Weather Loach w/Bumps     9/16/17
Hi!
<Hello Wendy,>
Your wonderful website has helped me before so I'm hopeful you can give me some pointers.
<Sure.>
Ghosty (pictured below), approx 5" & 3 yrs old; 55 gal tank; co-habits w/other loaches Jake 7", Jr 4" & Tiny 2", 1 angel fish, 3 zebra Danios & a 2" Pleco. Water parameters as of this am are Amm 0, Nitrites 0 & Nitrates .25. Now that they are in the 55 gal vs. a 10 gal, it's much easier to keep the tank healthy.
<Sounds fine, though do believe Nitrate is 25, not 0.25, which would be unmeasurable with typical test kits.>
Over the last week, I've noticed Ghosty not eating as much, and about 3 days post onset of eating behavior change, I noticed lumps appearing on top side of back very near tail fin. I have noticed what looks like slime film
floating in tank & his dorsal & tail fins aren't clear, they seem somewhat cloudy or slimy looking.
<I see this.>
He seems to swim & act normally otherwise. All other fish appear healthy & not affected by whatever is going on with him.
<Indeed.>
After today's cleaning, I added Stress Zyme & Vita Chem to tank in hopes of
boosting his health.
<Neither of these "cure-alls" does much. Stress Zyme is all but redundant in a properly maintained aquarium, while Vita Chem is a vitamin supplement, but just as with humans, assuming a balanced diet, basically pointless.>
Standard PWC includes Prime & Stability by SeaChem.
<Much more useful products.>
Any ideas? Thanks in advance!
<In the short term, I'd observe. But I'd consider three things. One, physical damage. I'm not a huge fan of gravel substrates with Weather Loaches, because gravel tends to damage them, leading to skin damage and bacterial infections. Anti-Finrot medication can undo the damage, but do check the gravel isn't sharp, and also that there aren't any objects likely to have caused such damage, like jagged rocks. Cloudy fins are a classic indicator of incipient Finrot, which is another pointer in this direction.
Avoid copper and formalin where loaches are concerned, but antibiotics and products such as eSHa 2000 should be fine. The second is diet. Deformities of the spine and fins can indicate malnutrition, which while unlikely with
fish that have hearty appetites, is certainly possible if you rely heavily on one or two types of frozen or fresh foods rather than optimally balanced pellets and wafers. Finally, there is so-called Slime Disease caused by
various parasites of the genus Ichthyobodo, sometimes known as Costia in older aquarium books. Slime Disease manifests itself as increased slime production, often distinctive lumps of the stuff, as well as clamped fins,
lack of appetite, and over time, wasting and death. It's tricky to deal with, but commercial medications are available. One last thing to bear in mind is that Weather Loaches are subtropical fish -- constantly maintaining
them at tropical temperatures is probably not ideal, and will shorten their lives appreciably.>
Wendy
<Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Weather Loach w/Bumps     9/16/17
Hi Neale,
Thanks so much for getting back to me so quickly!
<Welcome.>
You’re right, it’s 25 ppm with my liquid testing kit.
<A-ha!>
Would you advise treating for both Fin Rot & Slime Disease? Is there a product available in US which you recommend for treating both? If not advisable to treat both at the same time, which would you treat first and how much time would you give it before I treat the other?
<I would try to determine which was most likely given the symptoms. Normally Finrot appears on the fins first, usually as pink or white blotches, followed by eroding fin tissue. Of course if Finrot sets in on wounds on the body, you can certainly have a situation where the fins are fine but you see white, rotting tissue around the wound. Slime Disease is not particularly associated with wounds or fins, but rather expanses of excessive slime on the body. There may be an off-white to grey colouration over the background colour. Listlessness and wasting may be associated with Slime Disease. Your retailer may have some products that work against both, but if not, choose something for Costia, and simply run an antibiotic alongside it for the Finrot. This combo should be safe, though as noted before, avoid copper and formalin, both of which are particularly toxic to loaches.>
Are the other fish susceptible to whatever’s ailing Ghosty & thus should I treat the 55 gal tank (assuming yes if parasitic but no if bacterial due to injury, except other loaches at risk of same if they get injured on pea gravel)?
<Costia can be contagious, but seems to "pop up" when fish are stressed. So while you could medicate the tank, if a hospital tank is available, and the other fish seem fine, then by all means remove the infected fish. Finrot is not contagious as such, and fish suffering Finrot can be treated separately if necessary.>
Or move him to the 10 gal tank (currently populated with 5 guppies, an angel fish & 2” Pleco) & treat Ghosty with antibiotics there? I suppose I could move all occupants of the 10 gal to the 55 gal thus making the 10 gal a hospital tank, but I fear Ghosty would become lonely by himself, which would not help him recover any quicker.
<Quite so.>
I have not looked into better foods for the loaches but will do so, I would hate to think they are not receiving adequate nutrition. They do love frozen peas as a treat but I typically just feed a pinch of Tetra Tropical Crisps and Omega One Shrimp pellets (3-4, every other day or so). I have followed your advice from 2 years ago to err on the underfeeding side vs. the overfeeding side. Any US recommendations for food would be much appreciated.
<I do think your range of foods, including greens, is probably fine. The problems occur when people use just one thing, like bloodworms, which have a poor nutritional profile.>
The water temp is kept around 75 degrees - not sure how to make it cooler than that as tank is on my main floor & Kansas does get fairly hot in the summer. I can keep it much cooler in the other seasons - down to about 65 if the angel fish can handle that.
<Understood. I would keep the heater on (your Angels will suffer below 22 C/72 F) but avoid anything above 25 C/77 F as that'll be well above the comfort zone of these loaches.>
Thanks again!
Wendy
<No problem! Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Weather Loach w/Bumps     9/16/17
Great, thank you SO much Neale!
<You are most welcome!>
Re: Weather Loach w/Bumps    9/17/17
Morning!
After researching, I have decided on either API TC Tetracycline or Seachem Paraguard. Do you have any preference or experience with either product? Paraguard seems like a “safer” or less harsh treatment but I have no experience with either, so thought I would ask for your expertise. Thank you so much for your help! :)
<Hi Wendy. Seachem Paraguard does not contain an antibiotic, so is a less specific medication. So Seachem Paraguard is probably a good "first pass" medication if you're not sure what the story is, but the fish isn't in bad shape. Antibiotics are more limited, only dealing with bacterial infections, but they are far more effective at treating such diseases than anything else. This makes antibiotics much the best choice if the fish is in a serious state and/or you're 100% sure you're dealing with a bacterial infection. Make sense? They're both good products, just different! Cheers, Neale.>

Re Dojo Tail Difference - 09/22/17 Hi Again, <Wendy> I did pick up on a difference in his tail fin however. The top pic was pre-treatment, & the bottom one is after 4 doses of Furan-2. Today marks 7 days after the 1st dose was administered. <Mmm> I can't tell if the pointy bit of fin in the bottom pic is getting ready to fall off, or if his fin has regrown something that had been missing? <Will share with Neale. I can't tell. Bob Fenner> Wendy

Tail Difference      9/23/17 Hi Again, I did pick up on a difference in his tail fin however. The top pic was pre-treatment, & the bottom one is after 4 doses of Furan-2. Today marks 7 days after the 1st dose was administered. I can't tell if the pointy bit of fin in the bottom pic is getting ready to fall off, or if his fin has regrown something that had been missing? Wendy �� <Oh, this looks like regrowth to me; while the thicker white rays are probably deformed bones (which may heal in time) the absence of fin material like 'cobwebs' between exposed fin rays is promising. Still, I'd keep a close eye on this chap over the next week or two. Do look for pinkish inflammation indicative of congested blood vessels -- often the first sign of incipient Finrot. Cheers, Neale.> Ghosty the Loach      9/23/17 Hi Neale! Just thought I'd send an update on Ghosty, whom we think may have either fin rot or slime disease. I treated the entire tank with 4 doses of Furan-2, since after doing a lot more research, this seemed to be the medication that was most recommended for those two issues. We are now 7 days past the first Furan-2 dose & his fins are not in appreciably better condition than pre-treatment, and the bumps near his tail have remained the same. He is eating better though, & acting normal otherwise. The slime shedding has decreased significantly. I would be very appreciative of what you would recommend my next steps to be. Thank you for your advice! :) Wendy �� <Hello Wendy. I'd no nothing beyond observation. Antibiotics are often all that's needed to start the road to recovery -- thereafter good water quality, optimised diet, and temperatures towards the warmer end of the preferred range are all you need for the fish to get 100% better. Good luck! Neale.>

Re: Ghosty the Loach       10/9/17
Hi there!
<Wendy,>
Just thought I’d give an update on Ghosty as things have been going fine since the end of Furan-2 treatment (final of 4th doses given Sept. 19 with 25% water change on 9/20, carbon filter added back into the tank on 9/23). Ghosty’s fins all began to look much clearer about mid-treatment, and I was really hoping that would have been the fix he needed.
<Quite so.>
However, on 10/4 I began to notice his fins looking cloudy again, and another loach named Jake has a very slightly ragged dorsal fin & tail fin now. :-/ Water parameters are pristine with nitrate being kept at 20-40 ppm as I am very consistent with PWC. Ammonia is 0 as are nitrites. Temp in the tank fluctuates with ambient room temp of 72-76 as the tank is on the main level of our home.
<Understood. I would ensure a heater is in the tank, maybe set to 25 C/77 F while medicating. Even for coldwater fish, steady warmth can be beneficial while they're immune systems are working hard. By all means turn it down once the fish are healed, but short term, I'd offer steady warmth.>
I have both Furan-2 and T.C. Tetracycline on hand so I could do either one immediately; am just wondering if a fungal treatment would be more prudent now?
<Only if you suspect fungus; scattergun approaches to medication are no more effective with fish than they are with humans. On the other hand, repeatedly dosing antibiotics may be necessary when medicating against persistent bacterial infections or in situations where some stress factor is causing the bacteria to regain their foothold even after being knocked back successfully.>
All the fish are eating & acting normally but I really don’t like the look of Ghosty & Jake’s fins. All the other fish are looking great, in fact the 3 Danios are once again looking vibrant & beautiful now, whereas before their color was faded (combination of better water conditions and Furan-2 or water alone?).
<Perhaps a little from column A, a little from column B...>
There are two other loaches in this tank & so far their fins are clear & intact, nothing looking off to them as far as I can see.
<Good.>
Thank you again for all your help! I really appreciate it!
Wendy
<Most welcome. Neale.>
Re: Ghosty the Loach     10/11/17
Thanks Neale!
<Welcome.>
I will turn up the heater while treating then.
<Good-oh.>
I have never had any experience w/fungal infections so I honestly don’t know whether it would be better to only turn up the heat a bit to 77 as suggested & watch & wait, or also dose with Furan-2 since his fins did indeed respond quickly to that treatment.
<I'd up the temperature, and use the antibiotics again, especially if they worked once already. As stated earlier: there's no reason to assume a single course of antibiotic will do the trick with resistant strains of bacteria, any more than is the case with humans. A second or third course may be required.>
If he were yours, what would you do?
<See above.>
Thank you again!
Wendy
<Cheers, Neale.>
Re: Ghosty the Loach     10/11/17
Awesome! Will do. Temp to 76 now & will commence antibiotics. Thank you again!
Wendy
<Most welcome and good luck! Cheers, Neale.>

Maybe Not Really Algae; Misgurnis dis.      9/3/17
Hello WWM Crew!
<Hello Renee,>
This is Renee, in Idaho with the human remains in the water!
<Eh?>
Haven’t written to you for a while, and I hope you are all well, but everything here is going great! The BGK is healthy, happy, and almost 6 inches long now! The Elephant Nose has filled out nicely, is eating well, and has turned out to be a gregarious little charmer!
<All sounds like good news.>
I even “inherited” a Baby Whale (completely separate tanks from both the Elephant Nose and the BGK {who are also in separate tanks from each other}) who is turning out to be a really fun little fish! We had a little “bump in the road” in the loach tank earlier this week (see attached picture), but I took this same picture down to my aquarium store, they sold me some Kanaplex which took care of the problem completely in 24 hours (I still have one more treatment to give, but the fish were clear 24 hours after the first dose). But something unforeseen happened after the first treatment and it is that event I wanted to ask you about.
This all took place in my 125 gallon which houses 7 Weather Loaches and 6 SAE’s (the SAE’s did not get whatever this white stuff was – just the loaches).
<It looks like Slime Disease, also known as Costia.>
Its been up and cycled for 2 years now. That is significant because this tank was in operation before I found out about the .5 – 1 ppm of ammonia and the human remains in my tap water. I changed the substrate when I switched to the RO water, but the tank, ornaments, filter, and powerheads, were all exposed to the creepy, nasty, water from my well. When I changed over to the RO/DI water, I did it incrementally so as not to destroy the biological filter in the tank. Regardless, for the last year, I have been battling a nasty algae that sprung up and covered the ornaments and the back wall (and only the back wall) of the tank. Originally, it was the long black hairy looking algae, hence the SAE’s who took care of that promptly. But a blackish green algae remained (you can kind of see it in the background of the picture of the sick fish), again, only on the ornaments and back wall. But the SAE’s wouldn’t touch it. I tried putting one of my Bristlenose in for a while, but I never saw it go near that back wall.
<Black slime on an aquarium is almost certainly algae. If it has a distinctive musty smell, chances are that it's Cyanobacteria. If you have a hand lens or microscope, you can look at it, and often see it has a fine, matted, thread-like texture even though it looks glossy and sheet-like. Red algae, which can be black, turns red when left in clear alcohol (hence the same, and yes, vodka should work) has a coarser tufty texture in most cases and other than a watery smell, doesn't normally smell of anything.>
So I’ve been scrubbing that stuff weekly ever since without much success. I mean, this stuff is tough – I scrub with a fairly aggressive plastic pad as well as an algae scraper from my aquarium store and I have to scrub very hard for what seems like forever to even put a dent in this stuff. Well, the Kanaplex that I used to treat the loaches is killing this stuff (I don’t call it algae, even though that’s what it looked like, because I no longer believe that’s what it was).
<Antibiotics can, do kill Cyanobacteria.>
After the first dose, ¾’s of it was gone. After the second treatment, all that’s left is a few patches here and there. And it’s NOT floating loose and creating a green cloud in the water like it does when I try to scrub it, it’s just gone (YEAY!)! I’ve been researching and the stuff that comes closest to what I had was the Cyanobacteria – but still not quite the same. The pictures I saw of the Cyano showed the stuff covering ONLY the floor and ornaments in the tank, not the glass walls at all.
<There are of course various kinds. In my experience Cyanobacteria tends to be promoted by a number of things: slow water movement, direct sunlight, high temperature spikes during the day, and infrequent water changes that allow nitrate to stay consistently high.>
The stuff I had covered the back wall harder than cement, but only the back wall and the ornaments. Maybe that means nothing, I don’t know.
<Oh, it often is significant. Sand and gravel may be at places where water flow is slower, and ornaments will certainly reduce water flow.>
So I guess what I’m asking is can you identify this stuff, could it be responsible for the sick fish, and will it come back?
<I think the loach has Costiasis, which is unrelated, and while somewhat difficult to treat, there are medications available that do deal with it effectively.>
I take care of both of my elderly parents and my father had a health crisis three days before I noticed the sick fish (he’s ok now), so they could have been suffering with this during that time.
<Possibly, but might simply be bad luck.>
The day I realized what was going on also happened to be the day of their scheduled water change and their monthly filter cleaning. Ammonia and nitrite were zero, but the nitrate test was a fairly dark orange, but no red, which I interpreted as 20 – 30 ppm (which is a little higher than normal). The tank has an E-heim 2217 canister filter and a powerhead (on the opposite side of the filter spray bar to keep the water moving on that end).
<Hope this helps. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Maybe Not Really Algae  9/4/17
It helps tremendously, thank you!
<Most welcome! Neale.>

Septicemic Golden Dojo?    /Bob's try       8/28/16
Happy Saturday Crew(aside from my loaches),
I recently introduced a group of 30 golden Dojos about a week ago. They are in a well filtered/established unheated 75g quarantine tank with airstones, circulation pump and fast growing floating plants like Salvinia and Nymphoides indica. NH3=0, NO2=0, NO3=15, temp is 74f.
Upon arrival all looked very good and active but had some ich, which cleared within a few days but by day 5 I noticed one dojo flashing. It was close to bed time so I just observed the tank and saw no other symptoms. By the next morning 6 loaches were near dead with redness. A few had bright red gills but most had very light red patches on body with zero fin rot.
I'm starting to see a few more with red and sometimes whites patches on body. My substrate is fairly immaculate. Any ideas whats causing this or treatments?
<Yes; either something/s that happened before you received these Dojos (thermal shock, ammonia burn et al) and/or something/s that are toxic in this system. Was there life in this tank before? Do you use chemical filtrants? Other materials on a regular basis; prophylactic treatments?>
I have noticed the loaches are hauling up on floating plants nearly out of water, could there be a irritant. I dropped a chop stick in the tank accidentally for 24hr the day before symptoms showed up but cant see how it could be related.
Thanks
<Not the hashi... maybe the rock... I'd do a bio-assay (taking some water, and separately substrate, rock...) and test with a fish, simple invertebrate in other tanks... For the present Dojos, I'd place a unit of Chemipure in the filter flow path, and likely a pad of PolyFilter as well (to hopefully remove whatever is causing the issue here, spiff up water
quality so the remaining ones might recover. IF I were there day one, I would have raised the temperature five degrees F. and treated w/ a Furan compound, 25 mg/gal every three days with a water change of 25-50% between each treatment for three rep.s Bob Fenner, who has seen/lived breakdowns of Dojos several times.>
Septicemic Golden Dojo?   /Neale's go       8/28/16
Happy Saturday Crew (aside from my loaches),
<Hello Brandon!>
I recently introduced a group of 30 golden Dojos about a week ago. They are in a well filtered/established unheated 75g quarantine tank with airstones, circulation pump and fast growing floating plants like Salvinia and Nymphoides indica. NH3=0, NO2=0, NO3=15, temp is 74f.
<Understood.>
Upon arrival all looked very good and active but had some ich, which cleared within a few days but by day 5 I noticed one dojo flashing. It was close to bed time so I just observed the tank and saw no other symptoms. By the next morning 6 loaches were near dead with redness. A few had bright red gills but most had very light red patches on body with zero fin rot.
I'm starting to see a few more with red and sometimes whites patches on body. My substrate is fairly immaculate. Any ideas whats causing this or treatments? I have noticed the loaches are hauling up on floating plants nearly out of water, could there be a irritant. I dropped a chop stick in the tank accidentally for 24hr the day before symptoms showed up but cant see how it could be related.
Thanks
<Loaches don't always ship well. Using antibiotics can be a good way to pre-emptively treat some of the bacterial infections they bring with them from the fish farms. Tetracycline is often used with loaches for external red sores, and that'd be my first suggestion. I'd also review the tank for any potential sources of poisons, recalling that Weather/Dojo Loaches are obligate air-breathers, and consequently as likely to absorb airborne toxins as they are waterborne ones. So paint fumes are as much a risk as, say, copper-based medications. The fact the fish are 'flashing' suggests something in the water, whether chemical (ammonia, copper, etc.) or biological (Velvet is the classic cause of flashing, alongside Whitespot, though Whitespot is more immediately obvious whereas Velvet can sometimes attack the gills without being visible anywhere else). Review, and act accordingly. Good luck, Neale.>

Re: Septicemic Golden Dojo?      8/28/16
Thanks for the reply back guys. This tank was cycled and had a large Syno in the tank that was keeping tank cycled but was removed 48hrs prior.
<Ahh>
I did a 50% change this morning and 6 more causalities. What is odd, is they are developing symptoms so quickly. They've gone from outwardly looking healthy to very sickly in 24hrs.
<Again; and with more confidence, these fish were challenged ahead of your receiving them. ALL the fish in that batch are very likely suffering the same effects>
Can't think of any airborne pollutants or in tank pollutants for that matter. On top of all that I just purchased a 2nd hand 240g corner unit looked to be in mint condition and once home I fill tested it and its leaking like a sieve. Argh
<Yikes! When it rains....>
I do appreciate the feed back. I hope your weekend is better than mine. Thanks
<Welcome. DO try the Furan/Nitrofuran... it may save some of the Loaches.
Bob Fenner>