|
FAQs on the Molly
Disease:
Treatments
Related Articles:
Mollies, &
Poeciliids: Guppies, Platies, Swordtails,
Mollies by Neale Monks, Livebearing
Fishes by Bob Fenner,
Related FAQs: Mollies
1, Mollies 2,
Molly Identification FAQs,
Molly Behavior FAQs,
Molly Compatibility FAQs,
Molly Selection FAQs,
Molly System FAQs,
FAQs on Molly Disease:
Molly Disease 1,
Molly Disease 2,
Molly Disease 3,
Molly Disease 4,
Molly Disease 5,
Molly Health 6,
Molly Health 7,
Molly Health 8, Molly Health ,
FAQs on Molly Disease by Category:
Environmental,
Nutritional (e.g. HLLE),
Social, Infectious (Virus, Bacterial, Fungal),
Parasitic (Ich, Velvet...),
Genetic,
FAQs on Molly Reproduction/Breeding:
Molly Reproduction
1, Molly Reproduction 2,
Molly Reproduction 3,
|
Again: Environmental issues kill off 90 some plus % of
mollies... CHECK your water quality!
Beware of toxic (bio. cycling killing) med.s and avoid
phony "Fixes" that do nothing positive.
|
Mollies dying; diag., trtmt.s f' 9/1/15
I apologize I hit send before checking my grammar and spelling, as I am
messaging from my phone...I will correct...
<Not a problem.>
Dear WWM Crew,
I noticed you had another person named Jace email you back in March of 2011 with
similar issue that has not been solved and was wondering if you have any more
insight now that some time has passed... I had 2 white mollies, 2 black mollies,
1 orange balloon sailfin molly and 1 gold panda molly in a 20 gallon cycled tank
(fish purchased approx. 1 month ago), frequent water changes done (25-40% per
wk),with regular testing, 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and 5 nitrates (no spikes during
this recent time) the mollies came from brackish water so I have kept this
environment for them.
<Can you tell me how much salt you're adding? Brackish water suitable for
Mollies would be something like 5 gram/litre (0.65 oz/US gallon). That gets you
a specific gravity of 1.002 at 25 C/77 F. You can use digital scales at home to
work out how much you'd want to add per bucket. For a 3 gallon bucket for
example, that'd be 3 x 0.65 = 1.95, close enough to 2, oz per bucket. Make
sense? Once you've measured it out you can use teaspoons and see how many
teaspoons there are in that quantity of salt. It's about 5 teaspoons per 1 oz of
salt, more or less, so we're talking about 2 x 5 =10 teaspoons per 3 gallon
bucket. With me so far? Mollies will actually do even better at higher
salinities, and even doubling this amount of salt
could be worthwhile if your aquarium is just Mollies and plastic
plants/ornaments (real plants and most other fish won't be so keen).>
Anyhow, first I noticed definite Ich symptoms - as the black mollies, orange
molly and panda molly were COVERED in white dots like salt grains (couldn't
quite see any on the white mollies). I raised the temp to 86 degrees to speed up
life cycle and increased the salt in the water to 3tsp per gallon
<3 x 6 gram per US gallon... 18 gram/US gallon... 18 gram/3.8 litres... 4.7
gram/litre... yes, that should certainly kill of Whitespot and Velvet.>
when white spots disappeared to kill the ich the natural way (without meds)...
<Salt is a medication... in some situations far more harmful than, say,
antibiotics.>
Now, before the white spots disappeared, 1 white molly's tail fin just
disappeared (frayed down the body) and then back half of her body started to
look fuzzy and she just kept spiraling around tank so I euthanized her.
The next day, the 2nd white molly's mouth was swollen open & just started
crashing in to the gravel upside down, gills heaving and could not move so I
euthanized her also.
<Not good.>
A few days later, the orange balloon molly's lips looked the same, she crashed
and died just like the white molly! So, I assumed the Ich overtook the fish
because this all occurred before the white spots fell off any of the fish and
the other fish were COVERED in salt grains so it just made sense.
<Possibly, but I'd be wondering if Velvet or even Costia is the issue here.
Costia is the old name for Ichthyobodo, and you'll see both names in aquarium
books, though Costia (or "Slime Disease") are more often seen on medications. In
any event, like Whitespot we're talking about a microscopic protozoan that
latches onto the skin of the fish and causes damage. Costia does seem to become
more lethal more quickly than Whitespot or Velvet.
Commonest symptom is the appearance of off-white patches (rather than the
discrete salt grains of Whitespot or icing sugar/golden sheen of Velvet).
It's more difficult to treat than Whitespot, though some medications will treat
both. Brackish water works well against it though, as do 2-20 minute seawater
dips (35 gram/litre). Mollies tolerate seawater dips extremely well, so this is
a useful approach. I'm mentioning Costia here because it's a bit of plague among
Mollies, notoriously obvious on Black Mollies because of their colour, often as
greyish patches on the face and flanks.>
So after a couple days of raising the heat slowly, the white spots all
disappeared and I started the salt treatment (to kill the free floating Ich),
when all of the sudden (now this is when it gets exactly the same as the email
you received in 2011 that I found on your site from Jace that had no resolution
or real answer) the 2 black mollies started hanging around the filter intake and
the heater near the surface (but not gasping), with their tails down as if their
tails were paralyzed (drooping) and if they swam under the waterfall from the
filter,
<This is the famous "Shimmies" when Mollies are stressed and unable to swim
properly. It's called the Shimmies because initially the Mollies rock from side
to side as they tread water, as if shimmying.>
they were forced into somersaults uncontrollably but then would buoy back up to
the surface, tail down again. I also noticed their bowel movements were a long,
clearish-white hair-like string (with intermittent white beads every so often).
<Interesting. Copious white faeces indicate excess mucous in the gut, which in
turn often points towards parasitic infections, most notoriously, Hexamita.>
The next day, one black molly started crashing nose down into the gravel and
could not swim or right itself (just as the white ones!) He stopped breathing
and I noticed its anus was extremely white. Now the other black molly is still
hanging near the surface with her tail down, obviously about to suffer the same
fate! The only other one left is the gold panda molly and she seems fine! Again
no parameters changed drastically ever during this time, and the only
identifiable problem I saw was the Ich, but, as I said, it cleared up before
these last 2 started crashing and they started displaying these unidentifiable
symptoms that even your site said were strange (back in 2011)...so, I'm
wondering if anyone has any ideas?
Any new knowledge on this? Could it be Ich AND something else?
<Easily. Whitespot/Ick is pretty much ubiquitous, but it's so easy to treat in
its early stages it shouldn't ever be lethal. But it's also easy for fish to
pick up other infections, and among livebearing fish, Camallanus worms, Hexamita
infections, and something called Tetrahymena are all worth thinking about.
Hexamita is treated by using Metronidazole, and is discussed elsewhere on WWM;
use the Google search facility on the top of each page and you shouldn't have
any trouble finding out about Metronidazole (often used alongside an
antibiotic). Now, Tetrahymena is something less widely discussed. It is
sometimes known as Guppy Disease.
Superficially similar to Whitespot in terms of symptoms but far more immediately
lethal. To save me rewriting a bunch of stuff about this disease, let me direct
you to a piece about this disease I wrote over at FishChannel:
http://www.fishchannel.com/fish-health/freshwater-conditions/guppy-disease-tetrahymena.aspx
The bottom line is that there are no effective cures, though a combination of
anti-protozoan medication (Metronidazole for example) alongside elevated
salinity (the higher, the better) may help.>
I forgot to mention all the fish were purchased together and introduced to the
cycled tank at the same time (which I would never do again obviously!)
But I am very curious what this is and what to do now? I don't want to proceed
ignorantly and subject any more fish to whatever this issue was!
Please help as I cannot bear to lose any more or have to euthanize; I am an avid
animal lover and it's breaking my heart!!
Thank you!
Kendra
<Hope this helps. Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Mollies dying 9/2/15
Thank you so much, I will look into all of this information!
<Glad to help and good luck. Neale.>
|
Sick Molly? 10/25/11
Sick Molly? (RMF, anything to
add/refute?)<<Nope>>
Hi WWM Crew,
I'm new to the hobby, and at a complete loss. I've
Googled as much as humanly possible, but lacking the proper
terminology can make things tricky. I believe my Molly may be
sick -- perhaps constipation, dropsy or a tumor?
First, I'll start with the (hopefully) relevant
parameters:
Aquarium: 29 Gallons
Filter: Rena Filstar XP3 w/ 2L Ehfisubstrat Pro
PH: ~8.0
Ammonia[*]: <0.25 ppm
Nitrite: 0 ppm
Nitrate: <5 ppm
Temp: 27 C
Salinity: ~1.004 sg
<Sounds a good aquarium for Mollies. While ammonia is toxic,
even at slight concentrations, Mollies don't seem
particularly sensitive to ammonia when maintained in brackish or
marine conditions, hence their (largely historic) usage in
maturing new marine tanks before true marine species are
added.>
[*] We triggered what I believe to be a mini-cycle last weekend
when we added three new tankmates to the aquarium. Previously,
the tank was fishless cycled using bottled ammonia (4 ppm per
day) until the ammonia and nitrite levels dropped to zero and
nitrates were present. We then completed a ~75% water change to
lower the nitrates. The first three fish were then added, and I
checked the parameters daily. Now that we experience nonzero
ammonia, we change about 25-40% of the water daily until the
ammonia drops below 0.25 ppm, with one exception: an Ick
treatment** (the new tankmates came with friends!) where I could
only change the water every other day. During this, I dosed the
tank daily with Prime to detoxify any ammonia.
** API Super Ick Cure Liquid
Presently, there are six Mollies inhabiting the tank. Only one
shows signs of this sickness so far. The first thing we tried was
to administer the correct dosage of ParaGuard -- which, according
to the info, appeared to be a cure-all for the inexperienced like
us (antibacterial, anti-parasite, fungicide, etc.). It did not
appear to help.
<Indeed. While Paraguard is a good medication, it won't
cure everything, and is primarily useful for treating external
bacteria, parasites and fungi. It will be of little to no value
when treating internal ("systemic") infections. There
are essentially two sorts of medicines in the world.
Those that kill pathogens on the outside of the fish, and so work
best added to the water *and* dosed to the size of the aquarium;
and those that kill pathogens inside the fish, and these work
best when administered via food or injections *and* dosed for the
size (weight) of the fish. There's little overlap between the
two, and on the whole, aquarists can expect good results from the
external medicines because dosing to the size of the tank is
easy. Medicines that treat internal infections are much, MUCH
less reliable because aquarists can't judge the right dose,
and a one-size-fits-all approach simply doesn't work. When
fish are sick with something systemic, it really makes a HUGE
difference getting a vet
involved because a vet can judge the right amount of medicine for
the size of the fish, and if necessary, inject that dose into the
fish. The worst situation is treating an internal infection with
a medicine that is dosed by the size of the tank -- this is
unlikely to be the right dose for a fish of given size -- imagine
an Oscar and a Neon both in 50 gallon hospital tanks -- which
would need more medicine?>
The Molly in question has a bulge behind her right gill, which is
increasing in size. Her scales in this area are also beginning to
protrude. Thinking it was constipation, we have been feeding the
fish peas and spinach for the past two days (they generally get
spirulina wafers twice daily*, and livebearer flakes once daily**
with random greenery substitutions throughout the week). This
Molly maintains her appetite, and
does poop, if not as much as some of her tankmates.
* Nutrafin Max Spirulina Meal Tablets
** Nutrafin Max Livebearer Flakes + Freeze Dried Tubifex Worms
However, during non-feeding time, she is somewhat active, but
appears to "gulp" constantly as if she was trying to
eat or breathe and generally hangs out near the middle-to-bottom
of the tank. The gulping is really nonstop.
Sometimes, she swims almost 90 degrees vertical, triggered when
the other fish pass by.
Thank you for your help!
-Mike
PS: Pictures attached. Sorry for the quality, they tend to be
fast little buggers! :)
<Mollies are of variable quality these days, and systemic
infections that cause bloating and dropsy are common. Maintaining
them properly helps prevent problems, but once the bacteria or
Protozoans multiply sufficiently to cause severe stress, like
this poor chap, then there's little you can.
One possibility is Camallanus worms, these are common among
livebearers.
But they're distinctive in revealing themselves as little red
threads at the anus; have you seen any of these? Shimmies is
another common problem, and apparently neurological. It tends to
be untreatable directly, but goes away when Mollies are moved
into the right environmental conditions. My gut feeling here is
that this Molly has something like a Mycobacteria infection, and
even with veterinarian help, it would be unlikely to recover.
I've seen this from time to time with livebearers, including
my own, and tends to happen when fish are past middle age and,
crucially, I haven't given them the very best care, so the
tank is overstocked, oxygenation is a bit low, the water
hasn't been changed much, or summertime temperatures have
been excessively high. Euthanasia is usually the best step
forward.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/euthanasia.htm
Cheers, Neale.>
|
|
|
|
Re: Sick Molly? (RMF, anything to add/refute?)
<<Nothing>> 10/27/11
Hi Neale,
Thanks so much for the prompt and informative reply.
<Glad to help.>
I took the sick molly to a vet after work today, and he
confirmed your suspicions -- Mycobacteria -- and
euthanized the fish for us.
<Too bad. Sadly not uncommon with this species, and
livebearers in general (esp. Platies and Guppies).>
I wish we could have done more, but I think it was the humane
choice?
<No question at all. With fish, there's often a very
narrow period of time during which you can treat successfully,
especially with small fish. Often a few days. If you miss that
window of opportunity, your best bet is often to euthanise the
fish, then go back to the aquarium and see what the problem might
have been. Fix them, then let the tank settle for at least 4
weeks before you add any more fish.>
We had purchased this particular fish three days ago, so it was
suggested that it was probably ill before we even got it
home.
<Oh, I agree. Mycobacteria infections take longer than 3 days
to get to this point. They likely incubate for a few weeks before
overwhelming the fish's immune system.>
I realize that you are likely busy with other aquatic crises, but
if you have the time, could you verify that we are raising them
in as close-to-ideal conditions as possible?
<Are you talking about Mollies? The key things are water
chemistry and water quality. Water chemistry needs to be hard and
alkaline, the harder the better. If you're just keeping
Mollies -- the ideal situation -- then try using the Rift Valley
salt mix described in the article below. Even at half the dose,
you should find life a lot easier.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/fwh2oquality.htm
At full dose, you will have to limit tankmates to hard water
species, so you might decide to go with brackish conditions
instead, adding anything between 6-9 grammes of marine salt mix
per litre, the lower end if you have live plants. In such
conditions you can add brackish tankmates such as Knight Gobies
or Violet Gobies. Next up, water quality. Ammonia and nitrite
must be zero, and nitrate as close to zero as possible, less than
20 mg/l certainly. In brackish water, the presence of salt
actually makes nitrite and nitrate less toxic, so this issue
isn't quite so critical. In short, your aquarium seems about
right to me, and if your Mollies are otherwise healthy, I'd
put this death down to bad luck. Wait, see what happens, and
don't add anything else for a month.>
Being newbies, we purchased and configured everything as
described on WWM; the "truth about mollies" article you
wrote was particularly informative!
Truly appreciated,
-Mike
<Mollies are lovely fish, and once established, easily justify
the extra care they need. Do keep your eyes peeled for Giant
Sailfin Mollies. The males comfortably fill a man's hand, and
the females can reach 15 cm/6 inches! There's also Liberty
Mollies, some of the prettiest fish in the hobby, and actually
quite hardy, but sadly also rather nippy, so best kept as a
single-species set-up. Cheers, Neale.>
|
Sick Balloon Molly
11/25/08
Hi there, I wrote to you a little while ago and I think you probably
saved my fishes, I'm just hoping you're able to do the same
again!
I have a 90L tank with 2 female mollies, 5 guppies, and about 20 Molly
fry.
About 2 weeks back I noticed that my Dalmatian balloon molly was acting
a little subdued, hiding and not swimming about much. I checked the
levels and the nitrites were high, I sorted those out and she seemed to
go back to normal. I've recently noticed all of the fish (including
the fry) scraping themselves on everything solid in the tank, but none
had any outward signs of parasites. I went out and bought Sterazin Gill
and Body Flukes treatment, and have been using the recommended dose.
After 2 doses, I have come home to find my Dalmatian molly, pointing
downwards, trapped between a plant and the wall. I thought she was dead
but noticed she was still breathing. After bringing a net close to her,
she swum off but has looked very ill since. Her stability seems
severely affected, she's floating all over the place, just moving
with the flow of the water, seemingly unable to control her movements,
and bashing into things. She's often completely vertical, either
pointing either up or down. Occasionally she'll come to rest in a
plant upside down, and stay there motionless until I get scared and
make her move. What's wrong with her? Do you think that I can save
her? And should I stop the fluke treatment? Thanks for you help
<Sterazin is a medication that has been around for years. It is
generally well regarded, and I'd be surprised if it was causing ill
health, assuming it was used correctly. Do check you dosed the tank
correctly: all medications are poisons, and the "art" is
using them in the right amounts.
When measuring out the dose, it's important not to overdose.
It's also a good idea to increase aeration when treating, because
sometimes these medications cause the amount of oxygen in the water to
drop. Also you have to remember to remove carbon from the filter; if
you don't, the medication gets sucked up by the filter without
doing its job. In any case, the thing with Mollies is that it is
extremely difficult to separate actual diseases from the fact they
almost never do well in plain freshwater conditions. I'd insist
they be kept in brackish water conditions, at least SG 1.003 (about 6
grammes marine salt mix per litre). It's remarkable how many sick
Mollies pep up when kept in brackish water conditions. The
"treading water" behaviour often seen with Mollies is called
the Shimmies, and is particularly common in tanks where Mollies are
kept in freshwater. And no, adding a teaspoon of tonic salt per gallon
doesn't make an aquarium brackish! Besides salinity, nitrate is
highly toxic to Mollies, as are rapid pH changes, so these are two
factors to review. Since Mollies and Guppies both do extremely well in
brackish water, adding marine salt mix is the cheap and easy way to
keep them in good health. Cheers, Neale.>
|
Bloated Molly/Possible Compatibility Issues...
FW env. dis... reading -- 1/26/08 HI WWM, I've read
tons of info on your site over the last few weeks and now have a
problem of my own. I'd keep researching but I feel like time
is ticking for one of our Mollies. We set up a 55 gal. tank
approx. 1 month ago. <Is it cycled?> All of the water
parameters are all in ideal range, with 0 nitrites, 0 ammonia,
<Were there ever?> neutral pH, hard water, high alkalinity,
82 degrees F. <A bit warm for the livebearers...> No air
pump, but we do have the filter that looks like a double
waterfall as the water is pumped back into the tank (I wish I
knew what it was called, I feel very stupid right now.) <No
worries. Your description is useful> I leave it running during
water changes in order to allow for aeration of the new/old water
for that brief period of time. Not sure if it's at all
effective, but I feel like it might be. Is it? <Should be>
Should we add an air pump to the setup? <Some redundant
circulation, aeration is a very good idea> In the tank we
have: 5 Mollies (3 Golden Lyretail, 2 Dalmatian) 6 Guppies 1
Bamboo Shrimp 1 4.5" Elephant Nose <Mmm... you need to do
a bit of researching here... the Mollies are brackish animals...
some of the livestock "likes" hard/alkaline water,
others soft/acidic...> So far we've been doing about 30%
water changes and vacuuming gravel weekly... with the exception
of 2 days ago when I dropped the entire container of food into
the tank and immediately vacuumed it all out and took about %75
of the water with it. <Yikes!> All the water was replaced
immediately, all water params were still stable afterwards as I
check everyday (I worry a lot.. :). I just did the first filter
change today, only changing one of the cartridges in order to
keep some of the bacteria the other side was holding onto. <Ah
good> Plan to change the other one in about 2 weeks, maybe
earlier. <Ditto> We're very very inexperienced in
keeping fish, which is why we chose what we were told are very
"hardy" species. <Mmmm... I'd be reading...
doing independent assessments here. Compatibility is not such an
issue with this mix, as the fact that there are different/varying
"water types" of freshwater environments on this
planet... and the life there not of infinite tolerance/range>
In addition, up until now I never questioned our fishes'
compatibility just because I felt like I'd researched enough
and gotten every employee at the local petstore's opinions on
the compatibility of these fish before we purchased any of them.
<... Live and. hopefully, learn> So now we've got a
problem. Last week I noticed one of our Dalmatian mollies (we
used to have 3 of them) was hanging out at the top of the tank
and being a lot less active than he had been previously. <...
here it comes> Upon closer inspection I discovered a bulging
eye, a mouth that was stuck hanging open, and torn fins. Clearly
he'd been attacked by another fish, but by who? <Whom? Not
necessarily "anyone"> Do you think it was an issue
of Molly on Molly violence? <Can only hazard a guess, but
likely "simple" environmental disease...> Do you
think the Elephant Nose is capable of killing a Molly? <Mmm,
not likely> (We expected the EN to be territorial, and
he's got 2 great places to hide during the day, but he
prefers to swim through them occasionally and spends the rest of
his time bullying the fish. He'll calm down occasionally, but
usually not for long. We feed him frozen bloodworms, which the
Mollies seem to enjoy, so not sure if he's territorial with
food? He's like this at all times, not just feeding time.)
Anyway, that Molly ended up dying within 2 days of when I noticed
his problems. <The others will soon be gone as well> And
today I came home to discover another one of the Dalmatian
Mollies staying at the top of the tank and being a lot less
active than is typical of them. Went up for a closer look and
discovered severe bloating in his abdomen, so much so that his
scales are already sticking out. I'm certain this developed
overnight since I usually watch them when they eat to make sure
there's no leftovers left to sink. <...> So I read as
many articles as I have time for today about adding aquarium salt
for the Mollies (we have a 55 gallon, so for now I'll just
add 2 tbsp., enough for 10 gallons.. <Uhhh....> and ease
into the recommended amount for all 55 gallons in order to avoid
a drastic change.) Every article I've seen says that salt is
OK for the Mollies, some say it's OK for guppies, some say
it's not. <Is okay for the Poecilia> I haven't seen
anything about how well the Elephant Nose and Bamboo Shrimp will
tolerate aquarium salt at the rate of 1 tbsp./5 gal. if they will
tolerate it at all! <They don't "like it" one
bit> So what do I do now? <Mmm, at least two systems if you
want to keep these species> At the moment we have nothing set
up to isolate the bloated Molly... very very very hopeful that
it's not dropsy and will not affect the other fish. I read
that it could be constipation and to feed a shelled, frozen pea,
but right now he's not at all interested in the regular flake
food and doubt that he'd pay a pea second thought.
<...> Do you have any suggestions for me? Should I add the
salt? Add no salt? Add some, but not as much as recommended? Do
any of the species need to separated to stay in freshwater and
turn the tank we have no into a brackish tank? I don't know
what to do! <Read, decide for yourself... You have two very
different, incompatible mixes of "water type" species
here... one cooler water...> I'd appreciate any advice you
could give me regarding what/how we should handle these issues
and thank you for your time! (If you've made it this far, I
know I've taken up a good amount of it.) Thanks again! -CM
<The "Systems" of all these species are gone over on
our site... as are their foods, compatibility... and unlike your
LFS, we're not charging you for this information. Lucky you!
Bob Fenner>
Re: Bloated Molly/Possible Compatibility
Issues 1/28/08 Thanks so much for your quick
reply. So should we keep the mollies and guppies together and
invest in a new setup geared towards the elephant nose and bamboo
shrimp? <Yes. Elephantnoses need very specific aquaria:
largish, sand substrate, lots of floating plants, no fish likely
to compete for food. Bamboo shrimps should be fine with
Elephantnoses.> Also, the Molly ended up dying that same
night. We quarantined it that afternoon, treated the water with
Melafix (as per the LFS suggestions) and overnight he passed
away. <Melafix is not all that good really. It's cheap,
which is why it sells well; but it isn't terribly effective,
and you're much better off using stuff that's been tested
in labs.> We also treated the main tank with melafix in order
to get rid of anything else that might be lurking in it. We
don't want anyone else to develop anything else.
<Doesn't work this way. Think about it: if tea-tree oil
really was a medication that got rid of everything nasty,
wouldn't doctors and nurses use it for everything? But they
don't, because it doesn't. Besides, disease in aquaria is
directly related to [a] quarantining and [b] water quality. To
keep all your fish healthy, you need to concentrate on these two
aspects. The direct parallel is with human health. Is it having a
cabinet of drugs that keeps you healthy, or clean water and safe
food?> Now the water is cloudy. We added aeration and the EN
seems to have calmed down a lot because of it. Do they need water
flowing over their gills continuously in order to breathe? <No
this isn't how it works. Fish ventilate the gill cavity using
muscles, and basically draw water in through the mouth in a way
analogous to how we breathe air.> Is that why he would never
calm down before? <No.> What can we do about the cloudy
water? <Water changes, time, replace the mechanical filtration
(usually filter floss) part of your filter.> Is it because of
the Melafix? <Unlikely.> The bottle says nothing about it.
Or is it because of the aeration? <No.> The removal of the
carbon from the filter, maybe? <Carbon serves no particular
function in a properly maintained freshwater aquarium, so the
lack of it shouldn't matter. In any case, carbon removes
dissolved organic materials, the stuff that makes old water
yellow and acidic. It has zero effect on silt.> So many
questions... so little time. <Hence we tell people to read
books first, buy fish second.> Thanks for your help! -CM
<Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Bloated Molly/Possible Compatibility Issues
1/28/08 So how should we go about treating the water to make
sure whatever bacteria gave the first molly dropsy isn't
going to affect the remaining 4 mollies and 6 guppies? <Let me
make this crystal clear: you can't. The bacteria that cause
systemic and Finrot infections in fish are in the aquarium
anyway. They're things like Aeromonas spp., which mostly sit
around breaking down organic materials. They're the
equivalent of E. coli bacteria on your body. In and around your
colon, they don't do any harm, and perhaps some good. They
only become problematic when they get into the wrong part of your
body and, for whatever reason, your immune system can't deal
with them. Ditto the Aeromonas bacteria in the aquarium. They
become a problem when fish have been damaged (e.g., fin-nipped)
and/or exposed to ammonia/nitrite (because this suppresses their
immune system). In other words, if your aquarium is stable and
the water quality good and the fish all happily swimming about...
Finrot and Dropsy don't happen! Simple as that.> I know
how important water changes are which is why we've done them
at the rate of at least 30% every week since we've gotten the
aquarium. In the first email I mentioned the spilled bottle of
food in the tank, after which we vacuumed all that we could,
taking 70% or so of the water with it, and then replacing all of
that water. This was last Thursday, so the water in there now is
OK, I'd imagine. PH is fine, temp at 78 now, nitrate and
nitrite are at ideal levels, if not climbing slightly over the
past few days. <OK, you've lost me here. Nitrate is one
thing, and will indeed rise slightly over time. It goes up in
between water changes, and then drops down when you dilute the
nitrate with a water change. Simple enough. Nitrite is something
else though: the filter should be removing it in real time. In a
properly run tank, there is zero nitrite, all the time. If you
ever detect any, you have a problem -- either overfeeding,
under-filtering, or overstocking.> alkalinity is high. Should
I be changing the water more often than I already do? <25-50%
per week is adequate. The more the better.> Also, two of our
mollies are very pregnant, obviously not something we're
ready to house. Since we can't keep them, and none of the
petstores want them, several people have mentioned adding barbs
to the tank. I hate that it's coming down to this, but will
the barbs be compatible with the older mollies and guppies (and
shrimp and elephant nose until we buy them a new home)?
<Depends on the barbs. Not all barbs are good community fish.
Puntius tetrazona (sold as Tiger Barbs, Moss Barbs, Albino Barbs,
and others) is most certainly not compatible with your fish. It
is a notorious fin-nipper, and unless kept in a big group (six or
more specimens) tends to be belligerent towards other fish.
Puntius pentazona, on the other hand, is a nice little fish. A
few barbs live in brackish water, such as Puntius ticto, so could
be kept with Mollies and Guppies in a low-end brackish system.
Among the other barbs in the trade are subtropical species
(Puntius conchonius) and bloody great big barbs (Barbonymus
schwanenfeldii), so research the barbs on offer, and act
accordingly.> Also, since diseases are directly related to
quarantining and water quality, and no new fish had recently been
added and the water quality is good (we're new at this, but
like I asked before, aren't the water changes we're doing
now more than sufficient?) what else could have caused the Molly
to get dropsy? <I do get bored saying this, but the problem
with Mollies is that they just aren't easy to keep. They are
reared in brackish-water ponds on fish farms, and while in theory
they can be kept in freshwater (and certainly are freshwater fish
in the wild) in freshwater aquaria they just don't seem to do
well. The reasons aren't at all clear to me, but genetics may
be part of the story: Mollies are hybrid fish, and at least some
of their ancestors were brackish water fish. But
nitrate-intolerance may be the bigger factor. Unlike most other
freshwater fish, Mollies do not tolerate nitrate well. Salt
reduces the toxicity of nitrate, so the more saline the water,
the less delicate the Mollies become. In brackish water, and
especially marine conditions, Mollies are an order of magnitude
easier to keep.> What else can we do to prevent it?
<Quarantine new stock, choose livestock appropriate to your
ambient water chemistry, be critical about your level of
experience and choose hardy species first, and more delicate
things later on.> Thanks for your time. -CM Also... when I try
to research these things I find so many contradictory opinions
from different sources. Is there an EXCELLENT book you could
recommend to me on keeping a freshwater tropical aquarium?
I'm ready to just accept one person's opinion, just want
to make sure that the book I buy is written by a reliable
source.. and who better to ask for recommendations than WWM?
<Ah, there are many, MANY good books. Picking one is
difficult. But if there is one book I think every freshwater
aquarist should have, that book would be 'The Interpet Manual
of Fish Health' by Andrews, Exell, and Carrington. It's
bee reprinted many times, and 2nd hand copies are easy to buy
cheaply online. Why do I like this book? It isn't about
species of fish, but about water quality, water chemistry, diet,
disease, and all those things you need to understand if you want
to avoid problems. It has got lots of diagrams and pictures, as
well as very useful sections that help you diagnose problems and
determine the best solutions. The second book -- practically my
bible -- is 'Baensch's Aquarium Atlas', possibly the
best encyclopaedia of freshwater fish. While there are other
(often very good) multi-species guides on the market, this is the
one I like the most. Now runs into many volumes, but Volume 1 is
the one to start with, and it covers not just fish but also
plants, diseases, water chemistry, etc. The 'Fish Health'
book is a better and easier read on healthcare and water
chemistry topics, but 'Baensch' covers the basics. Both
of these books will last you a lifetime. Cheers, Neale.>
|
Velvet and a pregnant molly, copper FW
trtmt. 2/28/07 I love your website and refer to it often when
I have questions or more often just looking for entertainment. It has
been a great resource over the years. Thanks for all the time put into
making such a great information source. <Welcome!> I recently
added a new silver lyretail molly to my community aquarium, but two
days later it started to show signs of velvet and died pretty quickly.
I didn't quarantine this fish (stupid, I know), and it spread to
several other fish, including all of the mollies and swordtails. I
removed my live plants and added CopperSafe by Mardel, and am keeping
the tank well oxygenated with a air pump since the plants are no longer
there to do this. I am also doing partial water changes (about 15%)
every other day to keep nitrate levels down as the plants (again) are
no longer there to take care of this. I also have one tablespoon of
aquarium salt for every 5 gallons of water and have raised the
temperature of the tank to 84 degrees. <All good moves...> One of
my black mollies is pregnant, and I expect her to give birth within a
day or two, but I know mollies often do not release their babies under
stressful conditions. As she is so far into her pregnancy I have been
reluctant to move her to another tank, but I am worried the stress in
this tank could be enough to keep her from releasing the fry anyway. I
am not terribly concerned about the fry surviving at this point, I just
want to give the mother the best possible chance. Do you have any
suggestions? It is a fully cycled tank that has been set up for about
14 years, with ammonia and nitrites both at 0 and nitrates at between 5
and 10 ppm. The other fish in the tank currently are two dwarf gouramis
and a small pleco. Beth <... Really... to continue doing what
you're doing... maybe with (you're likely doing this but
didn't mention it) testing for ammonia... A test kit for FW copper
use would also be a good idea... as with all such treatments, should
the effective/concentration drop too low... and this happens very
easily in established systems... mulm/other absorption... there is no
treatment. Bob Fenner>
My Mollies... hlth. - 02/15/07
<<Hello, Ashley.>> Thank you very much for the
reply. <<You're quite welcome.>> The tables have turned
now and Lancelot (male Dalmatian) is now chasing Vivian (female
Dalmatian) around like crazy. He seems to be head butting her and they
often run into the glass in their pursuit, I'm worried this may be
hurting them, but I'm unsure as to what to do about it. <<A
bigger tank? Actually, it's not likely that this type of
'crashing' will be harmful. What might be a problem is that
she's the only one he's got to chase. A couple of more female
Dalmatians, tank size notwithstanding, would 'dilute' his
attentions somewhat'¦unless Vivian's a real hottie.
Nothing we can do about that! :) >> I also have a question about
salting my tank. After I add the salt how often do I have to add more,
and how much. Also, will using table salt work as a temporary means
until I can get to the pet store? I checked the pet aisle at the
grocery story but they didn't have any and it will be a couple
weeks before I can get to the pet store again as I'm going on a
vacation next week and I don't have my own car to drive it all the
way to the pet store (that's generally my boyfriend's job). If
not, will they be okay until I can get the proper aquarium
salt? <<Second question first, Ashley. The grocery does have the
'equivalent' in the form of Kosher salt. Will work just as well
as aquarium salt since it doesn't contain iodine or anti-caking
ingredients. (There are varying theories on the use of regular table
salt. Some recommend avoiding it like the plague. Others state that it
works perfectly well as a maintenance-level additive. Personally, I
don't recommend it's use in aquariums. Kosher salt is fine,
however.) Now, the first question. You should add more with water
changes. How much you add will take a bit of minor calculation. Salt
does not evaporate with water so any 'topping off' of the tank
due to evaporation will put the salt-to-water ratio back where you want
it without adding more salt. (The 'flip-side' is that the
solution, salt-wise, becomes stronger due to evaporation so you'll
want to bear this in mind.) When you physically remove water from the
tank, you do, in fact, remove salt with the water. In other words, if
you've added one tablespoon of salt to your 10-gallon tank and
remove five gallons of water, you'll have to add one-half
tablespoon of salt to the new water to bring the ratio back to one
tablespoon per 10 gallons. More realistic? Let's look at a 20%
change (more appropriate anyway). You'll have removed one-fifth of
a tablespoon of salt with the water so you'll have to add one-fifth
of a tablespoon to the new water to bring the ratio back to normal,
i.e. one tablespoon per 10 gallons.>> Kinda sucks about not being
able to sex angelfish, but oh well, I say she's a girl, so she is.
It's unlikely that I'll get another angel anyway. <<A
flip of a coin says that you're right.>> Thanks a bunch for
your advice. Ashley <<Happy to help, Ashley. Tom>> PS: Your
site is absolutely great and it has so many important tidbits of
information. <<We've got a heck of Crew here,
Ashley.>>
Re: My Mollies... hlth. -
02/15/07 Oh, boy, me again. <<And it's me again, too,
Ashley.>> I've got another question that may sound strange
even though you haven't gotten back to me from my last email yet.
<<Sorry. A certain Yellow Lab puppy seems to think the world
revolves around her lately. :) >> I've been watching my
mollies for a while (they're so entertaining and I wanted to keep
an eye on my male to make sure he wasn't being a bully). So as I
was watching I noticed that my female Dalmatian doesn't swim like
the others. She's more erratic and seems to constantly be in motion
and when she swims her head moves as well as the rest of the body. I
noticed the other two managed to keep their heads mostly still when
swimming. At first I remembered something mention in the FAQ's
called shimmers or something like that so I searched back through and
when I found it the symptoms didn't sound the same. So I compared
the anatomy between the f. Dalmatian and my f. Creamsicle and
discovered that the Dalmatian is missing a fin! The entire fin that
goes along the back of the fish (dorsal? ventral? I don't know the
correct terminology) is gone. I haven't noticed this before, and as
I've only had them for three days I don't know if she came that
way or if she lost it to the male or if it was a birth defect (I hear
that there's a lot of inbreeding). Will the fin grow back or will
she be deformed for the rest of her life. <<Double check for the
'dorsal' fin, Ashley. While it's possible that the fin
could be 'missing', in a lot of cases a fish that's
stressed may have the fin so tucked into its body that it appears to be
missing it all together. My Sailfin Pleco has a very large dorsal fin
but can fold it in to where it's almost imperceptible that he has
one at all.>> Also, I'm curious as so why the m. Dalmatian
isn't interested in my f. Creamsicle. Is it because of the size
differences between them? The Creamsicle is bigger than the Dalmatians.
<<Size can make a difference but Livebearers (Mollies, Platys,
Swordtails, etc.) will attempt to 'mate' with their own kind
first. They can/will attempt to mate with others but I'd say that
Vivian is going to be Lancelot's main focus. Hybridization, is more
a creation of Man than of Fish. (Man tinkers with life and equates a
'success' with a green light to continue 'tinkering'.
Makes you wonder sometimes'¦>> Thanks again for all of
your help and for providing such a wonderful outlet for all of our
questions. Ashley <<Once again, Ashley, we're happy to help.
Tom>>
Sick Mollies, Medicated Food, And More -
02/07/2007 Hello crew! <Hi Mary> Thank you so much for all of
your help when I was setting up me aquariums, we now have three
situations. I am sorry, this is going to be a long one, thanks in
advance for all your help again! <Don't think I helped you last
time, but you're welcome, on behalf of WWM Crew. I'll try to
help you out this time, though..,< Situation number one: After all
that I went through with getting the two kids' aquariums up and
running, it was clear that when we were close to being able to stock
the tanks I wanted to quarantine any new fish first, we had already
been through way too much to endanger our two healthy tanks!
<Excellent decision!> So I now have 6 new fish in a separate
quarantine tank. We have 3 Dalmatian Mollies and 3 platys in the QT
tank. I am doing a 50% water change every morning to keep the water
clean, and all the fish seem to be very healthy. <Sounds like you
are taking very good care of these little guys.> Except for one
thing. The day after we brought them home, one of the platys was hiding
a lot and had stringy white feces. We had experienced this with other
fish from the pet store that eventually died. <Sounds like this fish
had an internal parasite - not uncommon, and just to note, a great
illustration of the importance of a quarantine, as you yourself
know!> So I treated the water with Jungle parasite fungus clear. I
figured in a quarantine tank we aren't trying to establish a cycle
anyway. <That's true, but generally speaking, internal parasites
respond better to medicated food, specifically something containing
Oxytetracycline. Here's where I buy mine from (it's
hard to find, at least around Chicagoland):
http://flguppiesplus.safeshopper.com/255/cat255.htm?785 > Within the
next day the fish seemed to perk up and now 9 days later they all seem
very perky. Except now 3 of the fish seem to have stringy white feces.
It literally looks like they swallowed a human hair and are excreting
it out, with little spots of feces stuck on the 'hair' along
the way. Sometimes it gets to be like twice as long as the length of
the fish! But again, the fish all look really peppy and healthy. So
that's situation number one. Any thoughts on the feces? <Do try
the medicated food. Sometimes it can be challenging to get fish to eat
it (I'm thinking it probably tastes bad, just like some human
meds!), so soaking it in a couple of drops of Kent's Garlic Xtreme
( http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=5016&Ntt=garlic%20xtreme&Ntk=All&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&Np=1&pc=1&N=0&Nty=1
) can stimulate their interest in the food. That's the
best way to combat internal parasites, in my
experience. Should clear the problem right up.> Should I
worry or wait and see how they are doing in a few days? Should I just
treat them to prevent any problems? <I'd try the food - this
isn't a problem that will just "go away".> Situation
number two: My daughter started off her brand new tank with 2 platys
and an algae eater. The first platy died the next day, and the second
within 2 days of setting up the tank. They both had red spots on their
bodies which we originally thought were pretty coloring and now I think
they were a symptom of some type of disease. <Can you describe the
"spots" a bit more? How many, how large, etc. What
color are these platys to begin with? My first thought was some sort of
ammonia burn, but I see below that your parameters are good. These
"spots" don't move, do they? My next thought is a
parasite, but that's just a guess...> We got one more platy
after the first one died. The algae eater wedged himself under a
decoration on day 4, with no signs of disease at all, I think he just
got stuck. Poor thing! <Did he perish as well? Some of these
store-bought aquarium decorations can actually be dangerous - I learned
that lesson the hard way after one of my Bettas got stuck inside one,
and eventually died from the trauma. Make sure you inspect
everything carefully, just as you would for little children - it seems
as though if the fish can get stuck, they will...> So now it had
been 2 and ½ weeks and we had one fish left alive in the
tank. The tank has fully cycled, with nitrates and nitrites testing at
0 for a total of 5 days, hardness steady at 75, alkalinity at between
40 and 80 (kH) ppm on my test strip and PH between 6.8 and 7.2. <Am
I to understand that the tank was cycling with the fish in it? If so,
that's likely what caused the platys to perish, and the red spots
were likely burns from ammonia, as I first suspected. Generally
it's best to do a "fishless" cycle, using a small bit of
fish food, and measuring the water's parameters the same
way. On another note, those "test
strips" you refer to are notorious inaccurate - I'd recommend
investing in a quality liquid test kit that contains ammonia, nitrite,
nitrate, and pH tests - I personally like the one made by Aquarium
Pharmaceuticals.> A lot of algae, so we went to the store and bought
an algae eater from the pet store and put him straight in to the tank.
Maybe not the best idea but my thought was that they eat scum, they
must be somewhat more resistant than other fish. What do you think?
<I think there are better ways to combat algae, like feeing less,
reducing the amount of light on the tank, and increasing water
changes. Also, when phosphates are a problem, it's
usually due to elevated phosphate levels - you may want to invest in a
test kit for that as well. If phosphates are your
issue, adding a filter media like PolyFilter (http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=4335&Ntt=polyfilter&Ntk=All&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&Np=1&pc=1&N=0&Nty=1
) can help keep the phosphates under control. What sort of "algae
eater" did you get? Is it a common Pleco, or something else? If
it's a Pleco, be aware these grow very large
(12-18"). Finally, I don't know of any fish that
eats "scum", as you put it...certain fish eat specific types
of algae, but really, water changes are the best way to combat algae
(along with the ideas above).> So I am wondering, she has three
platys in the quarantine area and we leave for vacation in 10 days. The
fish have been in quarantine for 9 days now. When would you advise
starting to add the 3 new platys? I know usually we would wait 21 days
and then go one at a time but while we are gone the fish will not be
getting the obsessive attention they have been getting, so I am trying
to weigh the benefits of adding one at a time and waiting a few days
between additions vs. leaving them in quarantine for longer. <This
can be a tough call. Based on my own personal experience of not keeping
livebearers in QT long enough, coupled with the fact that your fish
haven't been entirely healthy during the QT period, I'd leave
them where they are. Do you have someone feeding your fish
while you are away, then? I'd suggest making little baggies of food
for each tank, for each feeding, keeping in mind that less is more, in
this situation, since I imagine the kind person watching your tanks
won't be changing water...> I really would love your advice
here! <I suggest leaving the fish where they are, for the reasons
listed above.> Situation number three: My son started off his brand
new tank with 2 mollies and an algae eater. <Again, what type of
"algae eater"? A Siamese algae eater, Chinese algae eater,
Pleco, etc., etc...> They were doing great! And then suddenly Bob
(male molly) started swimming upside down (vertical) and losing all
sense of direction and balance. He looked grayish and dull, not shiny
and sparkly like a healthy fish. <First thing to always check are
water parameters...> I took him out of the tank and treated him for
bacterial and parasites, (each after water changes and a day between)
but Bob died after 3 days. <Best not to throw all sorts of
medication at a fish, as this can cause more harm than
good. It can be hard to diagnose a fish, but that's the
best thing to try and do. First thing, I would have checked the
environmental conditions. If all was well there (no ammonia or
nitrites, and nitrates less than 20 ppm), then I'd start looking at
diseases. Based on your description, sounds as though this
may have been Costiasis, a/k/a "skin slime disease". It is
not uncommon for this to be present in fish acquired from local fish
stores. It can kill very quickly. If it were that, I would
have treated with Metronidazole. Just information for the future - not
trying to beat you up for the decisions you made!> He was such a
great fish! We were heart broken. <I'm sorry.> But Molly
(female) was doing great and appeared pregnant. <Female livebearers
kept in community tanks usually are...> Molly kept right on doing
great for another week and a half or so, but suddenly yesterday she was
not swimming right. She is grey and dull like Bob was, has one white
cloudy eye, and seems to not have her equilibrium under control. She is
not swimming upside down like Bob was but she is not doing well either.
And her feces is stringy and white exactly like the ones in quarantine.
The nitrites were running really high (between 3.0 and 5.0 on my test
strip) when this all started, and the rest of the tank parameters are
identical to what is listed above. <Again, I suggest getting a more
reliable test kit. But, if the nitrites truly were at between 3 and 5,
that's WAY TOO HIGH - they need to be at zero. How often
do you change the water on this tank? The stringy white feces, as
discussed above, sound like internal parasites, for which
Oxytetracycline medicated food is generally a good course of
action...> The one good thing is she is still eating. She is not
eating at all like she normally does but she is trying. She has also
gotten thinner and does not look pregnant at all. I have looked at her
with a flashlight and she does not appear to have ich. First thing I
did was a 50% water change. <Did you re-test the water after that?
With nitrites as high as they were, you need to be sure they were
effectively reduced to ZERO.> Then I treated the water yesterday
with Jungle parasite clear, and did a 50% water change today and
tonight I treated in with Jungle fungus clear, which claims to also
cure swim bladder and white cloudy eye. I am treating her in the
regular tank because the quarantine tank is already taken up with the
new fish. (took out the charcoal). <It is very dangerous to mix
medications. I know you were anxious to help, but in fish illness
situations, the best thing to do is step back, try to diagnose based on
all the observable criteria, and treat accordingly. Your
description of Molly doesn't lead me to think fungus is an issue.
The white cloudy eye sounds like pop-eye, a condition caused by poor
environmental conditions. Many times the eye will clear
itself up once the environment is improved, but in more severe cases,
Epsom salts are usually a good course of action. Honestly,
if it were me, I'd get the water issues under control ASAP and
carefully watch the fish to see if she improved in a day or two, and
I'd feed her medicated flakes. If no improvement with
the swimming in a day or two, then I'd start entertaining
medication. You must be aware that many fish "diseases" are
nothing more than reactions to bad water quality - something that can
be fixed through good husbandry alone!> Would you advise cleaning
everything out and starting from scratch if she dies? <Actually,
I'd advise putting the carbon filter back in place and doing a
large water change - you have too many medications in that tank, which
could very well kill her. Get the water clean, feed the
medicated flake, and observe closely...> Could this be contaminating
our tank now? And of course now we will have to start the cycle over
again, because I'm sure the medication killed everything we had
started. <Yes and yes.> So now I'm really not sure what to do
with the new mollies that I have in the quarantine tank, we are leaving
town and that tank will not be cycled. Help!!! <OK, perhaps you can
prepare some water for water changes, and persuade the tank-sitter to
change the water at least once or twice? That would be the best
solution. I would not, under any circumstances, though, move the fish
around; at this point, you'd likely do much more harm than
good.> The algae eater is doing great in the tank and has grown a
ton! <Yes - you need to find out exactly what type of fish this is,
as he may eventually need a larger home!> Also, do you have any
advice on how to buy fish? What to look for etc? <I like to look at
ALL the tanks at the store, as all the freshwater ones are likely on
the same filtration system. Get a sense of how clean the
tanks are, how many dead/dying fish there are (ideally, there
shouldn't be any...a classic sign of a bad fish store is one that
lets deceased fish be cannibalized by others in the tank...), etc. Ask
the shopkeeper how long the fish you are interested in have been there
- ask what they are being fed, etc. You can even ask for the
storekeeper to feed the fish in front of you - nothing wrong with that
at all, many folks do it. Of course, you don't want to buy any fish
that looks lethargic, has clamped fins or other signs of disease, etc.
Try to find some pictures (either in books or online) of the fish
you're interested in buying, so that you know what a healthy
specimen should look like.> <Hope I've helped - best of luck,
and enjoy your vacation. Jorie>
Sick White Molly 11/10/05 Hi, <Hello there> I
have a 10 gal tank freshwater aquarium, inside are a female guppy who
gave birth to around 20 fry guppies, 1 orange platy and 1 white
molly. My white molly has been the healthiest fish since the
first time I bought her ( 8 months ago), but since yesterday she has
been acting different. she hid behind the rocks, stayed still near the
heater or stay near the bottom of the tank on one of the tank's
corners. I checked the pH, nitrate, ammonia, nitrite levels, and they
checked OK. I was wondering if it's because I put too much salt
yesterday, I put 2 tablespoon full. <Mmm, this shouldn't be too
much> I used to have a black molly that died due to white spots that
looked like flaky skin, I wonder if my white molly is having the same
thing, it's hard to see because she's white. <Ah, I see>
One thing I noticed though is that her fins/scales are darker than
usual, and there is a red visible patch on the top of her head.
<Good observations, bad symptoms> I have "quick cure"
and "MelaFix" already, which one do you think is better for
my fish? <Mmm, likely the latter... Quick Cure is quite toxic...
Melafix has only a mild antimicrobial effect... I would treat these
fishes for white spot/ich with Malachite Green...> Or do I need
other medication? Thank you very much, Ike <Not unless there are
specific symptoms... Bob Fenner>
Molly Not Moving Much 9/29/05 Hi Friends: Once again I
need a little help please. I have a sickly looking Mollie but with no
obvious signs of illness/injury. I have a 10-gallon fresh water tank
with approx 9 small Dalmatian mollies. They are all siblings from my
daughter and are still pretty small. My filter is a Whisper with a bio
bag and I have an anti-ammonia pillow in there also. I test the water
regularly and the tests are good except the nitrate which is still
round 20. Nitrite is zero, hardness 75, ph 7.8. Temperature is 80F and
stays very stable. I feed flakes twice a day except a couple of times a
week they get Tubifex worms or peas or something like that. I do a 1/3
water change every week and the problems I had back in August with the
cloudy water have gone and the water has been clear. The plants are all
plastic. Now I have a (female I think) Mollie who does not appear to be
doing very well. Yesterday I noticed she was on the bottom of the tank
a lot, although if another fish came near her she would swim off. Today
she was hanging more on the bottom and mostly ignoring the others. I
isolated her into a bowl and put her into an Epsom salt solution. It
was hard to guess how much so I think the solution is a bit light as I
was afraid of overdoing it. I don't have another tank to put her in
so after I did the water change today (it was actually due tomorrow) I
have put her in a clear container, still in the Epsom salt solution,
inside the tank where she will be warm. She has no signs of anything
like ick or injuries. She is just sitting pretty still, moving her fins
a little but otherwise pretty motionless. She is in a normal position,
not on her side or anything. My questions: Will she be OK with no
aeration? Is there anything else I can do for her? Is there an easier
way to measure the amount of Epsom salts for a small (1-1 1/2 ) pint
container? With no visible signs of anything wrong I don't know
what else to do. Thanks in advance for any help or suggestions Vivienne
< Mollies can actually handle seawater concentrations if the salt is
added gradually. Since all your other fish are mollies I would add some
salt over time in small doses. A big influx of salt will not be good
for your nitrifying bacteria. Add a tablespoon per week and see if it
makes any difference. Slowly you will be increasing the salt
concentration. Stop when you see the fish acting better.-Chuck>
| Sick Molly I have a Molly that was acting strangely a
while back. He had some white spots on him but it did
not look like any picture I had seen of Ich. It did not
appear as though it was sticking up like granules of salt or grains
of sand. It appeared flat just a few spots and 2 spots
under his head and a couple of spots at the base of his fins where
they meet the body. He was "shaking" on the
bottom of the aquarium and occasionally bumping things.
<Mmm, was this fish new to your system? Do you have salt in
there?> We treated for fungus first and I did an immediate 25%
water change and added salt to the aquarium. He had
immediate improvement. He has yet to shake or thrash
since, but his white patches have reappeared. No other
fish in the aquarium show any symptoms of anything
similar. I did have a platy that was being roughed up by
the guppies and she appeared flaky. I culled her because
she looked ill and she was constantly bothered possibly because she
was ill. I can send you some pictures of the
molly if that will help. <Would> I'm really beginning to
think it is not fungus. I've also done one Ich
treatment. If you have any ideas please let me
know. This is my oldest and biggest fish I'd like to
keep him. Thanks Raina <Thank you for writing so well and
completely. I do agree with your estimation that this is not a
pathogenic problem... Perhaps just environmental, maybe with a
nutritional component. Is your water hard, alkaline? What
temperature? Have you read over the parts on WWM re Molly, Platy
Systems? Bob Fenner> |
|
|
| Re: Sick molly I am so sorry I forgot to mention this
peculiar thing as well. weeks before the molly showed
any signs of illness he had clear string instead of normal feces.
<Can be a clue> I did not know what it was still
don't. He also exhibits no other problems he eats
interacts with other fish etc. I'm going to go ahead and send
the pictures to see if they help. <The fish appears healthy
overall> I've spent countless hours on the web looking and
disease photos and have yet to see something that looks like
this. Please have a look and help if you can. Thanks
Raina <I would seek to understand your water quality, solve this
issue... you could make a prophylactic pass at feeding/dosing
Metronidazole/Flagyl here... Bob Fenner> |
| Re: Sick molly Since I wrote this message there have
been other developments. My pregnant platy can't
swim well, she appears as though she is having swim bladder issues
and one little spot on her fin has appeared which does look like
ich sort of at least. But other than that she appears
fine great color eating just hiding but she does that in the week
or so before birth usually. I did another water check
and the ammonia and nitrites are at 0 so I was glad of
that. I had added salt first a week or so ago and he
immediately perked up but I've done so many water changes since
then it's doubtful there is much salt left. <Mmm, the salt
doesn't leave solution except by dilution...> Upon the new
water testing last night I noticed something very disturbing. The
nitrates have gone through the roof. Just last week it
was at 40 which I know is a little high but still within an ok
range I guess at least according to who you ask :). <Mmm (again?
Heee!), actually about half this (20 ppm) is right about maximum...
fishes and non-fishes can "become acclimated" to higher
concentrations, but this is also stressful... I would shoot for
half what you state at the most> Well last night and
this morning it is at 160+ . <Yeeikesville!> I know that is
horrible. I'm going to clean out my canister today
and go get some carbon/nitrate combo filter material. I
haven't had anything in my filter for at least week due to all
of the treatments the tank has been undergoing. <Likely the
treatments either metabolically checked microbial action and/or
killed your nitrifiers outright...> I accidentally fibbed to you
in the previous message. I thought I had done an ich
treatment but I was wrong. After noticing a grain like
spot on my platy's tail I did that this morning. I guess now my
question to you is: Do you think I should continue ich
treatments and ignore the nitrate at this time, or do water
changes/filtration and take care of the nitrate first? <I would
do the latter, and replenish, replace the aquarium salt with the
water changes> My mother also mentioned I might
should buy some live bacteria since I've been medicating the
fish. I'm kinda lost at this point. Due
to the only fish with any symptoms at all being the molly and the
platy, I'm beginning to just think I should somehow isolate
them. I have a 10g that I could set up for them, but
would it be more detrimental to them to switch them to a new
uncycled tank? <Hard to judge from here... but I am leaning
toward your suggestion of moving them to the new ten, with a good
deal of the existing water (for biological cycling, acclimation in
general reasons), along with some of the "mulm" and
possibly gravel from their existing system... Will also help dilute
the ammonia being produced by all...> Oh and as per the
water. The pH is at 7.6 not sure if the water
is hard or not, but I know it's not soft, there is no nitrates
in the tap water I checked that last night. I've
upped the temp just a tad. Shooting for just under
80. Will that hurt my tetras or catfish and Pleco?
Thanks so much. <They all should be fine with the temperature,
pH, and the amount of salt (a level teaspoon per ten gallons of
water). Cheers, Bob Fenner> |
Molly Questions Hello, <Hi there> I have 2
black male mollies and one white one. I also have about 10 other baby
mollies ranging in various sizes. A couple of weeks ago my black molly
showed signs of ick. I treated the tank with RidIch and it cured the
fish in a couple of days, A few days later, the 2 black mollies top fin
has a white line of them so I thought it might be tail rot. I treated
the tank with Melafix for 4 days, then changed 25% of the water, added
more salt and dechlorinator and put the carbon back in the filter. Now
a few days later, one of my black mollies is shaking badly (like having
a seizure) and stays on the bottom of the tank. He comes out to eat,
but still shakes bad. Now my white female is also shaking badly and
stays bear the heater and filter inlet. I'm going to try a 50%
water change today. I tested the water and my nitrites are way high.
<How high is high?> I'm hoping the 50% water change will
reduce this number. I also bought some Amquel plus to reduce the
nitrites. What can I do? Is there something I'm doing that causing
this? Is their behavior due to water problems or a disease? Please
Help!!!! Mark <You're suffering from "too much buying and
treating" disease... Really, I would be careful here re these
"medicines"... and revert back to just maintaining good water
quality and having some salt in your water. Very likely your fish have
been poisoned by the med.s... They have killed much of your biological
filter obviously. I would leave off with their further use at this
time. Bob Fenner>
Re: Molly Questions Thanks for the reply. I most likely
killed the biological cycle which in turn, caused my fish to get sick.
<Yes> My female molly is still in the hospital tank. There is
white patchy cotton looking fuzz that is on parts of her body. There is
also a line of some white substance on her back tail. It has eaten out
the center of her tail and is still there. Also, she swims with her
head pointed down, she can't right herself. Maybe some type of swim
bladder disease. <Bad signs... seek out "Mollienex" if you
can find it... funny name, but a tried and true remedy/medication for
what you describe> It started about an hour after putting her in the
hospital tank. The medical tank has just clean water and salt with a
little stress coat. A person a Petco suggested I put some Fungus Clear
(Jungle) into her tank to take care of the white stuff which she
thought was fungus. It there anything else I can do. She looks real
sick and won't eat. <These were good suggestions, moves... see
above> The fish in my main tank are doing great. The nitrites are
still a little high. They are at about 3.0. Should I do another water
change (what %) or add some more Amquel Plus. <The water change...
now... keep ammonia and nitrite below 1.0 ppm> I know now not to
overfeed and test the water weekly with water changes. <I'd
test, change daily if it is getting, staying this high> I'm
concerned about the female molly. I hate to see her suffer. But do not
want to euthanize her until I know there is nothing else I can do. Is
there a chance she'll get better? <Yes> What is the best way
to euthanize the fish, if necessary? Please help. <In a bit of
water, in a bag, in your freezer. Bob Fenner> Mark Stack
Re: Molly Questions Bob, <Mark> Thanks for your
response. My female molly is still the same. I was not able to find the
Mollienex you talked about. Can you suggest a place where I can
purchase it? <I should have looked to see if it was still made,
available... not... but found same formulation under another name (same
manuf.): http://www.junglelabs.com/pages/details.asp?item=NJ117>
And (regardless of the 1st answer) tell me of some other medications
that might work that I can buy at a local pet store? Like I said, I
treated the tank with Fungus Clear (Jungle Labs) and some Melafix. I
have some TriSulfa, should I use that medication as well? <I would
try this if I could not quickly (a day) get the Fungus... oh, I see it
below> Can I use it with the Fungus Clear and Melafix? Someone else
suggested Maracyn II since my fish won't eat. Should I try this?
<Just Minocycline... no I wouldn't> Please give me suggestion
on exactly what medications I should use in what combo. I don't
want to over-medicate. Thanks. PS. There was a clear white gel or fuzz
on all the objects in the tank, including the female molly. You can see
it grow on everything (clear to light white) and you can see it move
with the water current. What is this? Should I do something to correct
this? I cleaned all the ornaments and gravel in the tank. Thanks for
your help. Mark Stack <Better, best to stay the course you're
on. Bob Fenner>
Re: Molly Questions Bob, <Mark> I called several stores
in my area for the Jungle Labs fungus eliminator, no one had it.
PetSmart had the same product, just for ponds, not aquariums. Can I use
this pond product instead of the one you suggested? <Yes. As far as
I'm aware they are identical> I stopped by another pet store
today and they suggested Maracyn, since the other product wasn't
available. He claims Jungle Lab products are not very good. <Most
are not... mainly salt... this one is> Should I use the Maracyn in
combo with either the Melafix or Fungus Clear. He suggested a 50% water
change and to use The Maracyn by itself. Or should I use the fungus
eliminator for Ponds with anything else (i.e. Melafix) <... Maracyn
is the antibiotic Erythromycin... I would NOT use Melafix to wash a
sidewalk> Please tell me what combo of products to use to correct
this problem?? Thanks. Mark Stack <If it were my fish and I was
starting at day one I would ONLY use non-iodized salt and assure my pH
was mid 7's or higher... with baking soda. You would do well to
just listen to one source and/or reason through the explanations, root
knowledge of what people are relating to you. Bob Fenner>
Re: Molly Questions Bob, <Mark> Thank you for all your
help. My molly is doing better. She is swimming upright and eats once
in a while. She still has some cottony growths on her one side. How
long does it take for this to disappear? <A few weeks generally>
The only medication I am using is the Fungus Eliminator you suggested.
I've been giving it to her for 10 days now. I replace about 40% of
the water between each treatment, a day long. I use some water
conditioner and a little salt. <Good> I have the water conditions
ideal accept for pH, which is a little high (7.8-8.0) due to my water
source. <Mmm, this should be okay (for molly species)...> I
did notice that she has some black specks in her top fin (they've
been around for about 3 weeks now), what is this? <Natural
coloring... not to worry> It also looks like the top of her body is
darker than the rest. Should I be concerned about this? <No> My
other concern is the last three days she has her back tail drooping
down and to the side as she rests. It seems like it getting worse. What
is causing this condition? Is there anything else I should be
doing to help her? <Not to worry> Her appetite seems to be
diminishing, but who knows. How long can they be on this medication
until it adversely affects their condition? <For a very long
time... months... unlike the vast majority of "medications"
that are quite toxic, debilitating. Bob Fenner> Any information to
help me on this matter would be greatly appreciated. Mark
Stack
|
|
