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Queen Angel system. 10/31/15 Adult Queen Angel Questions Hi Bob !!! I need your advice regarding my adult Queen angel. I had my Queen angel for one week and up to now, she refused to eat all kinds of dried food including frozen krill. There're a lot of "coaches" I mean fishes like damsels and tangs) around and hope that she will learn from them but she didn't. What should I do? <You state this is an "adult" specimen? Better to start with juveniles, sub-adults... as they are not so finicky about eating novel foodstuffs... Do you have plenty of live rock? If not, I would add more, quick, from the tropical West Atlantic (rather than from elsewhere)... hoping there are materials (sponges, tunicates, algae mainly) that this fish recognizes as food, and that the rock modifies the water/environment more to this fish's liking... otherwise, keep trying all different types of foods, perhaps soaked in a vitamin prep. ahead of offering> How long can she go without food or can she find food in my reef aquarium? <Perhaps a few weeks> Secondly, my queen angel doesn't like to swim out in the open like the rest but instead like to stay in one or two location. She doesn't appears to be sick. Is this a normal behaviour ? <Normal for a Holacanthus ciliaris that is "stressed" from capture, moving, being held in a very small space in "weird" surroundings...> Your articles regarding this species also stated that " The species is found foraging and hiding around rocky reefs, not in open, upper waters or over sandy bottoms. Provide some similar habitat." Could you kindly clarify? Thanks. <A note that this Angel requires plenty of cover to duck into, and forage on and about. Next time (if there is one) start with at most a four inch long specimen. Bob Fenner> Questions re Queen Angel Reef Safe Index... Hi Bob !!! I have two questions for you regarding the Queen Angel. Firstly, is the queen angel reef safe? <For a very large system... with lots of filtration... live rock to nibble on tunicates, sponges otherwise... maybe> I saw them in two of the LFS that I visit regularly and all the corals in the tanks are not damaged at all. Am I right to say that they're reef safe? <All animals to an extent are "reef safe"... but not really the large marine Angels... they are all subject/suspect to nibble, sample, tear up sessile invertebrates for... food, fun, experience...> Secondly, since they're known to be disease resistance, does this mean that they will never get any disease at all in an infected tank ? <Certainly not my friend... perhaps better to consider that they (Holacanthus ciliaris) are inclined to "show" the effects of parasitic, infectious diseases later than other types of fishes...> Please advice. <Be seeing you. Bob Fenner> Tropical west Atlantic Thank you for responding to my question about my Queen angels happiness. You suggested going to a more Tropical Western Atlantic setup. I having some trouble finding fish from this area. I have found that the Sergeant Major damsels live there. I've read that its hard to keep this damsel in shoals, is this true? <Shoals? Yes hard to do so unless you have a very large aquarium... for all members of the genus (Abudefduf)... > I would greatly appreciate some more ideas on other fish from the western Atlantic. <Have just come back from diving, filming there... have you perused the section on our site re this regions aquarium life?: http://wetwebmedia.com/twafwgv1.htm A section of my latest book...> My Queen is about 5" from head to tail and she grew 1" in a years time. If he/she continues to grow at the rate it will take 13 more years to reach her full growth, right? <Umm, no... this fish is being stunted in your system... it will likely only grow about another inch total... within a year or two. Bob Fenner> Will she attain 18" in an aquarium? <In a very large one (thousands of gallons), yes> Thanks, Tim Queen Angel, Quality of Life Issues I have had a Queen Angel for a little over a year. When I first Bought her I put her in my 55, knowing that I would have to put her in an larger system. Six mouths passed and I bought a 90 gallon. Since then I have come to find out that you recommend a much larger system. Right know I have a Miniatus Grouper, a Niger Trigger, Snowflake Moray, and the Queen. She has grown maybe an inch, so her growth seems slow. <To what size now? An inch in six months is about right. Don't think this specimen has been stunted by the environment> She's a slight bully but not bad. I assuming that she feel's crowded. Anyway my Question is if I remove the other inhabitants will she be happy in this tank buy herself for the duration of her life? <Hmm, define "happy"... May I share a bit of my understanding of the universe? To me "truth" is what is in keeping in line with our nature. Beauty is its semblance, goodness is its quality, and happiness is its sensation. Is living in a ninety gallon system w/o tankmates "sensorially enlivening" to this fish?> Or do I still need the larger system. Thank you for your time. -Tim <I would say a larger system, other fishes to interact with, perhaps something in the way of a tropical western Atlantic biotopic arrangement would allow your Queen to be happier. Bob Fenner> Queen angel Hi, what do you think about a queen angel in a 45 gal. Will it work? <The adult size of this fish is nearly a foot long and as such would be inappropriate to keep it in a tank this size. Even if purchased small, it would be better off in a large aquarium. Its always best to plan for the long term. Responsible aquariology with living animals. Anthony> Appropriate Tank Size Hello. Good Evening.<Hey there! Phil here!> I would like to get a queen angelfish.<Very pretty fish!> I have tried to find out as much information as I could before I got one. I read in "Marine Fishes" by Scott Michael that the minimum size for an aquarium to house this fish is 180 gallons. So I bought a 240 gallon aquarium thinking that it would be happier in a larger tank. Now I read in the angelfish portion of WWM that "a few hundred to several hundred gallon" tank is necessary. Is that absolute? Do you think that a 240 would be acceptable? I really had my heart set on this fish, but I don't want to be cruel. I know that it would be OK for a while, but would it be OK into adulthood? If not, how about an Emperor Angel? Thanks. Steve <Talked with Ananda about this for a while... A queen angel reaches around 17 inches. I believe your tank is 24 inches wide. That's kind of tight for an active fish. Ananda's rule (mine too) is that an active fish's tank should be 6-8 times their adult body length. So a Queen Angel's tank should be around 150 inches or more. These fish are very active and will swim like crazy. Size does matter! I think you can get away with a Emperor Angel if you keep high water quality, don't over feed, and keep a lot of open swimming space. Water should be perfect, these fish have a way of letting you know when they are stressed!! Remember Emperor Angels are tough to keep, much harder then say the Queen Angel. You need to be on top of them, watch for any signs of distress. Hope this helps! Phil> Re: question on queen angel Hello, I've got a 72 gallon setup with 50 pounds of live rock, a 5" yellow tang,4"regal tang,3"Picasso trigger , 1" clown and my 2" queen angel. I was just wondering when will I have to get a bigger tank and at what size do they change into the adult. thank you <ASAP as in now... your fishes are already mal-affected psychologically from being crowded... they will be less colorful, more aggressive, more susceptible to disease till moved to larger (like three times the size you currently have) quarters. Bob Fenner> Is it too big? Z. desjardinii vs. H. ciliaris in a 125 >I recently sent an email asking about keeping a queen angel H. ciliaris in a 125G tank, 72" x 18" x 22". I was emphatically told that a tank this size was far too small for a queen angel. >>Hmm.. a matter of opinion, here. I think that, while small, it could work. Of course, larger would be better, but the H. ciliaris is an 8" fish, that wouldn't exactly mean you were cruelly stuffing it into a tank it couldn't even turn around in. >There was some mention that it MAY be too small for the planned 2" Z. desjardinii I plan to have. >>FAR more so than the H. ciliaris! The queen will hit about 8", as I said, whereas the Z. desjardinii will be close to DOUBLE that size! Not to mention the fact that the tang will want/need *far* more in terms of swimming space than the angel. If it were me, I'd go for the angel before the tang. However, if you're new to all this, I'd go with hardier animals altogether. While the same size range as the queen, a blue-lined (C. septentrionalis) angel might work out a little better. >I would like to get further clarification on this, as I would never want to keep any marine life in an improper environment. Is a tank this size too small for the Desjardin tang, too? It won't be packed with LR or coral, but a nice mixture of swimming room but LR to forage on. >>As I said, much more so for the tang than for the angel. Part of the equation here is ultimate adult size, and the tang could conceivably hit 15", you see? I think it's great that you're doing research first, too, and want to encourage you and give you props for going to the trouble. >Thanks >>Quite welcome, and you might reconsider the queen angel (though I don't know who told you it would not be a good idea, depending on who it was I may or may not argue!). Marina Is it too big? H. ciliaris vs. Z. desjardinii -
CORRECTION >I recently sent an email asking about keeping a
queen angel H. ciliaris in a 125G tank, 72" x 18" x 22".
I was emphatically told that a tank this size was far too small for a
queen angel. There was some mention that it MAY be too small for the
planned 2" Z. desjardinii I plan to have. I would like to get
further clarification on this, as I would never want to keep any marine
life in an improper environment. Is a tank this size too small for the
Desjardin tang, too? It won't be packed with LR or coral, but a
nice mixture of swimming room but LR to forage on. Thanks
>>Hi, I wrote back to you last night regarding the suitability of
a queen angel vs. a Z. desjardinii in a 125 gallon tank. I
have been given information showing that the queen does not attain an
adult size of 8", but instead 18". Clearly, a tank
of the dimensions you outline above would be woefully inadequate for
such a fish. I must correct myself and state, emphatically,
that NEITHER fish you wish to house would be appropriate in this
system. I must also tell you that you need to make sure that
the animals you consider for this system should grow no larger than
6"-8", lest their health and physical and mental well-being
be harmed. You have my apologies for giving you incorrect
information. Marina
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