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Clarion angelfish
6/4/16
Why Are Clarion Angels So Expensive? ? 05/09/08 Hey Crew.. <<Hey Pok!>> Short and sweet. <<Okay>> Why are Clarion Angels so expensive? I have been told by "experts" they are abundant and numbered in the Millions yet they still command nearly 4000.00 per fish .. Pok <<Well Pok, according to Bob's article on this fish found here (http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/holacanthus/clarionensis.htm), It is a simple matter of the fishs? ?isolation and related costs for collection and transport?? Regards, EricR>> Steve Robinson 1/29/08 Bob, Hope all is well, I am looking to contact Steve Robinson. I have heard through a couple of people now that he will be moving a shipment of 50 Clarion Angels into the USA this next month. I was wondering if you had any type of contact information for him " Email". <Mmm, try him at: Clarionreef@aol.com Bob Fenner> Thanks Sean Stalter Saltwater Connections Clarions to become legal...soon 1/5/08 Hi Bob, How's it goin! I just read you post on the WetWebMedia and thought I'd write. After 4 years and lots of money to open up Mexico again, my guys just got a permit for fish including a clarion angel quota and so...am going for clarions this coming week. I may well be back up here in San Francisco by the 14th and after full disclosure and clearance with the USFWS , they'll be available. Your site gets all the wealthier uber-fish nerds all excited doesn't it? <Heee, a few> In case anyone wants some...soon the call will go out. <I'll post this...> But....they are not in and cleared just yet. I'll give you one for some serious referrals. <Thank you just the same... all I have nowadays are FW systems...> I got a email returned from Michael Gonzales [ who used to hound me for em] Marine care and Marineaquatics and the conventional wholesale sources i.e., SDC, Quality etc. I would already have. Steve Robinson Bajareef 510 750 6834 PS. Also; We are opening Papua New Guinea soon; good story...later on. <Glad to hear/read you're still about Steve... Keep it real. Bob Fenner> Question on clarion angelfish ? 9/28/07 Hello Bob, my name is John Coppolino and I'm a 30 year old avid reef aquarist that's been in the hobby long enough to remember the days when clarion angels cost about 1/3 of asfur angels from the Red Sea. I give a talk on rare angelfish (including IMAC next year where it looks we'll both be!) and have some questions for you regarding Holacanthus clarionensis. I read that you've witnessed these near Cabo San Lucas as many others have. Do you believe these to be waifs, or are there breeding populations there, outside of the Revillagigedos? <I think they are so few, not many mature animals... that they are indeed waifs> I recently met up with Gerry Allen and may have dinner with him when he is in town next week, and have read of his first hand accounts of this species at Clipperton (ah... visions of these hybridising with Clipperton's dance in my head :), where they are very rare and probably waifs. Also, with what frequency have you seen H. clarionensis/ H. passer hybrids? <I have only seen two... none in the wild> I know full well that collection of this species in the Revillagigedos is cut off, but is > the species protected from collection everywhere in Mexico, or is it protected from export? <Don't think it's protected period currently... Just need collecting, transport and import licensing...> Thanks in > advance for your insight, and I look forward to > meeting up with you at IMAC. John > <Cheers, Bob Fenner> Considering a Clarion Angel Hey Bob, I was reading
your articles on the Holacanthus clarionensis and I am
really intrigued by this fish and would really like to find
one. Plus the fact that it's good looking, not too big,
and gets a (1) care rating from you. You state that
"if you win the lottery, try this fish." About how
much money are we talking for this particular fish,
ballpark? Thank you Bob, Jeff <The going price is a few
to several hundred dollars... you might try contacting MarineCenter.com
re: http://www.themarinecenter.com/clarion.htm
Bob Fenner> Angels On His Mind... Hi Scott, how are you doing, hope you're doing great. <Doing fine, Juan- Hope all is well with you!> Just wrote you to say Hi!!, and to know how are things in L.A. honestly here in Tijuana we just have a lot of smog from the fires, and the roads to Ensenada and Tecate are a mess, but I can't complain because I have family in San Diego that were about to get evacuated, because the fire was 3 miles from there house, gladly they controlled and things seem to be better. <Yep- it's kind of like Pompeii here- tons of ash and lots of smoke...finally cooling down, and hopefully fire crews can get the upper hand on these fires> Changing the subject, The last time I wrote you I told you that I got a 1" Cortez angelfish, I did a lot of research and find out that at that age they need live rock to feed, and in the 20 gal Hospital tank that I used to have it, I could get live rock in because of the size. He was eating flake food, but I now that he need more than only flakes, some my only option was to get I'm in the 90 gal at home with a baby 2" Naso tang that I intend to get to my bigger tank and with my 5" harlequin Tuskfish, that he was the one I was afraid he could hurt him. <Quite a collection!> Tree weeks have passed and the harlequin doesn't seem interested in him instead, he comes near to were the little guy is and laid on the crush coral, and the little angel like start biting him, I assume that he is eating or searching for some parasites, but the harlequin seems to enjoy it. <Interesting observation. Some Pomacanthus angels are "cleaners" to a certain extent as juveniles....Not totally unusual, actually!> He is an aggressive eater, I am feeding formula2, flakes, brine shrimp and dry algae, the tang seems more interested in the algae, the flakes and the formula2, and the harlequin and the angel eat everything I feed them. <Great to hear!> I read that all angels need sponge, so I went to get one and they told me that sponge doesn't come in frozen food, that you have to put a live sponge in the water so that the angel can pick on it???? Is it true, and is the food that I am feeding enough for the dietary needs of the angel?? <You can get Ocean Nutrition's "Angel Formula", which has sponges in it.. I'd keep up with a nice mix of foods, just like you're doing> Thank you for your time, and advice. Juan Santos. <Always a pleasure, Juan! Glad to hear that the little guy is doing well!> P.S. These guy that get me the Cortez angel left me his telephone number and I said that if he ever had a Passer angel, he'd give me a call. He called me yesterday, and he brought me a beautiful 2" passer angel. He sold it to me for $10.00 dollars (he said just for the gas from Ensenada to Tijuana, because he had some business here, he his now in the hospital tank and he looks healthy and eating. <Excellent! Good person to know if you're into large angelfish!> He told me that he could get me any fish from the Baja Area, and in the mean time I wrote one of your articles of the "Three Amigos" Baja Angels, and the most beautifully one to my eyes was the clarion angel, <My favorite, too!> I asked this guy if he could get my one and he said that no problem, but those fish are not as common as the other two and he will charge me for it $50.00. <Wow! That's AMAZING!!!> Bob Fenner wrote that if you ever win the lottery, this is an excellent fish. I try to search for price information but I could find any. <It's very rare...and VERY expensive!> Just how expensive is these fish in the market, and is it an endangered species? <I have seen them offered for $1,200.00 USD, plus!> I don't want to get one if he is an endangered animal. <Not so much endangered...Just hard to collect and somewhat difficult to find, as they only come from one or two locales near Baja...> Thanks again.!!! <You're quite welcome! If you can get a healthy, ethically collected Clarion Angel for $50.00, consider yourself blessed! Good luck! Regards, Scott F> Question On Mexican Regulations Gents: <Howdy> Was wondering if I may ask you a question on the side (i.e. not posted in the forum of replies) ... I'm contemplating the purchase of a Clarion from a private hobbyist, which as you know is a pricey acquisition. My question is this ... do you know of any planned or potential changes in the export regulation of these fish which might affect their availability (and thus price) in the US market? <Mmm, well, as far as I'm aware, folks can now acquire permits to collect and export marines from Mexican waters. At least one outfit is doing so regularly from lower Baja... and there are a few Clarions to be had (more from further south and the Islas Revillagigedos)> Reason for asking is that a couple years ago I picked up a Bluespot jaw from a wholesaler for what I thought was a very good price, only to find the same fish selling retail for less at a local LFS two weeks later (BAD market timing!). As clarions are about 10 - 15 times more than Bluespots, I'd hate to relive that same experience. Anyways, as your team has had experience in that part of the world and seems to be dialed in pretty good to what's going on, any insight would be much appreciated. Best regards. <Our businesses were involved years back (before the ten year or so moratorium) in the collection, distribution of marines from the region... present circumstances: the distances, lack of air freight... all conspire to keep prices high. Bob Fenner> Re: Question On Mexican Regulations Bob, thanks for the prompt reply ..... understand there's no guarantees on future availability (or lack thereof), so I'm on my own. Appreciated your input as I'm just trying to define a reasonable price point, all things considered. Rgds. <The Clarion does have a limited distribution... have seen them brought in from Costa Rica and Panama... have you chatted with the folks over at Marine Center (.com)? They regularly deal with Robinson (Steve) in his Mexico collections of this and other species. Bob Fenner>
Clarion Angel pix Hi , I've just read with interest and enjoyment your feature on the Clarion angelfish. I am putting together an article on the Genus Holacanthus for a UK magazine called "Marine World". I would like some photos if possible and wondered where you sourced your from? Any reply would be greatly appreciated. <Umm, I shot them. underwater on location and aquariums. Bob Fenner> Best Regards, Steve Birchall Hybrid Passer/Clarion Video Steve- Hope this works @ Cortez's computer. Gresh <Neat. Bob F> http://www.createfate.com/ClarionAngel.exe Re: Mexican ban on collecting fish I thought there was. Why are there no clarions that come on down to the trade then? <Ahh, this I can answer, as our old co.s used to be involved in the collection, distribution of marines al sur (we are in California, U.S.A.). The only regular station in operation is in southern Baja (run by Steven Robinson), and not further south (as in the Islas Revillagigedos... Socorro, San Benedicto Islands...) where the Clarion is much more common. Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/holacanthus/clarionensis.htm A few specimens do get caught out of Baja... these are promptly shipped to the higher bidders, usually in the orient. You might contact the fine folks at the Marine Center (.com) re prospects of ordering one. Bob Fenner> Re: Clarion Angelfish Additional reply: Well I contacted themarinecenter.com about the Clarion Angelfish and wow, they are not completely unavailable, but the last one they had went for $2500.00 and they saw one recently at a wholesaler for $2800.00 and the big shocker is that this is the price for the fish WITHOUT a fully stocked reef tank package! <Ha! I remember when they were $300-500 wholesale <G>. Sheesh> For a country with economic problems, you would think Mexico would welcome the chance to have a reputable collecting operation over there. <Hmmm... some body has to front the tens of thousands of dollars to establish it though. A lot of bribes too with unreliable results> There's serious demand and they have the supply. Maybe El Nino will push a plethora of them into American Waters. If not, somebody needs to figure out how to breed and tank raise Clarions, <I hear you my brother. It would be cheaper for you to make a collecting vacation of it and catch you own. Well... close> maybe with a mega tank between piers for a real natural environment. That's the end of that for me unless my lucky numbers actually become lucky. <you could sell drugs to get the cash for one... or... Perhaps you could smuggle Cuban cigars in a body cavity on the way back to fund the purchase <G>> (But if that Mega tank idea pays off for anyone, they owe me a few Clarions!) Thanks again for the advice. Rich <my pleasure... and glad I don't smoke. Anthony> Clarion Angelfish Hello again! This will be a quick one ............... I've been searching the net and beyond for a Clarion Angelfish I may possibly find affordable, but haven't found any at all. <they are inherently expensive due to their geographic isolation/restrictions> On your FAQ page for Clarions, it seems my luck probably won't change in the near future unless you have some late breaking news. Next month, I'll be in Brazil (Inland unfortunately) and was wondering if I could possibly find one in a local Brazilian fish store (LBFS) and if I actually did, <do call ahead... perhaps special order> is there any issue Customs would have with someone bringing a bag of live fish back? <often fishes declared for personal use (important to use this verbiage) are of little concern. Still... talk to US customs for necessary forms you will need> (How do collectors arrange it?) If there is no Customs issue, <definitely a customs issue to some extent> what would be the best way to prepare it for 12 hours of travel? Rich <the fish needs to have been held and stable for several days (pref a week or more) at source. They cannot feed it for 36-48 hours prior. And packing the bags (triple bag or better) with pure oxygen will help. If you can carry the fish on board the plane in a mini cooler it will be even better. Best of luck... this in one fish that I admire more than most any. Kindly, Anthony><Not found in the tropical west Atlantic, off Brazil... read over the FAQs re this species on WWM: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/holacanthus/clarionensisfaqs.htm, contact Randy Walker of Marine Center re. Bob F> Clarion Angel I have a 4" Juv Clarion Angelfish for sale. It eats everything and allows me to "hand feed" it. Are you or do you know anyone interested? Can you recommend a site to advertise this fish for sale? <Mmm, I'd try the BB's... ours is the WetWebMedia.com Chatforum... there's a "for sale" area there. Link on the homepage of WWM proper. Bob Fenner> Trying to find a clarion angel fish Bob, My very last and 4th fish I want to add to me 240 gallon system . Is a large clarion angel fish from Mexico. Where can I get one? FFExpress, nor Marine Center never offers one. Thanks again <Actually, both/either can likely secure you a specimen. They are in touch with a source in Baja California. Do contact them. Bob Fenner> Linstun Lee Clarion angels bob, here's what FFExpress said about Clarion Angel fish, then how do I get one??? Dear Lee, Thank you for your inquiry. It is not possible to obtain a Clarion Angel fish from Baja Mexico within the legal limits since it is a protected species. If you have any further questions please feel free to contact us again at any time. Sincerely, Petra Talley <Mmm, have seen this species in the last couple of years... Contact Randy at Marine Center. I'll cc him here. Bob Fenner> Re: clarion angels Bob, Just talked over the phone with Randy at Marine Center. He told me that He could not get that fish, because of the restrictions. He told me that one wholesaler in LA had one and sold it for $2500 bucks and that's wholesale!. Bob if you can get me a nice 7 " specimen I'll do anything for you. If you ever come up to northern CA . I want to cook up a good meal for you. Remember I'm the guy with the Chinese rest. Thanks, <Yikes, for this sort of money, offer, I may take up collecting in Baja again! Be seeing you. Bob Fenner> Linstun Lee clarion angel bob, How much time/experience would you say it would take to catch about 10-15 of these beautiful fish. <On site? A couple of dives... with a standard fence net... some other simple catch, decompression gear> how often do you come upon juv.? <Years ago when I was in this part of the trade, almost non-seasonally in the Revillagigedos> I am extremely interested in starting up a regular collection of these beautiful fish in about 3 months I will make my first attempt on the clarion and would like to know your stories and get some advice. sincerely Michael <Do start the processes of securing collection permits in Mexico, import ones in the U.S.. Perhaps ask around and try to "run-into" or contact Steve Robinson when he's in the States. Bob Fenner> CLARION ANGEL DEAR BOB, MERRY CHRISTMAS & HAPPY NEW YEAR! <Thank you> Finally I have got my Christmas present - 2 pc.s. of Clarion Angel. As you know I have been hungered them for the whole 8 years time. Please update the estimation of the price because they cost me nearly US$5,000 each!!! (Cost of fish plus the air ticket / hotel... as I caught them in the pet shop personally) <Wowzah! For that sum of money I'd go with you to Baja and catch them.> However, big headache - although they are claimed to be schooling species, they are fighting each other!!! <Yes... only "schooling" or associating as young at certain times> Maybe they are too young (4-5 inches) or I am wrong for ordering 2 pc.s. but both of them are so bright and beautiful. <These are about "medium size"... we used to catch one to two inch individuals... and they can get to about 10-12 inches... We/I wouldn't collect any larger than what you have... don't do as well, adapting to captive conditions, being shipped...> In order to end the problems, I have an idea of selling one of them to your folks (non profit and not for re-trade at all). <Will post your offer on WWM> Anybody can contact with me at danny_summer@hotmail.com if interesting. My next goal is Clipperton Angel. Please advise if you can provide any good sources. <Contact the Marine Center, linked on WWM, and ask them. I have never seen one, but would like to haul out to Clipperton. Bob Fenner> Thanks with best regards, Danny :) Re: clarion angel (Psst, wanna buy a watch?) Clarions will be available legally would you be interested and if so how many would you be interested in ...if you are serious contact me John at 650 992 XXXX <Am not in the biz in this fashion... Is this someone in the industry related to Steve Robinson's efforts al sur? Bob Fenner> Looking for... Hello, I am a hobbyist that has been on a hunt for this fish for years and had no luck. Maybe you can point me in the right direction. If any info. is very appreciative. Thanks <This fish? Mmm, are we missing something? Bob Fenner> Re: Looking for (Clarion Angel) I am sorry for been ignorant. But it is the clarion angel adult. Thanks <Oh, this marine (Holacanthus clarionensis) is back in availability. Do know the fine folks at Marine Center do offer it. Here's my take on the species: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/clariona.htm Read this and the associated FAQs file (link at top in blue) and Marine Center's link is there on the top right shared border. Bob Fenner> Clarion Angelfish Hi Bob, My name is Dimitri and I am an avid marine aquarium hobbies. I have three 150 gallon tanks. I am wondering if you might know of someone or somewhere I can purchase a clarion angelfish. <Yes... this Holacanthus species is now being semi-regularly collected out of southern Baja waters (in small numbers)... and is shipped through a few Los Angeles marine livestock wholesalers. On the etailer side the fine folks at Marine Center (.com) have these available from time to time... I would contact them> If you have a phone number or a web address you can give me I would greatly appreciate it. I understand clarions may be quite expensive but I had pretty much every type of fish and I am looking for something new. Thanks again for any help you might be able to give me. Dimitri <You're welcome my friend. Please see "The Three Amigo Angels", "Fishwatcher's Guide to the Tropical Eastern Pacific"... areas on our site: www.WetWebMedia.com about this spectacular Angel. Bob Fenner> Bob's Tanks @home Question and Clarion$ Hello Bob, Two questions today. First, what kind of tanks do you keep at home. <We have a bunch of twenty gallon fun and experimental tanks in the house... and about four thousand gallons in a green house on the side... Nothing fancy or exotic... Old businesses were engaged in design, fabrication, install and maintenance of systems for decades... Do get to visit private, commercial, public installs all year long... so, like children, don't have any of my own, but enjoy other's...> I picture your house as having many huge tanks, stocked with the worlds rarest and most sought after fish. Second, what price should one expect for a Clarion Angel nowadays. <No rare fishes... Have collected thousands of Holacanthus clarionensis years back... Retail? I would guess closer to five hundred U.S. in the West>> I have spoken with one of your new sponsors, and have been quoted a price of $1000-2000, with no promise of actually obtaining one. This is FAR beyond my budget. FAR beyond. <Wowzah, mine too... better take a look into collecting al sur again...> I spoke to a fish store owner in San Fran, who told me he used to sell them for $150 before the moratorium. En breve, where can I get one, and how much will it cost (other than the aforementioned seller)? Thanx. -Josh <Hmm, think most everyone is receiving theirs from Steve Robinson's efforts in Baja this last year, and possibly solamente este anno... Through L.A. wholesalers... Bob Fenner> Clarion Angelfish (Holacanthus clarionensis) Mr. Fenner, I would like to know if there is still that ban you mentioned on importing the clarion from Mexico, and how do I get a hold of Phil Shane to acquire one for myself. <The ban was lifted on collecting in the amigo country a year or so back. Regular shipments have been coming out of there, and have seen Clarions in Europe, the Far East... A link to Quality Marine is on the pages of the same name on the site: www.wetwebmedia.com... Have your dealer (wholesale only) contact them or Sea Dwelling Creatures in Los Angeles.> One last thing could you E-mail me back with the response Thank you, any information you could offer me would be sincerely appreciated. Michael Camacho <You're welcome. Bob Fenner> Holocanthus clarionensis Can you tell me anything about the Holocanthus clarionensis? Will it coexist with an Asfur Angel (Arusetta Asfur) in a 125gallon tank which will be acquired in the near future? It might be a reef or just a FO w/LR, depending on my budget. And where can I go about to acquire one? and do you know how much they cost? I know they're infrequently encountered in the US. Thanks. <Indeed I can... used to be about the only source of this species... years back when you could legally collect/export/import them from Mexico. Both these angelfish species should do fine together... and a 125 is about the smallest I would try... with both the specimens starting at 1/2 adult size or less (five, six inches...). As yet, there are very few Clarions offered (Mexico is still closed... a few come out from nations a bit further south)... have your dealer/FFExpress search for them for you.... Most all make a bee-line for the big money markets of Asia (mainly Japan...). Thank you for asking. Bob Fenner, who has his H. clarionensis articles stored at www.wetwebmedia.com if you'd like more.> I wanted to offer some thanks for your contributions to the marine aquarium hobby. I have been a marine aquarist since I has six years old. Nonetheless nineteen years later, I am still enamored with the hobby. I have read many of your articles/literature and book and appreciate your "conscientious" approach to the hobby. Moreover, you have written a few things on a fish of particular interest to me - Clarion Angels. About two years ago, you wrote an article for FAMA about the fish. You mentioned that you had commercially collected/harvested the fish for the trade and that every now and then a few "stragglers" make it out of Baja. I think your last words were, "should you inherit or win the lottery, consider this fish." Do you have access to obtaining this fish? With your ties to the wholesale and collecting sides of the hobby, could you obtain the fish? What is the approximate market value for the fish? I am looking for a 3 1/2" specimen or smaller for my aquarium. I have a 10" specimen that I have had for about 7 years. I love the juvenile pattern of the fish and I want/need another. My favorite genus of fish is Holocanthus. I have H. limbaughi, H. africanus and H. clarionensis housed with numerous other "oddities" in a 4000 gallon aquarium. Hence, I wondering if you could steer me in the right direction as to how I can obtain another specimen. Much thanks, Michael Gonzales <Michael, thank you for your acknowledgement; it is indeed gratifying to realize my attempts at sharing are reaching the intended receivers. The Clarion Angel piece and its bibliography I have placed at the wetwebmedia.com site There is still a ban on collection, export of marines out of Mexican waters, but there are definite signs that this ridiculous hiatus may soon (within a year) be over. In the meanwhile, a few Clarions do make their way occasionally from the Tropical Eastern Pacific from a bit further south. Please have your dealer contact the larger marine livestock wholesalers located in Los Angeles (esp. Phil Shane's Quality Marine). I am not directly involved with any stations on this coast for the present, but will tell you that the Clarions I have seen are going for a few to several hundred dollars. You've picked out just about the right size for a good starter. That is quite a selection of Holacanthus and a whopper of a system! Are your other specimens so large that they have lost a great deal of their youthful beauty? I encourage you, take a few images, and write up your experiences with this group, and that humongous tank, and send all in as an article to the hobby magazines. Good luck on finding that Clarion. Bob Fenner>
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