Tough Decision to Make; Mormyrid comp.      6/14/17
Hello Crew! This is Renee from Idaho with yet another situation specific mormyrid question for you.
<Fire away.>
But first I have to tell you that my BGK is doing beautifully, staying healthy, growing, and continuing to enchant every day (getting the catfish for her was a brilliant idea! Not only are they keeping the tank clean, but she feels more comfortable with them than any other dither fish I've tried and now she moves around the entire tank - thank you again for that suggestion).
<Cool.>
However, in the past I've shared with you my desire to get an elephant nose someday. I've put it off because that species is not available in my area and because I wanted to focus on my BGK and other tanks, but now I find
myself in a situation. My local aquarium store, who I previously asked about the availability of the elephant nose fish, gave my information (with my permission) to a military couple, who are being relocated, who have an elephant nose they can't take with them, but they only want to give the fish to someone with experience with Mormyrids.
<Understood.>
I told them my experience was very limited (at best), but invited them out to see my tanks and talk with me about taking the fish. We had a nice visit and they loved my BGK (who chose to be very social for the occasion).
I explained to them that while I wanted their elephant nose, that I did not have time (or the energy) to properly prepare a whole other tank for the fish before they were going to be forced to leave (I have an empty 55 gallon, but it's dry, has no substrate, filter, or heater - I've just been storing it). Still, they seemed quite determined to get me to take the fish and suggested that it would be fine in my 75 gallon.
<Hmm...>
Well, my 75 gallon currently houses 2 rope fish, one peacock eel, and a 2 inch Bristlenose, and I just don't know if that group would be compatible for ALL the animals.
<Very difficult to predict. In terms of tank loading, not a problem assuming good filtration and regular water changes. The question is whether the Elephantnose and the Black Ghost will coexist. Ecologically, they occupy very similar niches so there will be competition for them in terms of swimming space, hiding place, food, and most importantly, electrical frequencies. This latter is the key here: if they jam one another, they'll irritate each other, and because the sense is electrical, not visual, you can't really "hide" them from one another by adding more rocks, plants, etc.>
I told them I believed the peacock eel also found its food by use of an electrical signal and I don't know if that would cause a problem for the elephant nose or the eel.
<I'm not aware of electric sense organs in Spiny Eels, but I could be wrong. If they have one, it'll be passive, like on sharks, simply able to pick up the electric signals caused by muscle contractions in prey animals; fish with active electric senses, like Black Ghosts and Elephantnoses, have distinctly "stiff" bodies so that the electromagnetic field is fixed, allowing them to sense the distortions caused by obstacles, rivals and prey. Much more sophisticated!>
I told them I wanted to help them, and that I wanted the elephant nose, but I wasn't going to sacrifice the current residents of my 75 gallon tank, the elephant nose, or my sanity by forcing this.
<Right.>
I've been researching since last night and can't find anything specific, both for or against, putting the elephant nose in with the rope fish and eel, so when they called me this morning, I told them I was going to write to you for your advice - if you thought it would work, I'd take the fish; if not, they were going to have to find someone else to take it. So, what do you think?
<I'd give it a shot *if* you had the option of returning the Elephantnose if they squabble. But if you're lucky, the two species will use different frequencies, and beyond territorial skirmishes, will ignore each other. I wouldn't bet the house on it, but it'd be worth a go, particularly if both specimens are still relatively small. Neither species is heavily armed, so aggression tends to be a slow burning sort of thing, with stand-offs and chases, rather than bites. So all else being equal, you can see if they're failing to get along, and act accordingly. Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Tough Decision to Make. Mormyrid comp.       6/15/17
I'm sorry, I should have been more clear. The elephant nose would not be going in the tank with the BGK.
<Ah!>
You see, (and you're going to think I'm crazy) I have 8 fish tanks up and going and although the tanks are not species specific, they are parameter specific.
<Sensible.>
I refuse to expect a fish to "adapt" to less than ideal parameters for that species just because I want it.
<Agreed; some fish are adaptable of course, but others will inevitably do poorly in the wrong conditions. You simply need to know your fish.>
I believe that each tank should meet the specific requirements of the fish I want to put in it. Therefore, the BGK has her own 72 gallon tank that she shares only with her Brochis catfish and one Bristlenose because they share the same parameters and the Brochis and the Bristlenose don't mind the extra current that the BGK needs (plus there are areas where the current isn't as strong).
<Quite so. Brochis are sadly underrated, but a much better choice than Corydoras in larger, deeper tanks. Things like Megalechis and Hoplosternum are good too, being even more hardy and a bit more robust, so good choices with adult oddballs that aren't actually predatory, just big.>
Even though the water parameters would fit the elephant nose, I still would not put that species in this tank for the reasons you mentioned plus the fact that elephant nose don't like a strong current.
<I think they're a bit more adaptable than you might think. Bear in mind that even a brisk aquarium current is barely a dribble compared with the flow in an African river! So provided there are resting spots below or behind rocks where they can rest, these sorts of fish should tolerate water flows up to 8-10 volume of the tank per hour. But yes, for sure they won't appreciate turbulent flow in open tanks without shelter.>
The tank I want to put the elephant nose is a separate 75 gallon that has only the two rope fish, the spiny eel, and a Bristlenose.
<Oh, he'd be fine here.>
It has a sand substrate, plenty of plants (the plants have a tendency to "move" as the spiny eel likes to tunnel through the sand), and plenty of caves to hide in. It has a Cascade 1000 canister filter which provides a pretty good current, so I keep the spray bar submerged to slow it down as the rope fish don't like a strong current either. That is the tank I was going to put the elephant nose in. The rope fish are 6 and 8 inches and the elephant nose is just under 4 inches, so I don't think I have to worry about them trying to eat the elephant nose (they haven't bothered the spiny eel and its about 4 inches as well). Plus, I feed only frozen foods (bloodworms, baby brine shrimp, daphnia, Cyclops, and chopped up grocery store fish or prawns) so hopefully that satisfies their craving for meat.
<All sounds good. Elephantnoses go wild for plankton, so your baby brine shrimps, daphnia and Cyclops should fit the bill nicely! Once settled they're pretty tough, even bossy, but these tankmates sound about right for them.
Good luck, Neale.>
Re: Tough Decision to Make      6/15/17
Many, many thanks! The couple that have this fish live on (or near, I haven't been to their home) Mountain Home Air Force Base in south central Idaho. It's about a 2 hour drive for me, but they were so excited (and I think relieved) when I just called them and told them you gave the "thumbs up" that they offered to meet me halfway in Boise.
<Cool.>
Their movers are coming this Friday to get the rest of their belongings, and they fly out on Saturday, so we've arranged to meet tomorrow when I can pick up the fish. I'm really excited, (ok, and a little bit nervous as I won't be able to return this fish if something goes wrong), and your comments have given me the confidence to go ahead.
<At the very least, you're giving this fish its best chance of a secure future. Keep us posted.>
Thank you for all you do!
<Most welcome. Neale.>
Re: Tough Decision to Make      6/16/17
Well, here he/she is! I hope I reduced the picture small enough for you to download. (lol) I'm sorry about the picture, but he/she wasn't in the mood to "mug" for the camera and this is the best I could negotiate.
<Not an easy species to photo, trust me!>
It's understandable though, he/she just spent the last 3 or 4 hours in a plastic butter tub driving in a car and then suddenly finds himself/herself in a whole new world.
<Quite so; this is an intelligent animal (for a fish, anyway) sensitive to its world. Give it time.>
Is this species always so thin?
<Nope. While the "stem" between the tail and body is thin, the actual girth of the body should be relatively chunky; Mormyrids are valued food fish in the wild. At the least, you want the belly area to be distinctly convex, and regular small feedings (even 3-4 per day) is a good way to help this fish put on weight. They have big appetites (perhaps something to do with their electricity production) and do need good quality food, and plenty of it. Daphnia, brine shrimp and the like are useful; if you can get them, clean wormy foods are excellent, perhaps Microworms but ideally small earthworms and the like. Tubifex and bloodworms definitely taken, but not without their risks.>
Is there a way to tell if its male or female?
<Probably, if you're another Mormyrid. Females are probably a bit more chunky when mature (commonly the case with fish) but they actually identify gender by using their electric sense, so far as we're concerned, they basically look the same. If you know any physics specialists with an oscilloscope, it's actually possible to hear their clicking with the right tools. Very neat. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Elephant Nose - Peacock Eel question. Comp.        11/24/17
Ok, this morning I had to move the Eel. When I woke up, it was at the top of the tank hiding behind the spray-bar from the filter and the Elephant Nose was pacing back and forth as if "stalking" it.
<Oh! Doesn't sound good.>
So now the Eel is in the BGK tank with its two Ropefish buddies (72 gallon). I don't think the Eel will mind the extra current as there are a lot of places to hide or get out of the current, and plenty of sand to dig through - is that correct?
<Yes; Spiny Eels enjoy strong water currents, provided they can burrow into something that keeps them secure, like soft sand or a hollow tube. They are riverine fish, so more than able to move about in strong currents. They
just don't like constantly swimming. What suits a Black Ghost should suit a Spiny Eel just fine. Very similar requirements, and indeed, to some degree ecological niche -- nocturnal predators on small worms and the like.>
I'm really glad that this territorial behavior indicates that the Elephant Nose is doing well as I truly love this fish, but now he seems to be going after the Ropefish.
<Uh-oh. Any chance of adding something to disrupt this behaviour? Some active midwater dither fish (Congo Tetras would be African species that fit the bill nicely) might help to give the Elephantnose something to target
without being vulnerable themselves. Synodontis species are good too, having what Loiselle referred to as a 'Mosaic' approach to retribution -- not actually aggressive if left alone, but like the prophet Moses, more than able to wreak bloody vengeance when pushed, so tend to be left alone by all but the most psychotic tankmates. A group of adult Synodontis nigriventris should be a good choice, and usually aren't nippy or bothersome, something which can characterise the larger Synodontis. There are some gentle giant Synos out there though, if you want a single, bigger catfish; Synodontis eupterus springs to mind.>
The smaller of the two Ropefish is now in the same spot the Eel was this morning while the larger is swimming circles up and down the wall beneath him.
<Does sound like territoriality, in which case adding -- not removing -- fish can be the solution, by spreading out aggression. Another tip is to remove the aggressor, rearrange the tank, and after an hour or two, return the aggressive fish. With luck, this resets the dynamic as the aggressor has lost his territory, and now behaves more like a newcomer. Sometimes, even giving the aggressor a 'time out' by confining to a net or something inside the tank can work, by reminding him he's not top dog, and there's someone even more terrifying in the jungle, namely, the fish net!>
Now the Internet is full of advice, some good - some not so good - about the Elephant Nose (and everything else of course.) and every article I've read says the Elephant Nose is a schooling fish and shouldn't be kept alone. Is that true?
<Right, here's where things get complex. In the wild, yes; these fish occur in big schools. HOWEVER, in fish tanks it's very difficult to keep a big enough group that they coexist. As you know, they're electric fish, and
constantly jostling for position by jamming each other's frequencies. It's something we can't see or hear, but presumably stressful. So if you keep, say, three or four specimens, you usually end up with just the one dominant
fish. Think about Piranhas and you've got much the same problem. I guess if you had space for six specimens it'd be worth a shot, but you'd need a really big tank, given adults are 20 cm/8 inches or so in length. Bottom line, outside of jumbo tanks, it's simply easier to keep a singleton. They can't do much harm to L-number catfish or Synodontis, so those are reliable tankmates, and equally, a school of Giant Danios or Congo Tetras isn't going to be overly bothered by them simply because they're too quick for it to harass.>
Because my Elephant Nose seems to be telling me it wants the tank to itself, and that's ok.
<Certainly, for whatever reason it doesn't appreciate the fish it sees as competing for food or hiding places.>
I have another 75 gallon tank up and running that houses only a 3 inch Baby Whale and a 2 inch Senegal Bichir (an odd couple, I know, but the Bichir is the only fish the Baby Whale has terrorized to madness) and it would be
quite easy to move the Ropefish to that tank.
<Sounds a teeny-tiny Bichir! I'd treat that chap very delicately at this point, as they are a bit sensitive when this small.>
I just want everyone to be healthy and unstressed (me too if that's possible!).
<Hopefully the above will help. Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Elephant Nose - Peacock Eel question       11/24/17
Well, I can't do anything about trying to get new fish today because of the holiday, but I do have 5 Serpae Tetra in my community tank who seem to LOVE to chase each other around all the time anyway and are too fast for the
Elephant nose to catch - would that work, at least temporarily?
<I would not... Serpae Tetras are highly social, and highly hierarchical, little nippers -- really scaled down Piranhas! Fin-nipping is part of the way they feed, so they're poor choices for pretty much anything. Nice fish
to look out, and fun, but best kept in large groups on their own in shady, planted tanks. Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Elephant Nose - Peacock Eel question       11/24/17
And yes, that Bichir is very small. I got that one and another that is barely an inch long from a guy who wanted to try to use them as feeder fish for his 5 Jack Dempseys.
<I... uh,... don't know what to say... so pointless and cruel. It's not like JDs are obligate piscivores in the wild, and the farmed fish will eat most anything.>
Apparently he found new victims elsewhere and wanted the bichirs gone.
<I despair of my fellow fishkeepers sometimes. Neale.>
Re: Elephant Nose - Peacock Eel question       11/24/17
I completely agree. Want to hear the "kicker?" He has his own business - aquarium maintenance.
<Yikes! In all honesty, he may be a great fishkeeper for all I know. But he really needs to break the feeder fish habit! Expensive, risky, cruel, and without any kind of benefits for any of the fish widely kept by aquarists.
I admit there are one or two very rare things, like South American Leaffish, that really do need a supply of home-bred livebearers or Killies to stay alive, but most everything else can and should be weaned onto alternatives. Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Elephant Nose - Peacock Eel question       11/24/17
Hey Neale, if you don't already think I'm crazy, this may make up your mind. I moved my Ropefish out of the elephant nose tank because the EN was harassing them to the point that they were throwing themselves against the lid trying to get out. But even that didn't stop the EN's tirade - he started in on the plants and seemed to almost be thrashing around the tank.
I did water testing and results came back no ammonia, no nitrate, and nitrate was definitely less than 20 ppm (this tank's water change day is Tuesday). I put my Neon Tetras (8) and Harlequin Rasboras (7) in with him and he became a mad bomber blasting his way through the schools repeatedly.
I had a random thought that this fish is experiencing some sort of short-circuit and tried to remember when this behavior actually started. I thought it started shortly after I put in a terracotta "cave" I made for them. He acted weird when I first put it in, but he always acts weird when I make any change to his tank. But looking back, this was different.
Instead of hiding, the EN was approaching the terracotta cave in an almost aggressive manner, and then backing away from it - repeatedly. Also, the Peacock Eel was lying under the sand right next to the terracotta cave when
the EN first attacked him. So I looked up terracotta and it was described as a "clay type earthenware, glazed or unglazed, most commonly used in the old days as an ELECTRICAL INSULATOR..." (ok, lights are going on now!) The article went on to say that all clays are the best electrical insulators because they completely resist the flow of electric charge? So I took the terracotta cave out (half an hour ago), and although the EN is still pretty
active, he's just swimming around, he's no longer charging the rasboras or the tetras. This is really important because he still has two decorations in the tank, his other caves, that are ceramic but these items are glazed
(the terracotta cave I made is not). Do you think it's possible this could be setting off his aggressive behavior through some distortion of the electrical signals this fish relies on to function in its world?
<It's possible, but I'd have thought less likely than the 'buzz' from the wiring in and around the tank, such as the lights. But still, empirical evidence always trumps the theory, so if removing the cave helped, and he's now settled down, then I'd definitely call this a win if I was you!
Elephantnoses use their electricity in two main ways, for navigation and for communication. So far as navigation goes, it's why they keep their bodies so stiff and straight, and as they release electrical charge, they detect any distortions in the field they produce, and that tells them where objects are. It's kind of like radar I suppose. The communication thing, as we've discussed, includes a lot of hierarchical elements because there is a best frequency for the navigation field, and only the dominant one will use this frequency, forcing others to use less ideal frequencies. The lower down the pecking order you are, the worse the frequency you're left with.
(If this isn't a good metaphor for Net Neutrality I don't know what is, but I digress...) Things that interfere or reflect with the frequency the dominant fish is using will be seen as a social threat. That might be another dominant fish, in which case they fight, but I suppose it could be some unusual object that somehow reflects or distorts that frequency, irritating the dominant fish. Being just an animal, albeit a relatively smart one, he or she would be angry, but likely to transfer that aggression to another fish rather than some dumb rock, because he or she knows rocks aren't social threats! Anyway, that's my theory for now! Good luck sorting it all out, Neale.>
Re: Elephant Nose - Peacock Eel question    11/25/17
I think your theory is correct - thank you for your help!
<Maybe a hypothesis is a better word! But anyways, good luck, Neale.>
Re: Elephant Nose - Peacock Eel question    11/25/17
If I could trouble you with just one more question, and then I promise to drop it, but I'm sitting here looking at the Elephant Nose, I can see he is a lot calmer, but still agitated to a lesser degree. He seems to be fixated on one corner of the tank. It's where the terracotta cave was but its no longer in the tank at all. But what is over there are the tiny, baby bichirs. Could the EN be recognizing their species by sight and see them as a physical threat, not a social threat.
<By sight, no; Elephantnoses have poor eyesight, and recognising a 'species' isn't really something fish do. A big giant Bichir would be seen as a threat, sure; a baby one just registers as background detail. As always with animals, beware applying human motives and human senses to their world -- we/they are simply too different, and making comparisons is the pathway to confusion. Elephantnoses primarily react to electrical stimuli, possibly other fish, but mostly fish that are emitting electrical fields themselves. They will also react to things that conduct electric fields in a novel way, such as balls of aluminium foil in their aquarium.
They are gregarious (so do get lonesome, I'm sure) but also hierarchical (so become aggressive in small groups). Their secondary sense is taste, which is what their 'trunk' is all about. So foraging is important to them.
Think about ways to make their lives more interesting perhaps, by offering live foods -- baby brine shrimp for example are very popular with some -- which takes them a while to find and eat.>
The bichirs went into that tank at the same time as the terracotta cave (I made it for them as a safe haven).
<I would simply observe for now. It may well take time for all to settle in, and settle down. Cheers, Neale.>