SW med. reading, BFs, Velvet, Copper  01/30/10
Hi everyone
Hi again guys lol. Ok, so I am in the middle of a two month fallow period in my 90gal tank due to a velvet outbreak. I currently have my 3..5" Heniochus in a ten gallon
<Yikes>
QT tank with a penguin 150 HOB power filter a heater and some sand in a pouch from my main tank to avoid a level spike (or at least help with it). I have medium amount of circulation and an airstone for oxygen. I just made the first dose of Cupramine.
<... I would not expose these, or most other Chaetodontids to copper... Look into/use a Quinine compound instead. Read here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/quinmedfaqs.htm>
Now, the label says to dose this for two weeks
<Not w/o testing for free copper daily>
and your good to go (if no signs of spots or symptoms), but do you think this is long enough?
<I suggest you read re Cu use on WWM>
I know for a face there is velvet in the water because it's the same water that was from my display tank. If not two weeks, what amount of time do you feel is safe enough to say the fish is free of velvet and can be placed back into the display? And, how do you feel about the "Prime" product by Seachem just in case I run into problems with ammonia and water changes aren't completely
cutting it?
Thanks,
J
<Start here: http://wetwebmedia.com/mardisindex.htm
scroll down... Bob Fenner>

Re: Crypto or something else? & BF dis.   11/29/09
Thanks for the quick reply, Bob. The saddleback butterfly, who has been "cleaning" the rock beauty, has a blood-red, swollen mouth now (doom I know for B/F fish!). Wonder if it could be from "cleaning" the rock beauty?
<Mmm, doubtful. Much more likely resultant from dashing around the small system in the dark, banging into things>
Parasite or bacteria that has been transferred, perhaps?
<Mmmm, duet... not really... Most all are omnipresent to extents>
Anyhow, I'll keep an eye on things and treat with Crypto Pro (quinine sulphate) if I feel like the mystery spots are looking like Ich on the rock beauty. Not sure what to do for the poor saddleback.
Mike
<Not much can be done unfortunately... Keep some light on outside the system at night. BobF>
Re: Crypto or something else?& BF dis., beh.   11/29/09
Think I have figured out how the saddleback is damaging it's mouth. It seem to "peck" madly at the front glass as it swims up and down on it's side.
Very strange!
<Mmm, actually... not "strange" in the meaning of "uncommon".
Butterflyfishes and many other families display both territorial behavior in detecting their reflections, and "do this" sort of thing in small volumes>
Anyhow, put a fresh oyster in the tank tonight and it went to town on it!
<Ah! Very good>
Continued after feeding to keep going up and down the glass though, which is troubling.
<Do please tape a piece of paper (newspaper will do) on one end and a long side of this tank... Should have a discernible effect immediately>
Thanks again for the insight and quick reply. I won't trouble you any more on this particular subject. Take care.
Mike
<Never a trouble Michael. BobF>

Disease Diagnosis   11/14/09 Hello WWM Crew, <Jarred> I am embarrassed to have to write you under these circumstances but I am looking for help diagnosing the problem I have going on here. <No need/cause for embarrassment> First, the background information. I have a 160 gallon tank with 120lbs live rock, a purple tipped anemone, two tank raised clowns and a purple tang. I have had all of this in the tank for about 3 years with zero problems. I felt it was time to add to the tank so I set up a QT tank (not sure if you can call it this, as I put live rock in, fed it with water and some substrate from the main display and let it cycle for over a month now. so really it's just a small 'other tank'). I then went to the LFS and purchased a Saddleback BF and a Raffles BF. After staring at them for almost too long in the tanks at the LFS and talking with an employee (here is where the problem starts), he convinced me that they have had these fish for a few weeks, the water isn't shared with the other thanks, they are eating just fine <Did you see this?> and are essentially quarantined right there in the store. So I took them home, fresh water dipped them and plopped them in my 160 gallon tank, totally ignoring the fact that I had a perfectly good QT tank beside it (yes I know. lesson learned.). Here we are a week later, with the Raffles doing wonderfully - eating happily, swimming around with personality, picking at rocks. even happy to see me when I come around with some food. The Saddleback, however, is doing some things that I am not sure about. Last night, for the first time, I saw him rub on one of the rocks - <Some rubbing behavior is fine> he would line up his fin / gill area, press against it and then do a swoop off of the rock. I only saw him do this twice at that moment, and after watching them for hours, he hasn't done it again. Another thing he did last night was move his mouth open and closed quite a bit, and do some very heavy fast breathing while staying still in the water. He also once in a while does a body shake / shiver. <Also natural> He isn't nearly as active as the Raffles, and doesn't pick at any rocks. <This is bad... this specimen is very thin... has a low index of fitness as we say in fisheries> He also won't eat (I have been feeding Mysis). There are no signs of white specs on him, and he looks totally fine, other than maybe his gills look a little red (see attached photos). I'm thinking I am going to move him to the QT tank, treat the tank with copper <I would not do, use this> (obviously move the LR out before doing this) and if you think it would be a good idea, do 3 - 5 formalin dips on him. <Perhaps one enroute to quarantine> However, I am looking for some sort of confirmation that this is Velvet. <Is not. If so, all your fishes would have contracted it, and likely be dead by now> as I am now thinking that even though all the other fish are fine, they are going to eventually come down with it too. <And your system would be infested> Oh, and one thing I forgot to mention is that when I decided his gills were slightly red, I couldn't believe it as I can't remember the last time I have had water problems in the big tank, but I figured my ammonia or nitrite levels were high. so I did that check and everything is perfect (0 and 0). Nitrate is even fine at just above zero. So this once again confused me (if the water was bad the other fish would be complaining too I would assume). So first things first, based on the pictures and the actions described above, what do you think I am looking at here? <For one, a "bad" specimen... IF it is not too inconvenient, I would simply return it to the store myself> Is it a parasite I can be rid of by copper and formalin treatments? <This regimen will almost certainly kill this fish in its present condition. Even when Chaetodon ephippium, actually all Chaetodontids are in excellent shape, they fare poorly if exposed to copper, formalin> If so, I assume this means the other fish are infected as well and I should treat everyone and leave the main tank fallow for a month or two? <Again, I don't read or see in your pix evidence of parasitic infestation> Or should I just treat the Saddleback and see how the others fair in the meantime? Or, maybe I should see how it plays out, which means I should concentrate on getting the Saddleback to eat? <If you can't return the B'fly, I'd try interesting it in other foods, soaked in a vitamin & HUFA prep. (liquid stimulant) like Selcon... Try adding some new/er live rock, try frozen/defrosted bloodworms, a small opened shellfish (from the human food store or Gamma brand), try even some live brine shrimp. This "upon the horse": ephippium (which for humans is a saddle) is likely just stressed from capture, handling, transport... starved from lack of nutrition through the process. In future, I would demand that such potential purchases be fed in my presence. Please read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/bffdsfdgfaqs.htm Bob Fenner> Thank you in advance, Jarred P.S. I apologize for my dirty tank - I haven't cleaned it since the arrival of the BFs as the Mag-float stresses them out and I am trying to avoid any unnecessary stress!

A question for Bob, please (since he wrote the article), B'fly fish sel., disease   8/20/09
Hi there Bob. I have learned much from your book, the photos are fantastic, as well.
I have a question on the disease resistance nature of two species you place high on the list of suitable aquarium inhabitants. In one write up on Golden Butterflies, and in a few questions from readers, you state they usually come in pretty clean, and would really only recommend a dip before placing directly in the display, skipping the QT for these.
However, I followed a link you posted to a reader that gave an updated version for the care of these butterflies, and in that article you'd stated they are quite susceptible to Ich and velvet.
Perhaps I interpreted your statement incorrectly?
<Sorry for the confusion... this Chaetodontid is "more susceptible" than many fishes/groups used in our interest, but amongst the Butterflyfishes as a family is very sturdy, typically parasitic et al. disease resistant. Does this make (more) sense? Tough as BF's, but BFs themselves are quite susceptible...>
do not point this out to show a contradiction, for I don't believe there is one...only to receive clarification on the disease prone nature of the Golden Butterfly.
Are they as susceptible to Ich and velvet on the level of a Hippo Tang? Or more hardy (disease-wise)
<Much less susceptible than Paracanthurus... which in turn are relatively tough for Acanthurids!>
like a damsel or a Mac Angel?
<Two notches down from a Mac let's say>
Your approval of them had me put a pair on hold at my LFS.
My second choice for my 320 FOWLER display (that currently only houses an 8" Naso Tang) would be a pair of schooling Bannerfish if the Golden Butterfly is not the best choice. I would like to get a pair of either one. It all comes down to which of the two are more susceptible to getting those marine diseases of Ich/velvet.
<Heniochus of all species are about "on par" with Chaetodon larvatus...>
I am aware that even the hardiest of fishes can succumb to such parasites, but I'd love to hear from you which of the two species you'd recommend on just that one factor alone.
Your decades of fish keeping and wholesale importing have certainly yielded some fascinating files of information.
Thank you kindly,
Martha
<Happy to share, Bob Fenner>

We don't want to lose our new addition! please help! (Butterfly Qs) 11/05/08 Hello, <Hi.> I am writing to you in desperation. My husband and I have purchased a long nosed butterfly over the weekend. He looked happy and healthy at the store though we did notice a few spots when we got home. <It should have been quarantined or even brought back.> The number of spots has increased and we are unsure how to treat him. The spots are small and white (possibly looks like Ich, I have attempted to take pictures but have yet to get one that is not blurry) and are all over his body. <Please see here http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ichartmar.htm  and http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ichart2mar.htm  and get familiar with the disease, symptoms and treatments described. See here http://www.wetwebmedia.com/forcipdisfaqs.htm  for Longnose butterfly disease cases.> He has taken to hanging out behind some live rock in the bottom right corner of the tank but this evening I noticed he was hanging out near the surface in the top right corner. He started floating with his tail towards the surface and head down late this evening (similar to what our clownfish do), and seemed to be moving slower and floating instead of swimming is this normal? <Floating tail up at the surface? Not normal, I would be concerned, too.> Once the lights when out he went back to the bottom corner (to sleep?). <Probably.> We have a 35 gal tank <Too small for the new addition. Please see here http://www.wetwebmedia.com/forcipig.htm . There is some good disease information found as well.> with 2 clown fish, 2 damsels, 1 chocolate chip starfish and our recently added long nosed butterfly, along with fair amount of live rock. We are looking to expand but due to financial constraints have post boned the expansion (We started with a 10gal saltwater take 14 months ago <If you still have this one running, it would be a small-but-better-than-nothing quarantine or treatment tank.> and upgraded to 35 early last spring, but are looking to upgrade again). Our readings are consistently normal <What's that?> and other then a slight algae over growth lately we have had no problems in the 14 months we have had our reef tank. We have fallen in love with our butterfly (still working on a name for the colorful little guy) and would hate to lose him. How can we help him? <Read where you have been referred to above and act accordingly. Good luck. I hope the butterfly (and your other fish) get well again.> Desperate in Tennessee <Marco in Heidelberg>

BF spot, Dottyback color loss, Centropyge feeding in QT   7/12/06 Thanks for your prompt reply, <Please include prev. corr...> I have done as you said and given my Copperband with a freshwater dip mixed with M/Green. He has a parasite attached to his front left fin, I hope it will come off after a few more dips. But he is looking much better after the first dip, the itch has receded significantly. And he's eating well as usual. <Mmm, a parasite? Might just be a "spot" from bumping into something... I'd try a purposeful cleaner organism... perhaps a Lysmata sp. shrimp... Gobiosoma goby...> Now onto my Dottyback. He has lost a lot of colour, when I got him he was a bright magenta and yellow, now he's faded to a dull purple and yellow. I have been told this is due to him not being the dominant fish in the aquarium, as the Anthias don't seem to like him too much and chase him sometimes. <Possibly a/the factor here> I feed him Mysid shrimp, brine, algae flakes, angel fish mix, ocean plankton, pretty much whatever I can get my hands on, and he is still showing no signs of his original colour. Any suggestions? <Spectrum pelleted food/s> My final question is about my eibli angel, which is refusing to eat Mysid shrimp, marine algae, brine shrimp and flakes. He is in my QT tank atm, and I'm worried that he hasn't eaten for 2 days. I am not treating the tank with any medication so I am thinking of buying a small piece of live rock for him to nibble on. Would you suggest Nori too? <Do add a good deal of ready-cured live rock with obvious algal growth> I'll just like to add that you guys provide a valuable service and your advice is greatly appreciated. Thanks. Albany <Welcome. Bob Fenner>

Heniochus acuminatus with Ich 6/23/06 Hi WWM crew!! <Hi> I have an Heniochus acuminatus that show symptoms of ick. <Uh oh> It has white spots, that look like salt. It doesn't have that much but it still concerns me. <It should> It is still eating well. It doesn't breathe rapidly. All the other fish are healthy. <All other fish are infected with Ich, just not symptomatic.> I don't want to treat the main tank, because I have some invertebrate. <Almost always a bad idea.> I am not able to set up a hospital tank, I don't have the space for it, since I live in an apartment. <Really need one, doesn't need to be always set up, can be taken down when not in use.  Without a QT/hospital tank expect to continue to have problems with communicable diseases.> Yesterday, I have give it a freshwater bath( specific gravity: 1.008) with blue Methylene for 10 minutes. <Provides temporary relief, not a cure.> But, today, it still shows symptoms of ICK. <Most likely will continue until the Ich life cycle is broken.> What should I do to treat my fish? <If you are unable/unwilling to get a hospital/QT tank and remove and treat all fish and allow the tank to run follow there is not much you can do.  Provide good quality water and food and hope the fish's immune system and fight off the Ich.> I have bought a Formaldehyde - green malachite solution to use it in a bath, but I am not sure if it is a good idea and how much should I use and for how long. <Toxic stuff, I'm not a big fan of it.  Baths will help temporarily, but when the fish is returned to the tank they will be reinfected.> Could I use copper in a bath that would last for a long time? <Not effective.> If yes, how much should I use and for how long? Any other treatment I could try? <Not that wouldn't nuke the tank.  Medications are not specific enough to kill the Ich and not destroy the live rock and biofiltration.>    Thank you very very much!!! I hope my fish will be fine, I really like it!! <Hope so.> Steve T. <Chris>
Heniochus acuminatus with Ich Part II 6/30/06 Hi Chris, <Hi> As per your advice, I am actually looking to setup a hospital tank for my fish, to help to get ride of the ick problem... I have 2 clown fish, 2 green Chromis, 1 neon goby, 1 six line wrasse and the Heniochus. What size of hospital should I go with? <Good to hear, at least a 20 for all those fish.  If easier you could go with a couple of smaller tanks and split up the livestock.> Today the Heniochus have stopped to eat... :( <Uh-oh> What is my best bet with it? Should I give it a freshwater bath until I set-up the hospital tank? Any other ideas? <A bath may help, make sure its ph adjusted and the right temperature.  Try adding either Selcon or garlic to the food.  Both seem to stimulate the feeding response.  If it goes too long try some live brine shrimp.> Thank you very much... Steve <Good luck and remember to QT any new additions to avoid these problems in the future.> <Chris>
Heniochus acuminatus with Ich Part III 7/1/06 Hi again Chris, <Hi> Sorry to bother you again, <No bother.> I promise I will quarantine any new addition to my tank in the future. <Good> But, I just have a idea of what I could try to cure my fish from ick and get it out of my main tank. I know that the WWM crew are not big fan of hyposalinity, but could I just buy a tank (the one I would use in the future to quarantine any new addition) and use it to put all my hermit crab. They are the only invert I have in my system. I would put many pieces of live rock with them. So I would not kill all the zooplankton in LR and the crabs would be more safe... Could I lower the SPG in the main tank to kill the ick in it? I would keep the hermit crab apart for 6 weeks. Would it be effective? If yes, at what SPG would it cure the fish without being stressful to the fish? I have read from ATJ (the only name I have found of that guy) that the SPG should be at 1.009 to kill the ick. You can see this article here : '' http://www.petsforum.com/personal/trevor-jones/hyposalinity.html'' What do you think of that? <Well, it will get rid of the Ich if kept at that salinity long enough.  However, it will also kill off most of your live rock, and in the process cause a huge ammonia spike.  If you remove all the LR there will probably not be sufficient biofiltration and cause the same problem.> Thank you very very much for your help. If I found that the better treatment is the copper in a hospital tank, I will do it... Honestly, I don't feel confident about my capacity to keep them all alive in a basic none established system, though. <With lots of water changes should be fine.  Could also use Bio-Spira to jump start the biofiltration.> Steve <Chris>
Heniochus acuminatus with Ich Part IV 7/3/06 Hi again, <Hi> I just wanted to say that I should have listen to you one week ago. I mean I should have treated it as fast as I could. Even if the Heniochus had finally eaten yesterday, I have found it today in my overflow box dead. <Sorry to hear.>  I just feel like crap. The worst thing, it was my girlfriend fish... It was her birthday present. <Yeah, I learned that lesson the hard way too, no fish for gifts.>  I don't think she will like the tank anymore... I feel right now like I would give up too... It is sad that I had to make that fish die just to learn a so simple lesson!! <Been there, done that.  Almost quit after losing my possum wrasse, loved that fish.> So, I know that I will sing the same old song!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! TO EVERYONE, don't be damn stupid like me, DO QUARANTINE YOUR FISH!!!!!!!! <A convert, and ready to give others the advice, some good out of a bad situation.> So now that the only really sick fish is dead (the wrasse only had 2-3 spots and it is now gone), should I just wait 1 week or 2 before I start to treat them in a hospital tank? <Start immediately.> I mean that way I could let some sponge in my tank to have some biofiltration ready for the quarantine process. <See if you ca find some Bio-Spira to kick-start the biofiltration.  But do not buy it if it hasn't been kept refrigerated, some stores don't and without it the bacteria will die.> Should I start using the biofiltration right at the beginning or after the copper treatment so, the copper would not kill the biofiltration?  <From the beginning.>  Can I use filter pad that absorb ammonia with a copper treatment? <No, all will also remove the copper as far as I know, just have lots of new salt water ready for water changes.>  If not, would it be better to use hyposalinity, so I could use absorbent resin to help to maintain good quality of water ? <Most of the bacteria cannot survive the salinity change anyway, so copper is probably the better way to go.> Again Thank YOU VERY VERY MUCH for your patience Chris!!! <Anytime> <Chris>

Gill Irritation: water quality or Disease? 3/2/05 I've tried posting this at WetWebFotos board but no one has answered. Here's the thing: I've had a double saddle butterfly for 2 months and he recently began exhibiting a strange new behavior.  After evening feeding time, he occasionally (not all the time) starts swimming oddly on his side and kind of charging abruptly on and off at the live rock and glass. <this is called "glancing" or "scratching" and is a sign of gill irritation caused by parasites, disease or water quality> Like he's confused or addled. He also develops an instant fright/night coloring, and breathes rapidly. It only happens after feeding (an hour before lights go out). <sounds more like parasites that handicap its higher respiratory (excitement from food, etc) periods> I've been trying to pinpoint the cause but can't determine it. It seems to happen when I feed foods he's not fond of (for variety purposes) and hence maybe he's angry he hasn't gotten enough to eat(?). That sounds nuts I know. He's a pretty aggressive eater when it comes to foods he likes. <parasites are mostly likely... and being expressed not surprisingly after some weeks after import (very stressful). Hence the critical need to understand and apply proper quarantine to all new fishes (4 weeks minimum) to prevent these things from contaminating your tank as well as having a better shot at curing them (in bare bottomed QT)> Just recently he's been breathing rapidly and presenting himself numerous times to the neon goby for cleanings. Should I freshwater dip him or wait until other classic Ich signs emerge? <do dip promptly... and do so once daily for 8 consecutive days for the best chance at breaking the larval cycle> I have just added a coral beauty and yellow watchman goby after a 4 week qt (the cb had Ich in qt and I treated with hyposalinity) <if this BF was in QT for a 4 full weeks... I wonder if it wasn't the addition of some snails, algae or live food (without QT) to the tank that infected this fish?> tank 100 gallons 8.2 pH ammonia, trite and trate 0 salinity 1.024 Thanks kindly, Angela <best of luck! Anthony>
Re: weird butterfly behavior Thanks for the quick reply Anthony. <Antoine's out till the 7th> The butterfly was in QT for 5 weeks before introducing him into the main tank.  He, like all of my fish, got Ich immediately in the QT and I treated him with hyposalinity (1.009) for 2.5 weeks in a bare-bottomed tank then raised salinity slowly over the next 2 weeks.  <Sounds like the Crypt was in your system...> He was fine up until the weird addled behavior started a month after introduction to main tank (he doesn't scratch on the rocks but looks like he's lost a bit of control over his swimming ability and the change in color is spooky) I will dip him now as I fear he may have gotten Ich from the recent tank additions (even though they were QT'd for 4 weeks). I don't see any spots or scratching yet, just rapid breathing and the constant begging for a cleaning.  <Bob Fenner> 

Butterfly with gill flukes? My double saddle butterfly has been breathing rapidly for a week now. It's not Ich or velvet as I'm familiar with these diseases, and all of my fish have been QT'd for a month before introduction to the main tank. The bf isn't scratching, there are no spots on him, just the heavy breathing. I'm pretty sure he has gill flukes... <Stop! Where would these Trematodes have "come from?"> ...so I've been administering 50 min formalin baths (2 teaspoons Kordon's formalin/gallon) everyday for the past 3 days. Is this a sufficient treatment? <Possibly... there are more efficacious "de-worming" medicines... as you will see: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fshwrmdisfaqs.htm> I've read that it's better to treat with formalin as a bath rather than constant exposure in a qt tank. <Yes... please read: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/formalinart.htm> So far, the butterfly is still eating well, not hiding, but still has the rapid breathing. I've also noticed that he has thread-like poops. Could he have internal parasites as well? <Yes... but very much more likely this is just symptomatic of the toxic formalin exposure> All other fish are fine, although I noticed a long stringy poop coming from the coral beauty (I've never seen her poop like this). Are internal parasites contagious? I've attached a photo of the coral beauty poop. Ammonia, ni trite, nitrate, 0 Salinity 1.024 pH 8.2 79º Thanks, Angela <Angela, I would suspend the formalin treatments, look into Praziquantel... what you are doing is too toxic to continue, not likely helpful... the fish do not have monogenetic Trematodes... unless you've observed these under a microscope I strongly suspect there is not a pathogen involved here. Bob Fenner> 
Re: butterfly with gill flukes? Ok thanks for the reply Bob. I actually went and bought Prazi-pro yesterday and administered an hour long bath as directed. I plan to do another bath 3 days from now. Are the baths ok or should I just treat long term in a qt tank? <I would take the latter route> So far no breathing improvement. <... sometimes these fishes do "just" breathe hard... perhaps environmental influence/s... maybe social... I would not panic re> He's still eating well. As far as the stringy poops, the BF has always had them (I never saw him poop in QT, and was suspicious of that. It's because the thread-like poops are very hard to see) I figured he had gill flukes because of the internal parasite signs...  <I do wish everyone had ready access to a decent microscope (I have a neat, but cheapy QX3 Mattel/Intel unit... that's fabulous) to LOOK before using toxic chemical treatments... as I assure you that orders of magnitude more livestock is "bumped off" by well-meaning aquarists than dies from actual pathogenic infection/infestation> ...but also I'm at a loss as to what other pathogen would cause the rapid breathing (he has no spots or other signs) -a <As stated... there is almost certainly not a pathogen present. BobF>
Re: butterfly with gill flukes? Again, thanks for the quick reply Bob. I'll let him be for the rest of the week and then QT him on the weekend. I do wish I could help him! He's also constantly begging the neon goby for a gill cleaning (which he never did before), that's another reason I suspected the flukes. -a <Mmm, well "general irritation"... a zillion possible causes... will elicit the same behavior. Bob Fenner> 

- Pearlscale Flashing - I have a 90 gal with a dwarf lion and a Pearlscale butterfly. The Pearlscale has been scratching on the rocks for a few days now.  <Uggh.>  I have only had him for about a week.  <Does this mean you did not quarantine or at least give it a freshwater dip on the way into your tank?>  He does not scratch all the time. <May be ok, but if it happens several times in a five minute period, then you likely have a parasitic problem looming on the horizon.>  My pH is a little low and my alk is low also.  <Wouldn't worry as much about the alkalinity as I would the pH, although they are related. Do work on your water quality... poor water quality is a big source of stress and will lead to other problems, susceptibility to disease.>  I don't see any spots on him what so ever.  <No so easy to see spots inside the gills... keep a very close eye on things.>  He is not eating anything I put in there only the algae on the rocks.  <You may want to try this... find a lumpy piece of live rock or a dead brain coral. Thaw out a Formula One or Two type of food and then press into the spaces in the rock and re-freeze. Once the food has set back up, put the rock in the tank so the fish can employ its natural feeding habits on some real food. This will acclimate it to your various foods and will also [more importantly] get it eating.> So my question is, is this Ich?  <Could be... scratching can often occur before you see spots so I'd keep a close eye on things and get that quarantine tank ready to go.>   TIA <Cheers, J -- >
- Pearlscale Flashing, Follow-up - Thanks for the fast response.  <My pleasure.>  No I did not do a freshwater dip. I am getting ready to get a QT tank. The main tank is only 1 month old so I thought there was no need for a QT tank yet, but I should have done the fresh water dip.  <There is ALWAYS a need for quarantine.>  Anyway thanks for all the great info and I will try the rock thing you talked about feeding him. <Cheers, J -- > 

- Running on One Gill - So sorry to bother you again but I'm concerned about my Raccoon Butterfly. As I wrote before, he, along with 2 perculas are in a QT with CopperSafe as treatment for Ich. This is day 5.  I haven't seen spots on any of these guys for 4 days now. However, the b/f is only using one gill to breathe today. The clowns are fine. And the information I read about this problem on your site was in regards to smaller fish doing this because of Ich. He is 4" and has been in the with the CopperSafe. Could this still be Ich?  <Or worse, Oodinium... both infest the gills but Oodinium tends to spread very quickly and is fatal if not addressed.>  If not, what else could be going on?  <Well... butterflies are sensitive to copper, and I would have treated with formalin. Likewise, if this is Oodinium, it is not particularly responsive to copper and would have to be treated with formalin.>  He definitely is doing double time with the other gill.  <Is not a good sign... the best I can say is that if the fish is still with you by the time you get this mail, I'd run some activated carbon on the quarantine to remove the copper. Then I'd set up a pH-adjusted, freshwater dip for this fish and a follow-up bath in tank water with a formalin solution. Once the fish is returned to quarantine, I'd begin re-treatment with formalin and work on keeping the water quality as good as possible. Follow the instructions on the formalin bottle to the letter - formalin is bad news when overdosed. Because both copper and formalin are toxic, they will make it impossible to keep a running biological filter so you'll need to have several days worth of water changes ready to perform perhaps 25% every other day, perhaps more. You have a set of compounding problems here that will keep you on your toes... keep the water quality as high as possible... diligence will prevail.> Thanks once again, Christy
<Good luck. Cheers, J -- >