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Question about Lysmata amboinensis; hlth.
4/14/15
Two Feather duster worms and blood shrimp gone on same day
1/11/12 Peppermint shrimp injury? 9/19/11
Fire Shrimp is dying?! 11/7/2010 Peppermint Shrimp/Health 2/15/10 Acclimation of Lysmata amboinensis -- 12/15/09 Acclimation of Lysmata amboinensis JustinN's indept.
reply-- 12/16/2009 Re Acclimating Lysmata amboinensis... RMF interregnum
12/16/2009 Re: Acclimation of Lysmata amboinensis --
12/16/2009 Re: Acclimating Lysmata amboinensis, and CP trtmt.
12/16/2009 Odd Lysmata amboinensis Deaths, poisoning
11/6/09 Shrimps Dying 7/14/09 Re Shrimps Dying 7/16/09 Re Shrimps Dying 7/15/09 Re Shrimps Dying 7/15/09 Re Shrimps Dying 7/19/09 And then there were two. Lysmata hlth. 8/18/08 Dear Crew, <Rich> I think one of my Lysmata amboinensis died last night. Here are the details. The tank is 6 months old with two tank bred Amphiprion percula for 4 months (after 2wks in QT), two Nemateleotris magnicifica for 3 weeks (after QT 3wks), and three tank bred L. amboinensis for a week (after QT 2wks) until today, I think. It is a 72 gal bowfront with a 10 gal sump, <I bet both of us wish this was larger> about 80 lbs of live rock, and a skimmer. When I looked in this morning, it looked like one of the shrimp was trying to hide in a small space between the rock and sand substrate. He was not moving. I figured he had molted and was trying to hide because there were pieces of exoskeleton scattered in the tank. <Very likely so then> Molting had occurred before and none of the shrimp had ever tried to hide. <Mmm, do "naturally"> An hour or two later, the body was floating around near the substrate. I thought there might have been more molting because the eyes and dark internal gut parts were gone, but when I removed this piece from the tank, there was muscle/meat in the tail and the tail coloration was bright red unlike a molted exoskeleton. In addition, there was more skimmate than usual. <Good observations, relating> I'm pretty certain he's dead although we'll see if he crawls out of the rock in the next few days. Assuming he doesn't, this begs the question. why? <A few regular possibilities> Tank parameters today are stable: 80F, 1.022, <Mmm, really too low... s/b 1.025-6> pH 8.2, Ca 380 ppm, KH 196.9 ppm, <Mg... and its proportionality with Ca?> and zero ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. All remaining livestock are eating well and acting normally. One of the remaining shrimp is a little larger and carrying eggs. She will push the other shrimp out of the way, but could she actually kill another shrimp? <Could, yes> This seems unlikely although I imagine she nibbled on the presumed deceased. Will these shrimp attack a freshly molted comrade? <Can, yes> I have a hard time believing there is an intruder in the rock because I haven't noticed any evidence with the other fish or the shrimp when molting has occurred before. The only other possible source I can imagine is some parasite or contaminant in the SF Bay Frozen Cyclops I feed them. I alternate this with Spectrum dried pellets. If the frozen food is the culprit, are there any ways to avoid unwanted contaminants? <Not the food> Any idea what happened to my shrimp? <Perhaps just "bad genes"...> Of note, at least one of them was accidentally exposed to air three weeks ago when I was acclimating them. <Perhaps a stress element> Since I have your attention, I have a couple other questions. First, how long should I dip fish in Methylene blue? <Posted... generally not much more benefit past about five minutes immersion> I used the Kordon Methylene Blue preparation for all the fish mentioned so far. The manufacture recommends no longer than 10 seconds. This is supposed to make 50 ppm. <I'd bath for longer> For the clowns and Firefish, I did so, but I tried 3 minutes for my most recent arrival, a royal Gramma. I thought it was ok as long as there was no evidence of distress. He rolled onto his side. I didn't use an airstone, but a standard 5 gallon bucket with only an inch or two of solution. However, he didn't look good for hours after being placed in the QT where he is now. At first, he was gulping for air at the surface, nearly jumping out of the covered tank. <Typical behavior> Then, he just rolled on to his side and breathed very deeply then very shallow for most of the night. <Ditto> Today, he's more active although we just started working on feeding. He'll QT for 4 weeks. All my livestock fed well in the store and were acclimated prior to QT, the shrimp with a drip. My last question is about stocking. I plan to finish my piscine roll call <Neat> with either a Centropyge bispinosa or a Centropyge loricula. I realize I'm probably done after this, but I wondered if you could render an opinion about adding a Sand Sifting Star to the tank after all the fish are in. What do you think? <I wouldn't... for the reasons archived... on WWM> Oh one more. can a shrimp molt while carrying eggs? <Mmm, no... not w/o losing the eggs> Thanks very much for your time and all the work that goes into this site. Rich <As you know, a pleasure to share, learn thereby. Bob Fenner> Scarlet Skunk Cleaner Shrimp/ Ammonia levels 03/28/2008 Hey guys, <<G'Morning, Andrew here>> OK here we go. I have a question within a question. First my tank info: 20 gal (salt water) tank is 3 months old Whisper 20 power filter (Activated Charcoal) Generic small skimmer rated for a 30 gal tank Temp: 79F Salt: 1.025 Nitrate: 2.0 (yes I know) Ammonia: .23 (again I know) 1 x Brown Saddle Back Clown 1/2"-3/4" 1 x Lawnmower Blenny 3"-3 1/2" 1 x Fire Fish 1 1/2"-2" 1 x Coral Beauty 3" 1 x Butterfly Fish 3" 3 x Turbo snails 1 x Scarlet Skunk Cleaner Shrimp 4 x small assorted hermit crabs 30-35 lbs live rock 3"-3 1/2" Crushed coral/shell live substrate All was well till 2 days ago. The snails were doing their grazing, the Blenny eating everything in sight, the Coral Beauty being the Diva she is, getting cleaned every 10-20 minutes. All in all everything was going well, then everything went to hell in a hand basket. All levels started to sharply rise to dangerous proportions. I did a 70% water change last night. The ammonia is now slightly higher than it was yesterday. I think I may be over feeding the fish so I cut back. What can I do besides another 70% water change or starting the tank from scratch. <<Yikes...In all honesty, that is far far too much livestock for a 20 gallon tank. The Coral Beauty and the Butterfly do need a lot bigger homes than their current habitat. Suggest around the 50 gallon mark. The stocking levels of your tank are not helping water parameters. It could well of been, as you mention below, over feeding and this is causing the bio-load to be raised higher in the tank>> This I do not want to do. The fish have been very stressed. Also I am noticing my cleaner shrimp has tiny hairs and "fuzz" like stuff growing on her since the water change. She is my favorite in the tank cause she has such personality. She runs around seeking out the fish and cleans them nonstop, and my hand as well if offered. I would hate to loose her. Any ideas? <<As above, I think if you removed the Butterfly and the coral beauty, the bio-load levels on the tank will drop considerably as I feel its too much for the filtration of the system.>> <<Thanks for the comments, hope this helps. A Nixon>>
Fire shrimp acclimating -- 07/24/07 <Hey Joe.> I bought a fire shrimp at a reputable salt water store near where I live. I put him in and he seemed fine all day just moving on the live rock. He is in with 3 damsel fish, 1 Bali starfish, 1 chocolate chip starfish and 4 turbo snails. I turned the light in the tank off at about 12am and woke up to the kids screaming hat he was bit in half. It turns out that he must have molted in that time, because his shell was off and there were no signs on him that he had been bit. He did die though. <Did you find the carcass or did you only find the empty shell?> I was wondering if this is common or just a fluke? <They are very sensitive to changes in water quality, temperature and need a very long period to acclimate (several hours) during which water from the tank is slowly added to a bucket with the shrimp and the water in which it was transported in. Many of them die in the first days when acclimated too fast or when water used for larger water changes differs too much from the tank water. Disturbing crustaceans while they are molting might also result in a loss.> Any reasons or suggestions before I look at getting a new one? Thanks Joe. <http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/cav1i2/fatheree%20shrimps/james_w.htm ; http://www.wetwebmedia.com/clrshrpselfaqs.htm ; http://www.wetwebmedia.com/shrimpdisfaqs.htm could be interesting. Cheers, Marco.> Re: Kole Tang Shaking, and Lysmata hlth. 5/9/07 Thanks Bob for your quick response. This site has become my bible. I've tried adding cleaner shrimp before but on both occasions they haven't made it through QT. <I would NOT quarantine these (Hippolytid) shrimps... Direct placement after careful (for Spg mostly) acclimation will be fine> I like to QT everything now. SO far I've already stopped Aiptasia and a true crab (not sure what kind) from reaching my show tank. I'm also paranoid about adding more ich in the free floating stage with LFS water. <Understood... But there is exceedingly little to gain by such procedures with these crustaceans.> I have a QT setup with sand and rocks for my inverts. Parameters are the same as the show tank except for nitrates which are higher ( 5-7ppm. ) The first time I added a cleaner shrimp it did fine for about a week until it went off food (perhaps I was overfeeding). A couple of days later it died. The second time the shrimp was dead the day after I purchased it. Both times, the shrimp were very small as I feel that putting creatures in a tank when they're small gives them more chance of becoming used to their surroundings. The water current in the QT is quite strong - do you think they could have been blown about too much ? <Mmm, not likely... Just "too much stress" for these animals, facultative cleaners to be separated from host fishes...> They did both seem to struggle when they first went in. Any ideas again would be much appreciated. Thanks -Peter <Again, I would place directly, sans quarantine. Bob Fenner> Cleaner Shrimp Hello again! I have a question about our one-eyed cleaner shrimp. (No, he's not some sort of Cyclops, he had a full complement of eyes when we acquired him five months ago but about three months back one eyeball mysteriously disappeared overnight!) <This will "come back" (regenerate) next molt cycle> During the last week we have noticed that he has developed small, black, irregular shaped markings on his body and legs, almost like freckles. They are not raised and don't seem to be bothering him at all. <Are they symmetrical? Likely just coloration, natural markings> My husband has been feeding him by hand since he lost his eye just to make sure he didn't lose out food wise. I was wondering if you have any ideas as to what these marks are and whether we should be concerned. Our other three cleaner shrimp are all fine and mark free (although none of them have ever cleaned a single fish since we've had them!) <Maybe a sexual, size, age difference... the others may be a different species even> Also (sorry, this is a second question), we have spotted a bristle worm - Aarrgh! After reading through your site we have decided not to panic but it is exactly like the photo on your website. It came out of the substrate briefly, saw us staring at it in horror and burrowed back in! <It may have felt the same way> It was just over an inch long. As far as we can tell, all corals and inverts are fine and unbothered (so far!) Are we ok just to keep an eye on things whilst containing our panic or should we be actively trying to remove it? <I'd leave it for now... and not worry> We do have a Pseudocheilinus wrasse but he's only a bit bigger in length than the worm. I imagine he's too small to view the worm as a tasty snack. Your views would be appreciated! Many thanks (again!) Lesley <Enjoy this life. Bob Fenner> Re: Cleaner Shrimp Hi again! And another prompt response - thank you, you work so hard! The markings are not symmetrical, one side of his body has more than the other (so far). <Mmm, likely "old age" sorts of markings next in line of probability...> I expect he's looking forward to his new eyeball though! <Yes... this animal will get the new eye, lose the markings next molt... you might want to try feeding it a bit more, and checking on alkalinity to "speed things up" here> Thanks again! Incidentally, will you be coming to the UK anytime soon to give talks, etc? <Most anytime am invited. Am on way past there a couple of times this year... for a big tradeshow in Germany in May and to visit with friends, my business associates family (they live in York) at some as yet undetermined time. Bob Fenner> Cleaner shrimp and crab not surviving in my tank Hi Craig, <Hi Jun!> It's me again. I purchased a cleaner shrimp and a sally light foot crab today (third or fourth cleaner shrimp and the second light foot crab in the last 6 weeks). Within several hours they're already dead. What am I doing wrong? Water parameters are all good. I followed the acclimation process and still no luck. Please help!!!!!!! Thanks.....Jun <Hmm, did you purchase these from a local fish store or have them shipped? If shipped, this could be from adding a normal pH water to a waste laden shipping bag, perhaps affecting the toxic ammonia levels. Also, these guys are incredibly sensitive to salinity changes. If there is a big difference in salinity it needs to changed very, very slowly, like over a day or so. A drip line works well for this and changes water very slowly. These guys are sensitive! I sure hope this helps you. Craig> Scarlet Cleaner Shrimp Sudden Death after Water Change? Hello Just wondering if you have any information on scarlet cleaner shrimp that relates to water changes. <its extremely common with all arthropods and many mollusks. They are all quite sensitive slight errors in temperature and especially salinity differences between new and old water. Are you sure the new water SG was exactly the same?> I Never had a problem before. The only thing that I did different from before is that I switched to Coral Reef Red Sea http://www.redseafish.com/Products/Coral_Reef_Salt/body_coral_reef_salt.html from my Kent brand. <actually... I don't hold either brand in high regard for their quality control/consistency compared to Instant Ocean, Tropic Marin and Omega brands> Is there something that could be in that mix that causes instant death to shrimps? <not likely... but if a batch had too much of a common metal like magnesium... that would do it> I just finished doing a water change (about 10 gal out of a 55 gal - new water temp perfect match, chlorine removed and matched salt density). My shrimp was fine when I was siphoning the tank, but as soon as I finished filling it back up again he looked listless and was slightly on his side. <has the water been mixed and aerated over night or was it raw? If raw... you've been dodging bullets for a while> He jittered a bit and everything stopped "running" inside him and that was it. He molted last night and I fished out his dead skin first thing this morning. Was the water change too traumatic for his freshly molted self? <not at all likely> I am very concerned as I wish to do a water change in my other tank containing 2 shrimp and I don't want them to suffer the same instant death. For age - I am guessing a year to year and a half (I've had him for about 8 months and he was medium sized when I purchased him). Nothing in the tank is threatening so I can rule that out. I would greatly appreciate any advice you have to offer. <I am sorry to hear of the loss... but be assured that they truly are strict and sensitive about water chemistry issues. It could even have been the simple change between brands of slightly different composition. 10 galls was not too much... all else sounds like good husbandry. Let me suggest you try another bag or brand of salt for a water change on the other two tanks for perspective then follow later with the current bag (perhaps even blend it to wean from the old Kent mix).> My complements on the best site out there! Kudos! <best regards, Anthony> Cleaner Shrimp Deaths Hi Bob.....I have got a problem which I can't figure out. Three days ago, I bought 3 cleaner shrimps and it died the next day. <"It" or they?> At that instance, the only cause that I can think of is the SG level. Immediately, I measured the SG level and the reading was 1.024. Thinking that it might be due to stress because of the long hours in the bag, I bought one more cleaner shrimp the next day. Sad to say, it died also. Strange........all the corals and fishes in my tank are ok. Any clue to it? Thanks. <Could be the acclimation gap, your practices, the source of the shrimp... Not enough data offered here to render much more. Please read: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/clnshrpf.htm and beyond. Bob Fenner> Cleaner Shrimp I hope you can answer my question regarding 6 cleaner shrimps that recently died. I have a 125 gal reef tank that is a year old. Recently I purchased some new fish (1 purple tang, 1 yellow tang 2 maroon clowns and a mandarin). Two weeks later I discovered small white spots on my purple tang. One day after that I noticed them on my 2 regal tangs. I was informed that it was the marine equivalent of ich. <Yes... this is another holociliate protozoan species, Cryptocaryon irritans> Within a couple of days the symptoms cleared and all was well only for them to re-appear a number of days later. <What you describe is the "cycling off" of the parasites as they become temporarily free-living, and possibly resting stages... a mechanism of further dispersal.> After calling my local aquarium store I was told that I should consider purchasing cleaner shrimp and cleaner (neon) gobies. I informed them that I already had 2 cleaners but they said I could use some more. I purchased 4 cleaner shrimp and 2 gobies. One of the shrimp died right away so I replaced it with a new one. I saw no fighting or unusual behavior. Within a few days I would have a shrimp die. Within 2 weeks they all died. I noticed that they would become lethargic and would stay in one spot. Overnight they would die. The rest of my tank looks great. I did have another mild bout with the parasite but the worst seems to be over and they (store clerk) said that it is not unusual to have a reoccurrence while the parasite goes through another life cycle. <Yes... did you place a chemical of any sort in your system to treat the crypt/marine ich?> I also have two peppermint shrimp that I believe are still alive but they are quite shy and I do not often see them. I heard that there were cleaner shrimp coming in from the pacific that were being attacked by a parasite. Is this possible in my case? <Doubtful> I would like to buy more shrimp but I am nervous about buying more until I can figure out what went wrong. I tested my water and everything seemed normal. Salinity was 1.022-1.023. My pH was 8.0. Calcium was 450ppm. My water temp. runs from 78-80 degrees. I would appreciate any information that you have. Sincerely, Lori Reiss <Strange that the shrimp died as you relate. Or that by their use alone the ich was cured permanently. Again, what other "treatment" did you render? Bob Fenner> Re: Cleaner Shrimp Thank you for your quick response. The only chemical that I used to help reduce ich was Coral Vital. <... this shouldn't make much difference... the equivalent of adding a bit of apple juice.> I use this on a regular basis but I increased the dose when I first noticed the first stages of ich. Normally I would add a 1 capful per week. I increased this dose to 1 capful (approx. 1 tsp) every other day. I do not believe that the ich is cured but I was hopeful to reduce the number of parasites. I stopped using the Coral Vital a few days after I added the shrimp and Neon Gobies. I can not think of anything else that has changed. I believe that shrimp I originally had were a mated pair. When I cleaned out my powerhead I found what I think were shrimp larvae. This is as much information as I know to give you. I am trying to come up some possible reasons for their death. I realize that there may be some things that may never be explained but I consider this a way to learn more about my tank. Thank you.-Lori Reiss <Curious... more curious. Bob Fenner> Question on cleaner shrimp I am trying to acclimate cleaner shrimps from the LFS that keep them in natural seawater. What is natural seawater salinity anyways? My tank is now at 1.024-1.025. <Right about here specific gravity wise... Not important that this be a particular density, but that the Spg be kept more or less constant... best to check on daily, learn to adjust simply (like by adding freshwater from a jug next to the tank to a predesignated water level...> What procedures do I need to take in order to acclimate cleaner shrimps to my tank. <I would "drip" acclimate them... Protocol stored on site: www.wetwebmedia.com. No need to dip/bath, and generally, if they're in good apparent condition, no need to quarantine> Right now I'm trying to get a LFS water sample to match salinity. Then I will try the cleaner shrimp. <Theirs will likely be much lower... to save money on salt mix, allow for higher gas solubility (and hence stocking capacity), and reduce likelihood/spread of pathogens/parasites... If more than a thousandth, do acclimate the shrimp in a quarantine system slowly to your standard> Do you think you can keep a cleaner shrimp in tap water tank? <What? If you mean, salt mix made with tapwater... this will likely work, unless your tapwater has real troubles... See the tapwater use for marine systems works on the WWM site re... If you're suggesting placing these animals directly in tap/freshwater, no... this will likely damage them to the extent of causing their deaths.> Thanks. <Bob Fenner> Cleaner shrimp-high mortality Greetings Bob: I have a 37 gal (tall) salt aquarium with a Eclipse 3 system. It has been up and running for almost two and a half months. It has approximately 35lbs of LR as well as a Yellow tang, Saddleback Clown, and a Yellow-face Goby. I have gone through 3 cleaner shrimp in the past 4 weeks, 2 pacific cleaners as well as a peppermint. I acclimate the shrimp as quickly as possible. I normally take about 30 minutes to acclimate. All my water parameters are checking good, except the kH level. Its pretty high. Can you give me some clues on what water conditions as well as food items these shrimp require? I have read many articles, many posts on boards. I have supplied the shrimps with frozen brine as well as flake food. They keep dying, and I just can't figure out why! Thanks for your help Bob <<Thanks for writing, and I do agree, the Shrimp losses do appear anomalous... I suspect either one of two of the common causes of their captive mortality are at work here: too low specific gravity/big change from normal seawater, or too little biomineral at the expense of alkalinity... Do review what you can re your supplement usage and its probable harmful side-effects... At this juncture, if the supplement-imbalance is the/a cause, a massive water change is the direction to move the system back towards center. If low Spg, augmenting daily with hypersaline solution. Bob Fenner>> Re: Cleaner shrimp-high mortality Greetings Bob: WOW! A marine celebrity like yourself taking time out to answer a newbies crazy water question. <Hoboy... some strokes now! This and five bucks and we can get coffee at Mickey D's> Thanks for the reply. I have you book ordered, " The Conscientious Marine Aquarist". It should be here any day now. It came highly recommended from many knowledgeable marine aquarists I have met online, especially on the various saltwater discussion boards. <Thank you for the input. Am sure you will enjoy and benefit from the reading> I had a hard time with the conversion of ppm to dKH ( I'm a product of public education). <Hmm, divide ppm by 2.8...> I finally grasped the formula, and came up with a dKH of 5.4. A little high according to the test. <But not excessive... are you running into a situation of precipitating out biomineral as a consequence?> I think I will let this dKH level ride it out for now. I was told that it will come down shortly. <Yes, assuredly... the reductive activity, over activity(?) of captive aquatic systems results in this> My specific gravity stands at 1.022. I will mix up some new water & salt and raise the SG a little to 1.023-1.0235. I will let the tank stabilize for a week, then go out and buy another cleaner shrimp and see what happens. Once again, thanks for your help Bob................................................ <Sounds good... but do consider raising the Spg to 1.025 or so... this would be ideal> Regards, Kevin <And thou, Bob Fenner> Cleaner Shrimp Hi Bob, Over the past two weeks I've tried to keep two Pacific Cleaner Shrimps unsuccessfully. As soon as I would release them in to the tank, after acclimating them for about a hour they would land on one spot and sit there for about two hours and die. My pH, nitrite, and salinity are fine except my nitrate. Could this be the problem? If so could you tell me how to reduce the nitrate. Thanks <<Hmm, nitrates could be the problem... as could a myriad of biomineral and alkalinity causes... All can be addressed by the culture of some macro-algae in your system, and/or better in a connected sump/refugium... A constantly or reverse light photoperiod system to boost the algae growth will take up anomalous material, produce food, and make your overall water quality better... Do look into this possibility... among other ways by a long read through the pertinent parts stored on the site: Home Page Read up, and we'll be chatting. Bob Fenner>> Invert problems Hi- I have had two shrimp die on me, one coral banded, and one blood shrimp. Here is my set up: 72 Gallon tank, Millennium 3000 filter, two power heads, and 100 lbs Fiji live rock. Tank is two months old, and I have the following fish, 6 percula clowns, 1 yellow tang, 1 bi-color dotty back, and 1 watchman's goby. <May be the Dottyback... perhaps the Goby... any bodies left? Chewed on?> The water tests are normal. I tested the copper level as well. I use DI water. The fish are doing fine, but the shrimp, and will as the crabs have done so well. (Some of the crabs are still doing ok) <Ah... > A couple of questions. 1. Are any of the fish I have incompatible (I was told before buying them that they were, and everyone I ask seems to have a different opinion. <Yes to different opinions... likelihood that these animals were eaten... killed by the two fishes mentioned exists> 2. Should I avoid shrimp, starfish, or sea urchins? <Perhaps> 3. I feed them 2 cubes per day, (one daphnia, one brine or 1 shrimp) I feed them once per day to make sure some gets to the bottom for the goby. Is this too much food. <Don't know... what sort of measures of... nitrates, phosphates do you have? Any food left over after a few minutes?> 4. What type of protein skimmer would you recommend. <Many choices here... hang on, sump models... for a seventy two gallon system that's up and going... Maybe a AquaMedic product like a Turboflotor T-1000...> 5. Looking ahead what might be some compatible fish to consider adding? <Too big a category... read over the Reef and Marine Selection articles and the many survey articles posted on the www.WetWebMedia.com site> Sorry to pile on the questions, but I'd appreciate any help you could give me! Thanks!! Ron :) <Ron, do you pour in "supplements"? The crustacean losses (if there are no signs of outright foul play (could be from Alpheid shrimp, Mantis... hiding without your seeing them... nocturnal), I strongly suspect the "additives" as a/the cause... especially if all are dying, soon, about the same time. Bob Fenner> Re: invert problems Hi Bob- Thanks for the reply. I bought the goby after both the shrimp had died. The Dottyback was around for both. The coral banded seemed to be able to take care of himself. After he died I took the body out and it was intact. I did see the dotty pecking at the blood shrimp. When he died he was between the rocks and I couldn't get a good look at him. <Thanks for this info.> Nitrates are low, so I guess I need to check the phosphates. I don't add any supplements. The only thing I added was a chlorine neutralizer after the DI process to make sure there was no chlorine, and I used about half the recommended dose. <Hmm, maybe trouble here... I would dispense with the water conditioner period, and strongly suggest you pre-make and store your new synthetic water for a good week. Please take a read through the seawater use sections posted on the www.WetWebMedia.com site re this protocol and the rationale for it> I use instant ocean for sea salts. The algae was brown, now I am starting to get some coralline algae. (at least I assume it is as it is purple) <Likely, yes> Thanks for the help! Ron :) <You're welcome. Bob Fenner, who is working on the "shrimp" areas of WWM in part due to your prompting.> Lost Cleaner Shrimp Mr. Fenner, As you suggested I added a cleaner shrimp to my tank. I left it in the bag for 10 minutes than poked two small holes in the bag to get the shrimp used to the climate and salt content. I then opened the bag and added about a cup of the tanks water in the bag and waited a few minutes till I put it in the tank. None of the other creatures seemed to bother it, so I turned the lights off and kept an eye on it. I turned on the lights 2 hours later and it was dead. Why do you think it died? I have never had a creature die on me like that before. I guess I will try the goby instead. Thank You, Jason Cohen <Hard to say... often these losses can be traced to differences in just specific gravity... I would/do suggest you read over the "acclimation" sections on the www.WetWebMedia.com site, as well as the "Shrimps" ones... and develop a protocol for more slowly adjusting invertebrate life to your systems (like a controlled drip line... of airline tubing and a knot to slowly add your system water to the shipping... and throwing away the mixed water...). Be chatting my friend. Bob Fenner> Cleaner shrimp parasite and coralline algae questions Dear Bob, <Lorenzo here, responding for Bob-in-Indonesia> Well we survived Ick thanks to your recommendations and now we have a cleaner shrimp problem. I mentioned that our shrimp had a growth on its side and you said there was nothing we could do about it but live with it. Now the shrimp's antennae are starting to look like they are becoming brittle. Is this related? Could the parasite be depleting the nutrients the shrimp needs? I've started feeding it vitamin enriched flakes (any vitamins we need to look specifically give it?) directly and added some calcium to the water. We can test the calcium levels since we purchased a kit (rather expensive). Our tang visits his shrimp regularly so I suspect he's eating parasites. <Sounds like you're doing pretty everything you reasonably can, for this shrimp.> I've also noticed that the beautiful coralline algae on our live rock from Fiji is dying off. We have fluorescent lights (2 actinic 2 full spectrum) and given the heat and blackouts in California, we're reluctant to upgrade to metal halide since we'll need to get into chillers. Do you think that increasing the calcium level would help? Our LFS recommended we add some every day. <Hmm. Coralline usually does fine under fluorescents, unless your tank is particularly deep, or the bulbs are quite old (>1 year) Metal Halide is definitely not necessary for healthy coralline. Yes, increasing the calcium level may help, especially if it's quite low, and if the 'full-spectrum' bulbs are more than 10-12 months old, I'd replace those as well. My favorites for standard fluorescent fixtures are the 180 degree (internal reflector) 'Trichromatic' from Coralife, the 'full-spectrum' from the local Home Depot definitely won't do. If you really want to upgrade your lighting without moving to MH, look to Power Compacts, or compact fluorescents, as they're sometimes called. Most modern, efficient lighting currently available to the hobbyist. Not cheap. But cheaper than MH! (especially the electricity!) -Lorenzo> Only in cocktail sauce... <Hi Cheryl, Lorenzo-for-Bob
again...> Fire Shrimp Died Something killed my Fire Shrimp a couple of days ago. One minute he was on the gravel grazing (which I found rather peculiar, since he's usually underneath something where it's dark), then the next he was on his side. I pulled him out and put him in a specimen tank to see if he'd molt, or whatever. He died very soon thereafter. He had some sort of "erosion" on both sides of his body where the guts are, behind the head, and also on the left side in the middle of the tail. Not sure what it is, but I'm assuming it can only be some sort of parasite / fungus / bacterial thing. I recently started feeding live brine (but I soak them in fresh water for about ten minutes or so beforehand!), and last night I thought that maybe the metal in the net I am using had something to do with it, except for the fact that the hermits and my duster are OK. This doesn't look to be a copper related death, but I'm too new to know. He had also molted a couple of days before this. And he wasn't getting picked on. Also please note the white spots on top of the shrimp are probably because he started to get covered in fungus; he was dead for about a day when I took the pics... I tried to take him out of the water and he split in half, and all this gray goop came out of where his guts should have been. I included it only because it may help you put a finger on the problem. It's a wonder he hung on as long as he did with this kind of erosion of his innards. Kind of gross... Sorry. Any ideas? Also, I had my Yellow Tang get a whole bunch of little black spots on him, so I pulled him out, dipped him (about 3 minutes. Freshwater, about 5gals, a fair amount of Methylene Blue added, PH and temperature corrected) and quarantined him (had to net him - that was nasty. He evidently has quite a few pointy protrusions that like to get stuck in the net...). The spots went away entirely, but I'm going to dip him again, just to be sure. After I dip him, I'll put him back in quarantine and let him get a slime coat up before I put him back in the display tank. The other inhabitants aren't affected, by the way. One of the contributing factors is possibly that I had tried to clean the algae from the back of the tank and when I did that he started fighting with his ghost. It was shortly thereafter that I noticed the spots; maybe he was getting stressed to the point that his defenses were down and that gave them the ability to attach. ??? Please let me know what you recommend. Like I said, the spots DID go away, and I don't really think it was ich (I thought it was the Oodinium (or whatever), but somebody told me it was another parasite, I forgot the name). I also have some pics of my tank and the sump, if you'd be interested in seeing them. I didn't send them right off because: A: AOL has a 3MB limit, and I might get real close to that as it is with the limited shots I'm sending you here, <got them, just fine> B: Since I'm assuming you're downloading all this stuff via modem, this message alone will take you quite some time to download, so I'm already being intrusive enough, and <Never a bother, a treat actually> C: You've seen a million of 'em, anyway, so you just may not care. <Not in the last 32 years in the trade... always amazed at what is new... everyday> I'm only trying to send you the pics I think are critical for the diagnosis for the cause of the death of my shrimp. I'm holding off on all further stocking until I get the parasite thing wrapped up (well, maybe not; maybe I'll get them now and just have a little more lengthy quarantine duration, until I identify the cause... Can't hurt!). Any thoughts you may have are, as always, greatly appreciated. Thanks. Bruce Webster <<Hmm, well, regarding your Fire/Scarlet Shrimp (Lysmata debelius)... the root cause of the loss is hard to pin down... Do agree that from your description (the animal being out and about in the open... especially so close to having molted...) and images (the body seems secondarily decomposed... difficult to ascertain if the appearance has much to do with the real cause of death) but does seem "soft" as if the animal didn't have the wherewithal to remake its exoskeleton... Did you see it ingest its old skeleton (this they do as a valuable source of biomineral to build the new, larger one... and it should be left for such purpose in the tank)? Do you do much, anything to supplement minerals, alkalinity in the system? This over, under abundance could adversely affect the animal... The Tang complaint is actually a flatworm, a Turbellarian of the genus Paravortex... my old grad. school roomie worked on their life history... you can read bits about this animal and its control (mainly just found on Yellow Tangs), in an article about its host posted at www.wetwebmedia.com Your treatment thus far sounds fine... I would continue with the dipping procedures and quarantine for all new fish livestock.... and not worry about infectious agents re the shrimp. Bob Fenner>> Black Spots Two days ago I noticed some fairly good sized black spots on my cleaner shrimp. They don't appear to be raised and it almost looks like someone spattered him with paint. I'm not sure of his scientific name, but he has a white stripe down his back with a red stripe on either side. He acts normal and has been eating frozen food and riding around on the fish a lot. Then, last night, I saw that my Yellow Tang has very tiny little black dots spread evenly on pretty much his whole body. It looks like a very fine black pepper. I removed the shrimp and the tang and they are both in my quarantine tank. None of my other fish seem to have it (Powder Blue, Purple, and Kole Tangs, Tomato Clown, Green Chromis, Damsels, and tiny Snowflake Eel.), but the Purple and Kole Tangs are dark enough that I don't even know if I will be able to see it. <The black spots on the Shrimp and the Yellow Tang are two different cases... the first, "just" markings from age, growth, conditions in your tank. I would leave this (probably) Lysmata amboinensis, Pacific Cleaner Shrimp in with the Tang though... For about a month (watch their water quality)... to let the Tang's problem animal (a Turbellarian worm called Paravortex) die off in the main tank... And after that month, freshwater dip the Tang on its return to the main tank, and simply net and move over the Shrimp... If you don't know what I'm getting at... (can be confusing, for sure), please take a look at the "Shrimp", "Yellow Tang", "Dips/Baths", "Quarantine" pieces et al. stored in the Marine Index at the URL: www.wetwebmedia.com for much more> What is this stuff and how shall I treat it? My main tank is a reef, and I have never had any diseases before. Will my other fish probably get it too, and how will I tell if the darker colored fish have it? <The other fishes will not "get it"... pretty species specific, and easily defeated... Take a few minutes and peruse the WWM site... All will be well. Bob Fenner> -Can't keep cleaner shrimp alive- I have purchased individual cleaner shrimp on two separate occasions, and both have died within a month of buying. <Unlikely that it's acclimation; they'll die right away. Hmmm...> one of them died tonight, in fact, after molting yesterday for the second time in a month. <Death during molting has been linked to iodine deficiency, not sure if this is the case here.>it was a voracious eater, feasting on the algae on the back walls of my 20-gallon hex tank. the water quality is pristine - ph is 7.8, ammonia, nitrate and nitrite levels are all at 0.0 ppm. <pH seems low if it is like this all the time. You may want to check your carbonate hardness.> its only tankmates are a Sebae clown and a royal Gramma. what am I doing wrong that my shrimp do not survive? <Not sure, since there are no other inverts in the tank, it is possible that a heavy metal or some other contaminate has been introduced into your water. If so, the fish would probably remain unaffected. I may have a better guess for you if you describe your setup more in depth and let me know what your Another Dicky Shrimp and Mandarin Question >Hello hello! Good-day to all! Arg, I must be going through a transitional phase with my tank because I am just swimming (hehe, or is that "oh no"?) in questions! This is going to be a long one, so please forgive me! :) >>We shall try. ;) >I wrote in about a very sick Scarlet Cleaner Shrimp recently -- I thought it might be a lack of iodine, but I failed to mention that I do weekly water changes, about 5 gallons (from a 55 gallon tank) and in asking around I hear this should be sufficient to keep the iodine in the tank at respectable levels. If that's true then there's definitely something else going on with my shrimp because he's looking worse every day. (Btw, I have had a miserable time finding an Iodine test kit so I added the lowest suggested dose as a precaution until my LFS can get a kit, Wednesday -- if the planets align properly). >>Honestly, it would be better not to dose at all until you can properly measure. In the meantime, you should be able to feed it raw shrimp as a dietary source of iodine. Another question for you is - Is this the only arthropod in the tank? If so, then we might look to insufficient iodine/calcium levels as the culprit. If NOT, then that is far less likely (assuming the others are healthy). >>In addition to the symptoms mentioned in my first email (weak legs that bent in funky ways, missing leg and antennae tips) I noticed that one of his little body parts -- something like a pair cilia-type deals located directly above his gills, inside his clear carapace, are moving *very* slowly in comparison to the much healthier looking shrimp I have in the tank. >>That just answered question one. I would have to surmise that there is something wrong specifically with this one shrimp, and unfortunately for it and the hobbyist, there is a real dearth of information on diseases of these animals. I would recommend isolation (separate system) and watching the other animals. >(The healthy shrimp's "cilia" move impossibly fast, faster than I can count, the sick one's cilia flop up and down less than once per second). I've searched for some sort of identification so I could give you the proper name of the part, but I could barely find pictures that were detailed enough to mention maxillipeds much less this tiny little inner appendage thing. At any rate, this little gadget seems to have some brownish gunk at it's base. Before he shed the last time the gunk was *very heavy* and the little thingie barely moved and it seemed it moved with great difficulty. The gunk disappeared when he finally shed but it almost immediately re-infected him and is seemingly getting worse than the last time. So, if this isn't an iodine dilemma what is it and do you think it's contagious? >>It could be a bacterial, parasitic, viral, or other infection. It's really very difficult to tell. Isolate, and should you like to experiment with antibiotics I recommend Spectrogram. >My other shrimp doesn't seem to have any related problems and I'd like to keep it that way. eek. >>Then definitely separate the sick one. >Whew ok, now to less-stressful things. I have a minor (so far) problem with Cyanobacteria. I used to keep a golden-headed sleeper goby (until I lost him in a very unfortunate heater mishap over a weekend when I was out of town) and he kept all that under control, but since that sleeper goby died I purchased a psychedelic mandarin dragonet to keep the prolific and newly-unchecked microfauna (namely Planaria) under control. >>You, my dear, have a terrible nutrient export/control problem. I suggest upping the weekly changes to 50% minimum, starting with one full water change (do be sure it's properly aged and matched for temperature, salinity, pH). >The mandarin eats just about anything it can find, including the Mysis I feed, but my concern is that those two fish seem to fill very roughly the same niche and I worry that adding a sleeper goby might take away a lot of the mandarins "wild" food, do you think these guys could happily live together? >>They won't quarrel, but your system is likely slim as it is for just the mandarin. Deal with the excess nutrients that are likely the cause of the Cyano issue, and the rest should fall into place. Along with water changes, consider the addition of a refugium (make it approximately 1/3 the volume of the tank). If you don't skim, a good skimmer might be very helpful. You may also have an issue with phosphate/phosphorous (I don't know anything about the source water for your w/c's). >Like I said, the mandarin eats the food I feed the rest of the fish in addition to the "wild" stuff he finds in the tank, and my old Sleeper did the same. When I kept the Sleeper he was fat and sassy and now that I have the Mandarin *he* is nice and rotund, but I don't want to compromise that by keeping them *together.* And on that same note, I'm partial to the beauty of the V. strigata, but I've seen some other sleepers that seem to be just as dutiful, for my purposes (stirring the sand bed) would you suggest something else instead? I don't mind the way sleepers re-arrange things at will, I just want something to shake up the sand a bit. Thank you for your patience and time! Have a fantastic week! >>For the time being, I really think you should deal with these other issues first. Worry about adding a fish to stir sand later, as a 55 is rather small. If you MUST have sand stirring, consider an Archaster typicus (sandsifting sea star). One ONLY. >Rachael >>Have a good weekend. Marina Cleaner Shrimp Deaths Hi Bob Very informative website you have. <Hi! Ananda here today....> I have a 30 gallon tank with only 2 small - less than 1 inch blue tang and clown fish, with skimmer, live rock and dead corals. (planning a bigger-75 gallons once the grow) <I'd suggest something even larger so you can give that tang some space to swim in....> Trying to add a cleaner shrimp, 1st try - died the next day, after moving a bit stood in a corner and died the next day. acclimate for 2 hours, 2nd try - acclimate using the drip method for 3 hours - he looks very happy for 2 days eating and walking around. then died again. PH - 8.3, Salinity 1.23. <Hopefully, you mean 1.023 for that specific gravity...! Anyhow, at this point, I'm wondering if you've ever used a copper-based medication in the tank, or in any tank that the dead corals had been in. Any other substances that may have contaminated the tank or those dead corals might still be present in concentrations that are lethal to the shrimp but weak enough that the fish are not obviously affected. Also check your water quality (ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, etc.); inverts are particularly susceptible to poor water quality. You might also find out what the water parameters are at the store where you purchased the shrimp, so you can compare data. If there's a big difference, going even more slowly with the acclimation may help.> Thanks Henry <Hope this helps. --Ananda> Black spots on cleaner shrimp Thank you so much for all this wonderful information, when my cash flow will be a little better, I do intend to give money. I have had 2 cleaner shrimp for 6 months that seemed to be thriving up until last week when I noticed little black markings on its body. like little black specks here and there and scratch like blackish markings? Now he is on his side in the back of the tank and I think he is dead :( all seems good in my tank from what I can test. 35 gal with 40 gal sump, display filled with live rock, DSB with plenum, high turn over Ammonia: non detectable nitrite: non detectable nitrate: non detectable KH: 15 ph: 8.2 night time calcium: 340 salinity: 1.023 now bringing it slowly up to 1.025 temp: 78 to 80 3.5% daily water change small granular, flake, Mysis and as a treat brine once a week, any idea what this could be? << Unfortunately no. I've seen this a few times before as well. I think it may have to do with an Iodine deficiency causing molting problems. However I've also seen it in tanks with lots of Iodine. So unfortunately I haven't figured out what causes this. >> <I can... just opportunistic algal growth... Passes with molting. RMF> Gratefully yours Tristan << Blundell >> Cleaner shrimp death Hey crew, how are you guys today?
<Still kicking, James here.> Well you recently helped me with my
tank concerning my 2 false Perculas and royal Gramma with ich.
Everyone is doing well in the QT tank except for the male percula, he
seems to always have it. At one point he was so badly covered that I
had to give him a 10 minute freshwater dip. After that he seems better
but still has some spots. Anyways I went to go buy a cleaner shrimp on
Friday for my main tank while its going fallow. I bought him and
acclimated him very slowly over an hour. He seemed to tolerate it well.
So this morning he looks fine, nothing appears wrong but I come home 5
hours later and he's on the sand dead! I immediately see a medium
sized bristle worm close to him, but not touching him. I removed the
bristle worm and began examining the shrimp to see if it was his molt I
was looking at. Nope it was the actual thing. I tested the water and it
was as follows: Ph: 8.4 SG: 1.023 ammonia and nitrites: 0 nitrates :
around 7 or so. As you had suggested I raised my main tank to about 85
to speed the parasite cycle along and I did so. Again I acclimated him
very slowly. Could the high temperature seem to have done
it?<Unlikely> He seemed fine with it for the last 2 days. Also
when I found the body the eyes were missing no where to be found. What
do you think happened to him? <Do you have anything in your tank
that would include shrimp on the menu? James (Salty Dog)> Thanks
again crew! <You're welcome> |
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