Neotrop Cich Dis F3

FAQs on Neotropical Cichlid Disease/Health 3

Sunken belly 1/9/20
Hi Crew
My electric blue Acara, Finn (so named because of a piece missing from his dorsal fin), whom I've had for 8 months has been off his food for past 3 to 4 days. His color is good, no clamped fins, not hiding but he is ignoring his usual favorites (cichlid flakes. Brine shrimp cubes and frozen Blood worms) and his belly seems a bit sunken in. I've not seen any white feces. Tank set up is 55 gallon heavily planted with driftwood and rocks, Fluval canister 206 and sponge filter (rated for 80 gallons) and Aquaclear 70. Lots of filtration. Water parameters: pH 6.6-6.8, temp 77-78°F, gH 8°, ammonia and nitrites are 0 ppm and nitrates are around 20 ppm with weekly water changes. Tank mates are Columbian tetras and small school of Corydoras. I recently upped the temp from 75-76° to 77-78° as he seemed sluggish. He seemed more active in warmer temps.
My first thought was parasites. I don't think its stress related as he's pretty mellow. I have API General Cure on hand and since he is not eating I was wondering if best course of action would be to treat the whole tank? I have two Angel fish currently in my quarantine/hospital tank (one of whom I was planning on adding to his tank). I do have a 20 gallon tote I could put him in with a cycled sponge filter but I would need to buy a heater first. Any thoughts?
<Electric Blue anything tends to be a risky purchase, with few of these fish being as healthy as their regularly coloured ancestors. In this case, since your tank sounds broadly about right, I'm guessing the environment is basically fine. I'd be tempted to treat as per "mystery ill cichlid" scenario; i.e., metronidazole alongside a nitrofuran antibiotic. This tends to catch the usual problems cichlids waste away (i.e., Hexamita-type infections) but doesn't unduly stress the fish or filter.
Cheers, Neale.><<Totally agree. RMF>>

Re: Sunken belly (RMF?)<<Wish I had one; oh! Again, in total agreement>> 1/10/20
Thanks Neale for getting back to me so quickly!
<Welcome.>
He was treated when I first got him as a juvie with Metroplex in food (once a day for recommended treatment period). He was very skinny and spitting out his food. He seemed to bounce back and he's grown and filled out (over 5 inches). He has continued to be a picky eater, however.
<Does happen with cichlids; to some extent, you need to experiment, but good quality cichlid pellets should be taken.>
I have Furan-2 by API on hand along with SeaChem Metroplex. So, do you recommend dosing the volume of water with each med as per directions on each box?
<Medicated food is, by far, the best approach if viable. Dosing the water is less reliable, so should be Plan B.>
With this combo can I treat him in my planted tank thus avoiding the stress of moving him or should I set up a hospital tank for him? I know Metroplex won't crash my bio-filter but I wasn't sure about Furan 2 as I've never used it.
<Metronidazole shouldn't cause any problems for plants or filters. However, Furan-2 does seem to have a mixed reputation, and the manufacturer states that it WILL harm filter bacteria. So the ideal is to use Furan-2 (alongside the Metro) in a hospital tank with a zeolite-filled box filter.
If you must medicate the main tank because it's the only one you have, remove some of the filter media and keep damp, while also removing any irreplaceable plants, just in case (or at least some cuttings, so you can regrow them if needs be).>
It's one of those meds I bought to keep on hand. Also, is this combo safe for corydoras and nerite snails?
<Should be fine for catfish, but snails likely not. Remove them. They'll be fine in a large plastic container kept somewhere warm. Change the water every couple days, but otherwise just make sure the lid is on safely to keep them from escaping.>
I'm reading online that a lot of owners of EBAs are having similar issues.
Too bad.
<Indeed. As stated before, the Electric Blue varieties of pretty much everything are unreliable, at best. The relevant genetic selections that have produced these strains seem to be connected with the genes that provide disease-resistance. While the varieties may improve over time, there are some selected strains of fish that never really recover.>
He has a great personality. I hope I can pull him through this. Thank you again for your help and expertise.
Susan
<Most welcome. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: EBA with Sunken belly 1/11/20
Hi Neale
<Hello again, Susan,>
Well, I decided to dose General Cure until my heater arrived and I could set up his hospital tank. He appears to be responding somewhat to this treatment as he is coming out of hiding to greet me and he ate a small amount of blood worms mixed with Metroplex last night. I'm finishing the second dose of General Cure today.
<Sounds promising.>
SeaChem says they usually recommend not to do both (treat water column and do medicated food, they said General Cure is comparable to Metroplex with some Prazi added).
<Would seem logical; doing both would be an overdose, with perhaps unhelpful results to either fish or filter.>
Do you think it would be wise to continue with medicated food (straight Metroplex) after I've finished with the General Cure if I don't see 100% improvement?
<Yes, but I tend to favour waiting a day or two between the end of one course and the start of another. Certainly, doing a decent water change at this point gives the filter bacteria a breathing space.>
I want to knock out whatever bug he has but I don't want to over medicate.
SeaChem says to feed for 3 weeks which tells me the dose in the food, while effective, is on the low side.
<Possibly, but remember: when fed as food, you're getting all the medicine into the fish; when added to water, only a tiny fraction is absorbed through the skin because its so massively diluted by the aquarium water or metabolised by other organisms in the tank. So feeding the fish generally ensures a closer-to-optimum concentration of the medicine inside the fish.>
Thank you for tip on using Zeolite in the hospital tank filter to control ammonia. I usually use Prime but I know it can reduce O2 levels especially when medicating. Zeolite is a better alternative.
<Indeed it is. A simply box filter will do.>
Thank you again! I can't count how many times your site and advice has saved my fish and made me a better fish keeper.
<And thank you for these kind words. Cheers, Neale.>

Cichlid with a growth 11/3/19
Hello!
I have a 50 gal cichlid community tank, one of my cichlid (golden Sovereign) has this growth near its anus and I'm not sure what it is or how to help.. please advise! See attached pictures.
<27 megs of pix?!.... SEE as in READ on WWM re prolapsed colons in cichlids.
The search tool on every page. Bob Fenner>

Green terror, not eating, parasites? 9/21/19
Good afternoon, crew.
<Roberto,>
I've had an Andinoacara rivulatus for over three years, had it since it was about an inch. He's about 7 inches right now. A proud father, he's in a 50 gal with its partner. They get along fairly well.
<Understood.>
He stopped eating about 3 days ago, normally a glutton and i mean a fish which would eat until it was swollen like a balloon, i am wary.
<First thing, check environment. Moderate water changes and extra oxygen will often perk things up if fish aren't ill but merely stressed by something in the tank. Also try slightly cooler water than usual to see if that helps, with low-end tropical temperatures between 22-24 C probably ideal for this species.>
I've started to do small water changes ( 15%) daily as the green terror tank water had parameters of 6.0 Ph and 4 Kh.
<A bit low for this species. More neutral, medium hardness water is probably ideal for this species. On the other hand, given its age, any water chemistry changes should be made slowly.>
Fairly soft as it's partly in my yard and rain falls on it. Tap comes out at 10 Kh and 8.0 Ph, so water changes are small. ( he's lived half his life in tap and half in this rain/tap mix).
<Understood.>
I noticed trans-lucid, stringy poops out of him ( not white nor yellow, but transparent), he's alert, is still chasing the female ( they lay eggs every 2 months and its about time now) colorful and responsive, he chews food but spits it out. I checked his body for flukes or Hexamita and none of it are present. So I'm not sure if it's parasites or maybe stress?
<Unlikely to be parasites if you haven't added anything new in the last few months. That said, Hexamita may well be latent in most farmed cichlids, so treating as per Hexamita isn't a bad idea.>
Too soft water?
<Possibly.>
Thank you very much, i will be waiting for your response.
<Hope this helps, Neale.>

Electric Blue Acara Hlth. 7/27/19
When he tries to eat seems like he can't swallow his food and puffs of white cloudy stuff (looks like smoke) comes out of his gills and mouth.
<Electric Blue varieties are notoriously disease prone. Going to direct you to some reading:
https://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/features/electric-blues/
As a general rule, avoid them.>
He's sluggish and won't eat most of the time, not even blood worms so I got a live garden worm today that he attempted to eat but again, the clouds of whitish stuff puffing out the gills and his mouth.
Getting worse by the day. In quarantine now with General Cure day 2.
<A good choice re: Hexamita, but do remember to remove carbon from the filter, if used, when medicating. Medicines might work inconsistently in old, mature tanks with a lot of organic material. A hospital tank with few decorations beyond ceramic caves is best.>
Have tried conservative treatment first #1 salt and higher Temps (82),
<Would be careful about higher temperatures, given Acaras tend to prefer cooler conditions than cichlids in general. Certainly provide plenty of aeration.>
#2 bloodworms soaked in PraziPro, #3 PraziPro in the water (all separate treatments over the last 2 weeks) and currently the General Cure.
<Understood, and these will help re: worms, but not much else.>
All water parameters are good. No different at all in the discharge from gills.
<Velvet is the classic infection of fish gills, but white spots on the body would be apparent as well. Hexamita is the ubiquitous threat to farmed cichlids, but again, your symptoms are not typical. Gill parasites are difficult to diagnose without examining pieces of gill tissue under a microscope. Dactylogyrus is one common example, but really, its guesswork.
Tetra Lifeguard is a product that treats a variety of gill infections, and might be worth trying.>
Thanks!
Michelle
<Most welcome. Neale.>
Re: Electric Blue Acara 7/29/19
Thank you so much for your quick response.
<Welcome.>
So I continued the General Cure to give it a chance and although the fish hasn’t gotten worse, I would say he’s not getting better. The fish is still not eating, even when I throw an earth worm in the tank. Here are my questions:
<Fire away.>
1. Are you ok with me giving him a Epsom salt bath for 30 min 3xs a day?
<Sure. Won't do much on its own except reduce swelling slightly and provide a slight laxative effect. It is quite useful alongside suitable medications though.>
2. Finished full coarse of General Cure and would like to try Lifeguard as you suggested. I put carbon filter back in, will do a 25% water change in the morning. When can I start Lifeguard?
<New medications can be added immediately after water changes, and all organic medicines (as opposed to salts, etc.) can be assumed to 'used up' after 24 hours. So if you need to add a second course of medicine, doing a water change and waiting 24 hours should be safe.>
3. I have 1 tbsp of aquarium salt in the quarantine tank, is that ok?
<Doesn't do much. As stated elsewhere on this website, doses of 2 gram per litre (about 0.25 US gal) can be used against Whitespot and Velvet. But other than this dosage and usage, 'aquarium salt' doesn't really do much.>
Additional info:
1. He finally pooped after being in quarantine for 4 days which is a good sign to me.
<Agreed.>
2. When I look in his quarantine tank with a light, I can see little strands floating around about 2-3mm long. They are all identical in diameter (similar to a strand of hair) but some slightly longer than others and they are very pliable. I’m wondering if it is some kind of dead parasite making its way out?
<Might well be; see Nematomorphs and Nematodes, for example. But could be other things too.>
3. Can’t tell if the white puffs of smoke that come out of his gills and mouth have stopped because it only happens when he eats, not when he is breathing.
<Indeed.>
Thanks again. Is there a way you accept donations to your site? I’d like to support your efforts. I really appreciate your help.
<We do have a tip jar somewhere on the front page (http://www.wetwebmedia.com) that goes towards running costs, so please do feel free, though by no means obliged.>
Michelle
<Most welcome, and glad to help. Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Electric Blue Acara 7/29/19
Thanks again. I read everything on the link you sent me, so you are in agreement with me trying Lifeguard?
<Up to a point. It's better than nothing. But any product that's advertised as curing everything (from skin flukes to fungus, no less!) is unlikely to be especially good at any of them. The most effective meds are designed specifically for one particular type of organism. So I'd be skeptical, though as I say, better than nothing.>
Or do you think something else would work better?
<With cichlids, the old Metronidazole + Nitrofuran combination is usually the best approach if you don't know precisely what you're treating.>
I'm slightly concerned about destroying his kidneys but it sounds line you really are knowledgeable so I want to move forward with your recommendation.
<Fish kidneys aren't like ours, and correct use of different medications,
with suitable water changes and time intervals between courses shouldn't
cause problems. Cheers, and thanks for the kind words! Neale.>
RE: Electric Blue Acara 7/30/19
Neale!!! Was able to catch video footage!!! Here's what we're dealing with.
https://youtu.be/MbKdhNYMNGA
<The things on the glass? White wiggly things? Could be harmless nematodes, or could be parasitic ones that have been evacuated from the host fish by anti-helminthic drugs. Hard to say. The former is, to be honest, more likely, since these worms do exist in varying numbers in many tanks. Still, a reliable anti-helminthic should kill them off (though sometimes multiple courses are required). Cheers, Neale.>
RE: Electric Blue Acara 7/30/19
Neale!!! Great news. While I was doing a water change, I observed the little white strands I mentioned in the tank and they for sure are worms of some sort. I found one still wiggling. Now that I have been able to identify that, what would you recommend? This is a pretty amazing revelation if you ask me. At least now we know what we’re dealing with.
<Or at least part of the problem. Intestinal worms are very common in farmed fish, and likely harmless in small numbers where the fish's own immune system keeps them in check. Put another way, this could be a secondary problem separate to what actually ails your fish, so keep an open mind. Cheers, Neale.>
RE: Electric Blue Acara 7/30/19
I’m sorry, I didn’t see your reply.
<Oh?>
They also have a head on one side of the worm and when I looked it up it looks like flukes. Best med to kill flukes in you mind??? I’m sorry for the bother, but I have the fish in the salt bath container until I know what to add to the quarantine tank.
On hand I have Lifeguard,
<This should treat skin flukes, Platyhelminthes.>
PraziPro,
<This for treating intestinal worms, Annelida and Nematoda, if you believe your fish is suffering from a worm infection.>
Kanaplex, EM Erythromycin, Tetracycline
<Antibiotics, for bacterial infections.>
and Ich X.
<Treats Whitespot and Velvet.>
All left over from that one sick fish and that one dose needed that leaves you with 15 more does. Lol.
<Lol, indeed. Be sure to choose the right medication for the pathogen you're dealing with. Over-medication can cause harm, and inappropriate medication wastes time that allows the fish to become sicker. Cheers, Neale.>
RE: Electric Blue Acara 7/30/19
The worm in the background on the black part of the tank is what I was referring to. And yes, the little flea like things hop from the bottom to the sides.
Correction, on gill flukes, I checked the tab I have open and they look identical to anchor worms.
<Anchor Worms require specific anti-Anchor Worm medications, such as Waterlife Parazin. Despite the name, these are crustaceans, not worms, and any medications that kill Anchor Worms will kill shrimps, crabs, etc., too. So be careful when using such medications. Cheers, Neale.>
RE: Electric Blue Acara 7/30/19
There are also little white flea like creatures in the aquarium that I cannot see without the sunlight behind the tank. Since he isn’t eating how can I treat these intestinal worms? I separated them into two different clear vases and tried PraziPro in one vase and lifeguard in the other and neither medication seems to be killing them. Any suggestions?
<If the little white flea things are stuck to the glass, they're likely harmless crustaceans. Commonly seen in many tanks, particular older or somewhat neglected ones. Cheers, Neale.>
RE: Electric Blue Acara 7/30/19
They are free swimming, not on the glass.
<Could be anything, really! If long and thin, with no obvious legs, then would seem to be worms of some kind. Whether harmful or not, hard to say -- so treating with anti-helminth drugs worthwhile. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Electric Blue Acara 8/7/19
Update. He's still alive and active but won't eat. I've had him in fresh clear water since we last talked.
He still isn't eating, even live fry. He popped once and it looked normal. Pooped yesterday and I found a little normal and then a lot of the attached pic (stringy white).
I would say parasites but I've heard constipation and also not eating can cause white stringy poop.
Any suggestions?
<Hello Michelle. The white, stringy spiral faeces is mucous, and indicates that the guts are irritated and expelling (at trying to, anyway) whatever is irritating them. It's quite commonly seen in two situations: Hexamita infections and during treatment for intestinal worms. Constipation, for obvious reasons, has the reverse effect: absence of faeces and general bloating of the fish as the intestine becomes stuffed with waste matter. Constipated fish usually still eat readily, which is why the main treatment is increasing the amount of fibre in their diet, ideally cooked peas, but failing that, small algae-eating crustaceans such as Daphnia and Brine shrimp. Epsom salt is often used alongside the change in diet. Dried foods are not used at all, because they can cause constipation in some fish, and it tends to be that dried foods are fine with small predatory fish (such as tetras) but more of a problem with omnivorous or herbivorous fish that would naturally consume a lot of roughage (generalist cichlids and goldfish are the classic examples). Anyway, I don't think that's the issue here.
Copious faeces is the precise opposite of constipation, and I think you're either dealing with Hexamita (common in farmed cichlids generally) or else intestinal worms. No reason you can't treat for both simultaneously. By the way, don't expect your cichlid to eat much if he's sick: they often don't, and won't get their appetite back until they're getting healthier again.
Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Electric Blue Acara 8/7/19
What would you recommend? I have general cure in the tank right now.
<I'd be treating as per Hexamita; i.e., Metronidazole plus a suitable antibiotic, Nitrofurans most often recommended in this combination. Outside of the US, or anywhere antibiotics are only accessible through a vet, you may need to use a one bottle Hexamita treatment, such as eSHa HEXAMITA, though these are likely less effective than Metronidazole. Cheers, Neale.>

King Midas Cichlid Help Needed 6/4/19
Hi!
<Hello Jillian,>
We have had our King Midas Cichlid, Midas, for 11 years.
<Nice fish!>
When we received him he might have been 2. So he could be 13 years old or older.
<Understood. Either way, he's a fair age.>
He is in a 75 gallon tank by himself. All of the water quality levels are within normal ranges except nitrate levels which we can never get below 20ppm no matter how much water we change in the tank.
<Likely your tap water has 20 ppm nitrate, so any amount of water changes won't fix that.>
We typically do a 33% water change approximately every 2 weeks and vacuum/suction/syphon the substrate. We have a Marineland Emperor 400 Bio Wheel Power Filter.
In January, he seemed to be losing his tail to fin rot or something else, I'm not sure. We removed the charcoal filters, followed the directions on the box and treated him with API General Cure twice.
<General cure-alls are fairly unreliable. It's a good idea to take a bit more time to determine the disease and use the specific treatment. API General Cure includes Metronidazole and Praziquantel, so is primarily of use against protozoan parasites and worms, but won't do much/anything against bacterial, fungal or viral infections.>
It seemed to help and his tail healed and started growing back.
<Cool.>
Now, the tail growth has stopped (but hasn't gotten worse) and he sits on the bottom of the tank during the day on his side breathing very heavily.
The only time he is active is to eat (he eats well) and when he sees children.
<Sounds familiar! My specimens was very 'friendly' in the sense of sitting at the front of his 200 gallon tank and interested in (attacking?) the students sitting on the sofa thing in front of his tank.>
He swims to the surface to eat and also as soon as he sees our daughter or nephew he becomes excited and active for a little while but then he goes back to laying at the bottom of the tank breathing heavily again. He has always been a picky King Midas Cichlid. He won eat vegetables like zucchini, lettuce or kale like I've see other people recommend. He won't eat brine shrimp or even pieces of regular cooked shrimp. He won't eat the bigger pieces of fish food that are meant for fish his size. He will only eat the very small 1mm size pellets. We feed him New Life Spectrum Cichlid Formula pellets 2-3 times a day. The only other thing he will eat occasionally are earthworms.
<All sounds fine.>
We have well water, so it's not chlorinated. We have had it tested, it is very minimally on the acidic hard side. After a water change we change the charcoal filter, add a 1/4 teaspoon baking soda to compensate for the hardness/acidity, aquarium salt, Boyd Enterprises VitaChem Fresh vitamins and sometimes stress coat depending on his health. That combination has always worked and kept him healthy until now.
<Indeed; they do need hard, alkaline water conditions, but beyond that general requirement, are reasonably adaptable.>
Is he just getting old or is there something I can treat him with to help him?
<Likely age is part of this, yes.>
I have been researching and the only other thing that seems that might fit is a bacterial gill disease. Could that be a possibility and what is the best thing to treat him with, I have read about various medications?
<Using an antibiotic isn't a bad idea. As per Finrot; something like Maracyn 2 (Minocycline).>
I feel so terrible for him and want to help him but I don't want to give him something that will hurt him or make him worse.
<Antibiotics are generally tolerated well if used as instructed.>
He has been truly loved and enjoyed all these years and we don't like to see him struggling and suffering.
<Understood. This is a great species with a high level of intelligence and personality. They should live 12-15 years in aquaria, but this does vary, and is surely a good deal less in the wild. So he's had a good innings either way.>
Thank you in advance for your time and response, it is greatly appreciated!
Jillian
<Hope this helps, Neale.>

Texas Cichlid 4/27/19
Hi,
<James>
It seems my Texas Cichlid has something growing by his nostril. I have no idea what it is. Please advise?
<Mmm; may be just a growth, transitory... of no notice; but could be the beginning/manifestation of HLLE (Head and Lateral Line Erosion)... I would check your water quality... NEED no ammonia, nitrite, and less than 20 ppm, even less than 10 ppm nitrate accumulation. Otherwise... might be sign of
Hexamita/Octomita or such infestation... Please search/read re these organisms, syndrome on WWM. Much archived there to assist you. For me, for right now; I wouldn't panic. Unless the area enlarges, comes to occupy other areas of the fish's body, I would not treat for Protozoans just yet>
Thank you,
Jim
<Welcome, Bob Fenner>

Juvenile EB Acara with sunken belly 4/20/19
Hi crew,
I received a 3 inch juvenile Electric Blue Acara in mail (shipped overnight) two days ago. He was acclimated by being briefly floated in my quarantine tank for temperature acclimation and then netted out and placed into my tank (plop and drop). He showed no signs of stress and was actively investigating the tank within minutes. He accepted a small amount of Mysis shrimp that night and has eaten every food I've offered him (cichlid mini pellets, bug bites, frozen Mysis shrimp). I've kept the tank lights off until today to keep stress levels down.
<Good>
I've been feeding very small amounts three times a day. The quarantine tank is a 10 gallon cycled tank
with substrate, some driftwood, java fern, a sponge filter and an Aquaclear 5/20 HOB. I've been testing ammonia and nitrite levels twice daily and they are both 0 ppm. Nitrates are around 5 ppm. Temp is 78°F. PH is 7.6 and Gh is 8°.
<The pH is a bit high... I'd be mixing some RO, rain water or such lower pH water to bring it closer to 7>
I noticed today (I turned lights on this morning) when he came out to greet me that his belly is somewhat sunken which has me concerned. I don't treat my fish in quarantine prophylactically as I feel it's an additional stressor if the fish is not actually sick.
<We are in agreement here>
I prefer to wait and see if any symptoms appear. I have friends with African cichlids who aggressively
treat all new fish with antibiotics and antiparasitic meds as a preventative.

Is the sunken belly due to fasting prior to shipping and his age or could he have parasites even though his appetite is good?
<Can't tell w/o more investigation; sampling, use of a microscope; HOWEVER, I would try lacing foods with both Metronidazole and Prazi/quantel or such (combo. of protozoacide and vermifuge), and increasing the frequency and/or amount of food/s offered>
I've not seen any clear or stringy poo. Should I give him more time or start treatment for parasites as my friends are advocating?
<See above... but, up to you>
The shipper is also the breeder and has an excellent reputation for quality cichlids.
Thanks guys.
Susan
<Thank you for sharing. Bob Fenner>

Re: Juvenile EB Acara with sunken belly 4/21/19
Thanks Bob!
<Welcome Susan>
I have both Metroplex and General Cure at my house. Also Focus and Entice. I have mixed Metroplex with food before but I have only ever dosed General Cure directly into the tank. Which would you suggest I try?
Can General Cure be mixed with food?
He continues to eat well and I've increased the amount of food fed as you suggested.
<Either just wait... or mix "some" of the General Cure (has the two ingredients wanted) in with foods>
Oh, concerning the pH, yes I agree it's too high! The quarantine tank was set up to be close to the parameters of the breeder's water (pH of 8 and Gh of 8°). The 75 gallon tank he is going into has a pH of 6.8 and Gh of 7°. I plan to very slowly adjust the parameters of the quarantine tank with small water changes to match the main tank over the course of a month (using water from the 75 gallon). I set up the quarantine tank in this manner with the hope that it would reduce the shock of acclimation.
<Ah, real good.>
Thanks again for your great help!
Susan
<Again, you're welcome. BobF>

Juvenile EB Acara with sunken belly /Neale 4/21/19
Hi crew,
<Hello Susan,>
I received a 3 inch juvenile Electric Blue Acara in mail (shipped overnight) two days ago.
<Nice fish, Blue Acaras. In the right tank, at least. But the Electric Blue strains, like other Electric Blue cichlids, are delicate and sensitive. Some specimens even seem a bit 'dim' compared to their wild-type ancestors.>
He was acclimated by being briefly floated in my quarantine tank for temperature acclimation and then netted out and placed into my tank (plop and drop).
<Sounds fine, but I would acclimate any new fish for some half an hour at least, and always turn the lights out afterwards, as you seem to have done.>
He showed no signs of stress and was actively investigating the tank within minutes. He accepted a small amount of Mysis shrimp that night and has eaten every food I've offered him (cichlid mini pellets, bug bites, frozen Mysis shrimp). I've kept the tank lights off until today to keep stress levels down. I've been feeding very small amounts three times a day. The quarantine tank is a 10 gallon cycled tank with substrate, some driftwood, java fern, a sponge filter and an Aquaclear 5/20 HOB. I've been testing ammonia and nitrite levels twice daily and they are both 0 ppm. Nitrates are around 5 ppm. Temp is 78°F. pH is 7.6 and Gh is 8°.
<All well within tolerances for the species.>
I noticed today (I turned lights on this morning) when he came out to greet me that his belly is somewhat sunken which has me concerned. I don't treat my fish in quarantine prophylactically as I feel it's an additional stressor if the fish is not actually sick

I prefer to wait and see if any symptoms appear. I have friends with African cichlids who aggressively treat all new fish with antibiotics and antiparasitic meds as a preventative.
<This is indeed commonplace in the cichlid hobby. The combination of inbreeding for particular strains, and ubiquitous parasites on fish farms, especially at the low-end of the market, make this well worth doing.>
Is the sunken belly due to fasting prior to shipping and his age or could he have parasites even though his appetite is good?
<Hard to say.>
I've not seen any clear or stringy poo. Should I give him more time or start treatment for parasites as my friends are advocating?

The shipper is also the breeder and has an excellent reputation for quality cichlids.
<Good.>
Thanks guys.
Susan
<Most welcome. Going to direct you to some reading over at PFK on the problems with Electric Blue cichlids:
https://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/features/articles/2017/5/24/electric-blue-fish-or-the-aquarium
There really does seem to be a pattern here, so if you do buy these fish, it's as well to understand the risks. Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Juvenile EB Acara with sunken belly 4/22/19
Thanks Neale!
I always appreciate your expert input, you have always been a great help in the past.
<And thank you for these kind words.>
Started feeding Metroplex mixed in with food this morning. His color is good and he accepted the food eagerly.
<Promising.>
A friend who keeps Africans treats for 7 days then observes and repeats for another 7 days if no improvement. Is this a good course of action or should I just treat for the recommended full 3 weeks?
<I'd always finish the complete course, as stated by the manufacturer, if only to avoid antibiotic resistance. My opinion is that unless you're a vet or doctor, it's very unlikely you know better than the manufacturer. The main argument for half doses or incomplete courses is to save money, given
that antibiotics and antimicrobials are very unlikely to cause harm to pet fish. Given the risks of antibiotic resistance, I don't believe saving a few quid is really worth it.>
Thank you again and also for the info on EBA.
Susan
<Cheers, Neale.>

White/red spots on pectoral fins of cichlids 2/13/19
Hello WWM,
<Hey Matt>
My name is Matt and I had a couple questions about my pair of festae cichlids I've owned for about 7 years or so. They seem to have a white spot looking growth on their pectoral fins. It can be a bit red as well, but that may be from the pectoral fin being "inflamed".

I'm not sure if vein is the correct terminology, but they seem to grow on the "vein" of the pectoral fins.
<These are "soft fin rays" in the most usual parlance... but do have blood vessels associated>
A little background about the pair:
Both cichlids are housed in a 135 gallon aquarium, eat very well, and breed every month and a half or so. The male is 12 inches, and the female is 9 inches. They have had this on their pectoral fins for at least a year now, maybe a bit longer. It hasn't seemed to cause any problems, but it also hasn't seemed to have gotten better, in fact it seems to have gotten slightly worse.
I'm wondering if it is something I should be concerned about?
<Mmm, could be... see below>
And also if there is any way to treat it. I have attached some photos of both the male and the female festae. Thanks in advance, I browse your questions and answers from time to time.
-Matt
<These "spots" are highly likely evidence of physical trauma... a bending, breaking of the aforementioned fin rays... Perhaps from a usual tussle twixt the pair, or a dash into something hard in the tank. Most all such injuries heal themselves in time... just providing good care (water quality, nutrition...). Some might suggest administration of salt/s, perhaps an anti-bacterial... If they were me, mine, I'd leave off with such treatment.
The spots/breaks may take weeks to a few months to heal/disappear entirely.
They are not dangerous.
Bob Fenner>

Re: White/red spots on pectoral fins of cichlids 2/14/19
Thank you so much WWM! These two are always getting into tussels with one another which is why I keep a divider on hand. This is very good news to know that this is caused by physical trauma rather than a parasite and/or a bacterial infection.
-Matt
<IF bacterial, this is secondary... opportunistic from a break in the skin.
Not parasitic.
BobF>

Hoplarchus psittacus not feeding 1/22/19
Greetings crew. I hope you are doing well.
<And you Robert>
Im happy to say I've kept my aquariums in check for some time now. Im writing to you today due to a rehome i accepted.
<Okay>
An adult Hoplarchus psittacus. Owner didn't say much why he was getting rid of many of his fish. When it got home i noticed maybe why:
<... an unusual cichlid; mostly out of the Rio Negro>
Cloudy eyes and bloody dorsal fin, hole in the head ( mildly) and severe stress, although, i guess any fish as big would also be very stressed. A week in observation in a 60 gal just for him, everything cleared. Good color, no blood, nothing. I received him well fed though, he's around 24 cm, maybe more. After 4 weeks i moved him to the 150 gal south American planted tank: Festivums, yellow acara, fancy Plecs, some unidentified species of big Pencilfish ( 9 cm each).
<These last can be troublesome... mean toward other fishes>
Problem is, while i saw him take bites out of food in the 60 gal, he never showed much enthusiasm for food, but was very active and colorful. He devoured plants massively though.
Now, in the 150, he's become skittish, duller colored, and is not eating, clearly he's beginning to become skinny, you can see a sunken stomach and skinny areas around the dorsal/anal fins.
<I'd move this fish back to the sixty>
Its been 2 weeks in the 150 and still nothing. Tank parameters are ph 7.8,
<This is way too high... this fish needs soft, acidic water conditions>
gh 10 , kh 14, temp is 25 c. These psittacus were brought a year ago by a store and were considerably smaller, so these have grown here. Water is changed weekly ( 75%) properly treated. Water service has been cut for quite a while, so im due 1 week of maintenance ( never been a problem, have gone even 3 weeks, since its not overly stocked and there it is full of plants). I tried soaking the food in garlic but nothing works, he does show interest and sometimes takes bites but spits it out.
<I'd try a good pelleted food (Hikari, Spectrum), and live insect larvae if you can get them>
A lot of the time is scared by other fish splashing water while feeding furiously. He's at least 2.5 times bigger than the biggest fish, how is he scared?
<Strange setting, being moved....>
I have medicine for internal parasites ( Levamisole) and can quarantine again if need be, but i would really like to know if i can try anything else beforehand ( moving a 24 cm fish is stressful for both him and me).

Food used so far is flake, granules, pellets ( 5 mm size) crumbles. Maybe try a bigger food? I breed roaches for my frogs, but he isnt interested in that either. Problem is he shows interest but most of the time he gets scared, or just spits the food.
The other day i saw him poop and it was a normal, thick poop. Nothing unusual. But, lately ( 4 days ago) he's started twitching his fins, caudal and dorsal, in a way which made me reminisce of mix of shimmies with flaring. He's also started darting, although pretty unusual. Fins are normally extended and he moves around the whole tank, but is skittish to me and active fish.
I link a photo of him currently, i hope you can see it.
https://scontent.fsal1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/50927156_10217745459924010_4535587938200715264_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ht=scontent.fsal1-1.fna&oh=5f55ffb1488e99f27eb520fe3e77fd10&oe=5CFF0E2A
Thanks, again.
<Thank you for sharing. Bob Fenner>

Hoplarchus psittacus not feeding /Neale 1/23/19
Greetings crew. I hope you are doing well.
<All good, thanks.>
Im happy to say I've kept my aquariums in check for some time now. Im writing to you today due to a rehome i accepted.
<Okeley dokeley.>
An adult Hoplarchus psittacus.
<Nice! Not a common fish at all.>
Owner didn't say much why he was getting rid of many of his fish. When it got home i noticed maybe why:
Cloudy eyes and bloody dorsal fin, hole in the head ( mildly) and severe stress, although, i guess any fish as big would also be very stressed. A week in observation in a 60 gal just for him, everything cleared. Good color, no blood, nothing. I received him well fed though, he's around 24 cm, maybe more. After 4 weeks i moved him to the 150 gal south American planted tank: Festivums, yellow acara, fancy Plecs, some unidentified species of big Pencilfish ( 9 cm each).
<A better home. Sounds about right in terms of tankmates. Can't imagine your Pencilfish are really Pencilfish at that size -- seems more likely they're Anostomus spp.>
Problem is, while i saw him take bites out of food in the 60 gal, he never showed much enthusiasm for food, but was very active and colorful. He devoured plants massively though.
<Correct. They are very much like Severums in terms of diet. Omnivores, but appreciate fresh greens. Do also try cooked peas, as well as Spirulina-based flake foods or pellets. They should take good quality cichlid pellets too, such as Hikari Cichlid Gold.>
Now, in the 150, he's become skittish, duller colored, and is not eating, clearly he's beginning to become skinny, you can see a sunken stomach and skinny areas around the dorsal/anal fins.
<One thing is to offer the fish equivalent of crack cocaine, also known as earthworms. Most fish go wild for these, and they are both safe and nutrient rich. Do check the tankmates too. If this fish is being bullied, he may be off his food.>
Its been 2 weeks in the 150 and still nothing. Tank parameters are ph 7.8, gh 10 , kh 14, temp is 25 c.
<These are soft water that probably won't be completely happy in hard water.>
These psittacus were brought a year ago by a store and were considerably smaller, so these have grown here.
<Good!>
Water is changed weekly ( 75%) properly treated. Water service has been cut for quite a while, so im due 1 week of maintenance ( never been a problem, have gone even 3 weeks, since its not overly stocked and there it is full of plants). I tried soaking the food in garlic but nothing works, he does show interest and sometimes takes bites but spits it out.
<Cichlids will often eat anything when happy, but nothing when stressed. So review the environment before worrying about him being picky. Chances are that he'll eat more readily once you figure out what's going on.>
A lot of the time is scared by other fish splashing water while feeding furiously.
<A-ha! He's not going to like that. Green foods that he can graze at a leisurely pace may help here, because the other fish will calm down and leave him alone.>
He's at least 2.5 times bigger than the biggest fish, how is he scared?
<He's a fish! Not that bright! Or put another way, he isn't as confident as you about his ability to take down the opposition.>
I have medicine for internal parasites ( Levamisole) and can quarantine again if need be, but i would really like to know if i can try anything else beforehand ( moving a 24 cm fish is stressful for both him and me).
<See above.>
Food used so far is flake, granules, pellets ( 5 mm size) crumbles. Maybe try a bigger food?
<See above.>
I breed roaches for my frogs, but he isnt interested in that either. Problem is he shows interest but most of the time he gets scared, or just spits the food.
<Indeed.>
The other day i saw him poop and it was a normal, thick poop. Nothing unusual. But, lately ( 4 days ago) he's started twitching his fins, caudal and dorsal, in a way which made me reminisce of mix of shimmies with flaring. He's also started darting, although pretty unusual. Fins are normally extended and he moves around the whole tank, but is skittish to me and active fish.
I link a photo of him currently, i hope you can see it.
<Nice!>
https://scontent.fsal1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/50927156_10217745459924010_4535587938200715264_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ht=scontent.fsal1-1.fna&oh=5f55ffb1488e99f27eb520fe3e77fd10&oe=5CFF0E2A
Thanks, again.
<Hope this helps. cheers, Neale.>
Re: Hoplarchus psittacus not feeding 1/23/19
Yeah, they are Anostomus now i think about it. No red fins whatsoever though, so unknown id.
<Anostomus Anostomus and Anostomus ternetzi are the two "common" species in the trade. If you send a photo along, I can try and ID the fish for you. They're nice fish of course, but can be territorial, so one to watch if you're dealing with some social issue.>
Regarding the hard water. I stay away from obligate soft water fish ( wild discus, altums, chocolate gouramies) but i thought the psittacus would be fine since theyve been growing in these waters for over a year, although, to be honest, the store brought 10 of them, but i only know of 3 of them that are still alive, we are a small community of hobbyists.
<Understood..
Do you think it is imperative to ro/ di the tank?
<No. It'll help, but good water quality is usually more important for cichlids than the precise pH and hardness. Large cichlids are often nitrate sensitive, so that's the thing to watch. Oh, and oxygen level.>
I have severam pieces of driftwood leaching tannins. Not sure if that helps. This guy was in a community of big cichlids ( bocourty, vieja spp, Oscars) i figured he would be better with me.
<Almost certainly, but still, something sounds "off" here, so would be watching feeding behaviour closely, and adapting feeding accordingly. Cooked peas and stuff like that can be left in the tank for longer, and shy cichlids will slowly graze on them, even when they're otherwise being pushed around at feeding time.>
Thanks, again, Neale.
<Most welcome!>

Re: Hoplarchus psittacus not feeding /RMF 1/23/19
Thank you for your response. Ill see to move him to the 60, but i guess once he's fine he can be moved back to the 150? He just looked to cramped in the 60, really.
<Yes and yes>
Regarding the hard water. Normally i stay away from obligate soft water fish ( wild discus, altums, chocolate gouramies). I thought rehoming the psittacus would be alright since theyve been in the country living in these waters for a little over a year and even grown. I am 100% sure nobody has given their psittacus soft water, nobody does that here for freshwater, although to be honest, approximately 10 psittacus were brought by the store, and i only know of 3 of them to be still alive. Figures, hoo?
<Might be the cumulative effects of high pH....>
He was kept in a community of big cichlids ( bocourty, Oscars, vieja spp) so i figured he would have it easier with me. Before turning another tank into ro/di, do you think a lot of driftwood/leaves would help as much? I have several pieces still leaching a lot of tannins.
<Yes they would help some; not as much as mixing, blending RO/DI>
Thanks, again.
<Welcome. BobF>

Re: Hoplarchus psittacus not feeding 1/24/19
Im send you the link of the Anostomus. They are boisterous among themselves but are oblivious to any other fish.

They dont look too big in the photo, but they are. Theyve been here for over 4 years. I guess they dont have much longer? :(out of a group of 8 I've only lost one so far.
<They live a while. My singleton has to be a good 8 years old by now.>
Update on psittacus. I did a deep substrate cleaning ( quite hard to reach every area in such a densely planted tank). I also remembered what used to happen with discus and low temperatures. The tank stays at 25 during the day, i raised the temp to 28 over night. The psittacus has fed all day!
<Nice!>
Not as much as the rest but he's definitely bolder and swallowing food. No spitting. He has taken tablets and pellets so far. Im making some room to add driftwood right now. Lets see if he keeps eating.
<Indeed; do watch oxygen levels as you warm the water up.>
In 5-6 years this aquarium has suffered quite a few plagues due to inexperience. Last two years have been pretty stable. Since its a planted tank it will naturally tend to accumulate detritus and an increasing amount of decayed mulm. I guess it would be a good idea to restart the tank?
<Not necessarily. To a degree, fish consume the decaying organic material, particularly Anostomus, which seem to be as much detritus and algae eaters as anything else. Rebuilding a tank can make sense, but it's not something to undertake lightly, and does lead to stress for the fish. Of course the main thing is that the filter is happy, so keep that running in a bucket of water so that the bacteria aren't stressed.>
If i miss maintenance for more than 3 weeks fish start to get sick, something which does not happen in my other tanks which are relatively more stocked. Is there such a thing as a "sick" substrate? Holding opportunistic pathogens?
<Not really. Pathogenic bacteria are all over the tank already -- Aeromonas in particular. Mature, deep substrates have anaerobic conditions that hold the bacteria that get rid of nitrate. That's a good thing. When you rip up the substrate, most of those bacteria will die, so nitrate can accumulate faster between water changes. That's a bad thing! Another risk is you suddenly expose hydrogen sulphide produced by anaerobic decay into the water. Assuming you remove all the fish first, this shouldn't be a danger to them. But if you leave the fish in the tank while removing the substrate, it's a potential danger, especially if water circulation is poor. Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Hoplarchus psittacus not feeding 1/24/19
<These certainly look like Anostomus ternetzi to me! Nice fish, a little smaller than Anostomus Anostomus, and generally a bit less aggressive. Neale.>
<<RMF, have attached the photo.>>

green Texas cichlid 12/28/18
About a week ago lumps appeared on both of my green Texas cichlid lips, then yesterday 27/12 she had a white mark on her lip which has now turned in to a pink lump, I have included pictures
<Please re-size and re-send your msg. and attached files. Am down in Roatan... can't download 28 megs. B>
Re: green Texas cichlid 1/4/19
Hello, the lump on my green Texas cichlids lip popped not long after my original message and she seemed fine, but now when she breathes only the side the lump was on is inflating, do you have any idea what it could be
<Nope. There's nothing here that is indicative of anything specific. If the fish has an open wound, extremely good water quality will be paramount, along with the use of antibiotics. Adding a little salt (2-3 gram/litre) can also help. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: green Texas cichlid 12/29/18
About a week ago lumps appeared on both of my green Texas cichlid lips then yesterday 27/12 she had a white mark on her lip which has now turned in to a pink lump, I have included pictures. also the lump on her lip has now popped
<Hard to say what's the deal here, but the old Metronidazole plus a reliable antibiotic (such as Kanaplex) approach would be a good first step.
Aggressive cichlids often fight using their jaws, and damage can become infected, especially if water quality isn't perfect. If the Texas Cichlid can feed itself normally, I'd medicate as stated above, but otherwise not be overly concerned. But if the jaws are dislocated or otherwise so damaged the cichlid cannot feed, this is usually a death sentence, and euthanasia will probably be required. As BobF mentioned, please do resize images before sending them -- 17.3 MB of images in one email causes immense problems for those of us travelling / diving / otherwise away from broadband. There are many websites that will resize images for you, such as:
http://www.picresize.com
Do please avail yourself of these. Cheers, Neale.>
Re Texas cichlid image 12/29/18
BobF, for your convenience.
Cheers, Neale
<Thanks mate. B>

Thorichthys care/sickness 2/7/18
Hello crew. Hope you are doing fine.
<So-so!>
Some weeks ago i talk to you about the possibility of getting wild T. aureus and T. Maculipinnis.
<Indeed.>
I got a group of 4 and 5 respectively. They came pretty stressed and some got ich as soon as they got into my tank, along with minor fungal infections.
<Often the case.>
A 32c + salt + malachite green treatment later and they are looking great.
<Cool.>
They are eating and gaining weight, but their behavior is not good. From afar, i can see them moving and going around the tank (120 x 40 x 35) and picking sand but as soon as i go near the tank they stay still.
<Is the tank brightly lit? These fish dislike bright lights.>
They don't hide, they just stay still. No movement at all. They are housed with an Acara diadema and a small jack Dempsey ( about 7-8 cm)
<JDs are not compatible with Thorichthys species, so I'd separate them ASAP; as you hopefully realise, Thorichthys cannot fight because of their modified jaws, used for sifting sand. So they fight mostly with bluff, hence the eye-spots on the gill covers. If forced to fight, their jaws can become dislocated, and such fish starve to death. Acara are a mixed bag, and Aequidens diadema is a very odd choice here, being a sort of blackwater specialist really, and again, a bit prone to aggression. Might be fine with the JD given space, but I'd not risk with Thorichthys.>
they both exhibit the same behavior.
<See above. Cichlids prefer dark tanks, and upwelling light, whether from light substrate or plain glass, will disturb them. Adding floating plants will help a lot, because their main fear is overhead predators such as Herons. So anything that offers shade and shelter will help. Old school approach for quarantining new livestock was an unlit tank, shady corner of the room, away from heavy footfall (e.g., a basement, not a busy corridor), and large flower pots for shelter.>
The only ones that seem to don't mind are the Ancistrus cirrhosus in there( 2 of them)
<Indeed.>
Diet is Spirulina tablets and AquaMaster cichlid food along with flakes. They all eat readily and in front of me. Just their general behavior is off.
<See above to begin with; but there's more, of course, below...>
Today i found one of the largest maculipinnis dead. He seems a bit bloated, as the rest of the fish don't have that bulge. There is very fine river sand,
<See above!!!>
no pebbles. Big rocks and caves for hiding.
<Unfortunately the bloating could be anything, even decomposition. Assuming the fish are feeding well, I'd perhaps go the good old Metronidazole approach as a good first pass sweep against the commonest cichlid problems, but nothing else is immediately obvious here.>
I observe them daily, and that bulge wasn't there yesterday. I reckon i missed on the water change schedule the last two times by a few days, im not sure if that could have been it given their wild nature. Ph is 7.8, gH and kH around 9-10. No ammonia ( sump filter) but i lack nitrate tester...
Any insight on the matter is welcome...
Thanks
Roberto.
<Hope this helps. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Thorichthys care/sickness 2/7/18
I moved the maculipinnis to a separate bare bottom tank ( will have sand too) to observe them better. See the video, maybe that can flash some more light on the matter. Its just this one, the smallest, but i saw one of the others do it a few days back ( still alive).
<Nice looking fish. Nothing obviously wrong. Would suggest environment is off, perhaps lighting. Do also review water chemistry as appropriate to each species -- fish will be nervous if water too hard or soft for them. Ditto temperature. Good luck, Neale.>
Re: Thorichthys care/sickness 2/7/18
Do you not see the shaking weird? it looks similar to the Poeciliids ""shimmy"".
<Just looks nervous to me.>
Water hardness and ph should be on point. These are lake Izabal F0 specimens (Guatemala).
<Nice!>
I have moved the aureus to the planted tank, they have perked and colored heavily.
<Great!>
Active and all... maybe i should just move the maculipinnis too? but i would prefer to keep them separated, they are juveniles yet, but will they be easily told apart one species of another when older? internet pictures are not very reliable.
<Understood. Can you not add some floating plants, even bunches of pond weed, to the quarantine tank in the meantime, to see if that calms the nervous cichlids a bit? Obviously can't be 100%, but I do feel this is psychological, not pathological. Cheers, Neale.>

Continuation to problem / something very wrong. Thorichthys plus 2/8/18
Greetings.
<Roberto,>
I've talked to you guys these past couple days about problems with a batch of wild Thorichthys aureus/maculipinnis.
<Indeed.>
On a follow up i moved most of them to a big 150 gal planted tank. The original tank they were in turns out there is something really wrong with it. Today i found the jack Dempsey and Acara diadema heavily distressed, discolored and refusing food. 1 Ancistrus cirrhosus is dead and one Ancistrus ranunculus as well. Both of these have been tank raised, so we know for a fact these fish thrive in our waters. Picture added. You can notice a big bulge on the cirrhosus, a common occurrence among these when fed too much protein... this was not the case, as i feed regular flake, Spirulina tablets and vegetables. The ranunculus, on the other part, has a sunken stomach. One could say their dietary needs are far apart, but the case is that there is another ranunculus, with a normal sized stomach, and another cirrhosus, who is well fed but not swollen.
<I would start suspecting some poisoning of the tank. Whether adding something by accident, such as wood that's been treated with herbicide, or something already in the tank causing, for example, a sudden drop in oxygen level. Often times it's easiest to strip down a tank that's "failed" catastrophically, removing the fish in a bucket while you remove all the sand and wood, leaving just the filter and anything easily cleaned, such as ceramic ornaments. Big water changes also useful. Ideally, pretty much all of it. Try to keep temperature and water chemistry steady though. Of course, before going down this path, check water quality and chemistry to make sure they're right.>
In my past messages i told you how the Thorichthys would have swollen bellies when i found them dead.... this is may be a clue. Of all the Thorichthys, currently there is only one who has a slightly swollen belly and has white poop (non stringy, but rather, full, big) constantly coming out of him... i grabbed the fish gently and pulled on it and a piece of it came off... the fish is constantly evacuating said white poop... also, the fish is constantly shaking.. similar to Poeciliidae shimmying.
<Shimmying is a symptom of stress, so rather difficult to put down to a specific problem.>
ill address a video of the fish and its white poop in another message, since im reaching max size. the rest of the Thorichthys are colorful, active, and eating.. constantly picking at the substrate.
<Yes, please try and keep any/all files to less than 1 MB in size. Larger files cause us problems, and may cause your message to be returned unread.>
The aquarium in which they were before (in which the Ancistrus died, and where the Dempsey and Acara are) has turned white overnight, very cloudy. The filter sponges have also a strange, slimy, fluffy kind of growth which honestly i have never seen.
<Bacterial blooms could easily explain the cloudiness, and the fluffy stuff could be bacteria or, if on organic matter such as wood, fungus. Bacterial blooms typically imply unstable water chemistry and/or quality. Fungus usually appears on wood that hasn't been properly cured. Such fungus is more or less colourless, whereas your typical thread or beard algae have dark green, even blue-black colouration.>
I am at a loss. As of right now i have bleached the filter pieces and tubing. Im boiling water to clean the tank and start a new with used filter media from other tanks. i am restarting the tank. The fish are in a bucket and will be moved here after cleaning.
... Help.
Roberto.
<Hope this helps. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Thorichthys care/sickness 2/8/18
I will add plants to the quarantine, i have plenty.
<Cool.>
Seems i need to relocate fish/rearrange the tanks. I guess all the Thorichthys will be sent to the 150 gal planted tank until i properly arrange a 55 gal. I don't want hybrids so two tanks will have to be.
<Understood and agree.>
I would rather keep them in the 150 but i don't want to take chances with the smaller species of characins and the rest of fish in there.
<Yes.>
I found another one dead... on the floor. So... yes, this is stress. This isnt going as planned, but i will pull through.
<Hope so. Take your time, and use water changes and supplemental aeration as the two most useful tools to getting through environmental stress. While big water changes run the risk of exposing fish to changes in pH and temperature, if the water is 'bad' this is by far the lesser of two evils.>
Thanks again, for everything. I hope i can send you some pictures at a later date, when they have developed their best colors and size, and hopefully i get pairs and spawn.
<Will look forward to seeing this photos in due course.>
Thanks.
Roberto.
<Welcome, Neale.>

More Thorichthys issues 2/12/18
Hello crew.
A follow up from my issues with Thorichthys discussed before:
They have been feeding and coloring, i have kept a close eye on them and just today i noticed this... Worm like parasite in the left eye of one maculipinnis. Look into 0:35 onwards there the nematode can be appreciated.
Consulting with a local aquarist he has said these are seen sometimes in wild caught fish ( as is the case) and that a jaguar and a salvini of his had these worms that left them blind on the affected eye but otherwise "well".
My issue is, is there any way to treat this? This looks definitely like a worm. Is it related to gill/skin flukes? Should i be on the lookout for these as well on the rest of fish in the tank?
<Eye parasites do occur, and are typically Trematodes such as Diplostomum spp., and yes, these can be treated with anti-helminth medications. Praziquantel is perhaps the most widely used, and is reported to be effective against Diplostomum at least. If it doesn't work, more aggressive anti-helminths, such as flubendazole, could be used instead. It is worth noting that some anti-helminths are known to be toxic to fish, so best stick with the ones known to be safe, which also include Levamisole and Fenbendazole. Also important is the fact that many of these eye parasites have complex life cycles that cannot be completed in the absence of intermediate hosts, typically snails. So it is possible to break the cycle by ensuring the absence of snails from the aquarium, even without medication. Unfortunately the flukes can cause cataracts, which are bad for your fish, so while they may be relatively common in the wild, are not something most of us would accept under aquarium conditions. Cheers, Neale.>
Re: More Thorichthys issues 2/14/18
Thanks.
<Welcome.>
I can get Levamisole, and have treated before the planted tank with it for Camallanus worms with 100% effectiveness in just a single dose.
<Cool.>
I treated before the Thorichthys with it, but as you have seen, they keep dying, just yesterday i lost another one, the one i showed you before with the white poop coming out. The eye one is still eating and going as usual.
<All sounds a bit dispiriting.>
Just today, the biggest aureus (first aureus affected, by the way) is hiding in a corner, with very pale color, and not eating, and i could notice a slight white bulge out of this anus... so i assume... the same thing... i need to treat this guy and cure him. Im not sure Levamisole works on this... might try Praziquantel or flubendazole,
<Flubendazole generally regarded as the best of the fish-safe anti-Helminthics. It kills the eggs, whereas Prazi, and I believe Levamisole, are more 'irritants' that cause the worms to 'let go' of the gut.>
although ill have to get them as dog or human medicine, because i wont find it as fish medicine... most probably i will find tablets... does the fish have to eat this or can it be dissolved?
<It can be added to the water, or put in the food. The latter is probably best, but the former can work, assuming carbon is removed from the water. I'd also up the oxygen a bit, too.>
what a bout a bath in a high concentration of it? Levamisole was much easier to administer because it was a soluble powder that didn't need to be consumed, but not sure how i will find Prazi or flubendazole.
<Hope this helps. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: More Thorichthys issues 2/18/18
An update: the two affected fish haven't died yet, but no more have shown any symptoms.
<Well, that's promising.>
I treated with two doses of Levamisole. No Praziquantel or Flubendazole to be found. But a local drugstore will carry Prazi in a few days.
<Okay.>
I also took the fish out and gave then a bath on Epsom salts, considering that could help them evacuate whatever is causing the issues.
<Not how Epsom salts work; and besides, suddenly exposing fish to changes in water chemistry and temperature isn't a good idea. Assuming you're using the 'safe' dose of Epsom salt described earlier, it'll work slowly in the aquarium, but won't have time to do anything if you're merely dipping fish for a few minutes in such a concentration. What else to say except that 'scattergun' approaches to medicating are rarely effective, and often stressful. Better to do nothing than to mis-use medications.>
Pic related its the biggest aureus affected, can you notice the white bulge coming out of its anus?
<Looks like the ovipositor to me. No more than a few mm long even on big cichlids. Angled backwards and pointed on males, thicker and rounder on females. Often visible all the time on males, but usually only visible immediately (no more than a day or two) before spawning on females.>
Fish affected display it, and right now the condition has worsened on this fellow. He is getting skinny due to not eating and the bulge is getting bigger... Like a shin, it is red around the area right now. He's not moving much, i don't think he's going to make it.
<Understood.>
The other affected maculipinnis is still going around the tank, but hasn't eaten, but, he is evacuation ample white, stringy feces.
<Classic symptom of Hexamita, but do understand many anti-Helminthics will cause the bowel to evacuate large quantities of faeces, plus mucous, as part of the way they work.>
The bath consisted of 1 tbs of Epson salt in a gallon of water.
<So 5 tablespoons per 5 US gallons; to remind you/readers of the correct dosage as a medication, 1 to 3 tablespoons Epsom salt per 5 US gallons/20 litres. Higher dosages, as you're doing, may be tolerated by hard water fishes, but do monitor pH and general hardness to ensure they are within the safe limits.>
Thanks again.
Roberto.
<You're welcome. Neale.>

Re: More Thorichthys issues But, this time, autopsy! 2/18/18
I am sorry for messaging so much (double messaging even) things just seem to be going downhill without much in my power to do...
<Oh!>
The biggest aureus, which i showed a picture of in my earlier message, finally succumbed. I quickly scooped him out and tried to find anything i could. Surprise, he also had an eye parasite... these look like and move like worms... like, leeches... i would say they act and move like leeches, white in color with some red dots on the lower body... i have a video, if you would like to see it, i will send it to you bad quality video by the way.
<While that would be interesting, I do think
Then, i performed an autopsy on the swollen belly of the deceased. I found this.. worm, immobile, lying tangled in the organ that is also shown in the picture... warning, graphic.
<Looks like a nematode. Could be a harmless species though: a dead fish will attract them out of the aquarium environment, where they otherwise feed on decaying organic matter.>
Levamisole is ineffective to this. There is another Thorichthys showing symptoms, the one i showed you before with an eye parasite. It doesn't seem to be getting worse, but isnt getting better either, eventually starvation will set in i guess...
<Ah, do think I have mentioned this before. Flubendazole and Fenbendazole are, I believe, the 'best' anti-Helminthics drug aquarists have access to; Piperazine, Levamisole and Praziquantel are good, but by no means 100% effective. These latter are cheaper and more easily obtained though, hence their wide usage in the hobby.>
The remaining three of the Thorichthys (of a total of 10 originally....) seem to be doing completely fine. No eye parasite, no weird behavior, feeding a lot and generally acting like a cichlid.
<Which is nice.>
Main questions are: Are these parasites (eye and intestinal, which seem to be different parasites) contagious at this point?
<Impossible to say. Most 'worm' parasites have intermediate hosts such as snails or small crustaceans that they need to enter before producing the next generation of infective stages that will go after your fish. There are exceptions though, including Camallanus, which is why that genus of worm is so prevalent in fish farms and even home aquaria. Camallanus worms infect healthy fish via organic muck eaten from the substrate, so 'hoovering' the substrate will go some way to removing the baby Camallanus worms. The precautionary approach would be to keep the health fish isolated (i.e., in another tank) from the infected ones, and to ensure the healthy fish do not become exposed to water (buckets, nets, etc.) from the unhealthy fish tank. I would strip down the healthy tank as far as practical, so that it can be kept thoroughly clean.>
i made sure to remove any dead bodies rapidly from the tank.
<Yes.>
The planted tank has a collection of characins, Kribensis, and ugh... my precious Plecos.... Is there any risk of infection?
<While many parasites are species-specific, unfortunately the worm-like parasites do tend to be generalists, or at least adaptable. Medicating all fish exposed to the infected fish is certainly wise.>
should i move the remaining affected fish?
<The ideal would be to remove all infected fish to a clean hospital tank; medicate as effectively as possible (i.e., Praziquantel if that's what you have, but Fenbendazole or flubendazole if possible). Leave the healthy fish where they are, but clean the tank as far as practical (to get rid of any parasites in the gravel, etc.) and generally give the tank a good tidy up to ensure excellent water quality, stable water chemistry, and maximum oxygen levels.>
should i also remove the Thorichthys that are healthy? any...measurements?.... im really scared right now.
<Understood. I think you've been unlucky here, but cichlids do travel badly, and there is a problem in the hobby with cichlids picking up various parasites (such as Hexamita and Camallanus) on fish farms, wholesalers, and at retailers. Quarantining expensive cichlids is certainly recommended, and prophylactic treatment for Hexamita, and possibly Camallanus, can make a lot of sense. Good luck, Neale.>

Cichlids... WAY over-crowded beh. 1/7/15
Hello, My name is Alicia and would like to ask a few questions and hoping you have the answers and want to Thank You in advance.
<Greetings, Alicia >
I have about 10 Chiclids in my 55 Gallon tank, I love them all dearly. I have a big Oscar he is about 10 to 12 inches long and looks healthy, this morning when i turned on the tank light he was down at the bottom and eyes looked closed and I thought he was dead I freaked out I've had him for about 8 months, I don't know if it is normal for him to have been like that I have never seen the Oscar do that before??
<It is not normal and usually means something is wrong with the tank. First check the heater is working. Then check the filter pump. Now grab a nitrite (with an "i", not nitrate with an "a") test kit. Check the water quality.
If nitrite is not zero, then something is wrong. My guess is that your tank is overstocked. As the fish grow, they produce more waste. An adult Oscar can overload a 55-gal tank without any trouble, so 75 gallons is the recommended minimum for Oscars these days. You have a bunch of other fish as well, which almost certainly means water quality isn't good.>
And the other question is I have what I believe is a Jewel i don't know if it is male or female but it stays in the cave nonstop it only comes out once in a great while to eat and very quickly runs back to the cave i don't understand why
<Variety of reasons for this. Sometimes cichlids hide because they're scared, sometimes because they're guarding something, and sometimes because the environment is "wrong" somehow (water quality or pH are possibilities).>
and when the Convict gets near the opening of the cave they both open their mouths and looks like they lock mouths together
<Likely aggression.>
do you know why please im very confused about it i was told they are mating or lighting for dominance???And my last question is do they prefer sand or gravel, because I have 2 African Cichlids and I believe the rest are South American I have a huge Albino from and 2 Algae eaters one is huge and other is alot smaller jus to give you a idea of what's in the tank, <You have FAR TOO many fish for this aquarium. Time to start "pruning" your collection. An Oscar and a Plec on their own easily fill out 75 gallons; add a Jewel, a couple Convicts and whatever else you have by way of Mbuna, and you've got a collection that needs to be kept in a 150-200 gallon aquarium. Sit back, think which fish you really want, and keep those properly; rehome the others.>
Thank You soo much for your time and knowledge for getting back to me, I think your site is Amazing and have shared it on Facebook and other sites with fiends!!!
<Cool.>
Thank You Alicia
<Most welcome! Neale.>

? re a bocourti central American cichlid with bizarre issue 10/15/14
Sick Central American Cichlid
I have a large bocourti which is about 8 years old. He was fine until recently. He had some whitish clumpy material on two scales and by the area where one fin came out of body, but that went away with antibiotics. I
also had a trimac which developed a whitish exudative material that came out of the area around its eye. He died after about month. Now my bocourti has similar material, looks like a white horn, coming out of one
area of its scales. Around the white area his scales are slightly red and look damaged. Is this a fungus? Or what?
I have photos if that helps. I hate to lose the fish. Sal
< The reddish scales are probably a bacterial infection. The whitish clumps may be a secondary fungal infection. The antibiotics you used may have affected the bacteria that provide the nitrification of the fish waste and you now may have elevated nitrogenous waste levels. I would recommend a water change and then clean the filters. Try to keep the water very clean and watch for any progress. Your cichlid is usually very tough so I would only recommend antibiotics as a last resort.-Chuck>

Growth stunted after parasite? 7/5/14
I have two young gold saum cichlids, and they are the most beautiful fish I've ever owned.
<Quite so. Were moderately popular in the UK during the late 80s-early 90s, though at that time often confused with Blue Acara (invariably with disastrous results as Gold Saum cichlids are far more aggressive, so in the UK they're called Green Terrors).>
A while ago after I got them, the female stopped eating - the male was fine, and actually never showed any signs of infection. I did some research, and paid close attention, and within a few days of her failures
to eat I began to notice more and more telltale signs of parasite infection (stringy feces, shrinking stomach). I did ask around online some, and was recommended Seachem's ParaGuard.
<Would not have been my first choice. The Hexamita infection you are describing above can pretty much only be treated with Metronidazole, a.k.a. Flagyl. This, coupled with careful control of nitrate (and other
metabolite) concentrations in the water should help; do read:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/flagylfaqs.htm
Hexamita is quite common among farmed cichlids, and seems especially problematic in less than perfect environmental or dietary situations.>
For a straight two months, it was daily water changes and tests, soaking their food in medicine and garlic and hoping she'd eat at least one or two bites, and begging the gods to be kind. The first week, there was nothing.
Then, she kept down one bite. And then another, and another. I kept up treatment for another month after she'd begun eating normally again, but now she hasn't coughed up her meal for six weeks, and I'm (understandably, I think) quite proud of bringing my fish back from the dead.
<Indeed!>
The male was younger than her, and during the span of her illness, he caught up to her in growth. In just the month since she got better, he's grown to half again her current size - she's around 3 inches, he's going on 5. Meanwhile, if she's grown at all, the female gold saum hasn't done so noticeably. They are sexually mature, and have spawned once since treatment.
<Good.>
I've done some digging, but haven't been able to confirm for myself that her growth could be permanently stunted. I'm just worried that someday soon, the male will kill her in one of his spawning chases. Could her
growth as a female just be slower than the male's? Or will I have to separate them if I don't want my efforts to save the female to be thwarted by her own mate?
<Male cichlids are commonly faster growers and earlier maturers than the females, though not always. But to answer your specific question: yes, fish have a "juvenile" growth stage through which they grow fastest, and subsequent to that, their growth rate slows down dramatically. It never stops, but if a fish didn't grow much in its childhood (for want of a better word) it never quite catches up with its siblings who grew at the normal rate in theirs. Make sense?>
Thanks for any response!
- Margaret
<Most welcome, Neale. Have bcc'ed Chuck if he's got a different opinion/advice.>
Re: Growth stunted after parasite? 7/5/14
Thanks! I did have it clarified that, for the ParaGuard to work it had to be soaked in to the food. It was really very effective, but if there's ever a next time I might give your recommendation a shot.
<Cool.>
One other thing I wound up doing was, when I noticed that the female would swim directly into aquarium salt additions, I dropped some raw granules in.
She swallowed them, and that was the first thing she kept down after getting sick. I've been told it's not recommended, but she did keep food down more frequently after salt. I imagine it wasn't pleasant for the
parasites.
<Quite possibly. Whether the Hexamita parasite causes the stringy faeces and weight loss we associate with it remains unclear. Some argue the parasite is latent in most cichlids, but a combination of stresses causes the cichlid to weaken, and the Hexamita merely multiply because conditions now favour them. It's likely complicated, and perhaps varies from fish to fish. Metronidazole is an antibiotic as well as being good against Hexamita, but if Hexamita aren't the immediate problem, but the bacteria, then some other antibiotic could work just as well.>
Thanks for clarifying the infection, too! I only knew it was parasitic, but not what kind.
<If it's any consolation, mine's a wild guess. We hardly ever do the necessary science needed to identify the parasite or pathogen involved, and instead go by hunches and probabilities based on accumulated veterinary experience.>
I hope she grows some more, I'd hate to see her stunted her whole life. But I guess I did about all I could do?
<Indeed. Cheers, Neale.>
Cichlid Stunted After Parasite Treatment /Chuck's go 7/7/14
I have two young gold saum cichlids, and they are the most beautiful fish I've ever owned. A while ago after I got them, the female stopped eating - the male was fine, and actually never showed any signs of infection. I did some research, and paid close attention, and within a few days of her failures to eat I began to notice more and more telltale signs of parasite infection (stringy feces, shrinking stomach). I did ask around online some, and was recommended Seachem's ParaGuard.
For a straight two months, it was daily water changes and tests, soaking their food in medicine and garlic and hoping she'd eat at least one or two bites, and begging the gods to be kind. The first week, there was nothing.
Then, she kept down one bite. And then another, and another. I kept up treatment for another month after she'd begun eating normally again, but now she hasn't coughed up her meal for six weeks, and I'm (understandably, I think) quite proud of bringing my fish back from the dead.
The male was younger than her, and during the span of her illness, he caught up to her in growth. In just the month since she got better, he's grown to half again her current size - she's around 3 inches, he's going on 5. Meanwhile, if she's grown at all, the female gold saum hasn't done so noticeably. They are sexually mature, and have spawned once since treatment.
I've done some digging, but haven't been able to confirm for myself that her growth could be permanently stunted. I'm just worried that someday soon, the male will kill her in one of his spawning chases. Could her
growth as a female just be slower than the male's? Or will I have to separate them if I don't want my efforts to save the female to be thwarted by her own mate? Thanks for any response! - Margaret
< It is not unusual for cichlid females to be smaller than their male counter parts. The female usually puts her energy into egg production and not into growth, so she may be done growing for awhile. It is very possible that the male will kill the female if she is not ready to spawn.
Experienced cichlid breeders place dividers between the fish so the smaller female can get to the male but the larger male cannot get to the female.-Chuck>

question regarding whitening of lips of T. Sieboldii (Bob, second opinion?)<<Mmm, no>> 3/31/14
Hi crew,
Long time reader here of the dailies, I always find it interesting to read of the successes and problems of others, and your suggestions regarding these...these is always something new to learn.
<For sure, Henk.>
This kind of setup is really quite different from most other aquarium and fishkeeping sites, I really am a big fan of your website.
<Thanks for the kind words.>
I have a question regarding the whitening of lips of a few Tomocichla Sieboldii.
<Wow! These are some seriously rare fish.>
First some info on the tank. This is a 100 gallon tank, filtered over a Fluval FX5, Eheim 2078, and a small Eheim 2213. Temperature at 27 degrees Celsius, pH 8, KH 7, GH 10, ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate between 5 and 10.
I do weekly water changes of about 40% with water which has been stored overnight. Due to the extreme softness of the tap water (KH 0-1, GH 2-4) I add baking soda and Epsom salts to increase hardness. Tankmates are a pair of Hypsophrys Nicaraguensis and two Thorichthys Maculipinnis.
<All sounds about right, and good choices for tankmates. Not aggressive, but robust enough to handle themselves.>
Two out of three Tomocichla Sieboldii clearly show whitening of their lips.
There is no fuzzy growth noticeable. First these white lips where only noticeable on the smallest of the T. Sieboldii, and since this fish seems a bit weak/stunted, I actually thought of it as poor genes.
<Do think this is "wrestling" damage from the lip-pulling that cichlids engage in, especially when pair-bonding. Under good conditions generally heals up without any fuss.>
Recently I see the whitening of lips also on the other T. Sieboldii, very clearly on the presumed male, and to a lesser extent on the largest specimen, a female. I have enclosed some pictures which hopefully show this. The smallest fish has had these white lips for at least 2 months,
whereas the second one to show these white lips only does so since a week or so. I have never seen any of the T. Sieboldii engage in liplocking, so I'm quite certain this is not due to lip locking.
<Indeed, but may go on at times and in places you don't see it.>
The two largest T. Sieboldii are picky eaters (graze on algae in the tank and feed on frozen bloodworm and my sis, refuse New Life Spectrum or flakes after 3 months of trying) but eat well. The smallest one has never been a very good eater, but he's been in the tank for almost 3 months so whatever makes him eat less (spits out quite a lot including frozen bloodworms) I assume it is nothing acute.
<Do bear in mind these are strongly herbivorous in the wild. I'd be offering them a good mix of green foods alongside the usual krill, bloodworms, etc. You might care to try one of the Hikari wafers of the types used for Panaque and other herbivorous catfish.>
Not sure if it is more likely to be stress or parasites (or something else)? There's quite a lot of chasing around in the tank (mainly done by the T. Maculipinnis) but nothing out of proportion, nor anything which I would label as severe bullying.
<Indeed. Your mix of cichlids is on the "easy going" end of the behaviour range.>
Now on to the questions... I do have some medications on hand but prefer not to use them unless necessary. I have SeaChem Paraguard, SeaChem Kanaplex, Metro, and Tetra Parasite Guard at home in the medicine cabinet.
Regarding the whitening of the lips of these three fish and the poor eating habits of one of these fish, could this all be due to some kind of bacterial infection?
<Well, the possibilities are the bacterial infection we call Mouth "Fungus" (also called Columnaris); plain vanilla Fungus; and Finrot. Some medications treat all three at once; so you could try one of those. But honestly, I do think this is nothing more serious than damage from mouth-pulling. Obviously watch them closely, and if things get worse, medicate. But if the fish are feeding fine and the lips improve then you won't need to do anything.>
Should I just keep up good water conditions and allow some more time to pass, or considering the whitening of the lips seems to be spreading, start medicating?
Your opinions are highly appreciated!
Thanks
Henk
<Welcome, Neale.>

Free Fish With a Couple Catches Bloating, Pop Eye, Bacterial Infections Neotrop. Cichlid hlth. 3/24/14
Greetings WetWebMedia, I've recently set up a few new ponds and have been given a few fish. The latest a 14inch Oscar and 7inch Jack Dempsey, both 5 years old. They came from a 135gal aquarium. Immediately I noticed the Oscar was very bloated(round on both sides) with lateral line erosion and bulging eyes. Although color was OK and fins looked decent. The JD was slightly bloated with what looked like a huge slice in caudal fin(looked to of healed with middle 30% missing but not sure). The lower jaw protrudes slightly, probably from an injury during a mismatched battle with the Oscar or other tank mates.
I should mention the previous owner had stuck these guys in a 20gal tank filtered by a AquaClear 110 for at least 4 days prior to me receiving them, as he was trying to sell his 135g tank. As far as water quality and dietary history beyond that I don't know. Both fish show scratches behind gill plates from being netted head first with a 4inch net upon transfer from the 135g to 20g aquarium. So these guys have taken some abuse and could be suffering from multiple bacterial and digestive issues. I now have them in a 250g quarantine tank and have dosed them with Epsom salt. Since the treatment the Oscar is laying on his side more. It has been 15hrs and no change in bloat or bowel movements.
Do you think these fish can be saved without antibiotics?

( I can provide immaculate water quality) If not what are your recommendations?
<That you continue as you've stated>
The JD seems healthier, should I separate?
<Not necessarily, no>
I'm thinking this is environmental mostly, but how contagious would these conditions be?
<Not very>
Will Epsom salt have as much preventative value against fungus or bacteria, opposed to normal salt.
<Both can be used>
I'm just waiting for the Columnaris to set in.
I've been given several 250g acrylic domes and want to stock those guys and a large Pleco in one, filtered by an aquaponic growbed at 265gph. Thanks for your advice Brandon
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>

reddened area around base of pectoral fins 6/16/13
Dear Crew,
<Hello Henk,>
I have noticed the last few days that my Nicaragua Cichlids appear to have a reddened area around the base of their pectoral fins.
<Not uncommon in cichlids; usually goes away without treatment. Can be physical damage from handling (including with nets) or fighting, but may also be incipient Finrot-type bacterial infections, i.e., an inflammation.>
At first I wondered if this has always been there and whether I just noticed it recently, but I double-checked some pictures taken 18 days ago and there it is much less (or not) visible. I have attached a picture of the fish showing this reddish area most clearly (pic 1), and a picture of the same fish 18 days ago (pic 4), as well as a picture of another specimen where this reddish coloration is less visible (pic 3). Overall coloration of the fish has changed quite a bit, they are about 4-5 inches and coloring up, but the red area looks a bit suspicious to me.
<Indeed so.>
Water parameters as follows: pH 8, ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 10. Only less desirable parameter (which I measure) is temperature which is at 30 degrees Celsius.
<Ah now, temperature may be a factor…>
Unsure if this is related or not, but about three weeks ago one of my juvenile Thorichthys Maculipinnis (about 1.5 inches) had stopped eating and had white slimy faeces, so I treated the tank with metro, according to the recommended dose on the package, for 3 consecutive days. At the same time I added aquarium salt gradually to a dose of approximately 3g per gallon. After treatment the fish started eating again and no more sign of white faeces. Since the treatment there have been three 30% water changes. Now all fish are active and eating very well. The reddish area however worries me, only the Nicaragua Cichlids are showing this reddish area, the Thorichthys do not. I have checked online and on WetWebMedia and don't really seem to find descriptions of symptoms well matching the ones I am seeing. Can you have a look at the pictures and let me know what you think? Thank you very much.
Henk
<Treating for Hexamita infections of similar using Metronidazole should not cause any specific reactions in the fish, but there's always a small risk when using any medication of some side affect, just as with humans. My two concerns here are environmental ones: salt, which isn't really necessary as a permanent fixture to any Central American cichlid aquarium, and temperature. Hypsophrys nicaraguensis comes from water bodies with a definite current, not necessary turbulent, but steady, and are likely sensitive to warm water that carries less oxygen than middling temperatures around the 25 C/77 F mark. So what would I do? I'd slowly dilute the salt out of the equation through a serious of water changes, and I'd also turn the temperature down a bit to see if that helps. Adding extra aeration or beefing up water circulation may be useful too; I'd be aiming for a turnover rate of around 8-10 times the volume of the tank per hour for cichlids like these. Cheers, Neale.>

Problem with Female Festae Cichlid 4/10/13
Hi again WWM crew,
<Hi Matt, Rick here>
I have e-mailed you about a similar problem I am having with my current female festae. I believe this is the same problem because this is the 3rd fish I have had get the same symptoms.
<Maybe something dormant in the water? Has the tank been sterilized since the last outbreak?>
I had treated the previous 2 fish with API General Cure that has active ingredients of Metronidazole and Praziquantel. Both of those fish didn't seem to get better at all from treatment.
<Could have been too advanced a stage for recovery.>
Here is a the message I sent to you guys, you had thought it was bacterial because by the time the fish had died his gills were eaten through. I have attached the 2 pictures of the festae.
<Note to BobF: we cannot post the picture he pulled from Google due to copyright concerns.>
<<Thank you Rick. Understood. B>>
<Begin previous query - RN>
"Re: Festae Breeding, now hlth. Question 6/12/12Red Terror Problems- Maybe fish Louse
Hello WWM crew. I'm replying back about my festae cichlid that hasn't eaten for over 3 weeks now. I have him in a quarantine tank by himself right now and I've been treating him with General Cure made by API because I hear its a good all around treatment. The active ingredients are Metronidazole and Praziquantel and I've been treating as the package suggests with a dose every 48 hours and a 25 percent water change before each dose. It's been 6 days now (3 treatments). Ammonia is 0, Nitrite is 0, and Nitrate is 10. He's been breathing hard and won't look at food at all so I'm only treating the water column. I took him out of the quarantine tank today to take a look at his gills and I notices that the gills are not attached to his body on the underside and I think they should be (I've attached a photo with the area circled). < The gills are attached to a gill arch. The whole underside of the fish between the gill covers an the body doesn't look right. It looks as though a bacteria has eaten though some of the tissues in the lower part of the gill covers.> The other picture I've attached shows a bulge right below his gills, although its not the best photo. Is this the way normal gills look, I have always thought they were attached to the body on the underside? Thank you for your help!<
Flip the fish over so you can get a better idea what the bulge is . I am thinking you might have a fish louse. It is a crustacean that may come in to the aquarium with feeder fish. The Praziquantel should take care of this problem.-Chuck"
<End previous query. - RN>
As for my female festae, she has stopped eating about 2 days ago and has stringy white poop. <Indicative of an internal parasite. What have you been attempting to feed her?> Her breathing is labored and I don't believe it is due to lack of oxygen because she has thrived in this environment for over a year now. <Probably is due to a lack of oxygen passing through the gills, not necessarily lack of oxygen in the tank. How do her gills look now? Any discoloration, anything that looks like it doesn't belong there?>
Her symptoms are the same as the previous 2 fish that died. I also noticed a spot of her side fins, I found a picture of what it looks like on Google and have attached it to this email as well. <BobF: This is the picture we can't post.>
Ammonia is 0, nitrite is 0, and nitrate is 30 ppm. She is 7 and a half inches long and stays in a 135 gallon aquarium by herself. The tank has a Rena XP4 filter and a Marineland Penguin 1140 powerhead with the bubbles on. The temperature stays at 79 degrees.
If you could recommend a treatment along with a medication that would be great. All I have on hand is General Cure (Praziquantel and Metronidazole) and SeaChem's pure Metronidazole. I am willing to get something else I just don't know what to try. I will drop half the water in the 135 gallon and treat the whole tank. <I'd include a substantial partial water change also, which is standard operating procedure with Praziquantel. I'd try the General Cure first and observe closely for a couple of days, mainly because of suspicion of both bacterial and parasitic problems. Be sure to remove any activated carbon, and if you can get your hands on a UV sterilizer I'd put it use here for a few weeks as an extra measure.> Thanks for your response!
<Hope it helps. That General cure didn't work last time leaves me doubting that we'll see anything different, but if you caught it earlier than the previous cases, that might be enough. If in a couple of days you don't start to see improvement, we'll try to formulate plan B. - Rick>
-Matt

Suddenly sick cichlid, iatrogenic 7/14/12
We have a 60 gallon tank with one Pleco (maybe 12 or 14 inches long),
<Needs more room than this>
2 blood parrot cichlids, and one convict cichlid. PH is 7.8, Ammonia = 0, Nitrite = 0, Nitrate = 20+.
<Keep under 20 ppm. See WWM re>
Temperature is stable between 77 - 80. I noticed some algae growth around the white plastic parts of the Fluvia canister filtration system. The tank has been set up since about May and has been pretty stable, though the nitrates occasionally slip up to almost 40 where they were when I noticed the algae. I did a water change and left town two days later for a week. I used an automatic fish feeder while I was gone, set to feed twice per day. It is not the best process and the amount of food is not consistent, but I watched it for a week before and it seemed okay.
When I got back, I had full on algae bloom. I still did not see a lot of algae growth on surfaces, but the water was very green. The fish were fine, healthy looking, swimming and visiting with us, and eating the pellets and bloodworms we offered. I tested the water and everything was the same with nitrates back up around 40, PH at 8.0 and everything else at 0. I did two partial water changes which helped lower the nitrates, but did nothing to minimize the algae bloom. Two days ago, I did a 50% water change and added Algaefix.
<A mistake; toxic... PLEASE search ahead of writing us>
Last night our convict got erratic and flapped crazily across the top of the tank. Then he returned to normal, but his feeding was off.
Today, he won't eat at all. He has gone downhill all day. This morning he was mostly swimming normally, now he is laying on the bottom of the isolation tank we put him in. His color was normal, now seems a little light. We did not notice any unusual white, now he seems to be a little powdery or velvety. His breathing is getting more and more labored.
We put him (might be a her, we don't know) in a separate tank and added Maracyn.
<Of no use here>
I've researched many things online and don't have a good resource locally that we know of. All that I've read has rendered me quite confused.
Do I add salt or not?
<.... see WWM...>
Do I use Parasite Guard or not? Do cichlid pellets and flakes provide enough vegetable food or do I need to ensure the fish get more (when he starts eating if I am able to save him)?
Thanks for your site and any help you can offer in this situation.
Laura
<You've written a good record of the causes of the troubles here. Too much NO3 (and likely other nutrients) due to... insufficient filtration, maintenance... Poisoning of the system w/ the algicide... Fix the environment here... Bob Fenner>

Re: Festae Breeding, now hlth. Question 6/12/12
Red Terror Problems- Maybe fish Louse
Hello WWM crew. I'm replying back about my festae cichlid that hasn't eaten for over 3 weeks now. I have him in a quarantine tank by himself right now and I've been treating him with General Cure made by API because I hear its a good all around treatment. The active ingredients are Metronidazole and Praziquantel and I've been treating as the package suggests with a dose every 48 hours and a 25 percent water change before each dose. It's been 6 days now (3 treatments). Ammonia is 0, Nitrite is 0, and Nitrate is 10. He's been breathing hard and won't look at food at all so I'm only treating the water column. I took him out of the quarantine tank today to take a look at his gills and I notices that the gills are not attached to his body on the underside and I think they should be (I've attached a photo with the area circled).
< The gills are attached to a gill arch. The whole underside of the fish between the gill covers an the body doesn't look right. It looks as though a bacteria has eaten though some of the tissues in the lower part of the gill covers.>
The other picture I've attached shows a bulge right below his gills, although its not the best photo. Is this the way normal gills look, I have always thought they were attached to the body on the underside? Thank you for your help!
< Flip the fish over so you can get a better idea what the bulge is . I am thinking you might have a fish louse. It is a crustacean that may come in to the aquarium with feeder fish. The Praziquantel should take care of this problem.-Chuck

Re: Festae Breeding Question
Festae on Medications 6/19/12
Hello again, I'm pretty sure my male festae isn't going to make it. I am now worried about my other fish as I don't want the same thing to happen to them in my main tank. They are all still eating and I am wondering if I can dose the General Cure (Metronidazole and Praziquantel) into their food.
Is this possible? If so, how many mg should I put per dosage? Should I dose the water column also? I am also wondering if Metronidazole and Praziquantel make fish sterile? Thanks for the help.
< Keep the water clean and try to keep the nitrates under 20 ppm. The lower the nitrogenous waste levels the better. Look for medicated foods with these medications already in them. You may have to look online to find these meds. Usually the meds are very tough on the kidneys and liver. Stay away from glass or blood worms. When treating the water column the medications may effect the bacteria that break the waste down into nitrates so a "new tank syndrome" make occur after treatments. Hope this helps.
-Chuck>
Re Festae on Medications II 6/20/12
I'm still torn between treating the tank or not. The fish all seem ok and they have been since the other fish got sick (the other fish got sick a little over a month ago). In your opinion, should I medicate or not? I hear clean water is the best medication so maybe I should just keep the water clean? You said stay away from blood worms and I'm not sure if you
are just talking about live blood worms. Are frozen or freeze dried bloodworms OK to use?
< I agree that you should strive to maintain a clean environment and allow the fish to fight off infections on their own. I don't recommend any type of blood or glass worms in a cichlid diet. They do just fine without it.-Chuck>

Re: Thorichthys Ellioti bloat 6/8/12
Hi guys,
it seems I've got my fourth case of bloat in a Thorichthys Ellioti coming up. A bit frustrating, it seems we have our Elliotis for about a year, then they balloon up and expire!
<Not fun>
I'd understand if the junior Elliotis got stressed out as there is a wee bit of chasing, but it's always the senior (bully) who dies...
<Perhaps a clue>
We introduced two juvenile Bristlenose Plecos about a month ago, can that be the issue?
<Shouldn't be>
Would gladly hand them back to my LFS if that's the problem.
Our water quality is decent, but NO3 is a bit high
<How high? I'd keep under 10 ppm. Do see WWM, the Freshwater Sub Index, re>
(London UK tap water). I've got two good filters running, loads of plants, aeration, very careful stocking... Don't know what else I can do.
I've got a bottle of Anti-internal bacteria (bronopol formaldehyde) from Interpet – is that good?
<Mmm, have not read re use of for this symptom.>
Also have some EsHA2000, suppose that won't do any good?
<What little I know re bloat/dropsical conditions, in cichlids and other FW fishes is archived here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/dropsyfaqs.htm
Any advice? I'm really fond of my Elliotis and I hate to see them suffer.
<Yes... perhaps a bit more alkalinity, carbonate presence might help... There seems to be a correlation re>
thank you,
Fredrik
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>
Re: Thorichthys Ellioti bloat 6/12/12
Bloat Problems With Thorichthys Ellioti
Hi team,
Thank you for good advice. Ruby the senior Ellioti bit the big one I'm afraid. Tried treating her with internal bacteria meds but she was too far gone. I'm aware of NO3 issues, but I can't understand how Ruby could have stayed perfectly healthy for over a year with consistent 40 ppm NO3 and then suddenly balloon and die within 48 hours?
We also had a heat wave in London a few weeks ago, and the water temperature went up from 25 to 28-29 C for a few days, that could have stressed her too I guess?
< Probably not since this is in their normal temp. range.>
My three Elliotis got along much better after our separating Ruby in the birthing cage as you suggested btw, it worked a treat. Adding liquid carbon daily for the plants. pH very stable at 8.
Pretty close to giving up on this species now, it's been my favourite all along but it's so annoying when they keep dying...many thanks, Fredrik
< Check the diet. I have found that glass or blood worms may cause intestinal problems with some cichlids. In any case the binder of some commercial foods also may case intestinal problems. Try a change in food and see if that helps.-Chuck>

Lethargic chocolate cichlid, poss. tumor or egg-bound? 3/20/12
Hi crew,
<Brian>
I have a five year old chocolate cichlid (Hypselecara temporalis)
alone in a planted 75gal tank that has been very lethargic for a couple weeks. The water tests out fine (ammonia and nitrite zero, nitrate ~40mg/mL,
<Too high by twice. Please read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/NO2ContrF.htm
and the linked files above>
pH ~7.6). The water parameters haven't changed recently. She has been spending most of each day lying head down, back arched, right side up, tail up. She still responds to outside stimulus if I go up to the tank to see her, but quickly goes back to her lying down position. I've done multiple large water changes and added carbon to the filter (which I don't usually use since the tank is planted), along with a couple tablespoons of aquarium salt. She has been more responsive since the water changes and carbon. The tank has been running for about five years and she's the only fish that has been in there (though there are plenty of snails).
On her right side, lower body, she appears to have an asymmetrical bulge. I'm concerned this bulge may be due to a tumor or stuck eggs.
I know she's female since about four years ago she cleared out some gravel to nest and laid a few dozen eggs. She has not laid eggs at all since then (compared to our blood parrot cichlid that lays eggs every four weeks like clockwork). I've tried to capture the asymmetry of the bulge in the attached photo. When she headstands on the gravel, she always does so with her right side (the bulging side) up, at about a 45-degree angle. She is a very moody fish
<Common for the species>
and at first we thought this was some kind of nesting behavior since she cleared the gravel down to the glass bottom and used that spot for her headstands for a few days. After I covered the glass back up, she picked a new spot, moved gravel and resumed the headstands. Now she's just doing it without a cleared spot in the gravel so it seems more like lethargy than nesting/hormonal moodiness. Her diet is mostly Hikari cichlid feed plus occasional frozen bloodworms and fresh-caught houseflies.
<Mmm... I'd switch to Spectrum pellets, the occasional earthworm (from a clean/pesticide free area)>
She's not currently eating.
<Bad>
Can you suggest anything that might be able to help her out, or at least make her more comfortable for the time she has left?
<Perhaps the use of Epsom Salt. Read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/SaltUseFWArtNeale.htm
and the linked Epsom FAQ file above>
Does anything I've said sound like an indication for a particular antibiotic?
<Of no use here>
Would stuck eggs present as a more symmetrical bloat?
<Not necessarily, no>
I've used frozen peas for constipated fish before, any chance constipation could present asymmetrically?
<Possibly>
I'm also considering Epsom salts, maybe in-tank, maybe a dip?
<Yes... in-tank>
Thank for your time on this question and all the others you answer!
-Brian
Vermont
<Welcome. Bob Fenner, Ca.>

Re: Lethargic chocolate cichlid, poss. tumor or egg-bound? 3/21/12
Hi Bob,
<Bri>
I appreciate your response about our chocolate cichlid. I've slowly added 4 tbsp Epsom salts during a 15% water change to get to a bit under 1tsp/5gal and plan another tablespoon in the morning. I had added a Rena 'Bio Chem Zorb' pouch to the canister just before the nitrate test so that plus the next few water changes should help with the nitrate levels; I'll also give the micron and coarse filter pads an extra rinse and get to a weekly schedule on replacing the micron pad (and cleaning out plant detritus) to reduce nitrate generation.
<Good>
I will keep her in there with an extra bubbler for oxygenation and see how she does. So far she seems less stressed than this morning before the Epsom salts.
She'll get peas the next time she looks interested in food. I will look for Spectrum pellets, they don't sound familiar to me --
<Mmm, see here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/SpectrumFoodsF.htm
I'm still on pre-Fukushima Hikari bags and was wondering what to buy next so it's great to get a recommendation.
Thanks!
-Brian, Vermont
<Welcome. BobF>

Midas Cichlid with internal bacterial/fungal infection? 12/8/11
Hi Wet Web Media Team!
<Micah>
I need help with treating my sick Midas Cichlid. Our Midas who we affectionately call Midas (original huh!) has not eaten for three days and it's hard to tell because she won't come out from behind the rocks but she looks to have a growth or bubble on her underside. My husband cleaned the gravel, the filter and did at least a 50% water change last night. The levels were perfect as of last night. We have a Marineland Emperor 400 Filter with bio wheel. We inherited the fish and the fish tank from my ex-fiancÃ© about five years ago. Midas is approx. 8 years old. One of the problems is that the tank is over crowded. Like I said we inherited all of these fish, this isn't our choice to have this arrangement, but Midas is in a 75 gal tank with about 14 albino/pink convicts.
<Mmm, very likely being bullied by them>
We have tried to give them away and no one wants them, most of our friends have nice small fish not large aggressive fish. So we deal with it by doing frequent water changes and checking levels frequently as well.
<Good>
I'm not sure that's enough given that Midas is now sick.
I read these two questions/answers below that are on your website which really seem to apply to the description of our Midas right now but I still have a few questions. What temperature is optimal while she is in this state?
<The mid to upper 70's F.>
Should I transfer her to a hospital tank if I don't already have one established? Should I use the Metronidazole and the Nitrofurazone? If I don't use a hospital tank are these medicines safe for the albino/pink cichlids and our filter system with the bio wheel? And what is a furnace antibiotic?

Thank you very much for your help! We love her very much and want treat her in any way we can to save her!
Jillian
<This fish needs to be placed in another system... Really, the root cause is social/environmental. Won't get better living w/ all these Convicts. Bob Fenner>

Green Terror with swollen anal area 5/23/11
Hi Crew
<Tim>
I have a Green Terror that has suddenly developed a 1cm round bulge around its anal area.
<Ouch!>
It is still active and I saw it do a thin red poop. Other than that, there is nothing else protruding out of its
anus.
Its tummy also looks bloated, almost like a block.

Is it likely to be anything more than constipation and is there more I should do other than put in some Epsom salt (I tried peas, which were ignored).
Cheers
Tim
<IF you're sufficiently worried, AND this fish begins eating something, I might try "lacing" the food w/ Metronidazole (for possible Protozoans) and likely Praziquantel (or other anthelminthic) for worm parasites. Concentrations, rationale are posted on WWM for. Bob Fenner>
Re: Green Terror with swollen anal area 5/23/11
Thanks Bob.
<Hey Tim>
Maybe the attached picture will provide a better idea of what is going on. Any change to your diagnosis?
<Mmm, no... again, could be some sort of gut blockage only... or possibly parasitic involvement>
There is nothing small enough for it to swallow
<Not even gravel? Perhaps a "bug that fell in"...>
and no fish missing (eaten by it). I do have fine sand though - could it be swallowing mouthfuls of those when scooping up pellets?
<Yes>
Cheers
Tim
<Hopefully this too shall pass. BobF>

Parachromis managuensis orange material 10/6/10
Orange Mass With Managuense
Hi, Great page!!! I have a pair of Parachromis managuensis in a 500 l. plastic outdoor water
cylindrical tank, male is 35 cm. female is 25 cm.
My question is, At the bottom, there is a loose mass of orange like material (NOT EGGS) and the
parents did not display any behavior associated to spawning or egg caring (fanning etc) only the male hassle a bit the female, head bumping, a bit chasing'¦Could this material be some kind of pre-spawn substance?
Thanks in advance, Gustavo pd: if you answer, please send it here, and then you can post it. Thanks very
much.
< No pre-spawn. With cichlids it is usually all or nothing. I suspect that something is falling in the water since your tank is outside, or it is some indigestible fecal matter from the food you are feeding. It may have indigestible plant parts in it. Look at the label for things like corn etc...-Chuck>
Re: Parachromis manguensis orange material
Orange Mass With Managuense II 10/6/10
Thanks Chuck, I think you are right since I was giving them Koi pellets, high in wheat...
the thing is that they are rejecting small frozen fish, only eating spiders I give them. I guess they are a bit confused yet, only 5 days in the tank since I got them from a friend of mine...What other food do you suggest?
Thanks once again, Gustavo

Sensory Pores, HLLE, New World Cichlids 3/1/10
Hello Crew,
I have noticed as of late that there are small pin hole sized pores on the front of my Severum and Festivum. The water is a touch hard for those species but I am looking into an RO unit. I have read that these cichlids have what are called Sensory Pores that they use to detect changes in their surroundings. I cannot seem to get any other information other then that it may be Hole in the Head. How can I tell the difference? My nitrates are consistently at 20ppm or lower. The tank has been cycled for a year and is well established. The holes are perfectly symmetrical and for every hole on the left side of the face there is an equally sized and exactly symmetrical hole on the other side. Thanks in advance for your greatly appreciated advice.
Sincerely,
Phill
<Hello Phill. Generally, sensory pores are extremely small, and they don't suddenly appear out of nowhere. They also appear to match the background colour of the fish. Damaged pores, as you get from Hole-in-the-head, tend
to be larger and often appear white because skin (or flesh) below the coloured layer of the skin is exposed. Since the pores do become infected, the Hole-in-the-head lesions can appear symmetrical because the pores are
symmetrical. It's important to catch Hole-in-the-head early, and treatment needs to involve both medication (Metronidazole) plus correction of whatever dietary or water quality issues might be going on. Since Severums
are herbivores in the wild, it's important they get plenty of fresh greens.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebindex/hexoctfwfs.htm
Neither of these species is fussy about water chemistry, though they do come from soft water in the wild. I'd be more mindful of nitrate level, as this is more often the cause of sickness with large cichlids. Cheers, Neale.>
Hi Phill--
I accidentally responded to your e-mail without first placing into my own box to prevent it from being answered by anyone else! As a result, you've probably received two responses. I've deleted my own from WWM's inbox to
avoid any confusion, so I wanted to let you know that you only have to respond to one, not both! Feel free to respond to Neale's, since he seemed to think the situation more serious than I did, so is probably more familiar with the issue and more aware of its ability to appear benign but turn negative. Therefore, he would be the better person for you to speak to! I just wanted to clarify what was going on! Sorry for any confusion!
--Melinda
Re: Sensory Pores
Hi Neale,
Thanks for the help.
<My pleasure.>
I will get on that medication asap. As for the fresh greens....any good examples that will boost his diet?
<All sorts of things are good. Cheap aquarium plants are one way to go, as with Goldfish. Otherwise tinned peas, cooked spinach, Sushi Nori, even small pieces of soft fruit. Feel free to try out whatever salads you have at home, perhaps zapping in the microwave (or blanching with boiling water) to soften them up a bit. The goal is to have at least some greenery available for the Severum to munch on whenever he/she wants, rather as is the case with Surgeonfish, another group very prone to Hole-in-the-Head.>
I just added some Anacharis which I was told they will eat readily. I also add herbivore pellets and omnivore pellets once a week. Should I bump the herbivore pellets to twice weekly as I do see him eating that as well?
<For Severums, it's a good idea to balance the diet about 50/50 between green foods and meaty. I'd sooner use Spirulina flake and algae wafers as the staples than standard fish food, but regular offerings of fibre-rich wet-frozen krill and other whole invertebrates would certainly be worthwhile. On the other hand, try to avoid protein-rich, fibre-poor foods like beef heart, fish fillet and shelled seafood. You might use these as a treat two or three times a month, but no more than that. Severums do seem prone to digestive tract problems including things like prolapses and bloating, so making sure there's lots of indigestible matter in their diet is probably useful in the long run. It's also worth mentioning that the red colouration on these fish comes from the carotene in crustacean skeletons, among other things, so the more unshelled krill, Mysis and brine shrimp in their diet, the prettier they'll be.>
Thanks again.
Phill
<Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Sensory Pores
Hi again Neale,
<Hello!>
Sounds great. I have been doing flake (M.W,F) and Cichlid Attack pellets (T, Th, Sat) and algae wafers/Omni wafers Sundays with frozen bloodworms nightly.
<Sounds good to me.>
I'll replace some of the flakes with wafers and add some more Anacharis. He also seems to like my Crypt balansae plants.

Are the bloodworms ok or are they going along the same lines as the beef heart and could harm his digestive tract?
<Bloodworms contain a lot of indigestible matter. In fact I seem to recall they're only around 4-5% protein, with a good part of the rest being indigestible chitin and harmless water. So they're a good, natural food. In fact almost anything "whole" is good, at least in terms of fibre content and moisture, so problems with constipation are less likely. There are some who argue that top quality prepared foods are safer and better, and you can find such discussions elsewhere at WWM. But me, I reckon the more varied the diet, and the stronger the accent on providing green foods to herbivorous/omnivorous fish, the better. Much as with humans. There's much discussion about carbs, fat and sugar and all that good stuff, but you can actually optimise human nutrition by heeding just five words: eat more fruit and vegetables. Do that, and everything else takes care of itself.
Same with cichlids. Most cichlids are at least partially herbivorous, so anything you can do to get more greens into them improves their colour, vitality and disease resistance in the long term.>
Thanks.
Phill
<Cheers, Neale.>

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