase: there should be no livestock present cycling a system as you're doing>
During the day when the lights are on, the platies swim around, up and down the tank, swim in and out of the fake plants and hide in the rocks.
Sometimes they all seem to be very tired and retire to separate corners of the tank for what appear to be short naps. Then they swim around again, sometime hanging out hear the surface (but not gasping for air) just drifting in the current. Is this all normal platy behavior?
<No... they're being poisoned>
Any help would be appreciated. I just want to make sure that the fish are happy and healthy and that the tank is on its way to cycling.
Thanks,
<Read where you've been referred; and do write back if you have further questions, concerns. Bob Fenner>
Re: Question about my new cycling Platy tank 12/29/10
I did actually read the article that you referred me to. I guess I have two follow up questions. The first is, what exactly is happening in my tank as far as the cycle goes?
<It is "cycling" irrespective of the Hagen product, but you have likely forestalled the process via the use of the Ammo-products and periodic water changes. The old maxim of "it used to take seven days to cure a cold, but nowadays w/ modern medicine it only takes a week" comes to mind>
Are the bacterial colonies just not developed enough yet?
<Correct>
Is there anything that I can do to help them along?
<? All covered where you were referred to read>
Second, what steps can I take to make sure the fish are as comfortable and healthy as possible?
<This as well. They should be moved to a cycled system... Or if left where they are fed VERY minimally, and not at all if NH3 levels approach 1 ppm>
Is it ok if the pH remains as low as 6.4 and if I continue to do 2 water changes per day?
<Not really... please peruse the linked files... BobF>
Re: Question about my new cycling Platy tank 12/29/10
Oh, sorry...I guess I had a total of three follow up questions. The third is, can you describe what typical platy behavior is? Should they never be resting at a particular level in the tank (either at the bottom or top)
but constantly be moving at all times?
<Yes to moving throughout the tank, constantly during daylight hours. B>

Fritz Zyme #7 01/10/10
Crew,
Good morning, hope you are doing well today. I have one quick question.
My 55 gal freshwater tank has been set up for about 2 weeks now with no livestock. I just purchased a bottle of Fritz Zyme #7 to aid in cycling the tank. I asked the LFS if I should dump this in the water and let it wait a week or two anyway before I add any fish and they told me I should add it at the same exact time as my fish. Something does not sound correct to me about this. Could you please help me out with the correct answer here?
Thanks for your help,
Matt
<Hello Matt. In theory, Fritz Zyme #7 contains the bacteria of the sort in biological filters. Unfortunately, these bacteria "potions" have a very mixed track record. I'd not recommend using any of them without a back-up plan. If this was me, I'd use the potion, and then add a pinch of flake twice a day, just as if there were fish in the tank. Do this daily for a couple of weeks, using your nitrite test kit every 2-3 days. If the nitrite level stays at zero, then lo and behold, the bacteria have "taken" and your filter may well be matured. Your retailer is indeed correct that if there isn't an ammonia source, these bacteria will die back. But while you *could* add fish, that wouldn't be my preference, because of the bacteria don't "take", your fish will be exposed to high levels of ammonia and nitrite. Better to add fish food, the same amount you'd need to feed the fish in an aquarium this size, and see how things pan out across a couple of weeks. Hope this helps. Cheers, Neale.>

Using Ammonium hydroxide to cycle tank 7/19/10
Good afternoon:
<Good morrow Ms. de Almeida. Now AM here>
I am moving in a 6 weeks and wish to set up and cycle a new 55 gallon prior to transferring my goldfish.
<I see>
I have heard that one can use ammonium hydroxide to help establish the nitrogen cycle but I am not sure how much I should add to the tank.
<Mmm, I would not do/use this... there are other exogenous sources of ammonia (NH4Cl, dilute liquid cleaning ammonia...) that folks do use, but better to move some existing source of microbes and feed with a bit of flake food. Please read here re: http://wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm
>
I will be seeding the tank with some cycled material so all I will need to do is add enough ammonia to establish the bacterial colony and keep it fed until I can add my fish. I have purchased a bottle of ammonia (ingredients read: water and ammonium hydroxide) but no molarity is listed.
<Mmm, if you're determined to do/try this, you'll need to experiment... with a given volume of water and a measured amount (an eye dropper will do) of the NH4OH... Start with a gallon, add a drop, swirl around and test... you want no more than 1.0 or so ppm>
I have tested the tap water where I am moving and it is very favourable for goldies- pH is 8.0 and KH and GH are high. I can't find any information as to how much ammonia I should add to the tank to help build and establish
bacteria.
<"Just enough"... in other words there is no real minimum as long as it's measurable, but there is a maximum... a few ppm will actually subtend to kill nitrifiers/nitrification>
Should my goal be to add ammonia until I reach a certain number on my test kit or should I add ammonia based on the amount of water in the tank?
<The latter>
Also, should I be monitoring ionized ammonia, free ammonia or just total ammonia with my test kit?
<Total>
Thanks for your help.
Gina de Almeida
<Do take care my friend. Bob Fenner>

Fishless cycling, Freshwater 7/8/09 Hi crew, the following is an Email I attempted to send Chris Cow Ph D. author of http://www.tropicalfishcentre.co.uk/Fishlesscycle.htm . Apparently his email is not working. <Unfortunate.> Does anyone at WWM have experience with fishless cycling? <Yes, it quite popular with the crew.> Greetings , I read with great interest the Fishless Cycling article and wanted to share my diary with you and possibly get some feedback. My wife is the fish person while my involvement is setup and cycling. I have a broad mechanical/fabrication background and am enjoying learning about aquarium plumbing and function. <Good> We already have a 10 gallon setup that we will use as a hospital tank that currently contains 2 Cichlids. <Ok> It turns out our well water is a natural for them ( Non chlorinated, high hardness/high pH). <Ok> We recently acquired a 2' x 2' x 8' 200+ gallon aquarium free(should have been my first clue) from our neighbor. <Wow, nice.> It was up and running until I moved it to our home on 6/1. After 2 weeks of work refinishing the base, building a new canopy, beefing up foundation, polishing scratches in acrylic tank, re plumbing pump and filters and overhauling the under gravel filter it was time to fill and cycle. <Lots of work.> Added 2 1/2" fine gravel over filter(filter covers the entire bottom with 3 evenly spaced 3/4"suctions in bottom of tank). <While under-gravel filters work just fine they are sort of out of favor currently, they do have some pitfalls to be aware of. See here http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwfiltration.htm and here http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwfiltrmedart.htm for details.> Added 15- 6" x 8" x 4" rocks along with 2 dozen fake plants and a 48" air wand. <The rocks may cause filtration issues with the UGF as detailed in the above articles.> Twin cartridge filters (plumbed in Parallel) with a tested pass thru rate in excess of 600 GPH <Ok> This aquarium will be an all Cichlid No live plant setup. <Can't offer much on the Cichlids as I have never kept them, but we have many dedicated cichlid keepers on the crew.> Lighting is 3- 24" Dual compact fluorescent (3- 10,000K 65 Watt white and 3-Actinic Blue 65 watt for a total of 390 watts) <Overkill here if you do not plan on keeping plants, but should work fine, although it might encourage algae growth.> All test kits are by API and ammonia is 10%. Tank temp set AT 80 degrees. Due to time constraints all tests performed once daily at 7 AM <Ok> Tap water : 0 Amm(ammonia) , 0 Ni(nitrite) , 0 Na(nitrate) , 200 ppm KH(carbonate hardness) , 200 ppm GH(general Hardness) , pH 8.2 <Ok> KH , GH , pH did not vary from beginning to end so I have omitted them from the daily readings. <Ok> 6/12 filled tank added 4 tsp(Teaspoons) Amm to achieve 5 ppm 6/13 Amm 4.0 , Ni 0 , Na 0 , added 4 tsp Amm 6/14 Amm 5.0 , Ni 0 , Na 0 , added 4 tsp Amm 6/15 Amm 5.0 , Ni 0 , Na 0 , added 4 tsp Amm 6/16 Amm 10+ , Ni .25 , Na 8 , added 4 tsp Amm 6/17 Amm 10 , Ni 1 , Na 10 , added 4 tsp Amm 6/18 Amm 8 , Ni 5 , Na 10 , added 4 tsp Amm 6/19 Amm 2 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 4 tsp Amm 6/20 Amm 0 , Ni 5 , Na 7 , added 4 tsp Amm 6/21 Amm 0 , Ni 5 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm 6/22 Amm 0 , Ni 5 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm 6/23 Amm 0 , Ni 5 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm 6/24 Amm 0 , Ni 5 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm 6/25 Amm 0 , Ni 2 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm 6/26 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm 6/27 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 7 , added 2 tsp Amm Cartridges changed 6/28 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm 6/29 Amm 0 , Ni .5 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm 6/30 Amm 0 , Ni .5 , Na 8 , 50 % water change & added 2 tsp Amm (thought we were done, my mistake) Green algae and brown algae (Diatoms ?)appear <Common in new tanks, water changes to keep it in check.> 7/1 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm 7/2 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm 7/3 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 8 , added 2 tsp Amm 7/4 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 20 , added 2 tsp Amm 7/5 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 10 , added 2 tsp Amm 7/6 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 15 , added 2 tsp Amm 7/7 Amm 0 , Ni 1 , Na 10 , added 2 tsp Amm Green algae and brown algae(?) multiplying to cover all large rocks. <More water changes will help, 10-15% weekly ideally in my opinion, biweekly at least.> Sooo I'm a little confused. Hardness and pH haven't changed, Ammonia has crashed, Nitrite seems to beholding at 1 ppm, and Nitrate seems to be wallowing around 10 to 20 ppm. <Nitrates are the end product, and need to be removed by water changes, more filter material may be necessary to get the nitrite down to 0.> Am I missing something or is this on track and just not done cycling ? <Is not done, although hopefully will be soon, usually takes less than a month but with this sized tank and it may take a little longer.> Will the brown algae(Diatom?)die off or do I need to take action? <Nutrient control should keep it in check, pretty hard to eliminate completely especially without live plants to compete for resources.> Still having fun just want to make sure I'm not spinning my wheels. <You seem to be on track here. Enjoy, you have a nice start here and a tank that gives you lots of options.> Thanks, Chris <Welcome> <Chris> <<Stop pouring in the ammonia. You're forestalling establishment of nitrification... RMF>>

Re: Fishless cycling 7/9/09
Hi Chris
<Hello>
Thanks for the input. Your site and forum are far and away the best resource on the web.
<Thanks>
It has been in the back of my mind for a while that the amount of Ammonia I add every day could be overwhelming the biological filer, so unless you have reason to object, I think it is time to shift gears. The article says to do a 80% water change before adding fish so I'm thinking I could do this and at the same time reduce the ammonia added daily to 1 tsp.
<Ok>
I will continue to test daily and also take your recommendation of 15% water changes weekly.
If the Nitrite drops to Zero that should support the idea that the biological filter is either to small or not completely developed ( I lean toward the latter).
<Agreed>
My wife ordered (on hold) 60 juvenile - 1" Mbuna Cichlid : 12 Demasoni, 12 Electric Yellow, 12 Red faced Mac, 12 Rusty and 12 Obliquidens Zebra's from www.livefishdirect.com. According to the article the amount of ammonia we have been adding is well in excess of what a fully stocked tank will produce.
<Probably, but I would still not try to introduce all these fish at once, small groups least to most aggressive.>
If this is true 60 juveniles should be a small percentage of what the biological filter will eventually need to support.
<Most likely.>
Assuming I do all the above how long should I wait to stock the tank ?
<Once nitrite hits 0 and stays there you should be ok.>
I knew when I built the canopy that the lighting was overkill but I didn't want to build it twice and I wanted to allow for future possibilities.
<Good idea.>
I will continue to research the under-gravel filter (thanks for the links).
Assuming that the UGF stays what would your recommendations be for possible live plants to combat the Diatoms/Nitrate ?
<Live plants are often problematic with UGF, could try some floating plants, or set up a sump/refugium to grow plants in.>
We have a standing order on hold for
<Stock slowly, patience is key here.>
<Chris>

Re: Fishless cycling 7/12/09
Hi Chris Saw my previous post(with your inputs) on WWM website.
At the end of the post "RMF" added a comment to the effect that I should stop adding ammonia altogether.
<Yes... adding ammonia at this juncture is very likely poisoning your beneficial microbes>
If I interpreted this correctly then I either have to add fish immediately or the biological filter will die for lack of ammonia/waste.(?)
<Neither my friend. I would simply add a "pinch" of some dried food at this point... the protein therein is sufficient to supply nitrifying microbes>
A brief update : After an 80% water change and reducing daily added ammonia to 1/2 Tsp ammonia,
Tests on 7/10 thru 7/12 show 0 ppm Nitrite and 5 ppm Nitrate. If this continues it is my intention to stock the tank on 7/17.
My question for you or any crew member with Cichlid experience is about the manner in which I stock.
My wife and I have researched this extensively and the consensus seems to be that if we are going to have an all Cichlid tank, then the proper method is to Purchase "All juveniles" of varieties known to
coexist successfully and to introduce them all at once.
<This is the best approach>
From what we read this leads to less aggression and attrition. What are we missing in this equation?
<Perhaps to start with all individuals of about the same size>
Once again I thank you for your patience and help.
Chris
<Welcome. Bob Fenner/RMF>

Re: Fishless cycling 7/13/09
Thanks so much! Will go with adding flakes starting tomorrow. And yes, the plan is to stock all 1"/1.5" juvenile fish.
Once again, we think that you have one of the greatest sites around for information.
We spent many hours reading WWM prior to doing anything to setup this tank and I am certain that the information we have gleaned will keep us out of trouble.
Thank you again and have a great day!
Regards,
Dawn & Chris
<Thank you D & C. BobF>

Question about filters, FW, seeding/bacteria -08/27/08 Hello crew, How are you going today? <Just fine, thanks for asking.> My question is: I am in the process of upgrading to a 40 gallon tank from a 5 gallon (big change, so excited) and was wondering can the cycling process be sped up by putting the 5 gallon's filter on the bigger tank, thereby transferring the good bacteria? <Well, the bacterial won't actively "swim" from one filter to the other so while adding the old filter to the tank will help, it won't help by much. So for a few weeks you will need to feed the fish carefully and not add any more fish until such time as the new filter has become matured. The best approach is to take some media from the old filter and put it in the new filter. This will "seed" the new filter, and get it off to a much faster start. You can take 50% of the media from the old filter without substantially lowering its filtration efficacy.> Then removing it once the bacteria has had a chance to grow in the new tank. The 40 gallon would obviously have its own bigger filter as well. How long do you think it would take? I plan to put guppies in there. <I'd recommend leaving the two filters together for at least 4 weeks if you plan to do things this way. If you remove 50% of the media from the old filter, you can leave the old filter on the 5 gallon tank. That tank could now be used to rear fry. The "seeded" new filter will be instantly mature enough to handle half a dozen Guppies, and if you feed them carefully and use a nitrite test kit to keep an eye on things, this new filter should be fully matured within a month.> Thank you very much for your time, I love your site. Sam <Cheers, Neale.>

Freshwater parameters during cycling 8/12/08 Hello and sorry to bother with questions again. <Hello!> I am cycling my 40 gallon Freshwater aquarium. I got it on August 1st. I used Bio Spira and put 2 fish in right afterwards. I didn't have a test kit until August 7th. The kit that I got was a Red Sea liquid kit that tests ammonia, nitrites and ph. <OK; all sounds good to go.> The kit I was using and still am for Nitrate is liquid API. So between August 1st to August 6th I don't know if the Bio Spira worked my very first reading were ammonia .25,nitrite .2 and nitrate 5. <Pretty normal for an cycling tank. Keep the NH3 and NO2- that low and you should be fine.> All stayed this way no change. I tested tap water in a bucket with Prime additive still showing .25. <Ah, now: can be one of two things. You could have ammonia in the water. This can happen in certain places, especially agricultural areas where NH3 runs off the land into the water supply. More probably though is that you have chloramine in the water. It's used as a disinfectant. When you use standard dechlorinator in, the chloramine is split into chlorine and ammonia. The chlorine is neutralised, but the ammonia is left behind. If you have ammonia in the water, wherever it comes from, you need to add ammonia remover to the water before adding it to the tank. Products such as "Ammo Lock" do this. Some dechlorinators will remove chloramine, and if you use them and the source is chloramine you should be fine. The test kit can give an erroneous reading though; if in doubt, look on your water supplier's web site and find out if they use chloramine.> I then tested water straight from tap that was .25 so I got suspicious. I took all three types of samples to LFS tank water, treated bucket water and plain tap water. He tested all three with his API test kit and 0 ammonia in all three (makes me wonder if the Bio Spira did do its job). <Bio Spira is no longer manufactured, and some of the "old stock" may well be past its best by date. I've never used the stuff personally, but have to admit to hearing mixed reports. Some people swear by the stuff, others swear at it.> That in itself makes things difficult for a beginner such as myself. <Yes and no. If it's chloramine, add dechlorinator that treats chloramine, and ignore the ammonia reading in the water. In fact after the first week or so you can forget about the ammonia part of the cycling process and concentrate on the nitrite level. Why? Because within 1-2 weeks the ammonia peak will have passed, and you'll now be waiting for the nitrite peak, which usually comes about 3-4 weeks after setting up the tank. Don't be afraid to set the tank temperature slightly higher than normal, i.e., instead of the usual 25 C/77 F, go anything up to 30 C/86 F (assuming your fish will tolerate this). Adding extra aeration will help, too. Oxygen and temperature are both limiting factors, and the more you add, the faster the bacteria will grow.> Anyway I bought a API liquid test kit have been doing tests everyday (oh and I do have some gravel and plants and rocks and stuff from my established tank.) My reading since the 9th have been a consistent ammonia 0, nitrite 1.0 and nitrate 10 oh and ph is been 7.8 to 8.0 through out. <See, absolutely what I'd expect. Your ammonia-eating bacteria have done their thing and they're happy. You're now waiting for the nitrite-eating bacteria to come online.> Do I just need patients for that nitrite and nitrates to fluctuate any and considering I had put those poor 2 fish in (Kribensis and Opaline Gourami) which looks like they are ok to my novice eyes should I stay away from water changes till cycle completes or do I need to do a water change and how much? <These fish are in there? Gouramis are usually okay through the cycling process, but Cichlids are not happy about it (except maybe really tough species like Mozambique Mouthbrooders). In any case, they're through the worst of it now. In any case: do water changes. Water changes are good. Water changes are free. Water changes will save the lives of your fish! The more, the better. But certainly 25% every couple of days wouldn't be out of line.> I also have 3 julii Cory's waiting in the wings in my established tank. <Hold off for now... these are delicate fish and you're likely to lose some or all of them if you add them to an immature tank. Give at least 6-8 weeks before adding them. Once the nitrite is zero and stays zero, you can start adding new fish but don't go bananas.> I speculate that I should wait till all is well in new tank before I add them? <Correct. You're learning real fast!> I know Neale is for cloning the tank (which I am doing as stated above) and not using Bio Spira since he answered my last email. <Indeed. I'm old school about cycling tanks, and "cloning" is just so darned easy once you know about it.> But since I had used it originally and found that my test kit wasn't screwed up and I have fish in there. Otherwise I probably wouldn't even been writing in today. <You're doing fine. Just watch your fish for sings of stress (e.g. laboured breathing, damage to the fins) and keep doing the water changes and water tests for the next couple weeks at least. After that, you'll be done. Keep reading, learning, being patient and you'll have a lovely tank that's easy on the eye and fun to look after. The problems occur when people go tearing into things without thinking. Fishkeeping *is* easy, if you go by the numbers.> Thanks Joe <Cheers, Neale.>

A few questions in setting up new tank. FW BioSpira, 8/5/08 Hello, I have a few questions I am hoping you can help me out with, and if you see anything along the way that you think needs my attention to change I would appreciate any suggestions. <OK.> One of my questions I have is regarding Bio Spira. I was reading a similar question on your site from back in '05 that a link was given to read _www.marinelandlabs.com_ (http://www.marinelandlabs.com) or something like that. When I clicked on link it never connected, so I figured I would write in. I have a new 40 gallon FW tank I set up on Friday the 1st of this month. I used some about 3 gallons from an established tank and the rest from the tap after adding stuff for chlorine and chloramines. I then put in the Bio Spira packet. <Water from mature aquaria contains virtually no filter bacteria. So adding "old" water is a waste of time. To instantly mature a new aquarium you can take up to 50% of the filter media from a mature aquarium and then put it into a the filter in the new tank. Then just add fish! This method works completely reliably assuming the water chemistry between the two tanks is the same, and the mature aquarium won't be harmed (provided you don't go nuts and add a bunch more new fish or drastically overfeed during the next few days). In fact many filter manufacturers recommend half the filter media (sponge, filter floss, ceramic noodles) be replaced every year or two. You need to add new fish to the new tank so the filter has some ammonia to 'eat'. This process is called "cloning a filter" and is the best way to mature new tanks.> I don't know if their supplier refrigerates it, I can speculate the LFS refrigerates it because package was cold. When I got home I put it in the refrigerator till I set up the tank. Then as per what my LFS told me I put my Kribensis in the tank right after adding Bio Spira. Kribensis seems to be doing fine. I tested the water today Monday the 4th (so its been four days since I set the tank up and put in the Bio Spira). The water tested at 0.1 for ammonia .25 for nitrites,5.0 for nitrates and 7.8. for ph. Are these pretty normal for using Bio Spira four days prior? <Not normal, no. The idea with Bio Spira is you get instant maturation of the filter. This means zero ammonia, zero nitrite. But Bio Spira appears to be a temperamental product. I have never used it (I prefer cloning) but my impression from other fishkeepers is that while it _can_ work, it doesn't _always_ work.> Or how long till I should suspect if I got a bad packet. If so, would you recommend I try another packet from a different place or no? <Clone the filter as outlined above and be done with it.> I will keep an eye on test readings. What should I EXPECT to see if Bio Spira is not working? <Zero ammonia/nitrite if it does work; anything else if it isn't working.> Another Question I have is in regards to Emperor 400 filter. I read on here that using the carbon filters that are supplied with the Emperor 400 in the persons opinion was not good and to get something like Aqua Clear media foam sponges or bio balls (the sponges I have seen). I was hoping for a little expansion info on this set up. So I shouldn't be using carbon filtration at all? <I consider carbon a waste of time/space/money in most freshwater tanks. By all means use it if you want, but understand that to do its job it needs replacing every 4 weeks. If you don't do that, it's doing nothing. Moreover, if you do big water changes, 25-50% weekly, the carbon is redundant, because you're removing the dissolved organic chemicals the carbon would otherwise adsorb. Hence my recommendation that you remove carbon from the filter and replace with whatever additional media you like... sponges, filter floss, ceramic noodles.> and. How many slots of the 4 should the sponges be used in ? Just two, or all four? <All four would be fine for plain vanilla biological filtration.> Last Question. I have a pair of Opaline gourami's that I bought to put into the 40 gallon tank. Right now I have them in a 5 gallon quarantine tank. The male seems to be aggressively chasing the female constantly. Is this most likely because of the type of fish, or the small tank? <Absolutely normal for Trichogaster trichopterus, which is why I don't recommend this species as a community tank resident. Males are aggressive, period.> I am wondering if they should be better when I move them to the 40 gallon tank or if I should return the male and try for a less aggressive male (if there such a thing? <Just keep females (shorter dorsal fins, so easy to tell). Alternatively keep a less aggressive species like Colisa fasciata or Trichogaster leeri.> Thank You very much <Cheers, Neale.>

Bio-Spira... not following directions... 2/26/08 I wrote to you on 2/21/08 concerning Amon. & No2 & No3 levels. In brief: 55gal., aqua-clear filtration system, artificial plants & décors Started tank without fish 12/31/07 Amon ? O.5 No2 &3 - O. Added 6 Danios 1/9/08- Amon. O.5 No2 & 3 ?O. PH-7. <Ammonia is toxic> 1/24/08 Added 3 swordtails & 1 Gourami 2/10/08 Added 6 Australian rainbows Up to this time all levels stayed the same ? Amon. O.5 No2 & 3 ? O. All of this was recommended by LFS and knew of my concerns <... still deadly toxic> about the ammonia levels and no reading for No2 &3. (Told me that the tank probably already cycled) (Can you tell I'm new to this hobby)? <Yep> On 2/17/08 Amon. now 1.0 and still no readings for No2 & 3 PH-7.2 . Had been doing 15 ? 25% water changes weekly with no changes. <No use changing water... forestalling the establishment of cycling> Was told by Bob to use ?Bio-Spira?, no water changes, feed tiny amts. (feed every other day) and no new fish until cycled. <Good advice!> I bought the ?Bio-Spira? and was told by LFS to use only ½ of the pkg. <... a full dose?> I did this on Sat. 1/23 and tested water today and all levels are still the same as on 2/17/08. Should I use the rest of the ?Bio-Spira? --- or wait it out and test daily? <Use the full dose... as labeled> All fish are fine, water crystal clear and no odors. <And check your test kit... against another, and/or make a standard (with household ammonia, and water known to have no ammonia...) Thank you for any help <Read: http://wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwestcycling.htm and the linked files above. Bob Fenner>

Species of Nitrifiers in SW and Fresh 11/25/2007 Dear Crew, Just wondering whether the good bacteria in freshwater systems is the same bacteria in saltwater systems. <That's a far more complicated question that you might think. In one sense, yes, they're the same bacteria. However, they have different relative roles/importance in different environments. There's really no "light reading" on this, but you can try this if you're feeling ambitious: http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=168074> Cheers, Andrew <Best, Sara M.>

55 Gallon freshwater water quality problems 11/8/07 Hello Crew, I am somewhat new to the freshwater hobby and am having problems with the water quality in my freshly established 55 gal tank. I set it up and began Cycling on October 14th, 2007. I used a product called Stability from Sea-Chem. <Ah, one of these "instant bacteria" products. They can work well, but approach with caution. To paraphrase Euclid, "There is no Royal Road to a mature aquarium". All these products do is help things along. You still need to do all the usual water quality tests and stock the aquarium carefully checking for problems.> I provided the proper doses for 7 days as the directions said and completed my cycling on October 21. Nitrites, Nitrates, and Ammonia all came back 0ppm with a Ph of 7.0-7.5. <Very good.> 2 Days after cycling I added a 5" Common Pleco. 2 days after that I installed a new Aqua Clear 70 filter to go along with the Aqua-Tech 30-60 That I cycled the tank with. <OK.> That same day I also added a 2" long Horse Face Loach. 2 days after that on Saturday I transferred my 4" long Bala shark from my 29 Gal tank into the 55 Gal. Everyone was doing fine. I continued monitoring my chemical levels every other day for a week. after that week I decided to add two 3" Spotted Pictus Cats. Later that night I tested my water to find out that the Nitrites, Nitrates, and Ammonia have spiked. <Yes, this happens sometimes. An immature aquarium is an unstable aquarium, regardless of whether you do a with-fish or a fish-less cycle.> I did a 10 gal water change with a gravel vac (probably not a good idea) <No, water changes are good. The more the better. In this case, 50% per day would be the minimum. To stop fish dying you need to be re-setting the ammonia down to zero at every opportunity.> and added another dose of the stability per advice from my LFS who is very knowledgeable. <OK.> The next day the levels came down just a tiny bit so I added some more Stability and waited to see what the next day would bring. Well Tuesday came along and my levels were still high so I did a 15 gal water change, added some more Stability trying to get the bacteria up and added Ammo chips to help reduce the Ammonia. <Never mind the Stability. The bacteria are *already* in the filter, so adding more of them doesn't really make any difference. The bacteria just haven't settled down. That takes time. Water changes, my friend, are what you need here.> My last test was yesterday, Wednesday the 5th of November and my levels were as follows: Nitrites 0.25ppm, Nitrates around 10ppm, and Ammonia a whopping 1.0ppm. <Ugh. The nitrates are fine, but the ammonia especially is a killer. Water change! Water change!> My fish all appear healthy and are all very active. I feed them every other day (except for the Pleco, I give him an algae wafer and cucumber every night). <Cut back the food. Don't give them anything on alternate days. The less protein in the system, the less ammonia.> I am at a loss of what to do next. <This is easy: water changes!> I'm thinking of just letting it go and seeing if it balances on its own. <Yes, it will. Two, three weeks, tops. The fact you have nitrite and nitrate implies that the bacteria are doing their thing. They're just messing about a bit, figuring out the right population size of this mini-ecosystem. Let them settle down. In the meantime... water changes!> Any help you could offer would be wonderful. Thank you, Derrick <Good luck, Neale>

Re: 55 Gallon freshwater water quality problems 11/8/07 Thank you very much. I will do a water change as soon as I get home today. So as for the feeding. If am feeding them every other night right now (feeding one night then skipping the next) how often should I be feeding them if you say to cut back? <As infrequently as possible. No more than 3-4 times per week. Fish can go weeks without food, but ammonia kills in days. Cheers, Neale>

Grr....pet store people! ... salt use/FW... cycling prod.s... Using WWM 9/12/07 Good evening to you all! I hope this finds you well. Thanks again for all of your help. I've searched your site for the last few days, reading everything that even remotely applied to my tank/fish in hopes that I can learn new things to watch for so I can head off any problems. I've even read things that didn't apply sometimes because it was just plain interesting. Since our last email, I've added 1 more ADF. The original one spent a lot of time hiding and now comes out to play. I guess he/she was lonely. (I also feel like I should name them.) <Go ahead> I know I'm pushing the limits on what is "too much", but they all seem healthy/happy with no trouble maintaining proper levels. I have been doing a 25-30% water changes with gravel vacuuming twice a week. I'm wondering if I'm doing too much? <Mmm, no, not likely> Also, PetSmart suggested that I add conditioning salt <No...> to my tank because their breeders us it so the fish are accustomed to it. <...> Well, everything I bought from them died. I've asked the nice people at SuperPet and they said that it wouldn't hurt, but they don't use salts. I also use Jungle "Start Right" when doing water changes to treat for chlorine/chloramine. It has Allantoin added to it to "promote slime coat". Isn't that a bit redundant? <Can be> Should I continue with the salt and find another treatment for the chlorine/chloramine? <... Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/saltusefaqs.htm> Or stop with the salt? Can I just stop using it? Or should I slowly taper the level off? AGH! I promise you (and my fish) that I will never visit PetSmart again! One more thing...Though my water looks clear from a distance, when you get right up on the tank, you can see a hazy kind of something floating all around in the water. I have no idea what this is and can't find any mention of it anywhere on your site. I know this is kind of vague, but any ideas? <Likely a matter of microbial population, lack of established biofiltration... best to not feed... overfeed...> OK, so this is the last thing...lol. Another pet store recommended using Cycle (which I can only assume is comparable to what you all call Bio-Spira <Ah, no... this Hagen product is inferior> (I can't find it anywhere here). It says to use when setting up new aquarium to establish beneficial bacteria, during water changes, and when introducing new fish. Is this a product that you are familiar with and is it needed since I did cycle my tank in the beginning? <Please learn to/use the search tool on WWM: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/WWMAdminSubWebIndex/question_page.htm> Again, thank you so much for all your time and effort. I am so thankful that I stumbled upon your site (and found it interesting enough to spend the last few days here). You all are a blessing. By the way, I referred to the nice people at SuperPet to your site when I asked them a question that they couldn't answer (but at least they TOLD me they didn't know instead of guessing!). Brandi <Happy to share... Bob Fenner>

Bio-Spira Replacement 5/7/07 Hi guys, Thank you for providing such a fantastic web resource - it's a treasure trove of information! Here is my question: I'm based in Cape Town, South Africa, and can't find Bio Spira _anywhere_ !Could you recommend an alternative? There seem to be hundreds. Thanks again, hope you're all having a smiley day :)- Anusha < You can get Bio-Spira online from Drsfostersmith.com. I am not sure if it would survive the trip from the US. The best alternative would be to get some sand from an established tank at a local fish store. The needed bacteria live on the surface of the sand. Start stocking the tank slowly at first and watch the ammonia and nitrate levels. Aquarists were doing this for a long time before Bio-Spira. I have not heard any good feed back for any other aquarium starter culture.-Chuck>

Cycling Question--Cycle Product is Bunk! 5/4/07 Hello guys, <Hi, Jeni/Pufferpunk here> you might recall I contacted you about an Oranda that got it's eye ripped out with a syphon...He is still alive and seemingly doing well. <Awww... I hope he doesn't get picked on by the others.> I was hoping you guys could help me out again. I have a 45 gal tall tank with 4 gold fish, 2 Orandas, a telescope and a decent size black moor. I think it is cycled but can no longer tell. For a couple of weeks my nitrites were out of control and my nitrates were low, present but low. <When there is 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites & nitrates below 20, you have a healthy, cycled tank.> I went to a fish store that was deemed trustworthy by a friend that has been in the hobby for about 2 years. The OWNER recommended I use "Cycle" in my tank. He said it only has bacteria to work against ammonia and nitrite. <He is completely mistaken. Cycle contains dead bacteria (more waste) & can hinder your cycle. The ONLY product that contains LIVE bacteria is Bio-Spira & can instantly cycle your tank. It MUST be kept refrigerated.> I knew I was towards the end of my cycle and had been testing daily and doing 50-70% water changes daily or every other day. <Good> I added the "Cycle" to my tank and it seemingly did nothing. A week or so goes by and nothing is really changing, maybe a minor drop in Nitrites. I go to a different 'trusted' fish store and the girl there says "you are doing too many water changes, the cycle is in limbo". <Since the nitrifying bacteria lives on surfaces, removing water as often as possible to prevent the fish from being poisoned by ammonia/nitrites is fine & necessary.> She says my options at this point are to stop water changes and either A) over feed to produce waste OR B) use refrigerated 'live' bacteria. <A) Will kill all your fish & should be done as a fishless cycle. B) Is Bio-Spira.> She also goes on to tell me that "Cycle" only masks the test kits (I use aqua pharmaceuticals <Aquarium Pharmaceuticals> liquid drop tests) and that "Cycle" does nothing to progress the real cycling of the tank. <That, she is absolutely correct about.> I chose to over feed, (I was feeding sparingly prior to her advice, a small amount every other day). <Bad move.> Well, after following her advice 2 weeks go by and sure enough slowly my Nitrites are going down BUT my low levels (10-15ppm) of nitrAtes are going down too. So 2 weeks later here I am, with the following test results: Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0. I don't buy those results for the life of me. <I would be hard-pressed to believe a goldfish tank has no nitrates. Try taking the water into your LFS to test with their kits.> ALSO my water started getting white cloudy, which I am told is a 'bacteria bloom' so if that's the case, what the heck is going on in my tank? I fear I have rendered my test kits useless. <Did you add Bio-Spira?> To further make matters worse, my black Oranda has now started gasping for air at the surface, I did a 10% change tonight and lowered the water level to let the filters (Whisper 4 and a Bio-Wheel) pour into the tank to agitate the surface more, plus I took my airstones out of the gravel to make the bubbles finer. <Good moves. The bacterial bloom is reducing O2.> I don't think I asked any direct question but I could really use some advice, We JUST bought a 75 gallon tank for the goldfish because we thought the tank was cycled but now with the weird tests we are weary of transferring them, so any help would be great. <Start up the 75g ASAP. Get enough Bio-Spira to cycle that sized tank. Add it to the filter & add the fish immediately afterwards. Whala! Instantly cycled tank! Easy, huh? I suggest multiple filtration, as your fish grow. I'd say, the largest Aquaclear filter they make & a canister filter, like the Eheim. Until then, do 80-90% water changes daily on the present tank. Use Prime for dechlorinating & detoxifying ammonia/nitrite/nitrate. Most goldfish keepers do 90% water changes weekly, as these fish are extremely messy fish & produce a lot of waste.> Thanks guys keep up the good work. <Good luck! For future letters to us, please be sure your i's are capitalized, when used as a pronoun, as well as the letters in the beginning of sentences. I have corrected all that here, for posting in our FAQs. ~PP>

Bio-Spira + Amquel = Uncycled Tank 3/9/07 <Hi, Pufferpunk here> I started a new tank using Bio-Spira (75 gallon tank). I got a little crazy with the Amquel, which resulted in a lower pH and now I'm wondering what else its resulted in. <Amquel shouldn't lower your pH. If you read the directions on the Bio-Spira package though, it says not to use any ammonia-removing products with it. The bacteria in Bio-Spira needs ammonia to live.> My ammonium <ammonia?> went up and went down. My nitrites started down, went up, then up again, then up again and now I have no idea where the reading should be but it's a real pretty shade of purple. The nitrates stayed low until recently, now it's on the rise but the nitrites are holding steady. My fish are eating, swimming, seem relaxed but I'm extremely worried and willing to do anything in my power to keep those beautiful dollar bills swimming. I'm mainly writing to find out if Amquel is skewing my test on the nitrites. Please let me know. About the only thing left to buy is snake oil and the only thing stopping me is finding the salesman. <Now why would you want to go and do that? Using anything other than Bio-Spira to cycle your tank, will only hinder the cycle. Get another package of Bio-Spira and add to your filter, after doing an 80% water change to remove the nitrites & Amquel. You tank should be fine within 24-48 hours. Next time, please be sure to correct your capitalization & punctuation, before sending out your email to us. I have to correct them before they are posted in our FAQs. Very time consuming. Another Crewmember might have returned this email unanswered, for correction. Thanks, PP>

Fishless Cycle Mistake 2/12/07 Good Day, <And to you> I'll make this short and sweet. I was attempting to fishless cycle my 29 gallon tank which contains Ecco-Complete Cichlid Sand for substrate and an Eheim 2215 filter. I purchased "clear ammonia" from Shaw's and added 8ml to my tank; <Yikes... this is a BUNCH... too much ammonia presence actually kills all life... including nitrifying bacteria... I imagine (though barely) that too many pizzas would kill even me!> however, I neglected to give the ammonia the "shake test" before I added it to my tank. (I know, big mistake) Of course I shook the bottle and it foamed indicating that the ammonia contains surfactants, and now I don't know what to do. Please help? <Oh!...> The tank is empty besides the 40 lbs of Ecco-Complete Cichlid Sand.. and of course 29 gallons of water. I have carbon in the filter that is only a week old. Could that help take care of the surfactants? <Mmm, yes> I realize that I may have to empty my tank and rinse everything, which, of course is very frustrating. If this is what you recommend, Is there a way that I can keep some of my bacteria alive through out the process. Many thanks! Dan <I would likely dump, rinse and re-fill this tank... If you have the patience... you could try waiting a few weeks, testing (for free ammonia) and trying a test fish or two... Bob Fenner>

Re: Fishless Cycle Mistake 2/13/07 Good Morning: <Daniel> I just wanted to clarify a point with regards to my fishless cycle question. Yes, 8ml is a lot of ammonia; however, I did some research on the ammonia that I used and found that it only contains 2% ammonia. 8ml of this product brought my ammonia to 3ppm, 2ppm shy of the recommended 5ppm. <I recommend no more than 1 ppm, but good point... this is quite a dilute solution commercially> I ended up draining the tank and cleaning everything with water that I treated with prime in an attempt to save as much bacteria as I could. I went out and bought a product called "Austin's Clear Ammonia", and after checking with the manufacturer to make sure the product is pure I'm starting the entire process again. <Better by far to "start" with an organic source of ammonia (protein)... food... that will provide a steady supply...> With the help of a nasty filter cartridge from a locally owned trusted LFS <Ah, good> I'm hoping to put some fish in it soon. Thank you so much for your help! Your site is simply awesome! <Thank you for this follow-up, clarification. Bob Fenner>

Bio-Spira Confusion 1/24/07 Dear WWM Crew, <Hi Katie, Pufferpunk here with you tonight.> My first tank, which I cycled 2 years ago, was cycled with fish (I now know better). <Glad to hear it.> That cycle progressed in a straightforward, linear fashion, which made sense as I tested my water each day. I now have an 7-day-old freshwater 26-gallon bowfront. I used Bio-Spira to cycle the tank and I am confused on the progression of cycling. The LFS said to put fish in, wait a day to get some ammonia going, then shake and empty the refrigerated product into the tank. <I always suggest pouring directly into the filter, then immediately stock the tank with fish. I would think if you let the ammonia be produced by the fish 1st, not only are the fish suffering ammonia poisoning, the B-S will have to deal with more ammonia than if added at the same time as the fish. This is how it's meant to work.> I wanted to start with 6 white clouds and 4 Rasbora but they said that might not generate enough ammonia, so I added to that 4 Cory cats. <Although B-S is made to be able to instantly cycle a fully stocked tank, a smaller amount of bioload will suffice.> I brought them home, put them in the tank that had been filled and running for a day (after floating the bag). The next day I fed them in the morning and put the Bio-Spira in at night. I was testing the water daily and for the first few days, nothing--no ammonia, nitrites, nitrates; the water was cloudy, which I read on the Marineland website was normal. Then I started getting ammonia readings around day 4, still no nitrites, then by day 6 (yesterday), my ammonia appeared to be a "2" on my color chart. I was alarmed and performed a 50% water change. <Should be fine after 48 hours of adding B-S. You can add Prime to dechlorinate & detoxify ammonia to a non-toxic form of ammonia that can still be eaten by the bacteria.> I then went to the LFS to buy another pouch of Bio-Spira, thinking that perhaps my bacteria died while waiting for enough ammonia to be produced. But the LFS said I shouldn't have done the water change, that the ammonia is rendered harmless by the Bio-Spira and that now I may have diluted the Bio-Spira too much to work. <The B-S should have been attached to the surfaces of your tank by the 4 days & wouldn't be free-floating in your tank.> I was under the impression, having read it frequently, that Bio-Spira cycles "overnight". Even if that's exaggerating, I can't seem to find information regarding what type of cycling progression to expect (i.e. will I ever even see nitrites in my testing?) I bought another pouch, which is currently in my fridge. Ammonia is .5 today but I am now getting a trace reading of nitrates! The store said that my cycling would proceed normally (i.e., I'll get ammonia readings, then nitrites, then nitrates) but it will just not take as long as cycling without the Bio Spira--that it should take 3-4 weeks. Why do I see trace nitrates when I have not gotten any nitrites? <Totally incorrect. If the B-S has been kept properly refrigerated the whole time, you will see no ammonia or nitrites & trace nitrates, after a few days of adding the product & stocking the tank.> Is it true that ammonia is rendered harmless by the Bio-Spira? <Yes> Does Bio-Spira work overnight or take 4 weeks? <Overnight> Should I add the second pouch? <Couldn't hurt. Or you could try the Prime & water changes & see how it goes.> I'm so confused. Thank you for helping me with this. By the way, all the other water parameters are normal and temp is within tropical range. <There's good info explaining B-S at this website & these folks know a lot about the product, if you're having problems with it. http://fishstoretn.com/bio_spira.html A lot of research has gone into this product. If you're really into scientific jargon, read this: http://www.marineland.com/science/nspira.asp I think the biggest problem folks have with B-S is that if it hasn't been kept refrigerated, from Marineland to the tank, it will starve, rendering it useless or at the very least, not enough live bacteria to fully cycle a tank properly. I hope this helps. ~PP> Katie

Start Up Cycling Products Hi, I set up my new 46 gallon tank just 2 days ago and used a product called Cycle by Hagen. The product has been in the tank for around 36 hours and the water looks cloudy (I realize this is normal). I do not know how quickly this product can cycle the tank completely, but I heard Marineland's Bio Spira can completely cycle a tank within 24 hours. Do you know how much the product by Hagen speeds up the process? Do you think ammonia and nitrites would be at 0 in a week or so, or should I get some of the Bio Spira if I want results that quickly? If I do get the Bio Spira, would it be ok to add it to the tank since the Hagen product is already in there? Thanks <I have all of my tanks for many years. I usually give someone and old used sponge filter and tell them to "ring it out" into their tank to get the bacteria started. If you have a Marineland filter with a Bio-Wheel then I would just swap wheels. Trade a new one for a used cycled one. I have many friends with aquarium maintenance businesses and they have tried all the cycling products. They all use Bio-Spira. It works when it says it does. I would recommend the Bio-Spira and get your tank up and going the weekend.-Chuck>

Re: Adding Bio-Spira To A Maybe Established Tank Thank you very much. I will use the Bio Spira, will it matter that it will be going in the tank after a different cycling product was already used? <No, go ahead and use it. Medications may affect the biological filtration.-Chuck>

Re: Adding Fish To A New Tank, FW Cycling 1/14/07 One more question: should I put fish food in the tank as a source of ammonia so that the Bio Spira bacteria has something to feed on until the fish are put in the tank? < The bacteria need something to eat or they will go dormant. Put in the Bio-Spira as per the directions on the package. It will last until you add the fish, as long as you do not wait too long.-Chuck.>

Hagen "Cycle", Bogus? 11/9/06 <Hi Cody, Pufferpunk here> I have a question that I could not find but a few topics on. That is the product Hagen Cycle. I have set up a 55 gallon freshwater tank, with gravel and a tetra whisper hang on filter, rated for 60 gallons. The filter has 2 bio filters on them. No fish have been added, nor will any until the tank completely cycles. Anyway, my question was I purchased the Hagen Cycle before I read any reviews, and they all say its bogus! <Absolutely, the stuff is total bunk! It's nothing but dead bacteria in a bottle. > I did come across a few reviews that said it was good to pour the whole bottle in to get a few bacteria going but that it lacked necessary ingredients to get it fully cycled. My question is would adding the entire bottle, which I bought the smallest one, be a major set back to getting my tank cycled? Also, I plan to add live plants, should I plant them before or after the cycle completes? <Return that junk. The only product that contains LIVE nitrifying bacteria to "instant cycle" your tank is Bio-Spira. Nothing else will work. You can also do a fishless cycle (just do a search) but that will take a few weeks. If you do decide to go the Bio-spire route, you should pour it into your filter then you can fully stock your tank the same day. You must add fish or you'll have to feed the bacteria with ammonia. You can plant the tank before cycling it. Might even help it along. ~PP> Great website! Thanks, Cody