FAQs on Centropyge Angelfishes Disease/Health
3
FAQs on Dwarf Angel Disease:
Dwarf Angel Disease 1,
Dwarf Angel Disease 2,
Dwarf Angel Disease 3,
Angels and Butterflyfishes & Crypt,
FAQs on Dwarf Angel Disease by Category:
Diagnosis,
Environmental, Nutritional,
Social, Trauma,
Pathogenic,
Genetic, Treatments
Related Articles: Centropyge
Angels, C. loricula/Flame
Angel, Lemon/y Dwarf Angels, A
Couple of Lemons; the True and False/Herald's (nee Woodheadi)
Centropyges, Potter's Angels, Reef
Safari! Keeping Multibarred Angelfish By Alexander
Thomasser,
Related FAQs: Best
FAQs on Centropyge, Centropyge Angels
1, Centropyge Angels
2, Centropyge Angels 3,
Centropyge Angels 4, Dwarf Angel Identification, Dwarf Angel Selection, Dwarf Angel Compatibility, Dwarf Angel Systems, Dwarf Angel Feeding, Dwarf Angel Reproduction,
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Angelfishes for Marine
Aquariums
Diversity, Selection & Care
New
eBook on Amazon: Available
here
New Print Book on Create Space: Available
here
by Robert
(Bob) Fenner |
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Coral Beauty Angelfish 12/11/19
Hello
<Hello>
We recently had a coral beauty angelfish become sick and die. We removed the
fish just as he died. Are you able to identify what the disease is from these
photos? It appeared to be white fuzz and fin rot since the side fin deteriorated
away.
<Does look like Lymphocystis, a virulent disease especially common in tanks
where fish are already stressed due to poor water quality, unfortunately it has
no cure, the only option is to improve the fish health through good nutrition
and vitamin supplements, in addition to maintaining pristine water conditions in
a stress-free tank.>
Thank you for any help!
<Most welcome. Wil.>
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Coral beauty hole in the head 11/16/19
Hello Crew! I’ve had this Coral beauty in my DT (90 gal) for almost a month. On
the 4th day I noticed few fine white dots on his fins, then on his head, which
basically never totally disappeared (very fine, like fine salt),
<Just on the head? I'll assume this is what you mean/intend.>
barely visible without a magnifier and a flashlight, and of course my first
thought was ICH, but my tangs were spot-free.
<Not Crypt>
I have to mention here that I am fighting black ich (had it on my tangs) with
PraziPro in my DT.
<Simple freshwater baths (pH adjusted) will rid them of Paravortex. This is gone
over on WWM. Search for it>
The CB never ate very well (noticed white stringy feces the second day I put him
in the DT), sometimes he would grab food (frozen food) just to spit it out
later. He was swimming normally, picking at the LR, not showing any anxiety,
displaying normal colors, but he got really skinny.
<Mmm; I'd have treated en route (in isolation, quarantine, treatment tank) w/
Metronidazole along w/ the Prazi>
The other day I noticed a white spot (2-3 mm large)on his forehead, right in the
middle, between the eyes and the dorsal fin (the picture I managed to take is
pretty blurry).
<Nothing attached or linked>
Today the spot was a little larger and white, it looks like the skin went off
and you can see the bone!
<Not good>
He hides most of the time, and surprisingly he came out for food, didn’t really
eat, but he is hungry and starving. My questions to you are: is this treatable,
and with what medication?
<Mentioned above. I'd also add Selcon or equivalent to offered foods and the
water itself>
Any chances he could recover?
<Some>
And do you believe this may be contagious?
<Could be...>
Thank you again for your help! Cristina
<Do send along the pic. Bob Fenner>
Help with a new Potter’s Angel
8/24/19
Hello WWM Crew,
<Hey Gil!>
Hope you all are well!
<Cheers>
I am contacting you today with regard to a new Potter’s Angel. I purchased it
from Live Aquaria Diver’s Den, and he will be going in a 90 gallon Hawaiian
endemic SPS tank.
<Neat!>
After doing some research on this site and elsewhere, I’m wondering if my normal
quarantine procedures need to change for this fish.
<Let's see>
I typically only treat with Praziquantel, and observe the fish carefully for ich
for another two weeks after completing the Prazi treatment. This is done in a
2’x1’x15” tank, with a seeded sponge filter from my sump, and the smallest piece
of live rock I can safely remove from the DT. If I dose anything other than
Praziquantel, I know these are both gone forever but the live rock makes too big
of a difference in the fish’s health for me to ignore. There’s also a couple pvc
elbows for hiding in.
<Okay>
I know this is not enough space for my new angel (2.75”) and Potter’s are prone
to sudden stress related deaths. He appears healthy after 24 hours of
observation, other than attacking his reflection most of the day. Do you think
it would be wise to truncate the QT procedure and move him straight to display
in this particular case?
<I do count this Centropyge as one of the species that is generally better to
"expedite" through quarantine. UNLESS there is/are compelling reason/s otherwise
(apparent damage, disease), the majority of times it is better to use a simple
pH adjusted freshwater bath to reduce the possibility of external pathogens and
place new Potter's directly to the display/main tank.>
Thanks,
Gilbert
<Some background re here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/dips_baths.htm
and the linked files above. Bob Fenner>
Re: Help with a new Potter’s Angel 8/25/19
Hi Bob,
<Gilbert>
Thanks for the quick response!
<Welcome>
I heeded your advice and the Potter’s is now in my DT.
Unfortunately, now I have a second issue- my Kole tang is rather furious about
his introduction. Seriously, I haven’t seen aggression like this since keeping
Mbuna Cichlids years ago. I’ve added tons of fish since having the tang and
there was never an issue- frustrating it targeted such a sensitive fish!
<Happens... do occur in same areas, are competitors for space, algae... >
I’ve already tried rearranging aquascape to no avail. Any other tips?
<Catch the Kole (two nets, maybe two people) and place it in a floating plastic
colander (yeah, a pasta et al. strainer) for a day... with the lights out.
Likely will allow the Potter's time to become established, take some of the
vinegar out of the Ctenochaetus. BobF>
API Fish Medication... Mainly Metro-, Prazi-
8/24/18
Hi Bob,
<Hey Branko>
I've been having issue obtaining Metronidazole and Praziquantel locally. I was
thinking of trying out API General Cure, if manufacturer is to be trusted it
contains nothing but Metro and Prazi and is very effective in treating parasitic
worms on the fish.
<The Prazi/quantel is... might be cheaper if you're using very much to just buy
from a pharma source. I think Hikari sells it in bulk if you have a distributor
locally>
I've found a new supplier which im overall happy with except some of their fish
come with some form of Monogeneans (if im not mistaken).
<VERY common>
Fresh water dip usually takes care of it, however its way too much stress for
some fish and I'd like to avoid losing fish due to that stress.
<Understood>
After reading up on API general cure I've noticed they have wide variety of
other medications in their offer, are they any good? If yes which are worth
looking into?
<All their "older" offerings are efficacious. DO avoid the more modern "herbal"
"fixes"... they're shams>
Other than that I've seen Everything Aquatics advertising
similar medication blends, as well as 100% pure active ingredients. This is my
second choice, simply because I believe it will be easier to clear API's
products on customs. Please advise on what would you use if customs is not
something to worry about.
<My take on all is posted on WWM. Do you have a copy of Ed Noga, Fish Disease,
Diagnosis and Treatment? Either the 1st or 2d edition is highly recommended as
a/the ONE source for reference>
Ps. I have discovered that Centropyge Angels can be easily kept in CU, when
introduced slowly, 0.02ppm per day, and with a chelated CU mix with 16/1 ratio
of CU/citric acid (hope this helps your readers) :)
<Ah yes; I thank you>
Looking forward to your much valued advice.
Ps Happy Birthday! :)
B.
<Ahh, again, appreciated. Bob Fenner>
Re: API Fish Medication; now Prazi avail., Centropyge dis. pic.
8/24/18
Hi,
<Bran>
Thank you for swift reply.
<Sure>
Our local pharm company charges 350$ for 25 grams. While in the US 500$ 1kg.
Just ridiculous.
<?! I'd contact Hikari:
http://www.hikariusa.com/wp/solutions/healthaid/prazipro/
Their liquid prep. in one gallon is very useful... and already solubilized
(i.e., in solution)>
Ps please refer to a pictures of Centropyge heraldi which are in attachment.
What could cause that kind of damage? We did fw dip nothing fell off.
<.... can't tell much from a pic. Need sampling, microscopic examination...
Looks like a bacterially infected physically damaged area>
Fish has internal parasites it looks like it ate a whole marble
<... infection. Bob Fenner>
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Goldflake angel white stringy poop
5/5/18
Hi Crew,
<Hello Keith,>
I've a situation whereby My adult goldflake's appetite started to decline till
the stage it stopped eating completely couple of days before.
<Oh dear. Have you check environmental conditions first? Nine times out of ten,
fish stop feeding because they're stressed, and that stress is usually
environmental. For sure, diseases can be a problem, but there's no point
medicating unless you're 100% sure the environment is right, because even if the
fish is medicated, it won't get better if the environmental stress is still
there. To recap: Goldfish need plenty of space (I'd suggest 120 litres for the
first adult, and another 50-60 litres for each additional specimen). The tank
should be filtered, with zero ammonia and nitrite.
Water chemistry isn't critical, but shouldn't be soft or acidic; 10-25 degrees
dH, pH 7-8.5 are good.>
I was trying to diagnose the symptoms till I saw a strong of white poop. I
concluded it's definitely an internal parasitic issues.
<On the basis of what? Stringy white faeces imply excessive mucous production,
and while this can be a sign of Hexamita infection, or even worms, it's also a
sign of constipation or poor diet, specifically, the
absence of fresh greens. Constipated fish will be 'off their food' in some
cases, though admittedly not always, and since constipation is exceedingly
common among pet Goldfish, it's a really good idea to 'tick' this off your
checklist before medicating. Do read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/gldfshmalnut.htm
Fresh green foods, plus Epsom salt, can help a great deal.>
Given that it isn't eating, hopefully for now, will there be any course of
action which I can further consider? I've already performed medicating the QT
with Metroplex, however I've read that it may not be effective if the fishes
ain't eating the medicine.
<Seachem MetroPlex can be added to the water, and while arguably less effective
dosed that way, fish still absorb the medicine via passive drinking, and yes, it
can work. Do remember to remove carbon from the filter (if used) and follow the
instructions to the letter.>
Fish is still rather responsive but show no interest in food.
<Indeed. Have you performed a decent water change, say, 25-50% water change?
Assuming water chemistry stays the same, and water temperature changes are
minimal, this sort of 'freshening up' and have a strong tonic effect on ailing
fish. If they do perk up after such a water change, even for a short while, this
can imply an environmental issue.>
Thank you
Keith
<Hope this helps, Neale.>
Re: Goldflake angel white stringy poop
5/5/18
Hi Neale
Thank you for the quick reply. The above fish i was mentioning is a marine angel
Goldflake. Assuming it's Hexamita, will fresh water dip do any good?
Or just continue treating with metro?
Thank you
<Yikes! Misread that. Thought it was goldfish you were talking about. Any old
how... freshwater dips aren't going to help with internal problems much, if at
all. They're really about using osmotic shock to stress (small) external
pathogens before the (larger) host animal is harmed. I'd instead be looking at
medicating as per Hexamita, but also reviewing HLLE, a very common problem with
Pomacanthids given their specialist diets in the wild.
In other words, white faeces is a good indicator of irritation of the digestive
system, and while Hexamita is possible, worms might also be to blame, so think
about those as well. So far as diet goes, it's the lack of greens that's
probably the key, but whether the full range of algae types can be completely
satisfied in marine systems is up for debate; that being the case, I'd be
looking at the use of vitamins and perhaps an Iodine supplement to help turn
things around. Let me direct you to some reading.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/vitaminmarfaqs.htm
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/index.htm
I've cc'ed Bob Fenner here; he's far more knowledgeable re: marines than me, and
he'll pick up on anything I've overlooked. Cheers, Neale.>
Goldflake angel white stringy poop
5/5/18
Hi Crew,
<Keith, am starting out fresh vis a vis Neale's response here>
I've a situation whereby My adult goldflake's appetite started to decline till
the stage it stopped eating completely couple of days before.
<Not good; and as Neale pointed out, most often an indication of something/s
gone afoul re environment... Water quality, aggression from tankmates>
I was trying to diagnose the symptoms till I saw a strong of white poop. I
concluded it's definitely an internal parasitic issues.
<Mmm; best to confirm by looking at a sample under a microscope...>
Given that it isn't eating, hopefully for now, will there be any course of
action which I can further consider?
<Do you have a separate, treatment system set up, or that you can...? MUCH
better to treat there than in the main/display system>
I've already performed medicating the QT with Metroplex, however I've read that
it may not be effective if the fishes ain't eating the medicine.
<Correct... You want/need to get the active ingredient (Metronidazole) inside
the fish. Fortunately marines (vs. freshwater) fishes do drink their
environment; hence the anti-protozoal may be introduced via the water here.
Additionally, I'd co-treat for intestinal worm possibilities. Do you need help
using the WWM search tool?>
Fish is still rather responsive but show no interest in food.
Thank you
Keith
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>
Re: Goldflake angel white stringy poop
5/5/18
Hi Neale
<Bob w/ you again Keith>
Thank you for the quick reply. The above fish i was mentioning is a marine angel
Goldflake. Assuming it's Hexamita, will fresh water dip do any good?
Or just continue treating with metro?
Thank you
<No to freshwater dips/baths for internal issues, and cautionary yes to using
Metronidazole. Search and READ re its use on WWM. NOT safe to keep exposing
fishes to. Need to treat full-strength for the duration of treatment, then no
more. Bob Fenner>
Re: Goldflake angel white stringy poop
5/6/18
Hi Bob
<Hey Keith>
Thank you for the speedy reply. Much appreciated! Ok will continue to treat with
Metronidazole (Metroplex Seachem) for the stated duration of 3 weeks days with
each treatment 48 hours apart (approx 10 dosages). However can only dose in
water as fish isn't eating :(
<Yes; again, for clarity; Metroplex by SeaChem can be used as a water-applied
treatment, formulation, or added to food (as with their Focus product)
https://seachem.com/metroplex.php
>
As to co treating with internal worms, what will be the preference? I was
thinking of co treating with PraziPro together. Will you recommend it as the
fish itself isn't eating but still responsive.
<Prazi is a good choice>
Thank you
Keith
<IF you're moving this fish, treating it in isolation I'd add Epsom Salt to the
regimen. Bob Fenner>
Re: Goldflake angel white stringy poop
5/6/18
Hi Bob
<Keith>
Thank you. Will treat with Metroplex/PraziPro/Epsom salt all together
concurrently. Tank is 120 litres, can I trouble you to advise how much Epsom
salt should be needed ?
<... please use WWM... Neale's article>
I'm afraid of overdosing, if any. Will the Epsom salt be necessary to dose once
off (Meaning i will not need to dose additional Epsom salt for subsequent water
change).
<Some; just what is removed percentage wise>
On another note, because the fish was caught in the DT with its symptoms, will
this be spreadable to others.
<Ah, good; can't tell re contagiousness w/o knowing what this actually is>
Thank you once again
<W. B>
Lymph on Coral Beauty angelfish? 12/27/17
Crew! This fellow came in with a few other fish and he had some cotton on a
dorsal ray and some minor damage on a pectoral fin. I did a FW/MB dip on
everyone and put them all in QT. The other fish didn't develop any issues
and I moved everyone else to a holding tank. He's been eating and behaving just
fine. The cotton went away after the dip and he's been healing. Now, 2 weeks
later, the dorsal ray and pectoral fin look fine but this granule on
his caudal fin showed up. I'm thinking this is Lymphocystis and I'm wondering if
there's any benefit to keeping him in QT after the 1 month mark (I have a
Butterflyfish in my DT with Lymph). Also, do you recommend any immunosupportive
treatments while in QT? Thank you!
<I do concur w/ your observation. To me, this looks almost certainly to be
Lymphocystis. T'were it me/mine, I'd pinch off (with your finger and thumb, this
bit, while enroute moving this fish to the main-display. And do what
you can to optimize nutrition and environment to help the fish fight off viral
return. Bob Fenner>
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Sick angelfish Centropyge flavicauda
2/8/14
Hi crew,
I'm in need of help! I've had my 300l tank for a year and a half.
In my tank is a red lawnmower blenny, a mandarin, the angelfish, a
cleaner shrimp, two blue sea urchins and a few hermits and snails.
The angelfish was quite shy and retiring from the start,
<Very typical for the genus in the wild>
which surprised me as a friend has one that patrols the rocks boldly.
Mine found every nook and cranny to hide in.
<What they do>
It looked healthy upon purchase and seemed fine. However, after a
few weeks I noticed the fins were getting a bit ragged. There was
no white edging, just raggedy fins. It has now for the last twenty
four hours been swimming at a strange angle, head tilted up toward the
surface and has tried to leap a couple of times too. The other
fish show no signs of distress.
What is wrong with him? Any ideas?
<Mmm, my bet is on it having a tussle, perhaps eating some "things" like
Bristleworms... I'd do a bit of random baited "fishing/trapping" here.
Read:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/polychaewmcompfaq2.htm
Thank you
Jo
<Cheers, Bob Fenner>
my angel fish keep dying please help me 12/5/12
... hey ... i just started the saltwater world and i think i am
about to go back to the freshwater world because of my tragedies.. for
some reason my angel fish keep dying. Here's a rundown of my tank ..
I have a 55 gallon long tank. plenty of cured live rock.. 1 sailfin
tang,
<Mmm, really needs more room than this; this Zebrasoma gets very large
given time; and can be/come quite aggressive toward fish tankmates>>
1 black clown fish and 2 snails, 1 is a turbo snail, the other a zebra
turbo snail. i have a heater that keeps the water around 74-78 degrees,
i have 3 power heads, 2 - 275mph and 1 950 mph .. all positioned in
different parts of the tank.
My tank has been running for about 2 months now.
<This is actually a very short period of time... the system is only just
beginning to stabilize>
algae has been growing on the live rocks and spots around the tank. I
have went through 3 angel fish, and they all had the same fate - they
come into the tank and die after 3 days of being in there. I did not add
all 3 at the same time, i only put one in and when that one died, i get
another. i went through 1 coral beauty and 2 flame angels.
<And these Centropyge require more space as well really... A 55 of four
foot length is just too narrow to give them "depth" to feel
comfortable. IF you're interested in keeping Pomacanthids in such a
size/shape volume, I encourage you to consider the "dwarf dwarf"
Centropyge species. Read here
re:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/dwfdwfangels.htm
I have been going to the fish store out in Latham, ny "Eddie's Aquarium"
and they cure their fish and quarantine them (i believe) upon selling
them.
The angel fish will usually do the same thing, swim in the tank - go
into the castle and wont come out, to eat or anything, may poke its head
out every now and then but does not want to come out.
i have a salt water test kit and i have been testing my water before i
get them and during the time i will put it in my tank. even the fish
store says i am doing well and they can't find out whats wrong. here are
my readings always.
ph - 8.2
am - 0
NA - 10
NI - 00
Salinity - 1.024
i don't want to give up but these things are expensive. please help
<Read for now; and let your system age a few more months... Bob Fenner>
Re: my angel fish keep dying please help me 12/5/12
I did notice my sailfin tang being quite aggressive to the new angel
fish i would place into the tank. do you think this is the reason why
they were dying off quickly because of the stress of the new environment
and being chased around time to time?
<Mmm, likely a contributing cause>
I decided i am going to give in my sailfin tang today and get a dwarf
angel .. so it will just be the dwarf angel and the clown fish and the
two snails.. i can monitor the tank for now and maybe around or end of
January, beginning of February i can add a wrasse? and a fire shrimp? is
this okay or too quick for that time frame?
<Keep reading; and using a grammar checker! BobF>
Lemon Peel Angel Treatment 11/10/12
Hello WetWebMedia Team!
<Brent>
I have a question concerning my Lemon Peel Angel. It has been in
quarantine for a few weeks now. I had noticed that around its eyes they
were getting very dark and appeared to be pushing out from it's head.
<Mmm, not good>
Usually you could see the beautiful blue around its eye, but the black
was appearing to be pushing its eye out. I also noticed that its mouth
had turned white, rather than its yellow color. It almost appeared like
its mouth had worn away or was deteriorating.
<This too>
It didn't appear to be any growth on its mouth. I didn't know if it had
hurt itself from bumping into the glass, because it does bump the glass
very often.
<Am wondering, why?>
My LF said it sounded like it may be a bacteria so they suggested I soak
its food in Metronidazole.
<I wouldn't do this... better by far to seek out or just do what you can
to "solve" probable water quality issues, perhaps nutritional
deficiency>
They suggested its food be soaked in a "measure" or small scoop for 5
days.
I have noticed that the eyes are looking much better and its mouth is
looking much better. Its mouth is actually turning yellow again. Do you
feel the 5 days is good enough to treat this?
<Yes I do. Metronidazole is quite toxic in successive exposure>
I also was not sure where to go from here? How much longer should I keep
it in quarantine?
<I would move this fish post haste to the main/display>
It looks great besides this issue. Once it is ready to transfer to the
main tank, how long of a bath should I give it?
<A few minutes>
Should it just be a freshwater/ph/temp adjusted bath or should I do
another type of bath?
<The former>
When I do the bath, if I was to see parasites in the water, should I
feel safe to continue the transfer or should that signal I should put it
back into quarantine?
<For flukes, back into quarantine, for treatment>
I'm getting a little confused on the key things to pay attention to when
giving a good dip/bath. I wanting to make sure I am paying attention to
the key signals along the way that tell me to stop and turn back. I
appreciate your insight. You have helped so many times. We are learning
so much.
Brent Wells
<Ah, good. Bob Fenner>
Multicolor Angelfish Not Doing Well/Centropyge Health
10/15/10
I bought a Multicolor Angelfish
<Centropyge multicolor>
online last week and I've been quarantining him in a 10gallon tank.
Up until yesterday he was doing fairly well, eating pellets/Mysis and
wandering around the tank.
<Your QT is a little on the small side for this fish.>
Yesterday, he started hiding all day and stopped eating. This morning,
he still won't eat and is breathing kind of heavily.
There isn't anything visibly wrong with him on the outside. i.e. no
white spots or sores.
Do you think there's anything I can do? He's a cute little
bugger. Do you think it's worth doing a freshwater dip just on the
off chance that he has something growing on his gills?
<First thing that came into my mind was, did you drip acclimate this
fish?
I'm thinking the fish may be stressed out from the rigors of
shipping and will need some time to adjust, especially if it was not
drip acclimated. As to a freshwater dip, unless you spot a disease
problem, I would not do, will just further stress out the fish. If your
QT is lit, I would douse the lights until his condition improves.
I'd run some carbon or other waste removal media in the QT to
improve water quality and keep observing.>
Thanks in advance
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Multicolor Angel and Ich 09/29/10
Hello All,
I've had a small multicolor angel (not quite two inches) in
quarantine for 2 1/2 weeks. She is only picking at my rotation of food
(Mysis shrimp, bloodworms, spectrum pellets, Cyclop-eeze, and a frozen
herbivore
preparation),
<Very typical>
but looking at the "kissing marks" on the decor and glass,
I'm assuming substantial nutrition is coming from the
diatoms/algae.
<And what's associated with them>
The good news here is that she is active in a normal dwarf angel way
(darting in and out of hiding, curious- but cautious when I'm
around the tank). Her eyes are clear, her belly is round and her feces
are dark green and seen on a regular basis. She has one tank mate in
quarantine, an orchid Dottyback destined for another tank.
The problem is that two days ago I saw her "scratch" twice
and then go about her business.
<Mmm>
Tonight I noticed three salt grain spots on various spots on her
fins.
(The Dottyback has no sign of infection, yet.) After 12 years in the
hobby, my gut is saying these are Ich spots, but for better or for
worse I've never had to treat an angel for Ich. After looking
through the FAQ, it sounds like there are many different opinions about
how to proceed now.
<Yes>
I am particularly concerned that the angel is dependent to a high
degree on foraging on the liverock and diatoms/algae and that chemical
use would take away this food source.
<Correct>
The quarantine tank is 25 gallons, bare bottom, with two pieces of
liverock for grazing, and some plastic hidey holes. I have two little
hang on filters and a Prizm skimmer going. I do have a second potential
quarantine tank (30 gallons) which has its own heater, but no filter or
skimmer. I have about 15 gallons of pre-made salt water on stand by.
FWIW, my display tank is a 46 gallon low light reef.
Considering the small size of this angel and dwarf angels sensitivity
to chemicals, I would appreciate any and all advice.
My thanks in advance-Tricia
<I am inclined with small Angels (of size, not necessarily species),
to especially be careful re the use of toxic medications... IF
anything, I might use Chloroquine Phosphate (one dose) on/with this
fish... but am more likely (if this were my own situation) to just do a
cursory pH-adjusted freshwater bath (likely w/o any additional chemical
presence) and place this fish in your main display. Yes, there is a
risk (always) of spreading Cryptocaryon... but there is a very good
chance that your and almost everyone's systems have resident crypt
infestations (already). Bob Fenner>
Re: Multicolor Angel and Ich 10/28/10
Mr. Fenner (and crew),
I just wanted to give a short update. The multi-color angel is fairing
well. The Ich did make it through the dip, so I decided to add a
cleaner goby to help things out. The angel and goby found each other in
about a week. Since then the Ich on the angel has decreased to the
point that I can't see any more spots. The goby is also cleaning
the wrasse on occasion, but I haven't seen any spots on the wrasse
or the Firefish.
Everyone is eating well and no one is scratching (though the goby
is
growing quite fast!).
I am hopeful that my tank has reached "balance" with the Ich.
I guess time will tell.
Thank you again for your advice-Tricia
<Thank you for this report Tricia. I do agree with the sentiment and
hope expressed therein. BobF>
Bicolor Angelfish issue.. Feeding, QT too small.
3/17/10
<Hello Tyler>
I bought a Bicolor Angelfish from a reputable LFS three days ago.
<Mmm>
I have placed (her, I think), in a 10 gallon quarantine tank.
<Too small>
This QT has been up for three weeks, with water from the main 120
gallon reef. They are not plumbed together. In the QT I have a small
amount of sand, a few small pieces of live rock, and a frag of Trumpet
Coral, Star Polyps, and a Tubeworm. These are there to test potential
'reef-safe-ness'.
<Good practice, but you will have problems here>
The problem is that this fish refuses to eat.
<Did it eat in the shop? Essential that you buy this fish already
feeding, as this is a difficult fish. Have you read here
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/c_bicolor.htm>
It is from all appearances in great shape- it swims constantly, all
around, bothered a little by its reflection in the glass. Nevertheless,
it just won't touch anything.
<It is not likely to in this setting>
I've tried 3 varieties of frozen food (2 Rods, one homemade gumbo),
many more dry foods as well, I'm using garlic, and I hang small
algae sheets in the corner of the tank.
<This fish needs live rock to pick on, and in which to hide. It will
not feed if it does not feel secure, which is impossible in such a
small setting>
I've read all the FAQ's on WWM I could find about this, but
I'm bothered that I never hear how the suggestions end up working
out.
<Have you read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/dwfangfdgfaqs.htm>
What am I doing wrong??
<The setting is too small. If you are going to try to tackle a
difficult fish like this, AND keep good quarantine protocols, then you
needed to have ready a much bigger QT system for it, with good live
rock for it to graze. If you can't provide this then you will need
to move this fish prematurely (after a week or so) to the main system,
with all the risks that this action brings>
Isn't there something this fish can't resist?
<Not prepared or frozen, no>
I'd appreciate any help you could provide.
<No problem>
Tyler Smith
<Simon>
Flame Angel's Sudden Death/Centropyge Health
12/10/09
Hi everyone
<Hello Michelle>
I was hoping maybe one (or more) of you could help me out.
<Will try.>
I have a 75 gallon FOWLR setup going for three months now. I just
recently added a Flame Angel and three days later he died. My levels
seem to be good with zero of ammonia and nitrite, and 30 of nitrate
along with around
8-8.1pH. The water has A LOT of circulation along with aeration and
about 50lbs. of live rock. I noticed that this flame was unbelievably
healthy at the store and then seemed to become sluggish after a day in
my tank. He was breathing VERY heavy for the last two days before he
died (what is the cause of this?). Do I have parasites that aren't
causing any white spots?
I do have a UV running to at least help with the parasite potential.
The only other thing I was thinking was that my salt level was about
.012 when I added him. I was had the salt low to help fight off some
Ich a few months back. I did acclimate him very slowly for about 2.5
hours upon arrival to my display tank. Could the rapid breathing be
caused by shock from major salinity differences from the fish store
tank to mine? Your feedback would be of great assistance. Along with
telling me what I did wrong and/or what I could have done different,
please answer my questions (along with possible reasons as to why this
fish may have been acting in such a manner) also if you could.
<First off, your tank is too "young" to introduce a Flame
Angel.
Secondly, they appreciate pristine water quality, and with a nitrate
level of 30ppm in a young tank, something here is amiss. A protein
skimmer is a must in marine systems and you did not mention the use of
one. Skimmers are a great boon in increasing water quality by removing
excess nutrients thereby lowering nitrate levels. Environmental stress
is likely what caused the death of your Flame Angel and the large
change in salinity over a short period of time just added to the
problem. Under stress, these angel species are highly susceptible to
Brooklynella and Oodinium infections, and it is possible the later may
have occurred. Did you notice any tan to blackish small dusty dots on
the fish?>
Thanks a bunch,
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Michelle
Re Flame Angel's Sudden Death/Centropyge Health
12/12/09
No, no black or white spots at all. If I had velvet wouldn't my
other fish have it too?
<Not necessarily.><<RMF strongly disagrees. All fishes
would very likely be infested>>
And you think it's a possibility that the heavy breathing was
caused by salinity changes and/or nitrates, or do you think it's
most likely a parasite?
<The lowered salinity was likely the onset of environmental
stress.>
And wouldn't the UV help a little bit with it, if it indeed
was?
<No.>
I am using a canister filter with bio balls and ceramic rings along
with a sand substrate. Should I change any of this to minimize nitrates
or can I leave it all alone and just purchase a protein skimmer?
<If you have a good deal of live rock, I'd remove portions of
the bio balls and ceramic rings. They can promote nitrates because of
their efficiency at denitrification.>
And if so, which skimmer do you recommend for a 90gal that is
affordable? I don't want to spend much more than $100.
<That's a tough one there especially since it has to be a
hang-on type. If I were on a budget, I'd likely go with the CPR
Cyclone BAK-PAK"¢ 2R+.
See here.
http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=CPR-2R&Category_Code=Bakpak.
You may want to pose the skimmer question on one or more of the
bulletin boards, will see other folks opinions on skimmers in this
price range. James (Salty Dog)>
Re Flame Angel's Sudden Death/Centropyge Health
12/12/09
Thanks James.
<You're welcome, Michelle.>
I have a little over 50lbs. of live rock in my 90, is that sufficient
enough to take out some bio balls and rings?
<Yes, when you clean your filter every week, remove 25% of them.
Also would help by adding another 20 pounds
of live rock. James (Salty Dog)>
Re Flame Angel's Sudden Death/Centropyge Health
1/10/10
Hey guys,
<Jason>
I forwarded this previous email so you would have an idea of what my
situation is/was.
<Is appreciated.>
At this point in time, since almost every remedy for parasites failed,
I will have to let my tank "go fallow". I discovered through
research and everyone's' help here at WWM.com, that I do in
fact have a very aggressive strain of Velvet in my tank. All of my fish
are on their way out and the ones that are living through it I will
take to the local pet store. My question is: Which number of weeks do
you think is necessary to eradicate this parasite from my tank, 6 or 8?
I want to be absolutely SURE that the life cycle of this parasite is
over and finished before adding anymore fish. Is 8 weeks even long
enough or shall I wait longer? And is this "fallow" remedy
enough to completely eradicate the parasite from my tank considering
there are no hosts for it?
<Six to eight weeks is recommended. I've seen an article where
this process could be sped up (2 weeks) by elevating the temperature to
95 degrees,
but I would play it safe and go 8 weeks.>
Thanks,
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Jason
Re Flame Angel's Sudden Death/Centropyge Health
1/10/10
Ok thanks James, but will this 8 week period eradicate the parasite
from my system considering there are no hosts?
<As Mr. Fenner states in his article, "None of these is 100%
effective in eradicating Amyloodinium from a system."
Read here.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/amylloodiniumart.htm James (Salty
Dog)>
Re Flame Angel's Sudden Death/Centropyge Health
1/11/10
Hey, something I forgot to ask.......won't the 55lbs. worth of live
rock in my tank act as a host for the Velvet? Or is it fish only? I
plan on leaving my live rock and sand bed in there, will this be ok
through the fallow period or will it decrease my chances of eradicating
the parasite?
<No, the parasites will require the fish to survive through another
complete cycle. Leaving your rock and sand bed will not only be fine,
but likely be optimal.>
Thanks
<Glad to help! -JustinN>
Bicolor Angel with cloudy eyes... improper env., no
reading 7/16/09
Hey WWM Crew!
I have a bi color angel fish. He was introduced to the tank about a
week and a half ago. The tank is a 30 gallon,
<Too small for this species>
live rock system. It has a 55 gallon tetra carbon filter on it. In the
tank are a bulldozer shrimp, goby, and valentini puffer.
<This volume is too small for a Toby as well>
(These fish are doing fine, if anything, the goby and shrimp are
happier that the angel is not harassing them today.) The live rock has
about 6 large mushrooms growing on them.
Today, the angel is in its favorite hiding spot. He did come out to
eat, but he hasn't come out since. His caudal fin is a little
tattered...
<Likely... could be the Goby or Toby>
like someone took a bite out of him. And his eyes are super cloudy. I
wouldn't doubt that its hard to see. I was reading that the angel
probably has a bacterial infection...
<Mmm, no... not first order... improper environment
primarily>
I do not have a quarantine tank. What would you recommend as the course
of treatment for the angel?
<Better world; more space, less agonistic roommates>
I was reading that Mardel has a good treatment for cloudy eyes, but
also that a simple water change might work...
<Nope>
I am worried about the other fish and mushrooms should I treat with an
antibiotic. I don't have a test kit either : (. I have never had
any problems with my goby and puffer (except for some diet and dental
issues, which have been corrected) so I have never needed to check all
of the particulars of the tank. I do 25% water changes every month when
I change the carbon.
What do you suggest??
Thanks for your continual help!
Amy
<Reading: http://wetwebmedia.com/c_bicolor.htm
and the linked files above. Bob Fenner>
Coral Beauty and Flame Angel Mystery Deaths: Possible
Cyanide in Collection Need some more details 6/28/2009
Hi,
<Hi Dan.>
Searched through the site and I have an odd one for you.
<I do love a puzzle.>
We have an established 125 gal tank Water tested normal.
<Please, "normal" does not tell me anything. Actual
numbers are what we need.>
Tank has been up about 18 months. Stock is Cleaner shrimp, 3 Peppermint
shrimp, Watchman goby, Purple tang, Clarkii clown, Royal Gramma,
Strawberry Pseudochromis, 2 Chromis, Blue Damsel, Yellow tail Damsel,
Clown wrasse, and a purple lobster.
Running 2 1500 Cascade filters 24/7, close to 40lbs of live rock.
<Are you running a protein skimmer?>
Tank is peaceful and all get along. My girlfriend (GF from here on)
bought a Coral beauty and a Flame angel. Put them in the tank and they
were eating about 3 hours later. (introduced properly by mixing water
and temperature balancing.)
<No quarantine? At the very least, you can do a dip. Read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/dips_baths.htm >
They were both eating great and picking at rocks. 3 weeks later they
both die on the same day. No signs of stress or damage on the
bodies.
<How long did the fish store have these fish before you bought
them?>
The Beauty had Ick when we first got it, but it seemed to clear up with
the cleaner shrimp and Garlic extreme that was recommend by our
LFS.
<Ok.>
We went to the LFS and they agreed to replace both fish.
<Very generous fish store.>
We had them hold the new fish for 1 month and had them both freshwater
dipped, twice. Both fish came home after the month looking great.
<Are you sure they were the same fish? Unless it is a fish that is
known for dropping dead "mysteriously" like some of the large
Angels, or some of the Butterfly fish, it is better to quarantine at
home.>
We acclimatized them and into the tank they went. Once again they were
eating well and we got special
angel frozen food. (The frozen cube type, we feed Mysis, brine,
Cyclops, plankton. We also feed seaweed on a clip) Once again 3 weeks
to the day, just like before, they died on the same day. 4 fish all
lasted 3 weeks (21 days) then died. No signs of stress or damage.
<Do you know where the fish came from?>
We have had no other fish deaths (except for suicides from jumping out
of the tank.) The only variable is the temperature range of the tank.
It can drift 76-80 during the course of the day.
<A bit excessive, but not likely to be a cause here.>
My GF really wants those 2 fish but we really don't want to be
killing more of them. We have talked to all
the locals and no one had any ideas other then the tank might need a
grounding strap.
<You can check for stray voltage with a volt meter between the tank
water and a common ground. This is not likely the cause either.>
Any ideas?
<I can come up with three possible causes. 1. The fish were
collected using cyanide, in which case, they were doomed from the
start. 2. There is something in the tank that is killing them. Angels
are more sensitive to nitrate than most. 3. Your local fish store had
some bad\unhealthy fish get shipped in.>
<Do respond back with your testing results and any other information
you can provide.>
Thanks,
<My Pleasure.>
Dan...
<MikeV>
Clownfish/Hammer Coral and multicolor angel
questions 12/30/08 Hello and Happy Holidays -
Thank you for your website, knowledge, and assistance! I read, read,
read and then can still not believe that I missed an important piece of
information or still don't understand something. I guess that's
why this is a good hobby for me. Never boring. Always something new.
<Agreed> I have been in the hobby 5-6 years and recently revived
my saltwater tank after a home remodel - tank ran with a heater, rock,
and sand for almost a year. Now I have been re-stocking and re-learning
for a few months. My 100 gal tank (black sand, lots of live rock, 30
gal sump, ASM skimmer, very small and young HOB CPR refugium) has good
water parameters (SG 1.025, T 79, Amm/Nitrite/Nitrate all zero, PH
8.1-8.2). My two primary questions: 1. I have 2 black clowns (with
orange faces) that are in the process of pairing up. Overall, they seem
to have settled down, but I still see them nipping at each other now
and again. They have elected to host in my Hammer Coral. The Hammer
seems quite tolerant of this and looks actually very well. They have
been living in this coral constantly for the past 3-4 weeks, took to
the coral about a week after it was introduced to the tank. Days 1-3
very happy and in the hammer coral most of the time Day 4 fluffy cotton
hanging from both fish Day 5 or 6 cotton resolved Days 6-8 very happy
Day 9 Small slits in fins on both fish Day 12 or 13 slits healed
entirely Days 13-15 very happy Approx Day 16 both clowns had more
severe reactions to the coral. The smaller could not close his mouth.
The larger developed a very swollen and puffy-looking face. Small clown
moved away from the coral and resided in another area of the tank. Day
18 Smaller clown can close his mouth but has a very puffy face. He has
a split lip with red around it. Extra vitamins given in his food. Day
23 or 24 lip heals but face still quite puffy and clown moves back into
coral Days 25-27 very happy (in coral constantly, nip at each other
occasionally, eating well) Day 28 Split caudal fin with cotton on the
smaller clown, face more puffy (1/2 is paralyzed?), moves away from
hammer again. Still eating well. Larger clown face still puffy (maybe a
little less?), living in coral always, eating well. (Is this too much
detail? Sorry if so). <Not too much... good to have complete
picture> My thought has been "Hopefully this will sort itself
out", <And it generally does... Percula/Ocellaris clowns do
establish relations with Euphyllias in captivity... often course
through the sort of process you relate so well here> since they are
eating well and the smaller seems to be managing his illness to some
degree on his own. The swollen faces have been for more than 10 days
now. They look very much "allergic" and not infectious. I
would like to continue to watch it and hope eventually that this will
resolve on its own. Is there a time limit for how long I should allow
this to go on? <Mmm, no, not really... Till the two species either
"agree" or not to associate> Also - the day of the open
mouth and swollen faces was the same day my peppermint shrimp was
picking on that coral and pulling on its polyps. Would the hammer have
been potentially more toxic that day? <Interesting to
speculate...> (I have since removed the pep). 2. My multicolor angel
(in quarantine day 11) developed 3 white spots (2 on the caudal fin,
one on a pectoral fin). These remained for 36 hours and then vanished.
Debating on what to do, I coincidentally broke a heater in the tank and
had to remove him in order to clear the tank of glass. Therefore, I
cleaned out the quarantine tank and have placed entirely new water in
the tank. The angel is in a smaller 4 gal holding tank waiting for the
water to fully heat and aerate. (I didn't have quite enough water
ready for the whole tank). This angel is extremely skittish, <A sign
of good health> and I question whether or not he would tolerate a FW
dip as he attempts to jump out of the tank upon any slight stressor,
although he really looks well otherwise. (During acclimation, he tried
to jump out several times, even with a lid on - also tried to jump out
when I had to net him to remove from the QT and clean the class out.) I
am on the fence of "Oh no I need to do something" and
"Let's see what happens" due to my lack of experience
overall. <I would, do default to the latter... non-action in cases
of doubt> Trying the minimal approach when possible. Do you have any
tips for doing a FW dip in a skittish fish, or would you just skip it
altogether? <As you hint at, to be in constant attendance, make sure
the dip container is covered...> When I dipped my coral beauty angel
a number of weeks ago (since then I killed her with copper despite my
attempts at careful dosing, thus my aversion to any intervention
unnecessary) I was amazed at the things I saw coming out of her and
falling off of her (flukes and such), so I do think FW dips can be
helpful. Sorry for the long descriptions. Thank you for your
assistance. Lynn M <Thank you for writing so well; completely and
clearly... There are some "extra" ideas, methods that might
be added to my long-stated dip/bath protocol. For instance, the use of
practical anesthetics (akin to "doggy downers" for canines
that need to have their nails trimmed let's say)...
"Hypno" by Jungle Labs is "over the counter", and
there are other materials that might be profitably employed... Bob
Fenner>
Flame Angel will not eat while being treated...
coppered 3/1/08 Hi guys, I bought a flame angel fish and
placed him in my 10 gallon quarantine tank. He was doing well and
eating every type of frozen meaty foods that I fed him in addition to
eating algae from a clip that I put in the tank daily. He was eating
voraciously for over a week and now unfortunately he has come down with
a case of Ich. I am treating the tank with Copper but now he has
stopped eating. He hasn't eaten for 3 days and he seems to be
hanging in with the copper treatment but I'm afraid he'll die
from starvation while I am trying to cure the Ich. Do you have any
advice for how I can get him to eat? I have tried putting some food in
the tank but he just lets it float by and does not go after it like he
did before. I'd hate to lose this fish! Any advice you could offer
would be much appreciated! Thanks, Lynne <The copper... is
mal-affecting this fish... causes it to go off-feed... I would NOT
pre-emptorily copper Centropyge, Angels period... See WWM re Copper
use, poisoning... I would summarily dip/bath and move this Flame to the
main/display tank. Bob Fenner>
Please help. Angelfish gill spine skin is peeling
off. 2/24/08 Hello Crews, Recently I'm
getting very bother with my 6" Goldflake angelfish, as its
gill spine skin is peeling off slowly showing off the white bone.
<Yikes!> At first I thought its fine as it had just injured
itself because it appear only a small dot that's peeling off
but after 2 week, it has propagated to almost the whole gill
spine. I have deal with fungus, parasite, bacteria but never have
I encounter this type of situation. I had been researching online
and reading all your disease FAQs or articles carefully but come
to no conclusion or maybe I did not try hard enough. The closest
problem I can relate to this situation is body rotting/eroding.
Does any of you guys experience any similar problems? And
what's the remedy or solution to it? <Possibly... need
more info...> I wish I could provide a picture but, sadly, I
don't have a digicam with me currently. I have the fish for
about 3 months and itself is eating well and fat. In fact the
Goldflake is the largest fish and a bully. All other fishes are
scared of him. I'm running a 250gallon setup with about
~200kg of good quality LRs. Water parameters are in check except
the fact that the nitrate is >50ppm <Way too high... a
problem/influence here> on the high side which I know is a
problem and had just set up a sulphur denitrator and waiting for
it to mature. <I'd be checking the discharge here... could
also be problematical> The other angels including 2 smaller
but fat Regal Angels and other reef-safe fishes <Pygoplites
are... not really "reef safe"...> are doing
"normal" too. Please advice, <... advise> I will
be looking forward to your professional reply. Lastly, I would
take this opportunity to thank all you guys for all the wonderful
and resourceful information provided all these while. Thank you
guys! I really do appreciate the efforts spent on these. warmest
regards, Lawrence, the Worried Goldflake Owner <Well...
I've been party to how Goldflakes are collected...
posted on WWM... Very stressful... I suspect yours has an injury
that has become infected... I would try to reverse this by way of
improving the environment (need to greatly reduce the nitrates
here) and bolstering nutrition (you don't mention) by using
Spectrum pellets... perhaps their Thera product (w/ garlic)...
This is all the actual treatment I advise. Bob Fenner>
Re: Please help. Angelfish gill spine skin is peeling off.
Now NO3 issue/resolution 2/24/08 Thanks for the speedy
reply. Sorry that I didn't include the nutrition. I do feed
them mostly spectrum pellets, Thera A together with some DIY
frozen food from the LFS as snacks. I guess I will continue with
more water change to lower the nitrate. <Mmm, I would REALLY
look into other means here... will save you much time, money,
water on the floor... http://wetwebmedia.com/nitratesmar.htm and
the linked files above.> Once again thank you for your
attention. warmest regards, Lawrence <And to you, BobF>
|
Parasite Identification... Flame angel... perhaps
env. 12/10/07 We are very new to marine aquariums, we
started up our first tank 3 months ago and have found lots of very
useful information on your site! First off our water perimeters:
<parameters> Ammonia-0, Nitrite-0, Nitrate-around 20,
<Borderline high> KH-9, SG-1.025 We haven't had any
problems so far until today when we noticed our flame dwarf
angelfish has a visible raised white spot near her tail fin. <I
see this> She has been in the tank for two weeks now and is
eating well, behaving normally (as far as we know), she is not
itching at all and is very active all day swimming around the tank,
breathing seems normal. We have attached a photo, maybe that will
help, the slight white patch you see above the anal fin is just a
reflection of light, the only patch on the fish is the big one at
the top of the base of the tail fin. We do not have a quarantine
tank, as we live in a very small apartment in Amsterdam and
don't have any space but we recently got a 15 gallon tank that
we were planning to turn into a refugium today but maybe we could
turn that into a hospital tank if necessary?? Do you think we need
to treat our fish immediately? <Mmm, I would not. I would go
ahead and add this tank as a/the refugium though> And what with?
Freshwater dip? We have invertebrates in the tank (shrimp, crabs,
feather dusters, cocoa worms) and don't want to harm them by
using any copper based medication in the main tank. We have
searched on the web for identification and cant find clear
information or a definite identification. What do you recommend we
do? Thanks for any help you can give us, much appreciated!!! Jess
P.S. Your website is amazing, thank you guys for getting us this
far!! <This mark does not appear to be pathogenic-derived...
Perhaps is resultant from a physical injury some weeks prior...
very common. If it were me, mine, I would strive to improve the
environment (e.g. eliminate the NO3) via the refugium... mud/sand,
macroalgae culture, DSB there. This spot will clear in time with
improvement of the system. Bob Fenner> |
|
Sick angel... C. argi 10/16/07 HI, I have a 55 gallon
tank with two O. clowns, one yellow goby, one royal Gramma, and a
cherub angel. About a week ago, the angel stopped eating, and his fins
became ragged and frayed looking. <Mmm, maybe the Gramma...> I
put him in quarantine, where I noticed one of his eyes was bulging. I
have been searching and asking everywhere for help, and a few sources
said he has fin and tail rot and to treat him with Maracyn. <Mmm,
no> However, I do not think that is what he has. His eye bulged for
only one day, but is now back to normal. I am almost certain he is
blind, He swims in circles all day long occasionally bumping into
things, and he will not eat at all. I have tried holding food right up
to him but I get no response. He has not eaten in almost 7 days, and I
am really worried about him. Should I use the Maracyn? I don't
think it will help, but I just don't know Charlene <Does the
system afford sufficient dark areas for this little Centropyge to get
out of the light? What foods, supplements have you been offering? If
this fish is still feeding, I would try Selcon, and Spectrum pelleted
food of sufficiently small diameter. Bob Fenner>
Re: sick angel, blind C. argi 10/16/07 Hi,
Thank you for responding to me! I submitted the question about my sick
Cherub, who I think is blind. The main system is set up with about 30
pounds of live rock, with some pieces of base rock arranged so there is
many crooks, crannies, and caves. The angel really loved swimming
through them, and the tank is taller rather then wider. I have been
feeding him a variety of Mysis shrimp, pygmy angel formula from ocean
nutrition, frozen emerald entree, and ocean nutrition green marine
algae, which I would hang on the wall. Now that he is in quarantine, he
is not eating at all, at least that I have seen. It has been 13 days
now that I have last seen him eat. He swims from one side of the tank
to the other almost without stop until the lights go out and then he
goes over to one corner and turns almost completely white in color. I
have added nothing to the hospital tank but vitamins (vita chem) and a
little bit of Entice to his food (which has no effect) I have also been
doing bi-weekly, small water changes to keep the water quality clean.
Ph- 8.4, nitrates-o nitrites-o temp 78 SG 1.023 Is there anything else
I can do for my little fish? <Mmm, perhaps a deficiency syndrome
still...> Thank you, Charlene (do fish ever regain lost eyesight?)
<Yes. Do keep trying the supplementation to foods. Bob
Fenner>
Bubbles and Lips, Skimmers and Fish Injury... Rubbing face due to
reflection 5/8/07 Good
Morning everyone! <Good morning to you.> I have two questions
that probably could be answered on the chat forums -- but I can't
seem to register right now. I hope that gets fixed
soon. <Me too.> I was fiddling with
my CPR Bak Pak protein skimmer this weekend. It hangs
directly off the back of my display tank and the little pump that came
with it seems to be failing. The original pump was a Rio 600
RVT which seemed to do an OK job, but I was never happy with the open
face of it. <Standard pump that comes with it, but does not have the
greatest reputation for reliability.> Nothing ever got
sucked in but I've always been concerned, so I got a MaxiJet 1200
as a replacement. This pump solves the open face problem,
but the air intake tubing just being jammed in the filter screen seems
a bit cheap to me. So anyway, I was experimenting with
using an air pump to force air into the intake of the pump rather than
allowing venturi action and I got good results by regulating how much
air was sent in ... and it was my intention to pump the rest of the air
into a regular air stone in the main tank ... until I realized that I
rarely if ever see air bubbles, air stones etc. in marine
tanks. So what I'm asking is if there are technical
reasons why people don't put air bubbles directly into the display
tank? <A couple of reasons, one is that they get clogged
very quickly especially with all the life in a marine
system. Secondly the popping bubbles make quite a mess with
salt spray. The first effects you more here, you will need
to change your airstone frequently here.> Second
question is about a new acquisition, a Coral Beauty that is alone in a
quarantine tank. He eats very well and is very VERY
active, spending his entire day swimming back and forth right in front
of the glass-- maybe even against the glass. He refuses to
use either of the PVC caves I've provided (one white PVC the other
black ABS) and prefers to sleep wedged into the suction cups from where
the heater used to be (heater was moved to prevent burned CB
problems). But his upper lip is a like a thick
white stripe. It doesn't look like any sort of
growth or covering like a fungus ... as much as it looks perhaps a tiny
bit swollen and perhaps rubbed. From all that swimming in
front of the glass, maybe? Does this suggest any action
other than just further observation? <Sounds like a
physical trauma, maybe a shipping injury or even a burn from the
heater. Either way just keep up the water quality to prevent
infection and observe. I'm guessing with a little time
this will heal.> Thanks again!!!! <Welcome> <Chris>
Coral Beauty Dx HLLE Rx multiple approaches
1/6/07 Hello Everyone, <Hi Carol, Mich with you
today.> I just came across your website tonight and thought you
might be able to help. I have had my Coral Beauty Angel
for about 6 months now. Right after I got it, the new
Flame Angel got pop-eye and while treating for pop-eye the Blue
Tang got Ich. <Are you familiar with quarantine
procedures? If not please read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/QuarMarFishes.htm >
Over the course of the next few weeks we lost several fish.
<Sorry for your loses.> I got the tank, treatments and fish
under control and have looking good water-wise for about 3
months. The only problem left now is with my Coral
Beauty. At the end of the Ich, when the other fish
either died or got better, it developed white divots around its
eyes and down either side of its body. His appetite and
behavior has not changed. It seems perfectly healthy,
except for these divots. I have asked 3 saltwater fish
stores in my area and no body has heard of anything likes
this. Can you tell me what it might be and what I can do
to get my fish beautiful again? <Does look like HLLE
Head and Lateral Line Erosion. Is common in tangs and
angels. HLLE is linked with poor water quality,
nutritional deficiencies, and the protozoan Octamita (Hexamita
necatrix. "Stray voltage" has also been
anecdotally associated with HLLE. To try to improve the
health of your beauty, you will want to make sure you are keeping
on top of you water changes, make sure your tank is grounded, to
eliminate any stray voltage, and try supplementing your feedings
with a vitamin supplement (vitamin C and vitamin D
especially) such as Selcon. Steamed broccoli has
also been used to successfully treat HLLE. You can also
read more here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/hllefaqs.htm and here http://www.wetwebmedia.com/hllefaqs2.htm and here http://www.wetwebmedia.com/hllefaqs3.htm > My tank is a
75 gallon fish only that has been set up for 3 years. Thank you for
all your help and time, <Hope this gives you a place to
start. Good luck! -Mich> Carol |
|
The mystery of the disappearing Colini
Angel 11/19/06 Hi crew, I have really enjoyed reading
through your website- which has provided a huge host of information for
us relative newcomers to the hobby. So a big thank you for all you do.
<Welcome> I have a 6-month old reef system: 450litres (120galUS)
70kg (154lbs) live rock with a reasonable amount of growth of stuff on
them. 3 x 150Watt MH 14000K bulbs 2 x actinic blue tubes V2Skim 1200
Protein skimmer Large canister filter with ceramic discs Heater
(calcium reactor on its way) Parameters: SG 1.023 Temp 25degC
Ammonia/nitrites nil Nitrates 5ppm Ph 8.0-8.1 Calcium 375ppm The tank
contains: 2 x Percula Clowns and a poorly but alive BT Anemone (rescued
from LFS tank- probably a mistake) 1 x Copper Band Butterfly fish that
eats anything and is really a character 1 x Powder Brown Tang A few
Emerald Crabs 7-8 Scarlet Hermits 5 x Cleaner Shrimps Turbo Snails
Various softies and a few LPS and my trial SPS 12cm Maxima Clam (which
is very cool) Derasa Clam 2 x Serpent Stars <Mmm... the chief
suspects here> On Monday I saw a 3 1/2" Colini Angel at the LFS
and the owner was a little concerned it wasn't eating. <Is a
large specimen... too big for collection if I had been in the water>
I went home, read up what I could about this rare and difficult fish,
then went back to the LFS, took pity on it and took it home. To cut a
long story short, I stupidly put it straight into my main tank in the
hope it would eat off the LR, which it appeared to do, taking up
residence in a small rock cave <Another clue> near the substrate.
It was very shy and didn't come out to feed but I thought just give
it time and it might become bolder. Anyway, it didn't really
explore much. The Copperband was a bit nosey, but didn't hassle it.
The Clowns and Tang left it alone completely. I fed it a little with
target feeding of a mixture of Mysis, enriched brine shrimp, fresh Nori
and angel mix frozen, each morning and evening. I saw it eat some of
the food. Unfortunately, the cave then filled up with hermit crabs and
the emeralds looking for an easy feed! <Likely so> And now it has
completely disappeared. I have dismantled as much of the LR as I can
without causing too much damage and stressing the other fish, but it is
absolutely nowhere to be seen. I've looked around the tank in case
it has jumped. <Good> I've used a torch/flashlight to explore
the caves and other hiding places, and it has just gone. Weird and
scary. I've never had a disappearing fish before. So, the
questions... 1. Do you think it might just be hiding very, very well?
<Not likely, but a small possibility> 2. If so, do I need to try
to find it, to coax it out to feed? <Mmm, no, I would not... if
it's still in there, it will come out when/if it wants to> 3.
Could I have a hitchhiker, such as a mantis (if so, it would be the
first fish take- but we've had some turbo snails taken- probably by
the crabs)? <Yes... though I suspect the Brittlestar/s> 4. If it
has died, how essential is it to remove the body from the tank, or will
the clean up crew, well, clear it up? <This latter... it's very
likely already gone... you might discern a slight "blip" in
your measures of nitrogenous metabolites... might not...>
Dismantling the LR will be a real drag, as the corals are all
Milliputted in. <Like this term> Thanks so much for all you do
for us hobbyists! Best wishes, Steve Spicer Milton Keynes, UK <Mmm,
please do read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/brittlestarcompfaqs.htm
This Centropyge might have perished from "stress" alone...
and the consequences would be about the same as you relate... the
opportunistic piscivorous invertebrates would consume it, the
decomposing microbes in your system do the rest... readily/quickly...
Not to worry re chemical, physical consequences in a system of this
volume, gear-make-up, maintenance. Bob Fenner>
C. eiblii on the fritz - 11/11/06 Hi WWM
crew Sorry for all these questions, but this morning when I woke up and
turned on the fish light my Centropyge eibli was bloated by his pelvic
and pectoral fins. I fed them their normal three times today
and he still eats, but he has a weird swim. Should I do
anything special for him or just see how it goes because he is still
eating? Thank you so much! <... please read here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/dwfangdisfaqs.htm and the linked files
above... Perhaps a vitamin/supplement addition to the food... maybe the
use of an antibiotic. Need to discern a/the root cause/s here. And
address them. Bob Fenner>
Re: C. eiblii on the fritz - 11/13/06
Thank you for your response. He died this morning he was in
my 30 gallon tank, but was going to be upgraded to a 50
gallon. I can not find the body is it okay to leave it in
the 30 gallon tank or should I move all the live rock to look for it?
Thanks <A body this size, in this volume water... I
would dismantle the rock, remove it. Especially if there is other
livestock. Bob Fenner>
Centropyge eibli -
10/18/06 Hi Wet Web Media Crew < Good day to you sir. > I
have a question about my Centropyge eibli he has been in quarantine one
month and about 3-4 days ago I moved him into the main
tank. He is about 1.5". He is eating
good. I feed my tank Mysis shrimp, plankton, a carnivore
mix, emerald entree( a mix of algae foods), squid, brine shrimp as in
occasionally treat, flake food, an algae flake food, and a saltwater
mix. My Centropyge eibli is not scratching, not
lethargic, or do anything that would make you believe his is
sick. He just has these like blackish markings on him that I
noticed 2 days ago. They do not appear to be any
worse. There is no aggression towards the eibli in the
tank. These markings are black, I can not tell if they are
on the inside of the body or his scales, but you can see them, they are
pretty small and there is one on each side of his bodies in different
places one by the upper dorsal fin and one around his torso
area. They almost look like scraps, but I am not
sure. I have read all the FAQs on disease and selection
about Centropyge. I just want to make sure this is not
abnormal like they are just markings and no disease. Thanks for your
quick response. < From what you describe I would not be too
concerned. You may be observing a stress response from the move to the
new tank, or healing wounds possibly received while trying to find a
nice hiding spot in the rocks. Just observe for change and be prepared
to pull it out if stops feeding, looks worse, shows signs of disease
etc etc... > P.S. I could not get a picture of him because every
time I would get close enough to take a pick he would come out of the
rocks and dart back in because he saw me. < A good sign! Environmental awareness is a good indicator of health. Best of luck to
you! - Emerson >
Centropyge eibli - 10/19/2006 Hi Wet Web Media
Crew <Hi MacL here with you today,> I have a question
about my Centropyge eibli he has been in quarantine one month and about
3-4 days ago i moved him into the main tank. He is about
1.5". He is eating good. I feed my tank
Mysis shrimp, plankton, a carnivore mix, emerald entree( a mix of algae
foods), squid, brine shrimp as in occasionally treat, flake food, an
algae flake food, and a saltwater mix. My Centropyge eibli
is not scratching, not lethargic, or do anything that would make you
believe his is sick. He just has these like blackish
markings on him that I noticed 2 days ago. These markings are black, I
can not tell if they are on the inside of the body or his scales, but
you can see them, they are pretty small and there is one on each side
of his bodies in different places one by the upper dorsal fin and one
around his torso area. They almost look like scrapes, but I
am not sure. I have read all the FAQs on disease and
selection about Centropyge. I just want to make
sure this is not abnormal like they are just markings and no
disease. Thanks for your quick response. P.S. I could not get a picture
of him because every time I would get close enough to take a pick he
would come out of the rocks and dart back in because he saw me. <It
sounds like his behavior is normal. It could be where he has scratched
himself as he's adjusting to the new tank. Bumping into things when
he makes dashes or it could be an internal parasite as well. I
wouldn't go into high worry mode until he stops eating or has more
problems but I would cautiously watch him as well. I really
like eibli angels for their personalities after they settle. But I have
seen some of the Centropyge have problems with parasites that manifest
in this way. You feed a good mix and blend of food so that should help
and with your tank stable that will help as well. I might consider
adding garlic or some type of garlic food as a preventative, I've
seen it work. Should they become larger or more prominent
some other type of action might be needed.>
- Coral Beauty Eye Cataracts? 7/27/06 - Good
Morning Gentlemen. <Good morning.> My husband purchased (for me)
a previously owned 75g reef tank around May 7th, 2006 and one of
it's occupants is a Coral Beauty Angel. The previous
owners had this tank for 3 or 4 years so I'm sure on the age of the
Coral Beauty but I noticed that she had small white marks (for lack of
a better description) on the lower part of her eye or eyelids when we
got her. She seems very healthy. She eats well,
is very active and interacts well with the other fish. However,
I've noticed that these "marks" are slowly getting
larger. Could they be cataracts? <They could be, but
it's difficult to be certain. If the white areas seem to be
growing, do keep a lookout to make sure that it's not just cloudy -
cloudy eyes are typically a reaction to water quality issues. You may
want to run a test or two and prepare a water change, just in case.>
Any assistance would be appreciated. Louise <Cheers, J -- >
Angelfish and white spot, spare the formalin
7/7/06 I purchased a Coral Beauty Angelfish 2 weeks
ago. He is in QT. Yesterday, I saw what looked
like a white pimple on the front of his pectoral fin. This
morning the white spot is gone but his fin is frayed. I
thought he might have Ich but I am not sure since it was one spot and
was gone today. He is eating normally. Should I treat with
Formalin or observe longer? <The latter. Is not likely
parasitic/pathogenic... the formalin is far likely a source of trouble
than help> If I treat with Formalin, do I just do a dip
or do I also treat the QT? Or is there something else I need
to do? I have looked through FAQ's but still was not
sure what I should do. Thanks much for your help, Jana Gibbs <I
would not use the formalin here. Too toxic, too stressful to be
catching, manipulating this Centropyge. Bob Fenner>
Coral Beauty HLLE?
7/1/06 Hi, question for you. <Hello John> I currently have a
mid size coral beauty in my quarantine system. I purchase
him 16 days ago from a LFS. While in the QT he has developed
a small patch (approx the size of a match head) on his L side near his
lateral line. The area appears to be pale in nature and
irregularly circular. At first I thought he may have just
bumped against something in the tank but now watching it over the past
15 days. It appears to have grown ever so
slightly. Also yesterday I noticed a very tiny pale patch on
the R side of his head. Is this the beginning of HLLE?
<Possibly.> I feed sparsely (given that he is in a QT) brine
shrimp and Omega sea veggie flakes once a day each. <A
poor diet such as this can certainly aid in further development of
HLLE, if that is indeed what it is.> The QT is a 15 gal long
w/AquaClear 200 filter and carbon pouch. Airstone w/pump,
heater, small powerhead and PVC piping. 1 gal water is
changed daily. If this is HLLE should I attempt to treat it
before placing him in my main aquarium or place move him in after he
finishes out his QT time figuring the better diet and water quality
available in my larger system will fix him. <You've just
answered your own question here. Better vitamin (Selcon,
Vita-Chem) enriched diet and excellent water quality are the main
factors in reversing HLLE. There is no medication, in my
opinion, that will effectively reverse this. Do read
FAQ's on this also. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/hllefaqs.htm> My main
system is a 65 gal w/20gal sump, live rock. Thanks for your
comments, <You're
welcome. James (Salty Dog)> John
Eye problem with my
Lemonpeel angel fish 6/9/06 G'day crew, Chris from
Australia here with a question for you. I visit and download as much
info from your site as I can, as I find your information and help that
is provided to be invaluable. My question for you is an eye related
problem. I have a lemon peel angel fish in a 90 litre tank, <... too
small...> and my water parameters are as follows; Calcium 350, Alk
normal to high, ammonia 0 nitrite 0 nitrate 0, phosphate 0.2-0.5 pH 8.0
Specific gravity 1.025 I have had problems with cloudy eye, which I
treated with Epsom salts which worked well. A brown algae build up in
my substrate got stirred up and the above problem come back. <Very
hard to keep small volumes stable...> I do a 10% water change every
week to keep up my water quality, run an Aqua C Remora Pro skimmer 24/7
and leave the lights off to slow algae, which has been successful, but
the eye problem has gotten worse. The eye has what looks like a hard
crust over it building up from the outside in , as well as brown
discolourisation and now the other eye is starting to go cloudy. <A
bad sign> The fish stills seems healthy, eats a lot, swims around
and through the live rock, possibly scratching and inflaming the
problem more. I have tried to be thorough looking through previous
responses to other peoples questions but I have found none that sounds
like what my fish has. I know you may have answered questions like this
before so any references or direct advice you could give me is much
appreciated. Keep up the good work and thanks for helping by providing
such a brilliant site. Kind regards Chris. <Thank you for your words
of acknowledgement. As you point out, the highly likely root cause here
is environmental... Fix this animal's world and you'll fix the
animal. In all honesty it needs to be in a much larger system... 90
gallons or more, not 90 litres... Bob Fenner>
Cloudy eye on
Potter's Angel - 05/29/06 Greetings, I have a
Potter's Angel and just noticed she has a cloudy eye on the right
side. I am treating the tank for Ich with No-Ich made by Fish-Vet Inc.
<... Why?> I cannot find any info about cloudy eye in
regards to Potter's Angel. Please help. Thanks in
advance for any help. <... Not an easily kept species... Read here:
http://www.google.com/custom?q=cloudy+eye+potter%27s+angel&sitesearch=wetwebmedia.com
cached versions... a simple Google search with key terms... Bob
Fenner>
Lemonpeel health...Splinter on back? 5/16/06 I
have a Lemonpeel angelfish with a white almost splinter like thing high
up on its dorsal fin, near the rear. It almost looks like
you could pick it off, yet looks like its embedded except for the part
that's kinda sticking out. Its about the size of a pin
head. Everything else with the fish seems to be normal, no
other symptoms at all. I have only had the fish 4
days. Should I treat it just leave it alone since it seems
to not have any other symptoms, or do think more symptoms will follow?
<I would keep an eye on it, look for any developing redness in the
area. Doesn't sound like anything much to worry
about. A pic would help. James (Salty Dog)> Respectfully,
<Robin, in future queries, do not put all the personal info below
your name. I do delete this for your privacy as these
queries are posted daily and viewed by gazillions of people.>
Robin
Possible fungal infection - 03/12/2006 Hi Crew!
I have a Potters Angel in quarantine. I have had him for
almost a month. He is in a 55 gallon quarantine that I started
with water from the main display and a power filter that I
had on the display for 2 months prior to setting up my quarantine.
<Good set-up... this is a "touchy" species for aquarium
use (by coincidence I'm out in their home waters in HI> I do 30
- 40% water changes every other day. I feed a variety of good frozen
foods and alternate Vita-Chem and Selcon. He gets Algae strips
daily. He was the picture of health at purchase, he ate and
was very alert and curious . The guy at the LFS only used one net to
catch him [I even went and grabbed another for him, but he
didn't think it necessary] <Foolish... two nets
please!> When he finally caught the fish, I thought it looked as if
his mouth was pinned to the glass with the net. He seemed fine when I
got him home, so I didn't dwell on the rough treatment of my Pretty
Angel... But then last week I noticed his fins fraying . Around that
time he lost his spunk, he was not swimming all over the tank picking
at the decor anymore. He was also not eating as well as before. He
seemed to swim more on the bottom. I started doing daily
water changes but that did not seem to help. I started treating him
with Furan-2. I was getting ready to do my morning water change after
the second dose when I noticed the Angels mouth, It looked horrible!!
It almost looked as if it had exploded! I got the flashlight out and
stared at him for an hour it seems. He has something
white in his mouth. The white stuff is also
hanging out of his mouth, and parts of his mouth look torn. I have
tried to get a picture, but they all turn out too dark. <... might
well be subsequent to the net thrashing. Arggghhhh!> I
want to save my Angel. I am not sure what course of action to take next
but I feel I need to act quickly. I know fungal infections are rare but
the more I read, the more I think that's what I'm dealing with.
I purchased some Maroxy [sp?] <This is it> today and I also have
some Kanacyn, both say they treat fungal infections. I cannot decide
which to use. I need your expert opinion please! Thank you
all so much for taking the time to help!! P.S. It is 4am, I
am dead tired so I hope this letter is legible Thanks
again, Kim <Either of these materials could/can be used... if the
last, the antibiotic, it's best to try getting some into the fish
via offered foods... Bob Fenner>
Re: Possible fungal infection, Centropyge - 03/13/2006
Thanks Bob. I started the Kanacyn Saturday morn. He is
still alive. He can't eat due to the white 'growth' in his
mouth unfortunately . Keep your fingers and toes crossed
that he pulls through!! Thanks again! <Am rootin'
for you and your Potter's... a gorgeous species, but one that does
poorly by and large in captivity. Bob Fenner>
Bicolor
angel/disease? 3/4/06 Hi Bob <James today>
I'm a huge fan and love your book. <Bob thanks
you.> I have a 125g FOWLR tank that's been running
for almost three months now. My bicolor angel just started
to rub his face against some of the LR yesterday and has no physical
signs of any parasites. <May be too early to
see.> He's looks good and has been eating
fine though. Do you think this is the beginning of ICH
? <Don't know> What should I do right now ? <I'd watch
closely and at first sign of disease transfer to QT.> Leave him
there or give him a dip and QT for several weeks? I was thinking of
doing a five minute Methylene blue dip and QT with Cupramine
for two weeks. <I really don't like treating fish unless I know
for sure that they are infected. Was the fish in QT before
going into the display?> In the main tank I also have: 1
blue throat trigger, 2 Clarkiis, 3 Chromis Your help is highly
appreciated. It's a tough hobby, <Not so tough,
as long as we don't make it tough.> buts it's
people like you who keep us going ! thanks <You're
welcome. James (Salty Dog)> Peter
Coral Beauty, Pimple on Pectoral Fin--Popped? -
2/15/2006 (This is long, because there is a lot of
background. Per your WWM-etiquette page, that's how
you want it, I hope. The basic question is what I should
do about a pimple that looks like it either became a whitehead or
popped on my 3-4 week Coral Beauty in the Quarantine tank.)
<Mmm, the basic response: No...> Hi. Thanks so
much for the site. I spend several hours a week reading
the site since finding it last summer (summer
2005). Anyway, I have a 55 gallon display tank, and a 27
gallon QT, in which my problem arose. (tank specs are
below) I only have (1) 4 1/2" Tang and a 5"
Maiden Goby in my display tank (along with a sizeable cleaner
crew). Oh, I did add 5 Berghia Nudibranch(es?/i?)
<Just "s"> about a month ago to take care of an
Aiptasia problem, but I'm not sure if they are doing much or
not-haven't seen them for about three weeks, but that's an
aside. Anyway, about a month ago I purchased 3 white and
black striped Humbug Damsels and a Coral Beauty from my LFS.
Basically, my wife has been harassing me for months that I need
some more fish in my display tank, so I took her with me and let
her pick out some suitable (to both of us) community
fish. The guy at the store said that Coral Beauties are
super sensitive to changes in water, so I drip acclimated it for
about 2 1/2 hours, and the Damsels for maybe an hour or
so. I did not do a freshwater bath, particularly for the
Coral Beauty because I was concerned I was going to kill it due its
alleged sensitivity, and because I really didn't know
"how" to do it (had a couple casualties a year or two ago
leading to this fear). I just recently found that
article on using Methylene Blue freshwater dips, so I'm set
there for the future. The largest of the three Damsels began
pestering the smaller two almost immediately upon putting them in
the QT (I have about 7 pounds of LR, for hiding,
etc.). The day after I bought the fish, I noticed that
the Coral Beauty had a 1/4" to 3/16" pink pimple looking
thing where its left pectoral fin connects to its body (couple
photos at the following URL, but it's not very photogenic).
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/russjohnson/album?.dir=850f&.src=ph&store=&pro
did=&.done=http%3a//photos.yahoo.com/ph//my_photos <I see
it, but just barely> I searched your site, and couldn't find
anything that made me concerned about the pimple, so I just kept an
eye on it. I thought it may have been from a lack of
iodine, because this tank had been fallow for at least two or three
months (running, but with 1" of live sand, the rocks, a large
Penguin Charcoal filter, and some snails). My Tang got
Ich in October '05, so I moved him and the Goby up there to
treat-they both are happy now. Other than a couple water
changes, I really haven't touched the QT since they moved back
downstairs to the display tank, so that's why I added some
extra iodine and Kent's Essential Elements recently (about
5-20ml of each about 2-3 times a week). I did change the
QT water before adding the new fish and made sure the water quality
was near perfect. I thought the pimple may have been
from a lack of iodine due to some reading on the site...again not
sure, it was probably there when I bought it-moral of the story is
I shouldn't let my wife pick out fish, but this whole process
has really caused her to take some more interest in the fish, so
that's a good thing, if nothing else. Quarantine Tank Specs:
SG: 1.019 (I'm slowly raising it after Ich
treatment) <Good... 1.025> Temp: 83 (again,
lowering due to Ich treatment) pH: 8.2-8.3
Nitrates: ~20 (yes, I was surprised, I'll do a 50%
water change after this email; it was <10ppm about 10 days ago)
Ammonia: Zero Copper: ~.5 to .75ppm <Get
rid of this> Anyway, so about a week into the Quarantine, the
pimple was unchanged, but the Coral Beauty had developed Ich (could
it have been from not breaking the tank down?). <Likely the fish
had it... the tank is parasitized...> The big Damsel
had already killed the smallest Damsel (now I know why they are
called Humbugs), and will have killed the other one a couple days
later. Damsels all looked healthy otherwise,
eating/swimming, so I'm pretty sure they died due to bullying
(and I observed the relentless bullying). As for the
Coral Beauty, I figured that 3mo would have been long enough in the
QT for the parasites to die and not worry about transmitting it to
these new fish, but in the future I will break down this tank, to
eliminate the possibility of Ich transmission. My wife
wants the top of her dresser back anyway, so everyone is
happy. As soon as I noticed the Ich spots develop, I
began to treat with copper. I'm pretty sure it was
chelated copper (the kind that stays in the water longer), <If
not the fishes would be dead at this concentration> but the
package was silent on this fact. I raised the copper
level to 1.5ppm, and the Coral Beauty's condition worsened
slightly over the next couple days. <Centropyge are more
sensitive to copper exposure...> I bumped it up to
2.0 for a week or so, and the Ich went completely away in about a
week. Oh, I should also mention that I added a
week's worth of Maracyn-Two during that time, to eliminate the
possibility of any secondary infection, based on some advice I
read. The Ich on the Coral Beauty went completely away in about a
week after bumping up the copper. I checked the copper
level about twice a day to verify it stayed at
2.0ppm. After a week of the high copper levels I
concluded (based on the advice on your site) that the Damsel
developed copper poisoning (began swimming around erratically, the
next day, swimming sideways a lot, sitting on the bottom of the
tank, breathing hard, died after about 3 days of
this). Having to choose between the Coral Beauty and the
Damsel, I chose to keep up the copper up to cure the Coral Beauty
(the Coral Beauty had /just/ began to be free from the Ich spots,
and I know I needed to keep up the levels another day or two, to be
sure she was cured). About 7-10 days after all the symptoms went
away, I added a new carbon filter and a couple days after that I
filled up the plastic refillable sleeves in the filter with new
carbon to get rid of the copper. As noted, I am doing a
water change tonight as well. However, after coming home
from out of town last night my wife said that she thought the Coral
Beauty was getting Ich again. It isn't, but here is
my question-finally. She was correct that something
changed: the pink pimple I mentioned earlier now looks
just like an acne pimple that "popped". The
pimple had begun to shrink since the Ich was gone (now about 1/8
inch), and apparently over the weekend it
"popped". What my wife thought was the White
Spot of Ich is definitely some sort of substance coming OUT of the
pimple. Am I just overly paranoid here? I
have read a couple articles were you guys wrote that sometimes fish
just get pimple-type things and it's nothing to sweat. Should I
cut the pizza and chocolate out of the Coral Beauty's
diet? (Heh, Heh, just kidding) <Mmm> I have
searched and searched, is this something I should be concerned
about? It is otherwise normal, eats everything I put in the
tank (she prefers anchovy pizza), and has cleaned off
all the algae on the back of the tank, likes hiding out in the
rocks, and seems happy. In searching the site, I thought
/maybe/ it was Lymphocystis, or a tumor (that's the other
reason I was bumping up the Iodine so much). I'm not
sure it's Lymphocystis though. It seems that Lymphocystis
usually attacks the ENDS of the fins, rather than the base of the
fin. Moreover, the white spot/puss, doesn't look
like cauliflower (though frankly this isn't a helpful
description, b/c if I ever let a growth on one of my fish get to
the size that I could identify its shape as something other than a
spot, I should not be keeping marine fish). I guess when I saw the
white puss/spot at the tip of the pimple, I thought this was good
as if it is popping, but I really have no idea of knowing without
you guys' (and gals') help...what do you think? <This
spot is/was likely "nothing" catching... a pimple is a
good analogy> Should I get a cleaner shrimp for the QT? <You
could> I think I read that the Lysmata are not reef safe, so I
couldn't throw them in the display tank later,
right? What about the Periclimenes, or Stenopus? <Not
my other choices here, no> There is a Peppermint shrimp in there
right now too. Any other advice? <Learn to
treat/dip and quarantine all new livestock... investigate before
you buy...> It molts about 2x a month, and had babies in the
display tank. When does the quarantine clock
"start" now? When the pimple goes away, or
when the symptoms of the Ich were not visible? <Not following
you here.> Finally, have you guys ever heard of "Quick
Cure"? It purports to cure
Lymphocystis. ( http://www.petguys.com/pet-guys/-042781008000.html). Seems
surprising to me that there is a "cure" if it is a viral
disease... Man, so many quacks out there... <There is
no cure for Lymph... viral in origin. This material is formalin (a
biocide) and malachite green... Covered on WWM> Thanks in
advance, you guys (and gals) rule. Russ, Columbus, Ohio <Apply
yourself Russ... you'll do fine. Bob Fenner> |
|
Angel In Distress? 12/29/05 To the WWM Crew
<Scott F. with you tonight!> Bob, thank you very much for your
help about the Brooklynella/formalin but I think that my move was too
late... Now I have another problem with a beautiful and young Flame. He
is in another QT , 30 Lt. He arrived 6 days ago, is eating, and his
behavior is ok. Something is wrong because is color is becoming pale
and there white powder on is fins (not transparent). Sometimes he
scratch the pvc tubes on the tank bottom. <Hmm...could be Ich or
some other parasitic illness.> I put CopperSafe in the tank, and
will wait till tomorrow. So, please tell me if I must do something
else. Best regards Flavio <Well, Flavio, if
you suspect parasitic illness, medication is not a bad idea. However,
do exercise caution with copper and Centropyge angels, which are
notoriously sensitive to it. Monitor copper levels constantly and
adjust as necessary to maintain a proper therapeutic dosage. Be ready
to remove the fish or dilute the copper levels if the fish shows signs
of distress ("burning" fins, loss of appetite, etc.).
Formalin is preferred with these fishes. If you are very attentive, and
continue observing and monitoring the copper level, you can be
successful with this! Follow the manufacturer's recommendations on
dosage and duration of the treatment to the letter. Good luck! Regards,
Scott F.>
Spots 11/7/05 Hi Crew, <Steven> Basic question: I
have a Bicolor dwarf angel that has displayed since I bought him two
spots on one his (side) fins. They are larger than the pictures of ick
that is shown on various photos I have researched on your site. Also he
has not displayed any signs of flashing or scratching, he is breathing
fine, grazes all day on live rock, and eats well. He is active and not
showing any negative signs to suspect anything other than the visible
spots. I would estimate that the size of the spots would be equal
to two large grains of salt each (at least). I have had him now for 10
days and no change, other than he has eaten better each day (getting
used to his surroundings). Question: is ick considered very
virulent <Can be... or more "resting"... depending on
conditions, infectivity> and with this much time with visible spots
would one expect the spots to either multiply, fall off (progression of
ick), and make the fish progressively act more stressed/sick? <What
you are seeing may be pathogenic (encysted worms most likely, perhaps
Sporozoan...) but not likely "catching" or spreading...
requires the death of the host, other vectors (intermediates) to
spread> I have a 40 watt UV sterilizer, 250 gallons with 250 lbs. of
live rock, plus wet/dry, skimmer (skimming well), practice weekly water
changes, Phos Ban, Kent Activated Carbon, and refugium with crushed
live rock and Caulerpa. I keep the water very pristine (in my humble
opinion). Also no other tank inhabitants show any signs of spots,
including the ick magnet tangs (Chevron and Orange shoulder).
<Good point, info.> I feed a very varied diet of frozen angel
preparations, omnivore, carnivore, Mysis, as well as Nori sheets soaked
with Zoecon and Kent Garlic extreme. I wasn't sure if fish could
pick up a random parasite that is nothing to be worried about and not
otherwise contagious... is this possible? <Nothing to worry about
category> I don't think I will treat for anything or even
consider moving to a QT tank since there are no signs of stress other
than the visible spots.. do you agree? <Yes, emphatically>
Your comments are greatly appreciated, and as always, every one of you
are to be commended for your dedication. Steven <Cheers, Bob
Fenner>
Re: Spots 11/8/05 Good Morning Bob, <'Morrow to
you Steven> Thank you for your reply regarding the white spots on my
Bicolor angel. <Welcome> Let's for the sake of
agreement set aside the possibility that it is ick and instead focus on
that this is pathogenic, perhaps Sporozoan as you mentioned. Is
this condition self limiting? <Likely, usually so> As a general
rule do these Sporozoans multiply within or on the host fish and are
they lethal? <Generally not... lest/until conditions disfavor their
host too much...> I know from an emailed description you can only
apply your experience in rendering advice, <Yes... of a necessity...
honesty. But first and other hand...> however I think many people
see something odd, and automatically want to have the "shot
gun" approach and begin treating, often times doing more damage
than what they are treating for. <Ahh, you are wise here...
particularly "in the West", folks too often over-
mis-treat... well-intentioned, or not, doing so is a source of more
mortality than all other causes combined IMO> For this reason, I
want to always check myself with someone else and not take an
irrational approach. <Good... or at least we are in agreement
here> With the size of tank I have and the large amount of live
rock, I only want to attempt to catch this fish if I absolutely have
to. Again thank you! Steven <Welcome. Bob Fenner>
Dwarf Angel with Rotting Fin Caused by Shrimp? 10/25/05 Hi
Everyone, <Hello Casper> First of all, thanks for the great
site, I read it everyday and try my best to follow all the
recommendations you all make. First of all I have a Dwarf Flame Angel
in a reef tank. He has always been happy and never seems to have a
problem. Three days ago I added two Lysmata amboinensis "Skunk
Cleaner Shrimp" (?) to the tank. I was instantly amazed at
how the angel reacted and started interacting with the shrimp. He spent
the first couple days receiving constant cleaning from the pair. Today
when I looked at him, I noticed that one of his side fins was missing
about 1/3 of the fin. The fin does not appear to be diseased as
it is very clean looking. The fish is swimming around like nothing is
wrong. He is not scratching, eating fine, has no other spots or marks,
and this is isolated to only one fin. Do you think that he is
being over cleaned by the shrimp? Could there be some underlying
disease that the shrimp are taking care of? Do I need to treat the fish
with any medications? I gratefully look forward to any advice you might
have. <Casper, I would let nature take its course. Nothing to
be alarmed about, fin will grow back. James (Salty Dog)>
Sick Coral Beauty 9/19/05 Hi Guys <How goes
it?> I kinda feel guilty having to bother you, but I have a Coral
Beauty in need. <Not a problem, that's why we volunteer :)> I
have a 20 gallon tank (a little small) with two protein skimmers, both
for 60 gallon tanks and I'm using carbon and Poly Filter with
20-25% water changes weekly. <Sounds good> The water is 78 F,
S.G. 1.024 , ph 8.2 , ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 0-5.
<All good> The animals are 1-Coral Beauty (Sunrise), 1-Black
Clown (Dab), 1-Banded Shrimp (Aunt Tennay), 1-Turbo Snail (Wetfoot).
I've had them for a little more than a year. I was feeding Brine
shrimp with Spirulina almost exclusively (my mistake I think). <Not
nearly varied enough, and brine shrimp do not provide much nutritional
value> I'm now feeding seaweed (red and green), Spectrum dry, an
omnivorous and an Angel formula with sponge in it. <Great!>
Sunrise has fading color to the point of spottiness in places, lightly
tattered fins and has done some twitching and scraping, is losing his
appetite and hides too much now. The quarantine tank is ready but I
can't figure out if I should use it or what I would do if I did.
<Keep up the varied diet...try to get a hold of some live Mysid
shrimp (www.Reed Mariculture.com is a great source of live foods of all
types) to feed Sunrise as well. Don't make the move to a
quarantine tank until you can positively identify a
disease. This will hopefully work itself
out. Everything else you're doing is fine, so for now
it's just wait and see> Thanks for any help you can offer.
<Anytime> James <Michael Maddox>
Possible fin or tail rot? 9/7/05 Hi <Hello Jeri>
I have a coral beauty angel that is having some issues. We have a 46
gal tank. <Too small...> Wet/dry filter, 2 powerheads, and a
penguin bio wheel power filter (to acclimate the wet/dry). We have 2
clowns, 1 coral beauty, 20 red leg hermits, 7 turbo snails, 1 emerald
crab, 1 cleaner shrimp (Super cool), and a Condylactis anemone. And
about 20lbs. live rock. Water conditions are ammonia & nitrite 0,
nitrate 30ppm, Salinity 1.022, <I would raise, keep this near
1.025> Ph 8.2 & Temp 80 degrees. (which is high, we normally run
at 76 - 78 degrees). We just got back from vacation and will remedy
that problem. My Coral Beauty has what looks to be fin or tail rot
now. We thought the fish had Lymphocystis and let it run its
course. We just tried to keep water quality good and fed healthy diet.
<Good... this is what I would have done> Now the spots have
fallen off and it looks like in most of the places the spots were he
has holes. When we left him on Friday he had 2 holes in his tail. LFS
asked if he was eating, which he is better than ever, and if the holes
looked frayed. At that time they were not. LFS said it could be one of
the clowns and that usually when you have a complete hole in the middle
part of a fin that it is usually a bite from another fish. Said to
watch fish for changes. <Mmm, no... very likely is water quality
directed... from your wet-dry type of filtration, stress from being in
a small system...> Well we just got back from vacation and the holes
are frayed in the tail, the right side of his mouth is white (looks
swollen and discolored), and he seems to have a nasty sore or ulcer on
the ridge of his back. Also where he had the largest of the white
spots. He is eating and swimming better than he ever has before. We are
not sure what this is or what to do for him. <Could, can modify the
wet-dry, add other filtration moda... DSB, Refugium, macro-algae...
more live rock...> We do have a hospital tank available for him, but
we just don't know how to treat him and our LFS is closed for 2
days. Our QT is 20 gal tank with a blue damsel in it. We have a
separator net we use when quarantining a fish. Not sure what to do in
the case of treating a fish. This tank has a penguin BioWheel power filter as well, powerhead, airstone, and some PVC. I guess my
questions are: Do you know what is wrong with the Coral Beauty?
<Environment mostly, likely nutritional, social aspects
secondarily> What should we do about it? <Consider improving the
above> If he needs to be treated in the QT, do we need to remove the
biological filter? <Mmm, no benefit in moving this animal, not a
pathogenic disease...> I think that is everything. Sorry for the
long email, but I did searches on the FAQ about fin rot, white mouth,
& Lymphocystis couldn't find the help I needed. Thanks, Jeri
<No worries re length. State what you think is important (you have
done this well). Please start reading here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/mardisease.htm to gain an
understanding, more holistic view of what "disease" is...
then here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/centropyge/index.htm
for the linked FAQs files above on Centropyge "Systems",
"Disease/Health", and "Feeding". Bob Fenner>
Re: Possible fin or tail rot? 9/8/05 Thanks for great
advice. I will start raising the salinity slowly. There is one sore on
his back that seems to be open and I can see some pink. It is where the
largest white spot was. I know you said to improve environment, but
would he benefit from PolyAqua? That was recommended from LFS and to
improve his environment. <The PolyAqua will not improve the
environment or benefit this fish> We are looking to get more live
rock for the tank. Also I have heard about putting small pieces of Live
Rock in the wet/dry instead of bio balls. Does that really work to keep
the system clean? <Yes...> I had no idea that our tank would be
too small for this fish. <You can read re... on WWM, books> I
don't know what some LFS are doing. You ask for advice and assume
it will be good. <My real "advice" is assume nothing in
this world indefinitively> Glad I found you all here to double and
triple check any other advice I get. We are saving up to buy a Tenecor
Marine ready 150 gal tank. We may be buying sooner than we thought. I
will check out the articles/FAQs that you recommended. Thanks! <Real
good. Cheers, Bob Fenner>
Re: Possible fin or tail rot?
9/8/05 This morning the Coral Beauty is not eating, breathing very
hard, laying vertical against a rock, and letting the hermit crabs
& emerald crabs eat away at his fins. He is swimming into them and
staying there like they are cleaner shrimps. Water parameters all same
except temp is 78 and salinity is about 1.023. Clowns are eating and
doing well. <...> We are going to remove him from the
tank so the crabs can't do anymore damage. What else can we do for
him? Jeri <... read... what is your take on the size, type, quality
of habitat... its suitability for this species? Bob Fenner>
Re: Possible fin or tail rot? 9/8/05 Our LFS has been
testing our water quality every time we are there. They do not sell
fish to people with unsafe water conditions. I was told by them and
from things we have read that 40ppm nitrates is not toxic.
<Depending on the "cause/s" of nitrate accumulation... In
general, more than 20 ppm. is to be avoided...> We are trying to
improve the water quality by adding more live rock, on the
recommendation of WWM. <Good... takes time> I had read that dwarf
angels need to be in at least 30gal tanks. <Only the "dwarf
dwarfs" can be housed in such small quarters... most Centropyge
require a minimum of sixty uncrowded gallons (not tank size, volume of
water) for one specimen... Others here would say one hundred
gallons> 1 angel per 50 gal of water because they can be aggressive
toward each other (even when they have lots of room). They like to eat
off of live rock. They are not the hardiest of fish, but not the most
sensitive angel. <Yes> It was my understanding that he would do
fine in our tank as long as we didn't overstock it. We were told
that we would not have a problem with the 2 clowns and the Coral Beauty
outgrowing the tank. And like I mentioned earlier we are looking to get
a much larger tank by the time these fish are full size. <Need it
now> We are trying to make more informed decisions by using all
different types of references. A lot of the information we are
receiving contradicts each other and as a saltwater novice it's
hard to figure out what is best. We are doing the best we can and are
not purposely setting out to kill fish, as that would be a very
expensive & cruel hobby. <Agreed> I do thank you for all of
your help and will continue to read your site and learn as much as I
can. Thanks, Jeri <Jeri, it may seem self-serving, but I encourage
you to "step back" here, read a "complete" book on
marine aquarium keeping to gain a firm overall understanding, basis. I
encourage you to visit your local library, check out what they have. I
will state that I am the author of one of these works, "The
Conscientious Marine Aquarist"... Bob Fenner>
Re: Ich treatment for dwarf angels 8/27/05
FYI... dwarf angels don't do well with a full dose of rid
Ich. all three are now dead. ph,
salinity, ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate were all very
good. after two weeks of treatment Ich was not totally
gone. maybe it was the Ich...maybe it was two weeks of
formalin. none the less, very unsuccessful.
<Beware of formalin... a biocide. RMF>
Coral Beauty swimming
like a seahorse? 8/21/05 I have a 46 gallon tank. We have 2
clownfish, several snails & hermit crabs, a Condylactis anemone,
and a coral beauty. The coral beauty is swimming like a seahorse. Head
up, tail down. He has been doing that ever since we moved him into the
main tank 3 days ago. <Ohhh> He was doing well in the QT,
swimming, not eating real well. He mostly hid in the QT. I have tested
the water quality and it is great Ammonia 0 nitrite 0, nitrate 10ppm,
Ph 8.3, temp 78, salinity 1.022. The clowns are great eating everything
in sight but the Coral Beauty is not eating at all and then the funny
swimming. We have tried frozen brine shrimp, Marine cuisine, emerald
entree, seaweed, and the angel mix. Nothing is working. What can be
causing him to swim this way? Any suggestions on how to get him to eat?
<Mmm, could be a few things re the swimming, non-eating... most
likely damage (gas bladder most commonly, by needling for decompression
post-capture) in the process of collection, transport... Or a sting...
from the Condylactis?> He looks tired and his gills are starting to
look a little white or pale. What can we do to help this fish? Thank
you for any help, Jeri <Mmm, really only improving water quality,
hope... Do you have live rock? The organisms found in/on this are often
about all Centropyge angels do initially feed on... and the LR would
help to improve water quality... Bob Fenner>
Re: Coral Beauty swimming like a seahorse? 8/22/05 We do not
have any live rock. We are talking about finding a reputable place here
in Denver to get fully cured live rock and/or sand. With live sand how
much should be put on the bottom of a 46 gallon tank? <Ahh, I would
definitely be adding the best you can, soon> Back to the coral
beauty. If he was stung by the anemone, how long would the effect last?
Is there a way to force feed him? <Not easy to force feed... stings
can last days, weeks> I noticed he has one white spot on his right
side. It looks to be one large grain of salt embedded in his skin. He
also seems to have scraped his neck/back area. His spikes look a little
gray and are frayed a bit in that area. We have been watching the
clowns closely and they are doing great. They are eating everything in
sight, and look very healthy. <All markings are stress-related>
The store had the Coral Beauty for 3 weeks swimming and eating fine, we
had in QT for 2 weeks and it was swimming fine, mostly hiding, but not
eating real well. We moved him to the main tank when our QT spiked
ammonia and water changes were not helping it. We thought it would be
better for the fish to be in better water conditions. <Mmm, on to
that LR. Bob Fenner>
Re: Coral Beauty needs help 8/26/05 Spot is on left
side and now left gill not working. He is spending a lot of time at the
top of the tank, We did a 10% water change tonight to keep water
optimum. Nitrates still showing about 10 -20ppm. So we will keep
working on that. What can I do to help this fish? <Please read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/dwfangdisfaqs.htm and the linked
files above. Bob Fenner>
New Flameback angel (Centropyge aurantonotus) fat belly Hi. I
bought a Flameback 2 days ago and noticed that he has an enlarged belly
and that he has a white patch at the bottom of his belly, near his anal
fins. <From stretching?> Should I treat him with antibiotics -
I'm thinking he got infected because he may had been decompressed
with a needle. <May be...> Or should I treat him for internal
parasites? <No> If I do both, which treatment should I do first?
<For "blockage"... add a level teaspoon of Epsom Salt per
ten gallons of system water...> Thank you for website and the great
advice that you give. Oh...water parameters in my 10g QT are all good.
NH3=0, NO3=0,
SG=1.025, temp=78F. <Hopefully, this too shall pass. Good luck,
life. Bob Fenner>
Re: New Flameback angel (Centropyge aurantonotus) fat belly
Thanks Bob, but the little guy did not make it. I found him dead this
morning. I am curious on how to determine if a Flameback has
internal parasites vs. "blockage" or internal
infection. <Can be necropsied... cut open for investigation,
microscopically examined. Can do, or have done, a histological work-up.
Bob Fenner>
- Coral Beauty Angel - I recently started my first salt water
aquarium, and things have been going very well so far. I
have a 55 gallon drilled tank with an AMiracle wet/dry, Remora Pro
skimmer, 45lbs of Fiji live rock, two tank raised clowns, and a banded
coral shrimp so far along with some turbo snails and a hermit crab. The
other day I brought home a coral beauty angel, and put it in my
quarantine tank (glad I did so). It looked great at first,
but now it has a lot of tiny white spots on it. I have seen Ich on regal tangs and full size angels in pet stores before, and it
looks like this. When I brought the fish home two days ago I
gave it a 4 minute fresh water dip (ph and temp adjusted) as your site
recommends. I added it to my 10 gallon quarantine tank that
has an 8 watt UV on it (way overkill). <Is OK, a fine place to run
UV.> Is it normal for this fish to get Ich even with the freshwater
dip? <Not abnormal.> What can I do to get rid of it? <Dip
again, vacuum the bottom of the quarantine tank. Make sure you have a
flow rate sufficient to kill Protozoans with the UV.> Once the
symptoms have disappeared, is there any way to be sure it is gone (my
main concern is not infecting the display tank)? <Keep up the
quarantine for at least two weeks. If symptoms don't reappear, then
you should be OK adding the fish to the main tank.> Should I give it
another longer dip (it didn't seem to like the first one much, so I
am reluctant). <That won't hurt.> If there is no sure way to
do this would you recommend trying to return the fish to the pet store?
<No... I'd try and see this through. These fish are for the most
part, surprisingly tough.> Please give me any advice you can, this
is the first hurdle I have run into. <Well, you did the right thing
by putting the fish in quarantine. Good job.> I am hoping to get
through it smoothly. <I think you will.> I am hoping that by
reading as much as I can and being smart about things I can avoid most
of the problems people have switching to salt. <I think you are off
to a good start.> Thanks! -Ken <Cheers, J -- >
Any hope for this Coral Beauty? Hello
WWM Crew, Unfortunately, my letter today is not a happy one.
<You're telling me... your message is in HTML!> I have
recently completed a fishless cycle with my new 50 gallon reef tank.
The water parameters have now stabilized and are ideal per the
recommendations on this site. The cleaning crew and so on are in place.
To 'celebrate' the new tank's readiness for fish after a
very long 3 month wait, my non marine hobbyist friend bought me a Coral
Beauty angelfish. I received it in a deep bucket in the evening
and, naturally, we acclimated it over several hours via a drip in dim
lighting so I was not really able to see it completely. I was aware
that it had a torn tailfin, but it looked minor in the darkness. He
seemed to be all right; breathing a little hard but nothing too
serious, so I introduced him to his QT with the lights off and went to
bed. When I awoke in the morning and saw him with the lights on,
I was appalled. I have never seen a fish in this condition before. His
fin spines are exposed completely, his tail is torn and both it and a
patch on his body look like they are developing a fungal infection. But
worst of all is his mouth. His mouth is so raw, swollen and damaged
that it is painful to look at him. It's completely white and blood
vessels are visible. I tried to tempt him with some Nori and
Formula One, but he was disinterested in both. I'm actually
wondering if he is physically capable of eating with his mouth in that
condition. He is rapidly breathing, but apart from that, swims normally
and appears alert and plump. Is there any hope for this fish? <Some,
but not much... sounds too damaged> What can I do for him. My
husband took one look and declared him hopeless, but I'm not
willing to give up on him. Suggestions? <To add a bit of LR to the
quarantine tank, keep the spg a little low (1.021 or so), keep trying
different foods, and hope... Bob Fenner>
Angels Fallen from Grace Dear Crew, You
guys, and gals, have been a Godsend. <Thank you, nice to
mention our fair maidens.> Thanks to you and all that have
gone before we have now a fairly stable young reef tank in the
making. We are still having a few problems with pH and alk but
we're working on it. However, this problem is completely out of
the norm, if there is such a thing and if possible would like a
couple of different opinions. This morning I woke up to find both
my Coral Beauty and my Flame Angel dead! The Coral Beauty was in
the back and I scooped him out but when the lights kicked on and
everyone came out for breakfast I didn't see the Flame. Found
him a minute later on the other end of the tank and removed him
also. Immediately removed some water and tested. pH 7.8, amm.0,
nitrites a trace maybe .1, nitrates less than 10 All tests done
with SeaTest. S.G. is 1.027. I am writing this at 1700 hrs. and the
pH is now 8.4. I know I need to stop this swing... <The swing is
normal, ph will lower through the night, more so if you have macro
algae.> ... and we are in the process of hooking up a 60
gal. sump with a Mag36, a refugium, and the reverse photo period.
The water has been stable as far as what I can test for. Never any
ammonia, nitrates never above 10, and usually 0 nitrites. The tank
is 125 gal. acrylic with a 5 to 6 inch sand bed, 100 to 130 lbs of
live rock a TurboFlotor HOT skimmer with Ocean runner 2700 pump,
pulls about cup of really yucky skimmate every couple of days, we
change 10 to 20% of the water every week, (rarely do we miss a
w/c). Use Instant Ocean Salt in buffered well water. There
are also four P.H.s doing 300 gph each and an Aqua Clear HOT that
does 500 gph. In the AquaClear is Marineland Black Diamond carbon
that is changed every week (a good 8 oz. ). Now the
description of the fish. Both of them looked perfect in body and
fins and we have had the CB angel for a little over a year and the
Flame at least 6 mths. They did not fight or even chase one
another. Last night when I fed all seemed normal. ( We feed:
frozen Formula 1 & 2, Brine shrimp plus, mysids, Prime Reef,
Cyclop-eeze and Formula 1 flakes. No, not all at once. ) Now
when I found the Coral Beauty and looked at it up close in my hand
the first thing I noticed was its mouth. It was white! not fuzzy.
It appeared the flesh was gone of just its lips. Do fish have
lips? <Sort of> His body color, his fins
everything visible looked perfect. But the lips had no flesh and
was rough to the touch. Then I found the Flame and his mouth was
the same. No tears no red just white bony lips. I have a couple of
SMALL hermits somewhere in the tank but nobody was picking on the
bodies. <Not that you saw, perhaps during the
night.> <<These fishes are chemically BURNED. RMF>> |
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The inhabitants are: 2-1in. Green Chromis, 2 Firefish, 1
Blue Gudgeon, 1 Scissortail Dart, 1 2in. Sixline Wrasse, 1 3 in.
Canary Wrasse/Yellow "Coris", 3 Skunk Cleaner Shrimp, 1
Coral Banded Shrimp and a variety of corals. That is
everything I can think of and probably a lot more than needed,
but you never know. The only thing I have done differently in the
last week is I added Purigen to the AquaClear last Wed. (Apr.
20). I have never used this before but I trust the company and
read over the archives, finding no negatives. I also used
SeaChem's Reef buffer for the first time but less than the
directions called for. (I am leery of additives and want to wait
for the sump to be finished before I start dumping in stuff
I'm not familiar with). I mention the inverts because I
would expect them to be the first to react to adverse water
conditions and it is strange to me that something would kill two
seemingly healthy fish of the same genus and not affect anything
else. P.S. It is the next morning now, (I type reeeaaallly
slow), the actinics just came on and everyone left is out for
breakfast and looking fine. The only thing I did yesterday was
clean the AC filter, remove the Purigen which had been in 6 days,
and added fresh carbon and Poly Filter. I did not do a w/c
because the only water I had ready was what I had used last week
and wanted to make up some new just in case it was the water but
I doubt it. Am hoping that someone there has some idea what
this could be. BTW both fish came from the same LFS but like I
said at least 6 mths apart. Have tried to attach pictures hope
they help (hope they get there). Thank you so much for your time
and efforts. Diane and Tom. P.S.P.S The actinics have been on 30
min. and the pH is 8.0, barely, and the alk. is 2. meq./L.
I really miss my angels already but don't know if the
symptoms are indicative of poisoning, something peculiar to dwarf
angels? <It seems unlikely that this would be poisoning.
I'm sure you don't spray Windex near the tank or any
other ammonia based chemical. Inverts will usually handle more
ammonia than fish. Other than that, I'm at a loss for an
explanation. I will put this in a folder and Mr. Fenner may offer
more information. You mention well water. Do you RO this water or
use it directly from the tap. Quite possible this may have had
something in it. Fertilizers etc, eventually get down to your
water table. The angels you had are more sensitive to water
chemistry changes than the rest of your fish. James (Salty
Dog)>
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Angelfishes for Marine
Aquariums
Diversity, Selection & Care
New
eBook on Amazon: Available
here
New Print Book on Create Space: Available
here
by Robert
(Bob) Fenner |
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